4th Generation Glock Frames Inbound


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Curare
November 4, 2006, 08:56 PM
New ambi mag release and safety.

New mags have a horizontal notch on the front face for the new frames, as well as the old notch. All mags will work in the old frames, only the new mags will work in the new frames.

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symr00
November 4, 2006, 09:08 PM
Do you mean a mag safety or a thumb safety? Either way, I hope they're optional.

gudel
November 4, 2006, 09:09 PM
I believe it when I see it

glocker1911
November 4, 2006, 09:20 PM
Yeah, and I suppose these new features will also be available on their new carbine, single stck 9mm, and 1911 style Glock they are about to introduce too, right?:neener:

Curare
November 4, 2006, 09:29 PM
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d33/d8006/newglockmag.jpg

SoCalShooter
November 4, 2006, 09:43 PM
Sweet now if we could get a metal frame I would be happier, poly is ok but I want one of each.

10-Ring
November 4, 2006, 09:47 PM
I think I would prefer metal mags. But really, a 4th gen? Okay, but why? Kind of implies a lack of perfection w/ the 3rd gen...and if it wasn't perfect, what took so long to fix it?? :scrutiny:

Curare
November 4, 2006, 09:49 PM
Why 4th? Contracts.

ugaarguy
November 4, 2006, 10:19 PM
Curare, do you have any links with more info? Thanks.

Curare
November 4, 2006, 10:22 PM
That's all I have.

Kestrel
November 4, 2006, 11:01 PM
I believe this is a carryover from one of the military RFPs (Glock's entry). I saw something in John Farnam's quips about them. There is supposed to be a double-stack .45, similar to the G21, but with a slimmer grip. He did mention it has a manual safety and ambi mag release.

His comments stated they were going to be shown at SHOT, in January.

Another note of interest - he also said there was a 5" "version" of the G36, ie: 5" single-stack .45, to be shown in January, too.

Curare
November 5, 2006, 08:46 AM
The mag release as described in Farnam's piece is switchable/ambidextrous. Looking at the picture of the new magazine style above (which has been shipping to stores) I would tend to disagree that it is "switchable". The notch appears to be engaged from the front--not the side. This would support a permanent ambidextrous release, possibly like that used in HK pistols.

The second issue is the safety. From Farnam, "The SF45 will have an ambidextrous, two-position, manual safety. It is designed to mostly disengage itself as the shooter acquires a normal, shooting grip. But, it must be manually, consciously re-engaged. Resembles a cross-bolt."

I suspect that Glock can design the ambi release without changing the parts count of the pistol, however I have no idea how the safety will be designed.

hksw
November 5, 2006, 08:48 AM
Huh, I thought Glock was perfection from the getgo.

gudel
November 5, 2006, 01:39 PM
Huh, I thought Glock was perfection from the getgo.

It is. :D
Apparently someone at GLOCK realize there is a niche for a reliable light weight single stack with 5".
With the money these people are paying for jamomatic bricks, why not offer them a reliable alternative? ;)

Waywatcher
November 5, 2006, 02:25 PM
This sounds like a monumentally bad decision.

Slvr Surfr
November 5, 2006, 04:55 PM
I hope they dont go the way of the manual safety. I dont think they need them.

Soybomb
November 5, 2006, 06:27 PM
Hmmm makes me wonder if I should hurry upa nd get that g29 I've been putting off so I can use all mags.

salvador31c
November 5, 2006, 06:49 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! :cuss: LEAVE EM ALONE!!!! i hope if they do this all the GLOCK OWNERS will trade the thrid gens in so the prices of them will drop and i can buy one of each:evil:

diyj98
November 5, 2006, 08:37 PM
I like the idea of a manual safety. But unless the old frames can be converted I'd have to sell all old old Glocks to replace them with new ones :(

denfoote
November 5, 2006, 08:55 PM
All mags will work in the old frames, only the new mags will work in the new frames.

I am somewhat concerned about this.
It seems Glock is getting ready for another more draconian mag ban.
The rest may be an effort to make their guns palitable to the goofs in the People's MAssive Socialist Republic!!

dhoomonyou
November 5, 2006, 09:15 PM
maybe time to buy some 3rd gens?

Zach S
November 5, 2006, 10:05 PM
When I read 4th gen, I was hoping for something with a light rail and a smooth frontstrap. It would save me the trouble of sanding the finger grooves off the next one I buy.

