.50BMG rifles


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antagonist22
November 8, 2006, 04:53 PM
Does anyone know any .50 cal rifles that do NOT have ANY of these features?

Pistol grip(although joined to the butt is ok)
Flash supressor
Bayonet lug
Folding buttstock
A magazine of more than 7 rounds

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Outlaws
November 8, 2006, 04:56 PM
The pistol grip is where you will have the most trouble getting one without.

Most companies though that make 50 BMG rifles are not huge companies and should be able to help you out with a custom order. There are plenty of single shot rifles out there.

Sharps-shooter
November 8, 2006, 05:02 PM
Hmmm. 50 caliber with none of those features. I suppose a flintlock Kentucky Longrifle might qualify. But I'm guessing BMG doesn't stand for "blackpowder muzzleloading gun", in this case.:rolleyes:

antagonist22
November 8, 2006, 05:08 PM
.50 Browning Machine Gun (12.7 99 mm NATO)

Mikee Loxxer
November 8, 2006, 05:15 PM
Yep, shot one this last July. It was a single shot, had a thumbhole stock, muzzle brake (not a flashider) and or course had no bayonet lug. I can't imagine anyone thinking a bayonet lug on a 50BMG rilfe would be remotely useful, the one I shot was more than four foot in length and weighed thirty some odd pounds.

This rifle was built on a receiver the owner had bought some time ago (don't remember the manufacturers name).

bartsimpson123844
November 8, 2006, 05:26 PM
Yes, CenterfireSystems, Inc. used to stock them. Here's a link: http://www.centerfiresystems.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=723

I guess they are now sold out...

I believe that at least meets a couple of your requirements. If you are looking for a .50 BMG that has none of those features, you won't find any.

Fosbery
November 8, 2006, 05:42 PM
Arctic Warfare 50 by Accuracy International of England

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/8420/aw50ly1.jpg

McMillan .50 by McMillan Bros. Rifles of USA

http://img489.imageshack.us/img489/4129/mcmillaneq0.jpg

RPA Interceptor .50 by RPA International of England

http://img366.imageshack.us/img366/2221/rpapz4.jpg

Banshee
November 8, 2006, 07:05 PM
http://www.mcbrosrifles.com/50_CAL_BMG.htm#50%20Cal%20Benchrest

these have none of the above but the Muzzle brake.

A muzzle brake it pretty much a requiment.

Anteater1717
November 8, 2006, 07:33 PM
why 7 rounds:scrutiny:
isnt the limit ten in most places

dragongoddess
November 8, 2006, 07:41 PM
"bayonet lug on a 50BMG rilfe"


This was funny. I saw in my head someone with an AR-50 running through a field with a bayonet on it. There is no need for one. You can use the bolt for a weapon. Its a solid 6 pounds of steel. Bound to give someone a headach if it was to come into contact with a human skull.

50 Shooter
November 8, 2006, 07:52 PM
STAY AWAY from that Centerfire Systems .50, it's a Hesse/Vulcan!!!

Funny how they have it listed as a "BFG-50".:uhoh:

bartsimpson123844
November 8, 2006, 07:54 PM
"STAY AWAY from that Centerfire Systems .50, it's a Hesse/Vulcan!!!"

May I ask why? Is it really THAT bad?

50 Shooter
November 8, 2006, 08:22 PM
You asked, this is from a post I put on another site. BUYER BEWARE!!!


I went over to the FCSA website to grab some info about "facts" posted by members.


I've seen this with my own eyes.
The guy that got me into 50s bought a Vulcan 50. Looked like a monster! Had a big laminated wood stock. Big fat barrel.
But.........after every 4-8 rounds it was blowing the firing pin spring. Also, the bolt was so hard to open after each shot, the bolt handle broke off at the weld.
After 3-4 springs, he realized the chamber was not finished correctly. The empties had a ring around them, like the chamber was very tight from the mouth, back to about .75'' below the shoulder.
He had a very hard time dealing with Vulcan. After finally agreeing to take the rifle back to be looked at, the guy decided to keep it and finish the chamber himself.
Thats where it stands now I think. I don't think he has done anything with it yet.[end quote]


HH bought one a while ago, and the tale is about a brutal lack of quality in finish and construction, and it's not even functioning out of the box. He returned it on sight. As I recall it was sent with two bolts, (???) the only reason appearing that one didn't fit and the other didn't function. Actually rather than repeat MY recollection of his tale (and he knows his stuff) I think his rendition is on one of the threads elsewhere on this site. If he wasn't buried with the VHP deadline right now I imagine he would have seen this post and sounded in already.
The trick is, then, to ask why there is no one who has seen or had one of these who speaks well of it. And those I know who have inspected samples describe dangerous defects in function and deplorable construction.

