BATF Gun Room


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selector67
December 1, 2006, 04:04 AM
Found this on another site, thought I might share it here. Just makes me sad seeing all those confiscated guns.:eek: I'd love to go play in there.:D But to be serious, if we just sit back and allow the government to slowy erode our right to keep and bear arms, than all of us might find our firearms in this room one day!!If you got high speed click the first link, if you got dial-up click the second. http://bimmer.roadfly.com/bmw/forums/test/8098907-1.html http://www.davehayes.org/v/guns/batf/?g2_page=1

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Don't Tread On Me
December 1, 2006, 04:39 AM
Disgusting.

Those should be in the hands of free citizens.

It is amazing what these JBT's have confiscated, and that's just the stuff they're showing.

Who knows the amount of firearms taken from people because of issues with their NFA license....I wonder how many have been confiscated because the owners passed away and never transferred it to a willing party or for other reasons justified or not justified.

There's no reason for them to keep this cache. None. No technical reason at all. This is the BATFE's trophy room, their shrine of thuggery. That organization is perhaps the worst of all govt organizations when it comes to clannish mentality, us vs. them thinking and a general attitude civilians are scum and should be disarmed. They have that so they can say to themselves "look at what we took"...:barf: .


Every American should shed a tear when they see that, because there is nothing "cool" or "neat" about it. That is the equivalent of seeing a picture of dead people after a government atrocity. It is like seeing a funeral. In each case, liberty was attacked. The very fact that these arms are in their possession is a testament to the fact that the 2nd Amendment is on its last legs. If the 2nd Amendment stood, like it did in our founders days....those pictures would not exist. Those aren't pictures of firearms, those are photos of the death of liberty.


Not all of those firearms were taken from drug dealers or mobsters. There are quite a few collectibles there....

Jefferson is rolling in his grave.

Thanks for the pics though. Much appreciated.

Evil Monkey
December 1, 2006, 04:56 AM
+1,000,000,000,000 x infinite for Don't Tread On Me.

Man they even have things that would never be in civilian hands anyway, like the freakin' Chinese QBZ-95!!!!!!!!

http://members.roadfly.com/agent7/BATF%20Gun%20Room/DSC00003.jpg

antagonist22
December 1, 2006, 05:03 AM
What a horrible sight it is.

Even the guys in the photos(who are suppose to be working for BATF) look like they are enjoying their time in there.


Man they even have things that would never be in civilian hands anyway, like the freakin' Chinese QBZ-95!!!!!!!!

Thats what I thought. How the heck did they get that into the U.S?!!!

Frog48
December 1, 2006, 05:23 AM
Lots of guns that were stolen from their rightful owners. After you get over the initial "wow" factor of all the cool hardware those pics, the true nature of the situation hits you. The BATFE is a disgrace.

Erinyes
December 1, 2006, 06:00 AM
Dang. That's a crying shame. A couple of those almost brought a tear to my. To think all of those historic pieces sit and rot in a gov'ment storage facility, never to touch the hands of a mere serf ever again. :(

GunnySkox
December 1, 2006, 06:00 AM
The NFA MG registry ought to be reopened, and those things ought to be auctioned back to the citizenry. I'd be about the first worthwhile thing the ATF ever did.

What's what screwy looking MG on he wall underneath the chauchat?

~GnSx

selector67
December 1, 2006, 07:53 AM
That is a French 7.5x54mm Chatellerault FM 24-29 Light machine gun, produced from 1930 to 1940,there version of a Bren gun.:scrutiny:

GunnySkox
December 1, 2006, 07:56 AM
Woah, crazy. Thanks, Selector.