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=45791&d=1159917915

DRMMR02
November 5, 2006, 10:39 PM
Now if they can just redesign that ugly box-slide, we'll be set :)

Reyn
November 5, 2006, 11:50 PM
Im too use to shooting them without a manual safety. I was shooting my HK the other day and actually forgot to take the safety off at first. Made me wonder if that would carry over if the crap hit the fan.

Waywatcher
November 6, 2006, 01:48 AM
Zach S:
How did you do that? The modification looks very professional from the picture. What grit, tools, etc. did you use? How close is the 'finish' match upon close inspection?

Vitamin G
November 6, 2006, 02:59 AM
I was hoping 4th gen would have interchangable backstraps to get rid of that blasted hump! :cuss:

DRMMR02
November 6, 2006, 03:06 AM
Walther is the way to go :)

denfoote
November 6, 2006, 03:15 AM
Historically Glock has changed "generations" when the production moulds wore out.
I'm not so sure about this one, though!!

Curare
November 6, 2006, 08:56 AM
I doubt that it is because the molds are wearing out. It's entirely due to market forces. In 1998 the public was buying railed handguns like the USP and the 3rd generation frames debuted. Today military and LE wants a more evolved handgun frame, hence the 4th generation. If Glock had a "perfect" frame and was gaining--not losing market share, they would just rebuild any worn out frame molds.

I also hope that the safety is optional--like the lock. Unfortunatley, I believe that if it is optional, the only people who will see the non-safety models will be civies, and non-rank-and-file LE/military units. The safety models will take liability conscious LE angencies by storm.

I would like to see something like this as far as grip texture goes. It would have saved me about 15 hours on my old G19. I did a total of 7 frames and I will NEVER beat up my back, eyes and hands to do something like this again.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d33/d8006/stippledglockagemed.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d33/d8006/stipplemacro1.jpg

Boats
November 6, 2006, 12:53 PM
I am generally a fan of the 1911A1, where customization comes easy and the bug to do it bites most hard, but even I cannot understand modifying the entire grip of a weapon just because it was mismanufactured to begin with. Buy a weapon that fits better.

It is way past due for Glock to have done the following, (some of which they have notably undertaken):

Allow for swappable backstraps. (They should act more like Microsoft and just rip off good ideas from elsewhere, or would that make them seem too much like S&W?) The grip angle is the singlemost heard complaint about Glocks, but they stand pat.

Remove the frickin' finger grooves. Some people swear by them, the other 98% find them to be anywhere from mildly annoying to obnoxious deal breaker, especially when they weren't on any previous generation.

Reversible or truly ambi mag catch. As a lefty, I do just fine with the positive one sided mag catch of the 1911A1, but the Glock's squarish and plastic button has always sucked hind teat in that regard for the southpawed. Rip off H&K's paddle already.

Round off the triggerguard or at least soften the 90 degree face a little. Squared off trigger guards are so 80s.

Allow a factory option manual safety. Most other polymer pistol systems allow for it. If one still wants the original recipe, great, if not, great also. When I was a reserve deputy, I paid for my own Beretta 92FS rather than take an issue Glock for three primary reasons. One is the righthandedness of the Glock. Two was the sucky grip angle. Three was the lack of a way to disable the gun in the event of a struggle for the weapon.

With the Beretta 92FS, one just left the safety off, hammer down on a loaded chamber. In the event of a struggle for the weapon, thumb down the trigger disconnect safety to "on safe" and wrestle for control. Manual safeties have many documented officer saves to their credit, and I am aware of no report, anywhere, that a manual safety has cost an officer his or her life via "forgetting" it was on.

Hooah
November 6, 2006, 01:40 PM
Source for the 98% of people that are turned off of GLOCK? I find it suprising since it is the market leader.

Boats
November 6, 2006, 01:45 PM
I didn't say 98% were "turned off." I made up a stat that reflects that the finger grooves are far from universally loved. I haven't even thought about owning a Glock with the current generation frame. Lots of people make good money sanding and burning the finger bumpers off though. :rolleyes:

Zach S
November 6, 2006, 06:41 PM
Waywatcher, I just put some rags in a 4" vise and clamped down on the slide. Then I took a peice of 120(?) grit sandpaper about as wide as the frontstrap and about two feet long and just sanded away like i was polishing my boots. After I got most of the fingergrooves sanded off, I used a thinner piece, about .5" wide (and two feet long, torn off the same belt as the other piece) and smoothed it out. The sandpaper came out the trash bin, right beside the giant beltsander at work, so new 120 may be too rough.

You may think it looks good in the picture, but in person its far from it, it would look a lot worse sitting next to Curare's G19. It really doesnt match the un-modifed parts of the frame, but blasting it with a really soft media would probably make everything match up. I just dont care about it enough to worry about it.

