[Poplin]

Hello Friends:

A while back, I picked up a nice police trade-in Wingmaster 870. It has a Chaote extended mag tube. I haven't yet fired it (or any other shotgun, ever, for that matter), but I have managed to jam it up pretty good.

I loaded it up with dummy rounds and it functioned well for a while before jamming. Anyway, it appears a shell has been fed from the magazine but has hung up just above the lifter. The bolt is closed on another dummy round. The slide release looks halfway engaged.

I dropped the firing pin, but nothing happened. I took off the mage tube end and its contents spewed out. Everything is still robustly stuck. Help!

[Poplin]

http://www.platoscave.com/~simon/jam.JPG

http://www.platoscave.com/~simon/magtube.JPG

[Phyphor]

Have you tried to drift out the 2 pins holding the trigger group in?

Knock those out, and pull the trigger group, the round should fall out.

[Badger Arms]

Ensure that the safety is on first and that the gun is pointed in a safe direction. Dummy rounds or not, you can never be sure and don't stake your life on it. I concur that you should drift out the trigger mechanism pins and pull the mechanism down out of the gun. The extra round should drop out and your action will be open to allow you to eject the one in the chamber.

[Dave McCracken]

Before dropping the trigger group, hold it vertically with muzzle down and tap on the butt with a hammer handle. That should let the shell drop out. If not, drop the TG.

To avoid repeats, make sure when loading to push the shell in until you feel the click as it goes past the shell latches.

HTH....

[Lone Star]

Dave-

Thanks so much for that advice. I had a 20 ga. M870 a couple of years ago that had this sort of problem. A gunsmith had to polish the inside of the magazine tube, which was on the tight side, and it fed a little better after, but I got a number of those jams when the gun was new. It was a factor in my selling it.

I always had to remove the trigger group to clear this vexing jam. I plan to eventually get another M870, and if it happens, will try tapping on the butt.

But, how can the round drop out if you tap the butt when the lifter is under it??? Do you mean to remove the trigger group first, after all?

Thanks,

Lone Star

[Dave McCracken]

Vertical, muzzle down, and tap.

Also, I'd put 2-500 rounds through most shotguns before considering selling one due to glitches.

[Poplin]

Dear Friends:

Many thanks to you all for your suggestions; the THR / TFL community always comes through. My gun was quickly unjammed after I removed the trigger group. I shoulda thought of that myself!

Unfortunately, I can replicate the malfunction easily. I need only to load a shell into the magazine--and not quite push hard enough. I think the shell latch fails to hold the shell in the mag, the lifter falls back down into place, and the mag spring pushes the shell in the space between the bolt and the lifter. My original malfunction had the shell halfway in the mag and still under tension from the mag spring. It is also possible to have the shell completely out of the mag and rattling in the gun.

Very vexing indeed! There is no way to clear this jam without disassembly. Is this a known problem that needs to be overcome with technique or might I have some part out of tune? This worries me, as I am inexperienced with shotguns and would be nervous having this happen with live rounds in the field, not to mention in a dangerous situation.

[Intel6]

This is a very common problem with the 870 and is usually caused by the operator not pushing the shell all the way into the magazine. I did it a few times when I first got my 870. If this is still happening after you have definitly inserted the shell all the way in then you might have a problem with you shell interceptor latch. If you play around with the dummy shells cycling the action slowly you will quickly see how it works. One of the shell latches only lets one shell out of the mag tube at a time and the other holds that shell until the bolt gets to the rear of it travel and then it is released. There may be a problem with one of these latches?

This problem has been solved by Remington and now all 870's have a new shell lifter which has what is called a flex tab. This permits the shell that is halfway on the shell lifter to flex down just a bit to provide a bit of room for the bolt to ride over it and close so the 870 won't get jammed up like your did. It is a small 3 sided cut on the shell lifter. Go to a local gun store a look for a new 870 and you will see the flex tab lifter. You can buy a new lifter with the flex tab and retrofit your 870 so it has it.

[Dave McCracken]

Each time you load, make sure to push the shell forward until one feels and hears that click.

I had run thousands of rounds through 870s before I leartned this could happen. Good loading technique works.

[RussB]

Could this be a problem with the Dummy shells themselves?

What kind of "dummies" are you using?

[SRYnidan]

Intel6 has hit it right on the head with this one. I just want to add that this was a pretty common problem before flex tabs came out (inspired by the S&W 3000) and gets worse if you need to reload in a hurry (SD, practical competition, or when someone is shooting back). The flex tab is a good investment. I your life is on the line you can almost always clear this type of Jam by grasping the forend firmly and stirking the butt on the ground but is hard on the gun to do it very often.

[Duke of Lawnchair]

Ouch...

That's a nasty jam in an 870.

[Blain]

I've had this same malfunction, several times with 870s and snap caps. I have found that the round that is stuck above the lifter and be forced back into the magazine tube. This is the easiest and fastest way to fix the problem.


Also, where can one buy flex tabs? I've never heard of them before.