I note this is my opinion from what I have read and been told by those whose opinion I value, and for these reasons I never had or will own one. So, if you are with Vulcan and get your underwear in a bunch about my post, remember that the truth is an absolute defense, and my truth is that I have never heard from anyone who had one who was pleased with it.[end quote]


I had one of the early model Hesse 50 bmg rifles, got it in 2000 .
Most everything posted about the rifle so far,except the blowing-up part, is true according to my experience.
I tweaked mine and turned it into a fairly nice rifle.

Problems that were fixed:
1. Original bolt handle broke, built another one of my own design.

2. Poor chambering job, rechambered and headspaced.

3. Trigger (mauser 98) was epoxied to the receiver, did some machine work, drill and tap mostly and remounted a BOLD trigger with a safety.

4. Sanded some rough and sharp edges from the stock and re-finished.

5. Stuck cases, no cam on the bolt. Added a bar externally to the receiver so that the bolt would cam the case free.

6. Fitting of the stock to the receiver was accomplished with a lot of acraglass to fill in the voids. (no repair necessary, just poor fit-up).

7. I wasn't unhappy with the rifle, but SOLD it anyway.

I would buy another one, but would not pay a premium price.
From pictures of the new Vulcan rifles, it is obvious that they have added an extractor cam to the receiver and the new models may be better built.

It kind of reminds me of a 1969 Triumph Bonneville motorcycle I used to ride when I was a young adult. My Dad never worried about me riding it much since it was in the shop more than it was on the street.

Anyway, this is my two-cents about the Hesse/Vulcan Arms 50 bmg. [end quote]


Ok, I'll confess. I bought a Vulcan.
Its about 4-5 months old and has had about 300 rounds through it.
I dont see a problem with fit or finish but it aint that great. Maybe because its newer?
I have NO problem with accuracy. It does pretty good after the expensive cheek piece and a good Luepold scope.
I have a HUGE problem with the bolt and with Vulcan.
Last Vulcan ever! Period. Poor service and many e-mails later they tell me I can send it in....if I want too... but wont tell me there is a problem or they will fix it. This is at MY expense!!!

The big problem is the bolt. When chambering a round, if I am not extremely careful and put any downward pressure on the bolt handle, the bolt will lock up and freeze but...and this is dangerous and deadly as I told them in my e-mail...THE FIRING PIN COMES OUT BEFORE THE ROUND IS CHAMBERED!!!!

I dont see how I can fix this myself as its a design problem. This is enough to scare the hell out of me whenever I chamber a round. It may be the last round I ever chamber if that baby fires outside the chamber.

If I am very careful, pay 100% attention to something as trivial as loading a round (I shouldnt) then I am happy with it. It really does shoot good.

Its getting traded in for an AR50 ASAP!!!!!! My gun dealer has already ordered and dang, I took a loss on the Vulcan.[end quote]


I have the Vulcan and reported about some problems that are potentially fatal for the shooter or bystander.
First of all I want EVERYBODY to know that Vulcan/Hesse service, warranty and customer satisfaction is a freakin joke! Worst of any gun manufacturer I've ever dealt with. They would not accept the fact that I had a problem and would not issue me a return authorization ticket. Not even if I sent it on my own dollar would they look at it!
This is an exact quote. "Save your money and ours. The gun is perfect. You are shooting the wrong ammo. We dont want to see the bolt"
I had gunsmiths look at it. The bolt face was bad.
As far as the firing pin coming out before the bolt was fully locked....now THAT was a problem I wasnt going to accept.
This really sucks to have to do this to a gun that was under warranty but I fixed its shortcomings.
Dont laugh at this. It worked perfectly. If the bolt handle was pushed down slightly while pushing it forward to lock, it would "lock" up and the firing pin would spring out. The pin didnt hit with full force but enough to dent the primers. Scary stuff!!! So I did something simple that the factory should have done. I took a piece of metal from an ammo can, cut, polished, shaped, and attached it to the receiver with two 8X32 hex head screws. Problem solved. The bolt handle can not be pushed down until it is fully forward.
The bolt face. Ok..dont laugh again. Since Vulcan wouldnt fix it and the primers flowed back enough to pierce a primer and break the firing pin spring, I fixed it too. I am absolutely, positively ashamed of my repair but it has worked for over 100 rounds without a hint of a problem.
Actually it works great. Its JB weld in the center of the bolt where the firing pin comes out. It holds the pressure and heat without a problem. Its a lot of work to make a crappy gun safe to shoot and work I shouldnt have to do.
I feel safer and it does shoot pretty good. No problems since the fix. The firing pin spring came from Ace Hardware.[end quote]
***These are some of the problems, not only is the rifle questionable but Hesse/Vulcan has the worst rep in the gun industry. Why people continue to buy their crap is beyond me.