Curare, what did you use to stipple yours?

W.E.G.
November 6, 2006, 06:46 PM
Is the Gen 4 magazine modification present on all Glock models?

Curare
November 6, 2006, 07:10 PM
15W soldering iron.

Tecolote
November 6, 2006, 10:45 PM
Curare-

That is without a doubt the best stipling I've ever seen on a Glock. Even the high end custom shops don't come close. Please reconsider your decision not to take on any more frames.;)

StmtR
November 7, 2006, 06:50 PM
Curare, when are the Gen. 4's coming out?

Curare
November 7, 2006, 08:26 PM
Pulling this completely out of my buttstock:

Mags are in stores now.

We may see the G45 in next month's SGN, highlighting the new features.

New frames at S.H.O.T.?

I have no idea, but that's how I'd do it.

Ginny
November 8, 2006, 04:01 AM
Single stack!?! Glock's G21 double stack feeds so reliably, why not slim it up a bit, keep the double stack round count, and throw that new 5" barrel on it... ala XD Tactical?

I really want a Glock 35 in .357 from the factory more than a long barrel .45 (actually I want both, but the .357 would benefit more) ... now I have to worry about the next generation frame ... possible external safety ... before that .357 G35-ish pistol comes out ... IF it comes out.

Oh, well. I guess my Glock 21 and 31 will have to by my duty weapons for a few more years. Maybe Springfield will get a big, reliable external extractor on their XD's and give Glock a real run for their money.

As a side note, I have ordered the XD45 Tactical that I'm not going to carry. I'm just going to beat the snot out of it and see if it'll earn my trust the way my G21 has ... who knows, I might be a total XD convert in a couple of years! :uhoh:

StmtR
November 8, 2006, 07:23 AM
I guess I better pickup a G34 soon.

Curare
November 21, 2006, 01:32 PM
Update:

The model "G21SF" will be a G21 with a reshaped backstrap, updated rail, and an ambidextrous mag release.

Grayrider
November 21, 2006, 03:29 PM
You are correct, the gun was at a recent trade show in Dark Earth color. A colleague of mine handled it. He reported the 21SF was "slightly" smaller feeling in the frame.

John

Curare
November 21, 2006, 03:37 PM
I heard RSR has them listing in black--10 or 13 rounds, with or without night sights. Is the front of the slide beveled?

Correia
November 21, 2006, 04:35 PM
Glocks coming out with a new model?

Why? Did somebody invent a new caliber?

Hooah, it may have been the leader, but speaking as somebody who sells guns for a living, over the last year I've sold probably 5 XDs for every Glock. They aren't dominating like they used to. If Glock was smart they would change some things up and actually listen to their customer base.

Vitamin G
November 22, 2006, 12:55 PM
Hmm... I wonder if glock could find a way to make detachable and adjustable finger grooves?

Satisfy those who hate them, and those who like them.

longeyes
November 22, 2006, 01:31 PM
Flexible ergonomics (finger grooves, backstraps) would be a wise tack for Glock. Put me in the camp who wouldn't mind their offering a frame-mounted safety either, if only as an option. They make a great handgun but need to adapt to consumer needs.

Grayrider
November 23, 2006, 10:10 AM
I wish I had more info, but just know what I was told. He said that the gun grip reduction was not that much--in fact did not notice until it was pointed out to him. The most obvious changes were color and the rail. I wonder if there will be a 20SF?

John

denfoote
November 23, 2006, 12:57 PM
If Glock was smart they would change some things up and actually listen to their customer base.
__________________


I submit that, in this case, Glock IS listening to their "customer base"!!

Said base being the Demonrats who have just taken power!! The new Glocks have as many "features" as Gaston can think of to placate these goofs!!
For instance, look for Glock to start only selling the new 13 round mags to LEO departments in anticipation of the new and improved AWB!!!! I expect this soon after the first of the year when the new congress is sworn in!!

..
November 24, 2006, 12:53 AM
For instance, look for Glock to start only selling the new 13 round mags to LEO departments in anticipation of the new and improved AWB!!!! I expect this soon after the first of the year when the new congress is sworn in!!
:scrutiny: Uh yeah..........the sky is falling, tighten your tinfoil.

Autolycus
November 24, 2006, 07:06 AM
here is a pic...

http://www.glockworld.com/SlimLineGlock21.htm

Walkalong
November 24, 2006, 10:23 AM
Still Glockless in Alabama. 1911's for me. Oh Yeah, the XD's are Kinda nice too.