~GnSx

SDC
December 1, 2006, 08:54 AM
You also have to remember that before any firearm can be approved for import, ATFE gets at least two examples for their collection so they can see how easy it is to convert, etc. This is only a TINY part of their entire collection. One of the really rare oddballs in that series is the Hotchkiss Universal, a foldable submachinegun.
Open:
http://www.m201jeep.co.uk/smg-1.jpg
Closed:
http://www.m201jeep.co.uk/smg-2.jpg

LaEscopeta
December 1, 2006, 09:05 AM
Hey! Are these StG 44s?

http://members.roadfly.com/agent7/BATF%20Gun%20Room/DSC00054.jpg

Also, this is what I want:

http://members.roadfly.com/agent7/BATF%20Gun%20Room/DSC00064.jpg

Ian
December 1, 2006, 09:18 AM
&&$#@s have a Neostad, too. :cuss:

Glockfan.45
December 1, 2006, 09:21 AM
A freakin mini-gun, Krinkovs, AUGs, a FAMAS, Mg34/42s, thompsons, some ungodly anti-tank rifle, USAS12's. After I finished pleasuring myself to these pics I threw up at the though of them rusting away in the bowels of the JBT's lair. All this property should be returned to its rightful owners.

wacki
December 1, 2006, 09:40 AM
http://members.roadfly.com/agent7/BATF%20Gun%20Room/DSC00064.jpg


What is this one? LOL at the gun cop promoting the sales of firearms with his FN t-shirt.

Roadwild17
December 1, 2006, 09:40 AM
I think this will stir the stuff so please don't ban me or anything, but I don't see a need to some of that stuff to be in available to the average Joe. I mean yeah it would be the coolest thing in the world to rock an auto sbr at the range or to be reenactments with a MG42 or MP44, but I believe you should have a very good reason to own something like that.

There is also stuff in there that has me wondering, like the broom-handle mouser ?? pistols of the double barrel shotguns? (assuming the bbl is at least 18")

rbernie
December 1, 2006, 09:52 AM
but I believe you should have a very good reason to own something like that.

How can you say that, with a sig that reads:The second amendment, it’s not about hunting!

<sigh> We have met the enemy, and he are us.

.45Guy
December 1, 2006, 09:55 AM
What is this one? LOL at the gun cop promoting the sales of firearms with his FN t-shirt
Looks like a refined Winter Swatriplex. 2x9 round tubes. Neat gun.

LaEscopeta
December 1, 2006, 10:00 AM
What is this one? LOL at the gun cop promoting the sales of firearms with his FN t-shirt.It is an upside down and backwards plastic slide action shotgun:

http://world.guns.ru/shotgun/sh08-e.htm

And it is my holy grail firearm.

(Also, several of the people in the other photo have "visitor" badges, so I don't think all of them are BATF agents/employees.)

TexasRifleman
December 1, 2006, 10:01 AM
OK, I was sorta suspicious til the guy in the FN shirt, now I'm REALLY suspicious.

Where exactly is the proof that this is ATF?

I'd be more inclined to believe a private collection, maybe even one outside the USA.

ATF wouldn't give 2 cents for getting something dirty, why the white gloves?

That's museum treatment folks, someone that wants to preserve the value of the weapons.

Might be ATF but the IDs are all hard to read. I'm skeptical at least.

FM2Wildcat
December 1, 2006, 10:07 AM
Ok, I'll take the gatling gun and that street sweeper, also a plasma rifle in the 40mm range.

Hey,only what you see on the shelf pal.. :cool:

wacki
December 1, 2006, 10:14 AM
***deleted****

david_the_greek
December 1, 2006, 10:16 AM
so who wants to plan a SHTF bugout to their headquaters with me? I'm sure their agents will be so busy stealing law abiding citizens only means of self defense that they won't have enough guards/won't notice a few "sheeple" wandering around:evil:

BigFunWMU
December 1, 2006, 10:18 AM
Seriously, this is how our 2A rights get eroded in the first place.

But here is my need: the Second Amendment was intended to ensure that citizens be able to be armed equivalently to the militaries of the world. To that end, ALL citizens should have unresricted access to any personal arm they can afford.

