Kinda want a Garand... are Springfield Armory M1s okay?


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1KPerDay
December 7, 2006, 02:44 PM
http://www.springfield-armory.com/prod-rifles-m1-garand.shtml

They seem a bit pricey to me, :uhoh: but I don't want to get a gun-show special that may be junk. I don't know enough about Garands to spot problems. I want to get a .30-06 this year (100 years old; it's as good an excuse as any :D ) and have always wanted a Garand.

But I don't belong to any CMP qualifying organizations and from what I can see the CMP is pretty much out of the "good ones" anyway.

Advice?

Didn't SA used to make an M1 Tanker? That's what I'd really love. I don't think it was .30-06, though. I think it came only in .308.

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ocabj
December 7, 2006, 02:52 PM
Run a search in the rifle forum for the term 'garand'. I guarantee that you will get posts galore on Garands, and quite a few with the exact same question you are asking.

Sistema1927
December 7, 2006, 03:18 PM
It should be easy to join a CMP affiliated organization (The Garand Collectors organization comes to mind). I hear that CMP is getting another 50k Service Grade Garands. My 1956 vintage Springfield CMP Garand is an awesome weapon. 50 year old rifle firing a 100 year old cartridge!

I would still go with a rack grade CMP Garand before I laid out the big bucks for one of the newer Springfield offerings.

30Cal
December 7, 2006, 03:19 PM
But I don't belong to any CMP qualifying organizations...

The Garand Collector's Ass'n is something like $25 a year.

...and from what I can see the CMP is pretty much out of the "good ones" anyway.

People have been saying that for the past 10-15 years, but none of them seem to even own a CMP M1. I got this Greek field grade in August ($425). It has a replacement stock on it ($75).

http://webpages.charter.net/tyoberg/upload/CMP%20rifles%20Jul-Aug06/DSCN1332_edited.JPG

mrrick
December 7, 2006, 04:07 PM
Check out http://garandguy.com/

I got 2 from him and am very happy. Great value for the money.

MechAg94
December 7, 2006, 06:12 PM
You can get a field grade Garand. $450
Get replacement springs and M1 tool. $60 or less
New barrel from CMP. $165
New replacement stock from CMP. $120

Is that still less than a new M1 rifle?

There are lots of people who do restorations with new barrels and such for varying amounts of money. You can search for links on thread from this board.

1KPerDay
December 7, 2006, 07:05 PM
Thanks for the info, everyone. I realize there are a lot of threads on Garands and that's partly the reason I wanted some simple advice distilled into this one.;) Sometimes there are so many threads and posts on a subject that I can't make sense of it all and want "the forum opinion", you know?

Thanks a lot. Those garand guy ones look good... and the CMP ones sound doable also. Maybe I'll join the garand collector's assn... think they'll take me if I don't collect garands yet?:D

1KPerDay
December 7, 2006, 07:17 PM
Question: do I have to be a member of an affiliated club AND participate in one of the sanctioned shooting matches BEFORE I can order from CMP? How can I participate in a Garand shoot if I don't have a Garand to shoot?:confused:


EDIT: never mind... found the requirements on the CMP site.

TexasRifleman
December 7, 2006, 08:23 PM
EDIT: never mind... found the requirements on the CMP site.

And for anyone else reading, no you don't have to actually shoot a match if you belong to the right type of club.

And go ahead and order a Field Grade now, that way your paperwork is done if and when they get some nicer ones back in.

If you do that, you will end up with 2 Garands for less money than you will spend on 1 SA replica.

Warren
December 7, 2006, 08:37 PM
Are the field grade rifles good shooters?

I'm not looking to win any matches with it I just want to be able to hit a milk jug (iffn I can do my part) at 300 yards or so.

BoySetsTheFire
December 7, 2006, 10:40 PM
In addition to the Garand Guiy, Tony Pucci (Orion Inc) sells Garands for less than Springfield and they are tricked out to match grade.

Get a C&R application and file for your C&R. Then you can buy Garands through the internet from any of these guys and have them shipped to your door, with no FFL dealer involved. You can also get an SKS, M1903 or any surplus rifle that qualifies as a Curio & Relic.

offthepaper
December 7, 2006, 10:55 PM
30 Cal.