HMMurdock
November 24, 2006, 10:30 AM
Oh, I definately think GLOCK is listening to their fanbase-- thats why we get generation 4's. And as denoted by "Gen 4", this isn't their first attempt at redefining "GLOCK Perfection".

The safety features (or lack thereof) is a common complain by people I sell firearms to. Even the addition of the "beavertail" on the Springfield XD has won people over the GLOCK. Personally, I don't like the external safeties, but that's personal preference. The lack of external safeties is one reason Police Departments switched to GLOCK, at least thats what I've heard from LEs around here. There were too many instances of Officers panicking and pulling a safed trigger which got them hurt. So they went to GLOCKS based on the revolver principle-- keep it in a safe area and sqeeze. Kinda like issuing AK47s to illiterate conscripts --no offense to LE, I'm in law enforcement myself but anyone in law enforcement knows half the guys we work with don't know their @$$ from applebutter when it comes to their sidearm.

I'm curious what the benefit of the full picatinny rail is? And will the new glocks fit in old-style holsters? The new GLOCKS in stock do have that additional notch in the mag and operate fine, so will the new generations feed the old style mags? Are these features only on the new .45's or can we see Gen4 GLOCK 17s in our near future? I can only assume so... Obviously this is in response to the explosive popularity of the slim-framed Springfield XD in .45, but how long until we get new variants? I want answers! :banghead:

TRL

Grayrider
November 24, 2006, 11:24 AM
I was told the new Glock 21s will take the old mags, but I don't see how that could work given the mag catch would have no groove to set into. I would bet new mags work in old guns, but not the other way around. Pure speculation though. I had wondered about the holster issue myself. Probably depends on the holster and how formed it was to the shape of the rail.

By the way I said "dark earth" above, but recalled later my associate said "tan". I assumed he meant dark earth, but could be wrong.

John

Curare
November 25, 2006, 09:50 AM
here is a pic...

http://www.glockworld.com/SlimLineGlock21.htm

That is a "pic". However, when you blow it up, you would be more correct to label it as a "Photoshop pic".

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d33/d8006/topglockphotoisfake1.jpg

HMMurdock
November 28, 2006, 04:02 PM
I'm assuming this "4th Generation" concept will bleed past the Glock 21 "slimline" and into the model 17s and such, but the G21SF appears to me to be a response to the Springfield XD ... And I'm still baffled by the concept of the full rail? The light and/or laser is the only accessory I can think of going on the rail and modification of said rail would do little to no good... and if you haven't already, don't bother checking Glock's website. I don't think it's been updated in years.

Will the old-mag friendly "Gen 3"s still be produced or will these new ones totally replace the line-up? I WANT ANSWERS! :banghead: All in time... all in time...

TRL

Curare
November 28, 2006, 04:35 PM
Glock Website (http://www.teamglock.com/)

The G21 is not a Slimline. That is a term used for the G36. The grip circumference of the G21SF is decreased--but it is just as wide, to accomodate the 13 round magazines.

The average person is confused by the prospect of 2 new Glock pistols. They are combining the idea of the G21SF (with recontoured grip and ambi mag release), with a separate proposed pistol--the Slimline, G36 "Tactical"--a full size, G36.

BrennanKG
November 28, 2006, 04:55 PM
Curare,

Just to restate/clarify for the slow folks in the room, ie me, it is looking like Glock will be offering a full-sized G36?

Thanks,
B.

Curare
November 28, 2006, 05:24 PM
If Farham's info is good, and it usually is, we can expect a fullisize G36 at S.H.O.T.. If Glock doesn't muck it up, a 4.5-5" G36 with an 8-10 round mag would be very appealing.

http://www.teamglock.com/Glock-Buyers-Guide/images-guide/Glock-36.jpg

atblis
November 28, 2006, 06:01 PM
I am still waiting on the single stack subcompact 9mm (me and everybody else). Kinda like a Kahr that is reliable and durable.

Curare
November 29, 2006, 12:34 PM
I think that a single stack 9mm would be a great addition to the Glock line up (it would be their first single stack pistol--G36 has a staggered mag).

BrennanKG
November 29, 2006, 12:47 PM
Curare,

Are you sure about that?
I know the G30 is mag staggered.
The one time I shot a G36, its mag certainly looked like a single stack 6 rounder to me.



B.

Curare
November 29, 2006, 01:58 PM
Absolutley, take a base plate off a G36 mag, load in some rounds, and you will see it is very much not a "single stack" like a 1911, P7M8, SIG P220, etc.