Furthermore, if our purchasing must be need based, say goodbye to designer clothes, sports cars, SUVs, gourmet food, ladies makeup, and everybody's deodorant. 'Cause when you get right to it, we don't NEED that stuff either.

/rant

You think we could get a tax cut if they raised enough cash selling that stuff off?

Zullo74
December 1, 2006, 10:24 AM
This badge is pretty clear to me!

http://members.roadfly.com/agent7/BATF%20Gun%20Room/DSC00096.jpg

Manedwolf
December 1, 2006, 10:24 AM
This, to me, is the most IRONIC pistol in their collection. The WWII Liberator .45, designed to be dropped in mass quantities on Axis-occupied countries for resistance forces to use to fight back.

http://members.roadfly.com/agent7/BATF%20Gun%20Room/DSC00036.jpg

And it's kept in a place of oppression, after being taken from someone?

clarence222
December 1, 2006, 10:32 AM
I have one of those liberators it was one my favorite pieces, and I agree it is a shame that they have all of those I agree they should open up the regstry again and let us have at them

Kontiki
December 1, 2006, 11:00 AM
Man they could make a killing just auctioning all this off.

jmorris
December 1, 2006, 11:07 AM
Don’t see the need? You say why? I say why not?

We were shooting a friends class 3 Mac 10 this past 4th of July weekend down at our farm. After a few shooters, my mother in law asked “What’s the purpose for that gun?” I asked her, “What was the purpose for the fireworks last night?” I think this is a fair analogy, as neither serves a “practical” purpose, but both are fun ways to celebrate the freedom Americans have or at least had, in some cases. You have to be licensed for the “good” fireworks just as in firearms.

Seancass
December 1, 2006, 11:13 AM
it would seem they are going to distroy all those any day now wouldnt it? can you imagine the uproar: "NFA to release 1000 full auto weapons to public." sure its legal and our right, but the media would explode.

edit: oh yeah, and NOT THE TOMMY GUNS!!!!!!!!!!

Manedwolf
December 1, 2006, 11:18 AM
If nothing else, the Constitutionally-obtained ones (the two required for certification and those obtained only in unquestionably justified circumstances) should be in a public-trust National Museum of Firearms as grand as any of the Smithsonians...no political commentary allowed, either, just the cold facts of history about each one. The rest should be returned to the public at auction. The only firearms museum in the capitol area is the NRA's.

These should at least all be intact and in full public view to enjoy, not hidden away for only guests of BATFE JBTs to enjoy. And any obtained under circumstances with the least legal question at all should be made available for sale, with perhaps the proceeds earmarked to ONLY be used for such things as buying armor for troops currently deployed, and things like C-legs for the wounded returning veterans. Period.

I would even think that such a museum could have some really valuable history lessons for Americans...perhaps something like a range where people, equipped with hearing protection, could purchase a ticket for the cost of ordnance and then fire things from a replica Brown Bess musket to a current M-16, to see what it was and is really like for the people who fight for their freedoms. It wouldn't be hard to design a Steadicam-derived rig that would let them shoulder a rifle but not let them turn it away from the target, for safety. I think they'd get a healthy dose of respect, AND lose some fear of firearms.

carlrodd
December 1, 2006, 11:23 AM
those guys don't seem to be ATF, but visitors, as that is what their badges say. i don't know how they would be able to get access to that room, but whatever. if they truly believe in the 2nd, then they should be ashamed for having their goofy, grinning mugs posted all over the internet in pictures taken in that place. it's not a neato showroom; t's criminal that it even exists. 'freedom-loving civilians' happily visiting such a place seems no different to me than 'art lovers' joyfully visiting a nazi stolen art cache, and having their pictures taken with masterpieces. sickening.

xd9fan
December 1, 2006, 12:23 PM
Free country?.....free from whom??

Bet the JBT's get to shoot some of them too.

bender
December 1, 2006, 12:28 PM
I don't see what's wrong with the old broomhandle mausers with the stocks on them... C&R aren't they ?

