What Trigger do you like best? Dak or Lem?


PDA






possum
December 22, 2006, 11:24 PM
just curious what you guys thoughts were on the sig Dak trigger and the h&k lem trigger, which one is smoother? which one do you guys prefer and whatare the big diferences? what are the weights of the triggers. are the sigs and Hk's guns that should be da/sa or do the two dao triggers that these two companies came out with; actually good choices.thanks.

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10-Ring
December 23, 2006, 12:26 AM
I really like the LEM and someday I will have one in my collection!

1BLINDREF
January 13, 2007, 08:52 AM
I have a USP compact .40 that I had converted to LEM by the factory about a year ago. I got a SIG 229 DAK .40 last night and I like the sig better. The sig trigger reset is shorter, and it just feals better to me. Both triggers are around 6.5 - 7 lbs. Try them both before buying or just buy them both:D

Fun2Shoot
January 13, 2007, 09:00 AM
I have only squeezed a DAK trigger, on a P229 IIRC and I was impressed with it. If I had actually shot one I would have a fuller opinion.

Never touched a LEM, but I think that DAO guns serve a useful purpose in some cases, though I have yet to own one myself.

1BLINDREF
January 13, 2007, 09:22 AM
I like the idea of dao for ccw. I've read alot of articles on what happens to you when the sh*t hits the fan, and it seams like a safer mode of trigger to have when your adrenaline is pumping. I hope I never have to find out from experience.

possum
January 13, 2007, 10:21 AM
heck i like the idea of dao in any situation and is by far my favorite action out there, i have owned a few da/sa pistols and i don't like them one bit, so that is why all the handguns i own are dao. i was thinking about getting into a h&k or a Sig, and like to see what others thought about the dao triggers.

thanks for all the feedback guys i appreciate it!

fastbolt
January 13, 2007, 04:42 PM
Sorry, couldn't vote on your poll because I prefer neither as a first choice.

I prefer TDA (DA/SA). Too many years training and carrying issued and personally owned TDA pistols. Many more (previous) years of shooting both DA revolvers and SA 1911 pistols developed my DA & SA trigger skills, and then I discovered I preferred the TDA's DA-SA transition. Not everyone thinks similarly, though.

I prefer the SA trigger for deliberate, precise shots. I prefer the initial DA trigger stroke for general defensive purpose, but then I spent several years carrying S&W DA revolvers as issued weapons.

I dislike the feel of the LEM trigger.

I know a LEM user who experienced some trouble trying to qualify on a rather standard bullseye course of fire, and was able to do much better when he borrowed a TDA pistol.

Different strokes (literally ;) ) for different folks.

If I HAD to choose from the two designs listed, it would have to be the DAK ... but I place the DAK as a distant second choice to a good TDA.

The primary trigger stroke of the Enhanced Double Action Only (DAK) requires approx. 6.6 pounds of pressure to fire the trigger, and it's the 'full length' trigger stroke of the two ...

The intermediate trigger stroke requires a partial reset of the trigger, and a heavier (approx 8.3 pounds) amount of pressure to fire the pistol.

Granted, the primary trigger stroke actually tends to 'feel' lighter to many folks, because of the excellent geometry of the design ... but it's long, too.

When I asked an armorer instructor during my Sig Sauer armorer's class why the shorter reset trigger stroke had to be heavier ... since that's not generally the way of it in TDA pistols ... the answer given was that it was Sig's determination that it was 'safer' to have the shorter trigger stroke require more effort on the part of the user/shooter.

Remember, even though these pistols are sold in the commercial market, much of their intended market is military & LE contracts. Safety is a marketable attribute.

I've seen cops (and some non-LE) experience ND's on a range when they had their fingers on their triggers, but weren't desiring to intentionally fire a round. I've seen it occur with SA, TDA & DAO-type pistols. The significant number I can remember offhand involved either cocked (SA), or DAO-type triggers which had only been released to shorter 'reset' positions ... although I can think of at least one where a heavy DAO trigger was fully stroked by the owner/user by 'mistake' (negligence). "Finger off the trigger unless you're intending to shoot" and "Watch your muzzle" are a couple of my well-used comments on the firing line ...

