1860 Army pic


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stevenb
November 6, 2006, 01:54 AM
While I'm biding my time waiting on that 1860 to arrive ,I've been piddlin with other things. If I'm not shooting guns I'm doing some sort of graphic design or photos with them. Since I dont have the real thing yet this is digital....Steve.:)

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/stevensavage/cap%20and%20ball/1860flamessb.jpg

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Franco2shoot
November 6, 2006, 09:30 AM
I like the weight and feel of my Pietta 1860 Colt, but the hammer just doesn't seem to strike with enough force to reliably fire off the percussion caps. Just yesterday, I was comparing the Pietta to my Uberti Remington, and while the Remmy fired each and every time the Pietta was only about 50%. Most times I just cycle through a second time and it will fire, but sometimes I have to assiste the hammer fall to get it to fire.

Is there a way to increase the spring pressure so that it will fire more reliably?

KKKKFL

mec
November 6, 2006, 09:50 AM
If the hammerfall becomes lighter as the hammr advances toward the cone, your mainspring may be flexing against the grip inside the frame. I had to relieve the grip block on a paterson to fix that. If you are using cci caps, a switch to remington would help. My uberti 60 has a light hammr fall and is reliable with remingtons but acts like yours with cci

Nice picture.

Smokin_Gun
November 6, 2006, 11:55 AM
Franco, I have found that hammer seating or dowl seating the caps on the 1860 Army cleared that problem for me. Some say to buy a set of Treso or TRM(Ampco) Cones to cure that problem. But I haven't and seemigly cleared up the misfire problem. Sometime nipples(cone) do get mushroomed from use, a stone or file fixes um till they can be fixed no more. Then again my Pietta 1860 will take yur thumb off. But my Uberti 1851 has a lite spring and it fires CCI #11's hammer or dowl seated just fine everytime. Anyway all I use are CCI10's or 11's.
Like Mec said the cap has to fit the cone correctly. And if you try another Brand it may take care of your problem,... But ifin' it don't try the above method of seating caps.

Stickjockey
November 6, 2006, 12:01 PM
Where did you come up with a left-handed 1860?

Tommygunn
November 6, 2006, 12:16 PM
It's a mirror-image of the one underneath. Probably done with photoshop or some similar program.

stevenb
November 6, 2006, 08:31 PM
It's a mirror-image of the one underneath. Probably done with photoshop or some similar program.
__________________
MOLON LABE

I was wondering how long it would take for someone to notice that. Tommygun is right. It is just a mirror image of the original one. I use both paint shop pro and Adobe photoshop but man that photo shop has a much stepper learning curve. For the most part I use Paint Shop Pro for most of my graphics.:)

Franco2shoot
November 7, 2006, 12:03 PM
Smokin Gun,
Can you describe hammer seating? I'm as nervous as a long tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs when it comes to placing the hammer against a loaded cylinder w/percussion cap in place.

Also, I have never really looked at the seated cap to see how it fits over the nipple. Perhaps describing how that should look might be beneficial to us Newbies. I still don't really know the difference between the fit of a #10 versus a #11 what should I look for? I could practice placing a cap properly over a nipple in my back yard and touching it off without fear of the Local constable showing up and giving me a ticket for discharging a firearm in the city, although I'ld prolly only set one off.

Thanks to all for their assistance.

KKKKFL

Stickjockey
November 7, 2006, 12:58 PM
I kinda figured. forgot the :neener: smiley, though.

Would be kinda cool though, a lefty 1860.

mec
November 7, 2006, 02:26 PM
Hammer seating. Pressing the hammer down on the nipple to firmly seat the percussion cap. Some organized shoots don't allow this because of the possibility of setting off the charge

Dowel seating. Same thing only you used a wooden dowel to swage the primer down onto the cone.

I have a couple of revolvers with fairly light springs that won't set cci primers off even if I hammer seat them. All this talk of success by other posters caused me to revisit this ( that and the total cessation of percussion cap distritution by Remington). I learned that if I dowel seat them with a very great deal of pressure, they will fire reliably. This is a relief. Elmer Keith wrote about blistering his thumb pressing caps onto percussion rifles. the possibliity is there but it is likely that the earlier clorate and fulminate caps were more sensitive to this sort of pressure than the current stipenate caps. In any case, it is advisable to treat the gun as if it might fire during the process. and keep your hand back of the chambr when dowel seating.

