AR-15: Carbine or Rifle for SHTF?


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Kenshin
November 26, 2006, 09:58 PM
If you had two AR-15s on hand when the SHTF, which would you elect to take as your weapon?

The 16" barrel carbine?

Or the 20" barrel rifle?

Poll to your liking. Apply the question to yourself and your surroundings.

DON'T mention other rifles in this poll. This is a what-if with only AR's available to you.

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LkWinnipesaukee
November 26, 2006, 10:13 PM
If by SHTF you mean HD, then get the carbine.

Heavy Metal Hero
November 26, 2006, 10:16 PM
Well the carbine has all the practical range and accuracy you would need...

Kenshin
November 26, 2006, 10:25 PM
A carbine would also blind you in the event of a night fight.....some people can;t afford/aren't allowed to have flash suppressors, remember that.

Oh, and I mean SHTF as in society's collapse.

Glockfan.45
November 26, 2006, 10:31 PM
Tough choice. In the total collapse of law and order and long term civil disorder I would go with the full length 20" barrel. Four more inches isnt going to bother you much, and the added barrel length would lend itself to being a better game getter over the long road.

Kenshin
November 26, 2006, 11:01 PM
True. And to tell you the truth, I'd rather flee to the countryside when it all comes down, and the rifle covers the distance in the country better than the carbine.

GoRon
November 26, 2006, 11:13 PM
I'd rather flee to the countryside when it all comes down, and the rifle covers the distance in the country better than the carbine.

You sure the people in the countryside will be happy to see you?

I said carbine. I live in the burbs.

If I lived in the country I would go with a 308 or other 30 cal.

marksman13
November 26, 2006, 11:20 PM
+1 for the 20 incher. Hated carrying an M4 in the sandbox. I'll take the M16 A4 any day.

Grunt
November 26, 2006, 11:24 PM
Well, I like the compact barrel of my M-4 for close in handling ease. While I would normally say it depends on what your AO is should determin the barrel length you would want, in open areas where the longer barrel length isn't an issue and does give you an edge in velocity, you are still dealing with a .223 and the terminal ballistics just isn't there with this caliber. Nah, in the range that the .223 is still a somewhat effective round, you are just as well served with an M-4 length barrel.

Kenshin
November 26, 2006, 11:34 PM
You never know when that little extra velocity may help you...

Dienekes
November 27, 2006, 12:15 AM
I recently voted with my money and it said carbine. Among other things it handles pretty well inside the cab of a compact pickup. Try that with the rifle...

With a good sighting system and good trigger the M4gery will reach out to the practical limits of the 5.56 cartridge.

The carbine looks substantially more evil than the rifle which can be beneficial. When I took my Colt CAR-15 along on drug raids in the mid-80s it had a calming effect on things. FWIW...

noresttill
November 27, 2006, 12:32 AM
the ar15 is modular, so you could get just an upper and use the same bolt/carrier. while your at home, make it a carbine. If you move, strap on the upper.

I would buy a carbine first though, good to about 200 yards right?

Jesse

10-Ring
November 27, 2006, 12:42 AM
The added barrel length won't buy you any more accuracy, just more velocity. That said, I went w/ a 16" middy for mine and haven't found any reason to regret that decision.

Stiletto Null
November 27, 2006, 12:43 AM
Carbine. An RRA Entry Tactical is nice and handy, and is something like 36" with the stock extended to something comfortable.

The full-length M16A2/4 is right around 40" long...and my FN49 (which is much more authoritative, and better fits the performance criteria for a "rifle") is 42" long. And is a lot more comfortable.

lycanthrope
November 27, 2006, 12:59 AM
Well I have a 16" with an Eotech and a 20" with a 1.5x5 scope and the 3 gun timer says the 20" is faster.

I'd have never thought so, but it is.

Point shoot at living room distance and everything out deep makes up the difference.

No doubt in my mind. Period.

Aikibiker
November 27, 2006, 01:20 AM
If it is the end of the world that means I am gonna have to start living with th edarn thing. I'll take the carbine and pull off all the modular junk that tends to accumulate on M4geries as well. If I have to carry it to the bathroom and be climbing in and out of vehicles (while the gas lasts) and god knows what else I want it to be as light and handy as possible.

marksman13
November 27, 2006, 01:29 AM
I would buy a carbine first though, good to about 200 yards right?


