i dont know much about the hi powers, but I want one really bad.
they have one for sale at RB for about 42x.xx, is this a good deal?
is fn = fn herstal? are they a reputable company? last question is if the parts are the same.
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December 19, 2006, 09:17 PM
Fabrique Nationale Hestal (FNH) was the first company Browning contracted to make Hi-powers, the "Belgium" Brownings. Circa 1935, I believe there are now a few companies Browning Contracts to make the Hi-Powers they sell. There are at least two "Clones" the FEG PJK 9HP and the Charles Daly HP. Contrary to some statements here the Argentine, Fabricaciones Militares (FM) M-90 and M-95's were contracted by FNH and manufactured for the Argentine Military and other So. American Armies. They are not "Clones" due to the licensing arangements made by FNH. The blue prints used are the ones FNH used.
Well not the exact same ones I am certain many copies were made. The design has been in production since 1935, a few copirs of the blue prints have been made.
Back to matters at hand, If you can get an FNH 9 mm HP do so they are not being imported to the US any more.
The FEG PJK 9HP is one of the few Clones to take OEM Browning parts. It is the only model FEG makes that this can be done with. KBI is no longer importing the FEG. They are Selling the Charles Daly 9 MM HP. I am not certain if the parts are made in America but the Guns at least are assembled here. And I don't know how close the production is to the Browning. On the Surface they look Identical to the Browning, Except the sites are more modernized.
I own an Argentine FM and the FEG PJK 9HP. Both shoot well and seem to feed and cycle just fine. With one Glaring Exception. They must have all brass rounds. The cheapo CCI Blasers jam them every time. The All Brass CCI Blasers do not.
If you can get either the Browning or the FNH for $4xx.xx do so. NIB Brownings are about $650.00 at the low end if you are lucky. For the reason I already stated I haven't seen a NIB FNH.
Stephen A. Camp
December 19, 2006, 09:26 PM
Hello. FN makes the "true and original" Hi Power or P35. Browning Arms Co. imports them into the US with the Browning name on them. In recent years, FN also imported Mk III versions of the Hi Power into the US, but the FN name simply was not so well known as the Browning name. Other than rollmarks, locations of the serial numbers on the frames, and grips, the frames, slides, bbl, and other parts are exactly the same in either gun.
FN made some Hi Powers for Argentina but then Argentina began making their own under license from FN. These are the FM Hi Power pistols. Hungary's FEG has made and continues to make unlicensed copies of the Hi Power.
I do not remember the exact year, but I believe Browning began importing the Hi Power into the US sometime in the 1950's; the historians will know more about that than I do.
Speaking only for myself, if presented the opportunity to buy a Browning-marked or FN-marked Hi Power, I'd probably go with the latter. The same quality pistol with FN markings costs considerably less than the "real Browning Hi Power" when in fact, the primary difference is the name on the gun. The FN would have less trading value later, but for myself this is the way I'd go.
December 19, 2006, 09:54 PM
thanks for the corrections,
December 19, 2006, 11:47 PM
thank you guys so much~! i was thinking the fn was an off brand and browning was the real deal. i guess i will start looking for fn hipowers and brownings. i just picked up a black polycoat cz75b in 9mm and would love to have the hi power as a little brother.
the fn hi power i saw has no hammer, it looks to be hammerless. i have it bookmarked on my desktop, i will post up the link when i get home. thanks again.
December 20, 2006, 12:35 AM
"...the fn hi power i saw has no hammer..." It's not an HP then. The HP has a spur hammer.
"...as a little brother..." The CZ75 is a HP clone with some design changes. Not good ones either. The trigger is too far forward for my hand or I would have had one 25 years ago when they first came to Canada. Long before they were available Stateside. Every one came with a factory test target. Friggin' things shoot well.
"...a reputable company..." Yep. They've been making firearms in and around Herstal for well over 100 years. JM went to FN because he couldn't find a U.S. maker that would produce the HP. He died before the design was quite finished so a Belgian(Dieudonne Saive) finished it. FN refused to make them without the mag safety so it was put in.
During W. W. II, the drawings were spirited to Canada by FN engineers and the pistol was put into production by the John Inglis Co. for the Canadian and British armies. Mostly used by paras. The Nationalist Chinese bought a bunch with a 'tangent' rear sight(looks a lot like a 1903 Springfield rear sight) and a wooden shoulder stock/holster.
Wartime production Inglis HP's are still in use by the CF. Nothing wrong with a pistol of that age either. Except for the poor fixed rear sight. The CF mag holds 14 rounds instead of the 13 in the commercial HP.
December 20, 2006, 12:55 AM
Sunray: It's not an HP then. The HP has a spur hammer.
Not exactly. HP's come with three factory hammer types. Spur, Round and the SFS. It is possible that the Hi Power yongxingfreesty saw is a HP with the SFS hammer. It is MUCH smaller than the other two.
Another possibility is that this is a Hi Power-DAO, those hammers are almost invisible- no "spur" to thumb.
December 20, 2006, 01:44 AM
not at home yet, but here is the link , i think dogtown is right.
^^^ this gun looks pretty nice to me at a good price......is it possible to change it to a spurred hammer?
Stephen A. Camp
December 20, 2006, 01:58 AM
Hello. The link is to a different FN-made handgun. It is not the SFS version and internally it is a DAO autoloader that resembles the Hi Power a bit, but its internal parts are very different and its magazines do not fit the Hi Power and visa-versa. I could be wrong but I think that the gun shown in the link was also offered in conventional DA/SA. I do not believe that this particular pistol is currently being manufactured.
December 20, 2006, 02:57 AM
I'd prefer an FN... no real reason.
The Brownings all say 'assembled in Portugal' on them, I don't think the FNs have that.
December 20, 2006, 09:38 AM
I also prefer the FN marked guns to the Browning marked guns. I like military guns and to me FN is a "military" company and Browning is a "sporting" company. I feel more of a connection to the HP's long history as a military sidearm with a FN marked gun then I would with a Browning marked gun.
From a practical standpoint, my two FN HP's were both manufactured *and* assembled in Belgium instead of being manufactured in Belgium and assembled in Portugal.
Another difference is that my FN marked guns have the serial number on the side of the frame. The number is repeated on the slide and the barrel, which is kind of cool. Most Browning marked guns have the serial on the frontstrap, which gets in the way if you want to add any stipling or just put some grip tape there.
Like Mr. Camp and others have said, if given the choice between an FN roll mark and the Browning roll mark, I'd take the FN. No real difference in practical terms, but more "authentic" to me or something. (That said, I own one of each, presently, and I can't tell any appreciable difference between them.)
December 20, 2006, 01:18 PM
As long as it's Browning marked is fine by me. Novak Special Ops 1972 FN Hi-Power. Horseshoe Leather Products OWB & mag carrier.
The link you post is a BDA. It's not a Hi-Power and I would not buy it if you want a HP.
As already mentioned mags are different (expensive and hard to find also) and the internals are different. I don't think it's been made in years.
It looks like a HP but it's not.
December 20, 2006, 02:27 PM
The CZ is in no way a Hi-Power clone. There is not one part that is the same or even similar. The closest would be the barrel and that is different enough that it is not a clone. The CZ is a clone of the Hi-Power as a Glock is a clone of a 1911. The CZ is usually mentioned in relation to Hi-powers simply because it is one the the Holy Trinity of auto pistols. The 1911, the Hi-Power, and the CZ75.