Smokin_Gun
November 7, 2006, 04:22 PM
When Hammer seating or Dowl seating be certain that you place a cap on each cone first before proceeding.
Hammer seat; after capping all chambers guide the hammer down onto the indexed cap pushing hard forward with thumb(s) pressure. Maintaining the Rev pointed down range in a safe direction. If one were to go off, not likely but accidents happen, it'll go off down the barrel at full velosity.
Dowel seat; round on end of a wooden dowl for pushin' against the palm, cap or seating end flat. Cap each chamber then systematically go around the cylinder and press hard to seat each cap. If one where to go off in this method, it would go off the end of the chamber and glance the frame of the Rev,. Hardly any velosity and all. Still when loading/capping remember to keep your fingers from in front of the cylinder.
CCI#10's are smaller/tighter than CCI#11's. I even have better luck when use the larger #11's on a cone that may be a hair loose by squeezin and then seating them.

Franco2shoot
November 8, 2006, 11:04 AM
I think my problem is that I had the Uberti Remington first, and it works well with the 10's.... The Pietta 1860 Colt might have nipples that are just a little larger and I'm guessing that it will fire reliably with 11's, so that'll be my first experiment. The other thing I think I heard in this thread is that for the fulminate to explode it needs to be flat against the top of the nipple so that when the hammer strikes the cap, the shock and squeeze is what makes it flame. If the cap is just loosely on the nipple all that happens is the cap is forced down further, but there's not enough squeeze left to make the fulminate burn...

Is that a decent description of what happens? I'm a confessed newbie to all this, but sure enjoy learning from you old-timers.

KKKKFL

mec
November 8, 2006, 11:18 AM
"Is that a decent description of what happens?"

I think it is. I'm spoiled by just being able to thumb seat remington caps and getting good ignition. I have to really swage ccis to get the same but am relieved that this works.

At one time, I was messing with a crummy palmetton " Lincoln Derringer" with a very weak main spring. I stoned down caps to the point of foil thinness to get marginally improved ignition. I had to do about twice as much work on the ccis as the remingtons. I'm not saying this is a smart thing to do as it could set the caps off.

cdm15
November 12, 2006, 08:21 PM
My 1860 army peitta had a problem fireing cci #10's the store guy recommended, and I bought remington 11's and never looked back! There the same price here and work gloriously. Don-:barf:

stevenb
November 12, 2006, 09:04 PM
My 1860 army peitta had a problem fireing cci #10's the store guy recommended, and I bought remington 11's and never looked back! There the same price here and work gloriously. Don-

I have tried 10' and 11's on my Pietta 1860 and the 10's seem to fit mine better. Also I shot it for the first time today, how do you keep from getting the caps stuck in the action. This happened with both 10 and 11's but moreso with 11's. Sometimes they would fall inside the action beside the hammer. Otyher times the caps would get caught behind the cylinder as the cylinder was cycling. Any suggestions?

cdm15
November 12, 2006, 09:53 PM
sorry bubba, caps are made of copper I guess, and are very soft, no matter what you use-till they come out with steel ones, will break and fall all over-in your cylinder-its the nature of the beast. Don-

mec
November 12, 2006, 10:38 PM
cci number 11s are about the same size as remington 10s. A couple of my revolvers have light hammer falls and won't set off the ccis unless I dowel seat them with a great deal of pressure. This presents some level of danger that I will set off the charge while loading. Important to have the revolver pointed down range if you are going to do this.

The best bet for keeping fragments out of the action is to wipe the hammer channel free of fouling between loadings and hold the revolver down while cocking. at the end of the cocking cycle flip the revolver slightly over to the right to clear the fragment. A lot of people favor snapping the revolver straight up over head to fling the fragment clear of the action but this seems to just accentuate the problem of caps falling down into the action.

Tommygunn
November 13, 2006, 12:53 AM
how do you keep from getting the caps stuck in the action. This happened with both 10 and 11's but moreso with 11's. Sometimes they would fall inside the action beside the hammer. Otyher times the caps would get caught behind the cylinder as the cylinder was cycling. Any suggestions?

I have heard of two methods. One is to hold the revolver pointing forward, upside down, and as you cock it, twist it clockwise fairly slowly and supposedly this will allow the crushed cap to fling out. The downside is if you give the cylinder too much inertia it may overspin.
The second is to hold the revolver pointing upwards when you cock it, allowing (theoretically) a loosened cap to fall.
Be aware of safety concerns doing this. Some ranges don't like people pointing guns upward. If you shoot at such a range you can't use this technique.

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