Blackfork
December 1, 2006, 12:37 PM
I see those racks of guns and think how many ruined lives, bankrupted families, and shattered dreams those firearms represent, and how many promotions, raises, awards and commendations the agents got for destroying those American lives.

These are the people who are eager to arrest, ruin, kill, or lock up any one of us in here.

As one agent said after the Davidian Raid: "Just good people trying to do their jobs."

The BATFE should be abolished. Instead, Bush has given them a big new building and a fat budget and told them to get after us.

Manedwolf
December 1, 2006, 12:56 PM
They were given the "e" in 2002, and moved from the Treasury to Justice, allowing them access to millions more records without question.

HiroProX
December 1, 2006, 01:21 PM
:eek:

The ATF: A greater hive of scum and villainy you will never find.

soul_rapier
December 1, 2006, 02:19 PM
:barf: you know these guys got to be NAZI's they can't be true americans i don't know anyone would work for these guys and take some one guns for just anything like these guys do .And you just know it just a matter of time for they start coming for your guns its going to get worse .I seen mp40's bars and stens in that bunch of stolen guns . NOW are there any reason WHY they just can't convert them all to legal counter part and just sale them back to the public. For those people saying they don't see why or should not have these guns what would you say if some one says that about your stuff you like or love sounds like to me that you people are for gun control and shouldn't be allowed to be part of any gun forum but thats just my opinion . :cuss: :fire: sorry but i get a little upset when they let idiots have guns thats why the rest of us gotta pay for there mistakes

cracked butt
December 1, 2006, 02:31 PM
Why all the sickness, digust, and disdain for the ATF? One of the guys had a FN shirt on- I'm guessing he's a gun guy and would love to play with those toys too.

The ATF doesn't make the rules that put those firearms there, its every citizen in this country who ever voted for an antigun politician who did. The ATF doesn't make the rules, they enforce the laws that elected representatives of the people make.

Be thankful that at least these fine firearms ar ebeing preserved somewhere instead of being chopped up as Fat Teddy would have them do if he had his way.

If you want your children and grandchildren to gawk at such unattainable firearms such as remington 700s (sniper rifles you know), wincheter 94s (cop killer armor piercing bullet repeater), ARs, AKs, Garands, handguns, pump and semiauto shotguns, and anything else more powerful than a Daisy Red Rider 50 years from now, keep voting for Dummycrats, Rhinos and other flaovers of socialists.

Veprman
December 1, 2006, 02:36 PM
I want to know where the FAMAS came from. I wasent aware any where transferable.

dasmi
December 1, 2006, 02:41 PM
I wonder how many guns are "misplaced" at the BATFE gun room each year?

soul_rapier
December 1, 2006, 02:44 PM
i'd say a lot of them were misplaced over the years .

Manedwolf
December 1, 2006, 02:56 PM
Why all the sickness, digust, and disdain for the ATF? One of the guys had a FN shirt on- I'm guessing he's a gun guy and would love to play with those toys too.

Yes, and they can go and confiscate any they want! Why, they even have lists of whom they can confiscate them from, in registry states!

The ATF doesn't make the rules that put those firearms there, its every citizen in this country who ever voted for an antigun politician who did. The ATF doesn't make the rules, they enforce the laws that elected representatives of the people make.

At the risk of Godwin's law, I'd say that's like saying that an SS trooper wasn't responsible for their actions, that it was Hitler's fault or the German people who put him in power. He gave the directives, but people signed up and proudly stomped around wearing the lightning bolt, being vicious thugs for him. Same with ATF agents. Ever see them hassling law-abiding purchasers and dealers at shows?

PotatoJudge
December 1, 2006, 03:30 PM
"For those people saying they don't see why or should not have these guns what would you say if some one says that about your stuff you like or love sounds like to me that you people are for gun control and shouldn't be allowed to be part of any gun forum but thats just my opinion."

What good is preaching to the choir? Everyone is welcome.