Nice rifle. I also got a Greek in October, but your metal looks better than mine. But mine functions great and shoots better than I do.
Where did you find the replacement stock for $75.00? (looks great)

BruceB
December 8, 2006, 01:09 AM
A huge amount of confusion was deliberately caused by the company doing business today as "Springfield Armory", when they adopted (or misappropriated) the name of our famous, centuries-old government arsenal. The government manufactory was closed in the 1960s.

"Springfield Armory Inc" perpetuates their misinformation campaign with the motto about being "America's Oldest name in Firearms", or words to that effect. B.S.!!!! The ORIGINAL Armory can claim that honor, but not the upstarts in Illinois!

I say all this because "SA Inc" markets a Garand marked "Springfield Armory", just like the millions of REAL Garands originally produced for the government in its own Armory. The trouble is, the current-production rifles use a CAST receiver made by Lithgow Arsenal in Australia, and there have been quite a few problems with these receivers. Go to

www.fulton-armory.com

and in the M1 FAQ articles (from the site index on the left of the home page), read their technical inspection of a Lithgow receiver.

Long and short, I recommend NOT buying a new SA Inc Garand. Do as others have suggested, and get hold of an ORIGINAL Garand, from Springfield Armory (the REAL one!), Winchester, H&R, or International Harvester. CMP rifles are a fine starting place, and a rifle from them can be rebuilt or improved in as many ways as one wishes to spend the bucks.

As an example, I have a Garand up for consignment sale in a local gunshop. It has a Korean-War-vintage receiver of Springfield manufacture, a NEW government-issue Springfield Armory barrel dated 1965, and a new walnut stock set. It's priced at $800, and is a very fine rifle.... and much cheaper than a new-production ersatz M1 from SA Inc.

Lest anyone think I have a "hate-on" for SA Inc, I have a near-new M1A which I bought last year, and which is nearing the 4000-round mark of trouble-free enjoyment. It's already wormed its way into my affections so deeply that it may just be a serious contender for "favorite rifle" status. I just wish its makers had been a bit more honest in their marketing schemes.

iamkris
December 8, 2006, 08:51 AM
confusion was deliberately caused by the company doing business today as "Springfield Armory", when they adopted (or misappropriated) the name of our famous, centuries-old government arsenal

Hmmm, I've heard this argument over and other again. **shrug** I tend to think that its kind of sad that people don't take the time (not you specifically BruceB) to investigate a company to which they are laying down a significant amount of cash. I for one NEVER made the assumption that they were the government armory...I read up on them and made my choices...caveat emptor Anybody that walks into an Abercrombie and Fitch or Orvis and gets all huffy that they can't get their fine English double fitted...well, companies change (not always for the good).

Maybe it's because marketing strategy is a big chunk of my job, but I tend to see it as "Hey, there's this really great name that has been associated with great American firearms...it's not being used and people recognize it and "get" it...let's name our company that and provide the market more great firearms in the tradition of that honored name". And that's what they have done.

It would be different if there advertising said something like "From the arsenal that brought out the battle rifles of America's fighting forces for centuries, the new M1A SOPMOD 10 IV" (although that is a lot more catchy than "Hey, we're not the real Springfield Armory but we still have some guns...buy them!")

If names can't be used by anything but the original source so as not to confuse the buyer, we'd have to go call every 1911 in the market something completely different...because it wasn't from the original maker. By the same arguement, if FN decides to COMPLETELY shut down the Winchester brand, does that name have to lay dormant forever? And if someone does buy it, do they have to have big disclaimers that say "We're not the real Winchester?" If that happens, my guess is they'll have a tagline something like "Winchester - the gun that won the West"...and they should, because it is true...whether they are the original or not.

Dr. Dickie
December 8, 2006, 09:25 AM
"Maybe I'll join the garand collector's assn... think they'll take me if I don't collect garands yet?"