BrennanKG
November 29, 2006, 02:06 PM
Cool.
Thanks for the explanation.
I was disappointed with the G36 so I didn't investigate much after my one experience with it on the range. I was just a little too whippy for me. I imagine a longer barrel and slide would remedy this for me.




B.

Khornet
November 30, 2006, 01:19 PM
could someone explain these to me? And the dates of said generations? Only difference I can see is the grips.

Curare
November 30, 2006, 04:55 PM
VERY basic description:

Gen 1--very smooth texture wrapping 360 degrees around grip.
Gen 2--rough "grenade" checkering on front and backstrap.
Gen 3--thumb rests and Glock spec rail.
Gen 4--? grip, ambi mag release, Mil-Std-1913 rail.

There were other small changes along the way, including extractor angle, parts finishes, etc. I do not believe that the G21SF rail changes will be seen throughout the model range, however.

denfoote
November 30, 2006, 10:18 PM
If Glock doesn't muck it up, a 4.5-5" G36 with an 8-10 round mag would be very appealing.


I already own a G36.
Might the "new" mags just fit it????
That would be of more interest to me!!

Curare
December 2, 2006, 10:19 AM
That's the great hope. On the new website, the lone Glock in the "Slimline" column is begging for company. Imagine a "G45" and G36 combo!

bluejdixon
November 12, 2008, 06:39 AM
Im sure you have already seen this, but posting for those who havent.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/legacy38/firearms/glocknewgrip-1.jpg

Grayrider
November 12, 2008, 10:34 AM
I like that. Perhaps I should hold on any Glock purchase for a bit. When will those ship?

John

Ben86
November 12, 2008, 11:57 AM
I wish they would get rid of the finger grooves so I can decide were I want my fingers.

CountGlockula
November 12, 2008, 02:06 PM
I'll be the first one in line!!!

bluejdixon
November 12, 2008, 02:26 PM
I like that. Perhaps I should hold on any Glock purchase for a bit. When will those ship?

Actually, there is much speculation to whether this is actually a genuine ad... Most of us on GlockTalk aren't buying it... Yet :)

Quiet
November 14, 2008, 10:40 AM
It's was displayed at the International Association of Chiefs of Police convention (which ended Wednesday).

Glock reps there said no ambi-mag release and manual safety. Ambi-mag release may be an option.

diyj98
November 14, 2008, 10:44 AM
Quiet,

Did they mean no amb. mag. release as well as no manual safety or did they mean it WOULD have a manual safety?

CPshooter
November 15, 2008, 07:41 AM
What the heck? This thread is 2 years old and got brought back to life by bluejdixon posting that incredibly bogus ad. There's no way that Glock is putting those ugly serrations on their pistols. And that stupid grip texture? Shame on you people that believed it!

bluejdixon
November 16, 2008, 09:59 PM
my apologies, I didnt notice the age of this thread

SaMx
November 17, 2008, 11:28 AM
apparently glock really is planning on releasing a 4th gen at this years SHOT show.

http://www.saysuncle.com/archives/2008/11/17/fourth-generation-glock-follow-up/

coyotehitman
January 14, 2009, 10:04 AM
At least one local department has an order in for the new pistols. Word is they will ship relatively soon.

Quiet
January 14, 2009, 04:02 PM
Glock 22RTF
http://jeremyferg.com/sigforum/gen4-g22.jpg

HMMurdock
January 25, 2009, 02:29 PM
Wow, old thread.

Anyway, I hear the Gen 4's are only being released in Glock 17 and Glock 22 at first --anyone else know if this is right? Any dates on when they may be obtained and if the ambi-release is an option (I want to use my old mags)?

daorhgih
January 25, 2009, 05:18 PM
Perfection is a goal, not a product. The product improves towards Perfection......... 3,000,000 buyers in 20 years says a lot. I'm not good at Photo-shop; can anyone work up a rounded-top slide for Glock a la some of the old Randall pistols?? I think this should be an option, along with what sort of "groooovey" front we want / don't want on the grip.

veritas111
April 27, 2010, 10:46 PM
The new glock 4th generation magazine release sucks. I shot a friends 4th gen glock 17 and the mag release is so big that it is way too easy to accidently drop the magazine. Oversize mag release buttons are something for competion not on a street gun. Just another example of trying to fix something that doesn't need fixing. Dumb move Glock

ProCarryNAustin
April 28, 2010, 04:30 PM
Each to their own. I think the new mag release is a great improvement over the Gen3. Mine has not accidently drop a mag and I have shot and carried it plenty. In fact, I can't think of a single aspect of the Gen3 that I would prefer over my Gen4.

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