Given my druthers, I tend to prefer the heavier initial DA trigger stroke of a TDA trigger, and can certainly see why Sig Sauer supposedly intentionally designed the shorter, intermediate reset of the DAK trigger to be heavier. Safety issues.

Regardless of how the gun is designed, though, safety starts between the ears ... and ultimately rests there. User error and mistakes aren't the fault of the tool. I've always enjoyed attending other folk's training where safety was paramount, and trigger/muzzle safety was consistently monitored. People can do strange, unexpected and unintentional things during moments of stress ...

Just don't mistake my personal disfavor of the LEM & DAK designs, or my reluctant "if I had to use one" choice of the DAK as anything other than personal choice and opinion, however. Both manufacturers produce excellent products, and there are satisfied users/owners of both found easily enough ...

Kymasabe
January 14, 2007, 01:44 AM
OF the two, I like the DAK better but when given the choice, I buy my Sigs with the decocker and DA/SA trigger. DA is just slightly stiffer but SA is smooth and light! Simple decock and goas back to DA for safe carry.

gdvan01
January 14, 2007, 01:48 AM
+1 on the DA to SA preference of the Sig...carried and trained with it for too long.

Skunkabilly
January 14, 2007, 02:15 AM
I have a P2000 LEM. While it beats a straight DAO, it's just...weird. No experience with the SIG DAK.

1BLINDREF
January 14, 2007, 09:19 AM
Weird describes it perfectly. I'm thinking of converting my usp compact back to DA/SA. If you try the DAK you'll be hooked. The pull and reset is shorter than the LEM. To me, the LEM pull feals like it starts out light and it gets heavier as you pull the trigger and it takes too long for the trigger to break :confused: (not sure if thats makes sense).

shooter71
January 15, 2007, 09:49 AM
i didnt vote because i have not fired either..but id lean toward the Sig just because i have shot other models of each and like the Sig better and the DAKs trigger is a little lighter

but im sure this is like the , which is better debate..a BMW or Mercedes ..id take either if someone wanted to give me one :D

WYO
January 15, 2007, 10:59 AM
I didn't vote because I've never tried the LEM. The DAK has become my all time favorite trigger in a very short while. For me, it is the perfect balance of pull weight and distance that provides the extra safety of a DA with the ability to do precision shooting at distance. It won't shoot follow up shots as fast as some other action types, but I worry most about the first shot.

tinygnat219
January 15, 2007, 11:16 AM
Don't like either. H&K prices are too much in the Stratosphere for me to rationalize, and I haven't gotten around to trying Sigs with any seriousness yet.

However, I have tried both trigger systems and I prefer DA/SA. Much simpler to use and remember.

1BLINDREF
January 15, 2007, 12:31 PM
Once you get around to trying Sigs, I think you'll get hooked also. The DAK system is simpler than DA/SA - no decocker to put the gun back to safe, and same exact trigger pull for first to last shot. I have both DA/SA guns and DAO guns, I like both setups, but I prefer the DAO for ccw .... just my opinion, for what its worth. :)

Autolycus
January 15, 2007, 02:08 PM
I am an HK man myself. So I am biased. The LEM trigger can be lightened to 5.5 lbs which makes it a very sweet trigger. And all for under $20.

I dont know if the DAK can be lightened. I like the DAK trigger very much as well.

Either way you cannot go wrong with either trigger or gun.

I love my P2000 and my P2000sk. I like the ability to carry both and have only one magazine type to worry about.

mpmarty
January 15, 2007, 03:46 PM
I didn't vote as I don't like either one. I prefer dao as in the Taurus PT145 for ccw and single action for competition like the Witness Elite Match or (Heaven forbid) a 1911.

MyRoad
January 15, 2007, 09:59 PM
I didn't vote because I've never fired or even dry-fired a SIG with a DAK trigger... but I do carry a USPc.45-LEM and I love it. It's been adjusted down to about 5.5-6lbs., and it's smooth, crisp, reliable, and predictable. I know it's a bit off topic, but if you're comparing DAK/LEM type triggers, try a Steyr M40-A1 - it's the best of the bunch IMHO (if you like short-pull, crips triggers).

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