Auction the guns off? No, the money will just go to the same gov that took them, like rewarding a theif by providing them with a fence. How about distribution to the states for use in the militias (along with plenty of training for anyone who shows up :D ).

Fed168
December 1, 2006, 05:11 PM
A good amount of those weapons are low SNs, one of a kinds, oddballs, stuff that has sat in vaults for years amongst the new stuff.

gp911
December 1, 2006, 05:18 PM
Yeesh, did anyone else see the sawed-off shotgun and think either

a) "...and this here is the gun that started the Randy Weaver debacle!"

or

b) "People always wanna measure from the back of the chamber when they cut down a shotgun..."


gp911

EdLaver
December 1, 2006, 05:37 PM
God I would love one of those broom handle mausers. I always wanted one. This is a very sad and sick post to see our country's government take away our right to bear arms whatever type and size they are. But it needs to be shown so that those that are uneducated about it are educated. :cuss: YOU BATFE

cracked butt
December 1, 2006, 06:37 PM
Yes, and they can go and confiscate any they want! Why, they even have lists of whom they can confiscate them from, in registry states!

Blame the politicians you vote for then, they are the ones who give the ATF their powers.

At the risk of Godwin's law, I'd say that's like saying that an SS trooper wasn't responsible for their actions, that it was Hitler's fault or the German people who put him in power. He gave the directives, but people signed up and proudly stomped around wearing the lightning bolt, being vicious thugs for him.

That can be applied to any arm of Law Enforcement, examples of abuse exist in all agencies, but it does not mean that because someone carries a badge they are some sort of stormtrooper.

Zundfolge
December 1, 2006, 06:46 PM
The ATF doesn't make the rules that put those firearms there, its every citizen in this country who ever voted for an antigun politician who did. The ATF doesn't make the rules, they enforce the laws that elected representatives of the people make.
Thats not entirely true.

BATFE can create new firearms laws out of thin air pretty much any time they want since their "department policies" have the effective force of law.


For example, they could decide tomorrow that the Saiga 12 shotgun has no "sporting purpose" and ban its import and even force it onto the NFA registry as a "destructive device".

Owen
December 1, 2006, 06:50 PM
So ya'll find it implausible that the ATFE might have a need for a reference library of fireamrs?

cracked butt
December 1, 2006, 06:51 PM
BATFE can create new firearms laws out of thin air pretty much any time they want since their "department policies" have the effective force of law.


For example, they could decide tomorrow that the Saiga 12 shotgun has no "sporting purpose" and ban its import and even force it onto the NFA registry as a "destructive device".

And who exactly created the ATF and granted them powers? They certainly didn't spring from a vacuum. Powers given to them can also be taken away.

cracked butt
December 1, 2006, 06:53 PM
So ya'll find it implausible that the ATFE might have a need for a reference library of fireamrs?

Oh, no don't say that! People here will soon be accusing the Library of Congress of violating people's 1st amendment rights for hoarding books.;)

Zundfolge
December 1, 2006, 06:56 PM
And who exactly created the ATF and granted them powers?
Richard Nixon by executive order.

He's both been impeached and died so what more can we do to him?

And while I agree that we should focus on the politicians that do nothing to stop their abuses (if nothing else by allowing them to exist), that doesn't excuse them for their abuse of the American people.

FIFTYGUY
December 1, 2006, 07:14 PM
some ungodly anti-tank rifle,

I can make out a 20mm Finnish Lahti m/39, a 20mm Swiss Solothurn S18/1000 (or /1100), a 14.5mm Soviet PTRD, a 13mm German M1918 Mauser, a 57mm US Recoilless Rifle M18, and both a Canadian and a British .55" Boys.

All the usual suspects.:p

Manedwolf
December 1, 2006, 07:38 PM
Oh, no don't say that! People here will soon be accusing the Library of Congress of violating people's 1st amendment rights for hoarding books.

The Library of Congress belongs to the people. You can go into it and look at the books, and do research with them.