Good to about 300, but not as good as a rifle in my experience...I just don't shoot the M4 very well...I suppose rifles are just like pistols...you just gotta go with what feels right.

up_onus
November 27, 2006, 03:30 AM
hmm, where do you live? what kind of shtf? these questions are sooo dang variable...

for example, is it your only rifle? do you plan to possibley HUNT with it?
do you live in a city? plan to use it more "tactically"?

this is only the beginning of the list...but is 4 inches gunna make the difference????? which is MORE versatile...can do more?

reacurring theme...EVERY GUN HAS ITS PURPOSE, and some fit the purpose better than others, make your next shtf question a lil more "explainative"

Zach S
November 27, 2006, 09:32 AM
Carbine. An RRA Entry Tactical is nice and handy, and is something like 36" with the stock extended to something comfortable.
I've got my stock pushed in a little more, its right around 34" overall.

david_the_greek
November 27, 2006, 11:05 AM
i'll take carbine. I'm in an urban/suburban setting and I don't see the need for the extra couple inches. the shorter length would help for slipping under a long coat or shooting in and around my home. plus its what I have and frankly I can barely afford to be a mall ninja with only one ar, to buy and outfit a whole new rifle would kill me.

TexasRifleman
November 27, 2006, 11:17 AM
If I lived in the country I would go with a 308 or other 30 cal.

Agree with that. The rifle buys you nothing. If you need that kind of distance you don't need 5.56 anyway.

Lobotomy Boy
November 27, 2006, 01:50 PM
I voted carbine, but when I voted with my own money, I opted for a "dissipator" configuration--16" barrel with a full-length gas tube and M4 stock. I've jumped in and out of pickups with various guns my entire life, and for me the agility afforded by the carbine is worth much more than a minor ballistical difference. You get a good head shot and a couple of hundred FPS aren't going to make a hill of beans worth of difference.

Essex County
November 27, 2006, 03:38 PM
I have found that the 16" is a whole bunch handier....Essex

Eightball
November 27, 2006, 05:43 PM
The 10" bbl with a supressor is obviously the most superior; mounted on an armored, 1-wheel conveyance system that happens to be extroadinarily bouyent (sp?) as you can float down a river to safety is the ultimate solution :neener:

I'd take the plain-jane M16A2 style. With a stainless barrel. Plenty handy enough, and will get the job done, accurately.

arthurcw
November 27, 2006, 06:05 PM
The 10" bbl with a supressor is obviously the most superior; mounted on an armored, 1-wheel conveyance system that happens to be extroadinarily bouyent (sp?) as you can float down a river to safety is the ultimate solution

*SNORT!!!*

I go through more Keyboards here!

VIVA EL GUNKID!

I vote Middy Carbine for urban / HD and something bigger for country settings. The middy carbine (I want one!) seems to have the best Swiss army gun potential of the AR variants. Fun to shoot at the range, good for closer work, you can have poodles for din-din should society collapse, and it scares the bageesus out of the in-laws. Win - win if you ask me.

Then if you have the $$ and time, buy other uppers and conversion kits and have a blast.

While SHTF is a consideration, a gun should have some practical use... even if that use is, "it makes me smile when I pet it," or, "every time you buy and AR, Little Sarah One Note kills a kitten."

The Deer Hunter
November 27, 2006, 06:30 PM
If society collapses i would take the 16" and make full auto. BTW i dont know how to do that.

Lonestar.45
November 27, 2006, 07:03 PM
Carbine, no question, because:

a) that's all I have; and

b) no way am I going to play sniper during a SHTF situation and shoot more than 200-300yds anyway (more likely 50 and less), so a rifle sized AR would not offer any benefit IMHO.

Boats
November 27, 2006, 07:50 PM
Something about the end of "civil society" or "end of the world" and "I'll take an AR" doesn't compute to me.

The AR owes its popularity in part to being at the end of a very comprehensive world of either military or civilian supply chains and/or support services.

The AR is the military rifle of the civilized world. At the end of that world I would want something a lot more up to the task of operating without depots, reinforces fire discipline and ammo conservation, could kill large game with one shot, and would probably come with a manually operated bolt and also serves as a credible HTH combat threat.

To each his own I guess.

Juna
November 27, 2006, 08:49 PM
Given the choice between those two, I'd opt for the carbine. Smaller, lighter, still has reasonable range. It's difficult (but not impossible) to fathom why I'd be shooting someone at 300 yards if the SHTF. I'd rather get the F.O.D. and keep my family safe than get into a gun fight unless I had to. Plus, I live in the suburbs right now, and CQB would be more likely than long range shoot-outs.

Lobotomy Boy
November 27, 2006, 08:49 PM
The question was between two versions of the AR. If I expanded it to any one gun, long gun or handgun, I'd go with a good 12-gauge pump, like a Remington 870, Benelli Nova, or Mossberg 500. That is the ultimate all-purpose, any-situation survival weapon, bar none.

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