Outlaws
November 8, 2006, 08:30 PM
I recall reading that the 50 cal matches require all Vulcan rifles to be inspected prior to the match due to their terrible reputation.

50 Shooter
November 8, 2006, 08:47 PM
I think they have been banned from FCSA sanctioned matches along with Dominican Rep. yellow tip ammo.

garrett1955
November 8, 2006, 09:07 PM
would something like this fit your fancy?
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/5464/bberthafullcu0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


That is a State Arms rifle. Larry will put a wood stock on any of the rifles he makes. They really are works of art, and they shoot great too.

www.statearms.com

I have a Rebel with the aluminum stock.

antagonist22
November 8, 2006, 11:00 PM
why 7 rounds
isnt the limit ten in most places

Oh, in New Zealand,fitting any centrefire rifle with more than 7 rounds classifies it as a "Military Style Semi-Automatic"

Any firearm that has any of the following:

centrefire of more than 7 rounds
bayonet lug
flash supressor
pistol grip
folding buttstock

will be classified as a "Military Style Semi-automatic" in New Zealand.But any firearm without any of those features will be able to be purphased and shot by people with standard firearms license in NZ.

Not going to go on, but if you want to know more about arms control in NZ then I will be happy to start a new thread.

Jim Watson
November 8, 2006, 11:04 PM
Even if it is not of semi-automatic action? The guns shown are bolt actions.

A muzzle brake as on most is not a flash hider. Some make the flash (and blast) worse.

The Deer Hunter
November 8, 2006, 11:36 PM
http://mauser.org/rifles/blackarrow/index.htm

you could probably have a non-pistol grip stock made

yhtomit
November 9, 2006, 12:03 AM
Anytime someone has some insight to share re: the gun laws in any particular country, I think it's a good topic worthy of a new thread; I am guilty of assuming sometimes that what's true in Australia is true in New Zealand (and I'm on the other side of the globe, with the regular, North American system of gravity, too).

timothy

Fosbery
November 9, 2006, 12:36 PM
Do none of the rifles so far fit the bill?

I believe all the ones I posted, as well as the State Arms rifles meet all the requirements, and are bolt action, not semiautomatic.

Odd Job
November 9, 2006, 01:04 PM
@ Antagonist22

Yes please, do start another thread about what you can and cannot own in NZ. I am definitely interested.

MatthewVanitas
November 9, 2006, 01:11 PM
@ antagonist:

Do "thumbhole" stocks qualify as "pistol grips" in NZ? That would make a huge difference in our recommendations.

Here are some interesting options from SSK Industries. They have an outstanding rep in the T/C Contender community, and make some pretty innovative products and cartridges?

Do you handload? Here's what they tout for their .50 wildcat:

50 Peacekeeper = 88% of a 50 browning from a 23" barrel plus brake in a 13-14 pound rifle. Recoil is not as bad as most 35 pound 50 BMG rifles. It does 2400 FPS with a 650 and 2200+ with a 750 hornady with excellent accuracy.

They'll build you .50 BMG or .50 Peacemaker rifles in all kinds of flavors. Heck, they'll build you practically anything you can imagine.

I imagine they come a bit dear, but you might find their website interesting:

http://www.sskindustries.com/50.htm

Cheers,

-MV

DoubleTapDrew
November 9, 2006, 01:32 PM
The McMillan rifles are very nice and fit the bill (as long as they don't consider a muzzle brake a flash hider...it's more of a flash enhancer :p )
I can't say I've ever seen a .50 with a bayonet lug, or folding stock (OUCH!)

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