Go to the BATFE and ask to see the guns. See what happens.

CrackedButt, you seem awfully defensive of the BATFE, and that's a rather...unusual position for anyone involved in 2A defense to have, given their atrocious history.

BoySetsTheFire
December 1, 2006, 09:08 PM
First off, I'll likely get in trouble for my reply. Most people on gun sites don't like the BATF. I was on an SKS site and the topic came up. Next thing, hordes of unpatriotic freaks came out screaming about how the government is gonna kill us all and stick our heads up on poles.

I'm a PATRIOT! If you don't like what the government is doing, fine - voice your opinion. That's good. And if you want to walk the walk and do something about it, fine - send a letter to your congressman; donate to the NRA. But for the maniac freaks that believe the government is going to take away our freedom, I heard that countries like Turkey, Afghanistan, Lebanon, etc, don't have immigration quotas. And air fare is pretty cheap these days.

Yeah, love it or ...

The Grand Inquisitor
December 1, 2006, 09:45 PM
The Library of Congress belongs to the people


HAHAHAHA


Do you really belive that? Try to go to Washington, walk into the LOC, and just pick up a book. You'll find yourself either on you but on the steps, or in the local jail.

You need a relitvely hard to get pass to get into the LOC - in fact, it's easier to get access to 1800 years old documents in the Vatican Library than it is to get anything out of the LOC (in fact the Vatican Library is very well run and is open to any honest scholar).

Also, regardless of the fact that some of these guys working for the BATFE are nice people and normal guys, the sad, hard fact is, is that they are fundamentally working against America, the American people, and American constitutionalism. I'm not saying that these people deserve anything, but regardless of the fact that they are "letting" us see these "toys", they are not working for us...they are working against us (and by "us", I mean the people of the United States).

MatthewVanitas
December 1, 2006, 10:13 PM
But for the maniac freaks that believe the government is going to take away our freedom, I heard that countries like Turkey, Afghanistan, Lebanon, etc, don't have immigration quotas. And air fare is pretty cheap these days.

What the heck's so bad about Turkey?

It's a constitutional secular republic, and a pretty dang nice place overall.

I'd imagine that Turkey would be more palatable to THR members than some European countries would be, much less most of the rest of the world.

-MV

Erinyes
December 1, 2006, 10:25 PM
First off, I'll likely get in trouble for my reply. Most people on gun sites don't like the BATF. I was on an SKS site and the topic came up. Next thing, hordes of unpatriotic freaks came out screaming about how the government is gonna kill us all and stick our heads up on poles.

I'm a PATRIOT! If you don't like what the government is doing, fine - voice your opinion. That's good. And if you want to walk the walk and do something about it, fine - send a letter to your congressman; donate to the NRA. But for the maniac freaks that believe the government is going to take away our freedom, I heard that countries like Turkey, Afghanistan, Lebanon, etc, don't have immigration quotas. And air fare is pretty cheap these days.

Yeah, love it or ...So what, you've got a problem with anyone voicing a negative view over current policy in this country? Face it, the BATFE has no legitiment purpose and calling anyone who feels that way unpatriotic is one heck of an ad hominem.

Agreeing with every edict set down from Washington doesn't make one a patriot. Caring about this country and its citizens makes you a patriot. And we care that organizations like the BATFE can and have been abusive and a danger to our civil rights.

soul_rapier
December 1, 2006, 11:01 PM
freedom of speech is so good ..but oh well we'll not ''PATRIOTS'' cause a lot of people think that the goverment is full of sh**

SShooterZ
December 1, 2006, 11:24 PM
Wow, do you guys know something I don't?

Has it been confirmed that all these guns were taken from the hands of legal citizens?

Here in Chicago every year, they offer something like $25 Best Buy cards, Bulls tickets or Discount cards for firearm recovery.

You wouldn't believe the kind of guns that show up. Original German Lugers... Original M1 Garands... Tommy Guns... You name it!!