Ohh, but you will, you will.:evil:

30Cal
December 8, 2006, 01:25 PM
Nice rifle. I also got a Greek in October, but your metal looks better than mine. But mine functions great and shoots better than I do. Where did you find the replacement stock for $75.00? (looks great)

The wood it came in was a mess, but the metal is new (original finish with zero wear--TE=0, MW=0). I got a nice deal at the Reno show the same time I got the rifle (the CMP was there). Two Boyd's stocks and a sanded SA GHS for $150! Midway has a sale on them right now--I think they're asking $89.

I spent about 5 hours whittling the stock down to a more appropriate profile (Boyd's M1 stocks are a little beefy). They can require a little fitting.

Shot a 196-4x (on the SR target with LC67) at a local M1 match last month.

Here's a tip--when you send an order into the CMP, don't be afraid to attach a note to help them select the right rifle for you. If you make a simple request ("I'd like one with nice wood" or "I am looking for a good barrel" or "I want a WWII era rifle"), they'll usually come through.

Ty

Warren
December 8, 2006, 05:08 PM
I peinted out the order form and was suprised that I had to get it notarized.

I thought I just had to provide copies of my CCW and my club card.

richardschennberg
December 8, 2006, 05:38 PM
Regardless of how it acquired the name, Springfield Armory Inc. is one of the two largest sponsors of sport shooting, and the only one that never supported AWB, 10-rnd mag limit, etc. Their top IPSC and bullseye shooters actively help in inovating and improving their products. IMO the excessive claims of their longevity does not justify passing up quality firearms at a fair price.
Richard
Schennberg.com (http://www.schennberg.com)

.45FMJoe
December 8, 2006, 06:11 PM
True it may not by all USGI, but my SAI Garand has a bunch of USGI parts, brand new barrel AND lifetime warranty. :neener:

But, I just HAD to have a real one too, I'm on the Service Grade waiting list. :evil:

MechAg94
December 8, 2006, 07:48 PM
The trouble is, the current-production rifles use a CAST receiver made by Lithgow Arsenal in Australia, and there have been quite a few problems with these receivers. Go to

www.fulton-armory.com

and in the M1 FAQ articles (from the site index on the left of the home page), read their technical inspection of a Lithgow receiver.

Long and short, I recommend NOT buying a new SA Inc Garand. Do as others have suggested, and get hold of an ORIGINAL Garand, from Springfield Armory (the REAL one!), Winchester, H&R, or International Harvester. CMP rifles are a fine starting place, and a rifle from them can be rebuilt or improved in as many ways as one wishes to spend the bucks.
Honestly, do you really expect a competitor of Springfield Armory to give a glowing report of how great their receivers are?

I notice the Fulton doesn't really make an M1 Garand. They are rebuilding USGI M1 Garands and receivers with nice parts. They are still a great deal more expensive as well. If my memory is correct, I think Dean's Gun Restorations is cheaper. Fulton's cost is $1100 with CMP rifle credit as listed.

TexasRifleman
December 8, 2006, 07:56 PM
I peinted out the order form and was suprised that I had to get it notarized.

I thought I just had to provide copies of my CCW and my club card.

The only part you have to get notorized is the page that states pretty much what it says on a 4473. Since you are not signing a 4473 in person this is about the same.

Not a big deal, and you are not notorizing your sales order.

And you only have to do this once. Once you order from them you are in the system and it's much easier after that.

MechAg94
December 8, 2006, 07:58 PM
Either way, I have 3 CMP Garands and would suggest that option. Field Grade rifles are good shooters. From what I saw at the South store, condition of barrels can vary. Even condition of service grade barrels can vary. The field grade I selected has a tighter muzzle that my other two guns that are both service grade.

TexasRifleman
December 8, 2006, 08:24 PM
Honestly, do you really expect a competitor of Springfield Armory to give a glowing report of how great their receivers are?

Actually you will find Clint to be pretty honest about stuff like that, which is why people quote him.

Warren
December 8, 2006, 09:02 PM
TSM,

Thanks for the clarification.

1KPerDay
December 21, 2006, 12:52 PM
Well, I got a couple Garands. Details here in case anyone's interested.
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=2951614#post2951614

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