It is people not knowing any better and not CARING about the gun they posses and would rather have something in return. I don't see how that is some big conspiracy against freedom.

The best thing about freedoms is that people have the RIGHT to exercise them.

If you were looking at a warehouse full of exotic cars that people either turned in and/or were aquired legally, would there be such an uproar?

Until I know the WHOLE story about where, how and when these guns came into the hands of the ATF, I will not pass judgement.

Instead, I look at them as something to admire and learn about as I am not too familiar with many of those weapons.

Manedwolf
December 1, 2006, 11:33 PM
I somehow doubt that people are turning in mint STG-44's, MG-42's, nearly-priceless folding SMGs and other such rarities for Best Buy giftcards. (I found this Maxim in my son's drawer! I don't want him getting into that trench warfare scene...next thing you know, he'll have mustard gas!)

SShooterZ
December 1, 2006, 11:35 PM
I somehow doubt that people are turning in mint STG-44's, MG-42's, nearly-priceless folding SMGs and other such rarities for Best Buy giftcards.

Doubting and knowing are two different things.

Like I said, I know for a fact what people have turned in for silly crap here in Chicago. Some very expensive and rare guns.

Granted, an MG-42 probably can't be found in the closet of many people but what do we know about how these guns were aquired?

Zullo74
December 2, 2006, 12:02 AM
In 1968, when Congress passed the Gun Control Act, the old BIR/IRS laboratory became responsible for analyzing firearms and explosives, and the Alcohol and Tobacco Tax Division became the Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) Division. The 1970 passage of the Organized Crime Control Act made the role of the ATF Division more explicit, and signaled a shift away from IRS purview. On June 1, 1972, the Treasury Department issued Order No. 120–1, which separated the ATF from the IRS.:uhoh:

soul_rapier
December 2, 2006, 12:19 AM
Hey i'll buy some best buy cards trade for guns :D

Dr.Rob
December 2, 2006, 05:56 AM
I doubt very seriously that ALL those weapons were 'confiscated.' The ATFE and the FBI keep a large firearms 'library'... theres a ton of stuff in those pics that was never imported and some stuff that I scratch my head wondering about. That's a lot of Japanese MG's. Doubt they took a PIAT off a gangbanger.

In fact, anything 'used in a crime' is generally off limits until well after it's been in and out of court as evidence... though I've seen the FBI has a few 'famous' firearms in their 'comparison' collection ala "Dillenger's .45"

I doubt seriously that a 'visitor' could enter an evidence locker, anywhere.

While the ATFE doesn't pass laws, many federal and state agencies pass 'rulings' or rules that carry the weight of law, or penalties. Like it or not, that's a fact. Ignorance of the law or claiming a law is unjust won't keep you from being prosecuted. Enforcing certain laws and rules pertaining specifically to A, T, F or E is the job of this rather small agency.

Who knows why they have a rack of STG 44's.. maybe someone could write a letter to the agency and ASK, rather than make a huge number of assumptions based on a mix of preconcieved notions and a bunch of photos with no explanation from a 3rd hand source.

Or, you could just cuss some more.

crazed_ss
December 2, 2006, 06:44 AM
One thing's for certain.. the ATF has the most badass'd gun collection I ever seen. :eek:

>SHOCK<^>WAVE<
December 2, 2006, 07:55 AM
I don't believe that's the BATF Gun Room anymore than
I'd believe it's Sarah Brady's basement.:neener:

Exposure
December 2, 2006, 09:03 AM
How many of you people screaming all this negativity about the BATF have ANY experience with them other than what you read or see on TV?

I'm just curious because most people that really hate guns and gun owners have no interaction with firearms or their owners and simply base their opinions from what they see on TV or read in the newspapers.

wacki
December 2, 2006, 10:00 AM
What the heck's so bad about Turkey?

It's a constitutional secular republic, and a pretty dang nice place overall.


Things have changed. Turkey has the highest percentage of people that thinks Charles Darwin was spawned from Satan.

But unlike its western counterparts, Oktar's group claims Darwin is responsible for communism, fascism, and terrorism. Terrorists, according to Oktar, are "social Darwinists hiding under the cloak of religion," while communists, still active in Turkey, are in "bloody alliance" with Darwinism. "Evolution is a communist and fascist belief," offers Tarkan Yavas, BAV's president. "The Muslim community understands that now."

http://www.seedmagazine.com/news/2006/11/not_in_kansas_anymore.php

BoySetsTheFire
December 2, 2006, 10:09 AM
MatthewVanitas, I wasn't knocking Turkey, or any nation. I just know that we enjoy a high standard of living as well as a high level of personal freedom here in the US. And While I'm not knocking the countries I mentioned, I believe the people there do not enjoy the quality of life that we enjoy here. And if I'm wrong about a specific country, then I will confess I did not deeply research the countries I listed. One of my friends was stationed in Turkey and his stories convince me that I'm glad I grew up here.

As another example, graduate lawyers in Iran will work labor jobs for two or three years to earn enough money to buy a suit of clothing that will enable them to appear in court as a lawyer before a judge.

I guess I just like my country and I appreciate my government with all its flaws. I doubt that its critics are perfect.

And I will always believe, "Love it or leave it".

rallyhound
December 2, 2006, 01:31 PM
looks alot to me like that big company in california that rents guns to the movie people.

Soybomb
December 2, 2006, 04:16 PM
The collection is indeed that ATF's, I don't see why that would be doubted.

ndh87
December 2, 2006, 04:41 PM
they need to have a yard sale

Plumber576
December 2, 2006, 07:59 PM
I think there should be a special auction for all of the firearms that are legal to own, class 3 or not. Of the machine gun is transferrable, than it should be sold back to legal law abiding citizens. Plus, the Govt. could make some money.

Just have a bunch of people show up with approved forms somehow for thi special auction, and start putting the items up on the block.

SoCalShooter
December 2, 2006, 08:35 PM
Disgusting.

Those should be in the hands of free citizens.

its a beautiful display of guns, but if the government or the BATFE wants to make some extra money, they could start selling weapons, makes better sense then destroying them.

hankdatank1362
December 2, 2006, 11:47 PM
I don't see what's wrong with the old broomhandle mausers with the stocks on them... C&R aren't they ?

Oh, you know they were used by dope-slinging dealers in a drive by. Just like all the other evil weapons in there.


:barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf: :barf:

Wes Janson
December 3, 2006, 05:19 PM
I had to play "It's a Wonderful World" scrolling through those pictures...and then I started crying.

Glockfan.45
December 6, 2006, 09:42 AM
I don't see what's wrong with the old broomhandle mausers with the stocks on them... C&R aren't they ?

I took this from a site about the C96 this could be the case here, or they could be the full auto version and un registered.

There is another caution, unrelated to any of the above, which is worth mentioning.

The TU-711 frames made by the Chinese have a stock slot just like the original frames.

However, these pistols are new production rather than old Mausers and are *not* C&R

firearms. Attaching any stock/holster (including original Mauser made stock/holsters) to

a TU-711 would likely make that pistol a "short barreled rifle" under the provisions of

the National Firearms Act, and would expose the person in possession of said firearm to

all of the NFA criminal penalties. Just a word to the wise...


and to the poster who wanted to know why we harbor so much hatred towards the ATF they are the greatest enemy of those who love their 2nd rights. I have no love for an agency who uses a shoe lace or duct tape to convict a man who was within the law. I have no respect for an agency that makes laws without the involvement of congress, laws that violate the constitution. To sum up how I feel about the ATF I would never shed a tear for a fallen ATF agent. How anyone could go to work for a group that exist to stomp on our rights is beyond me. They are some of the lowest scum in our government.

Bazooka Joe71
December 6, 2006, 02:19 PM
Man, that is a sad, sad sight.....Thats more guns than gixerman1000 has!:D

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