Cheap Caliber


PDA






Mr.Caliber
December 31, 2006, 12:14 AM
Hey I am kind pf new to centerfire rifles and would like a centerfire caliber that i can shoot alot at the range within a resonible price.

Thanks,

Mr.Caliber

If you enjoyed reading about "Cheap Caliber" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
C-grunt
December 31, 2006, 12:23 AM
Id say .223.

mkh100
December 31, 2006, 12:27 AM
Yep 223 is still pretty reasonable.....I am considering a cheap AR just because of this....please don't tell anyone I am considering a little girl gun though :neener:

or go 7.62x39.....an SKS and 1000 rounds should still be doable for $200 - $300 or so.

Smokey Joe
December 31, 2006, 12:49 AM
Mr. Caliber--You're going to be getting into reloading. You just haven't realized it yet. Many of us here @ THR stand ready to help you when the truth dawns.

Tell ya what: With cheap milsurp ammo, you get about what you pay for. But go ahead, get an SKS or a Mosin or some such. Mebbe a Mauser M-48. Everybody's gotta start somewhere. The Swiss K-31's are really nice rifles, I hear, accurate, too--but their ammo is pricey.

Warning: Suggest you consider ANY non-U. S. made milsurp ammo as corrosive until proven otherwise. No biggie, just clean yr bore IMMEDIATELY after shooting, with hot soapy water, then clean the firearm as usual.

Enjoy. And remember, the journey is part of the destination.

Mr.Caliber
December 31, 2006, 01:22 AM
:what: Not reloading its SOOO confusing and it seems like buying powder for 20 bucks then buying bullets then buying primers, wouldent that add up to more than what i pay for cheap ammo just to shoot at the range??

RevolvingCylinder
December 31, 2006, 01:27 AM
Not reloading its SOOO confusing and it seems like buying powder for 20 bucks then buying bullets then buying primers, wouldent that add up to more than what i pay for cheap ammo just to shoot at the range??
You get a full pound for that $20 which can be used for many rounds. Primers are CHEAP. Bullets can be cheap. It's the startup costs that get you. But it pays off in no time.

ArchAngelCD
December 31, 2006, 02:06 AM
Hey I am kind pf new to centerfire rifles and would like a centerfire caliber that i can shoot alot at the range within a reasonable price.
The Mosin Nagant ($80 - $95) shoots 7.62X54R ammo at around $3 a box of 20.

The AK-47 ($350 and up) shoots several rounds but the 7.62X39 can be had for $3.15 a box of 20

Old German Mausers are relatively cheap and shoot 8X57 rounds at $3 a box of 20

.223 can be shot out of a lot of inexpensive rifles like some of the AK-47 Variants that are out and you can get .223 (5.56X45mm NATO) for around $3.99 a box of 20

5.45X39 ammo is getting a lot cheaper and is going for as low as the 7.62X39 stuff. The newer AK-74 are shooting that.

Of course you can buy this ammo in bulk and save even more.
There is a lot of fun stuff out there that you don't have to break the bank to shoot!!

ArfinGreebly
December 31, 2006, 03:10 AM
Well, since everybody else here is talking actual RIFLE calibres, why not mix it up a bit.

Have you considered 9mm from a carbine?

There are some nicely priced 9mm carbines, and a couple of "more money than sense" carbines.

Kel-tec makes a 9mm carbine (Sub2000).
Ruger makes one (PC9).
Hi Point makes one (995C).
Beretta makes the CX4 Storm series, but it's pricey.
Marlin used to make the Camp 9 (if you find one, buy it).
Calico makes one (though I've never handled one).
. . . and there are others.

Now, why would I mess up a perfectly good rifle thread with pistol calibre carbines?

Just this: I don't know of a rifle calibre above .22 that costs less than the 9mm cartridge.

Whereas a .223 round will cost about 24 or 25 cents for inexpensive stuff, the 9mm will cost about 14 or 15 cents.

Of course you're kind of limited in your effective range. The 9mm will acquit itself well at 50 yards, and deliver good punch and decent accuracy at 100, but you won't be taking any deer with it.

It's a decent close range ranch gun or personal defense weapon, and cheap at the range (can even be shot at indoor ranges). And, naturally, most of the pistol-calibre carbines can be had in .40 and .45 cal.

If the 24-25 cent per round cost is okay, then .223 is certainly a viable round. No deer, but it will ruin a coyote's afternoon. Good out to 300 yards (more, if you get good glass).

Wait, wait! That's clearly not enough confusion!

I left out the .357 lever-action carbine! You can shoot .38 special out of those for not a whole lot more (20 cents/round) than 9mm. And the .357 round will flat knock down varmints of all sizes, deer, bison, even elk and bear. (Just remember to clean the throat/chamber after shooting a bunch of .38 special -- the crud build-up can make the longer .357 case feed poorly.)

I see your eyes beginning to glaze over.

I guess I won't mention the .44 mag and .45 LC carbines.

Mr.Caliber
December 31, 2006, 04:04 AM
Where do u get that kind of ammo that cheap archangelcd? very intrested if i can find stuff like that and intrested in the old war rifles anyway like the mauser so please help.

toecutter
December 31, 2006, 04:06 AM
I really like the suggestion of a pistol caliber rifle. Pistol calibers are almost perpetually cheaper than rifle calibers.

From what I've been hearing and seeing, there is currently some severe shortages of .223 and 7.62x39. Most of the prices I've seen here in the southwest is about 5.50-7.00/box for .223 and 5.00/box for 7.62. I don't know what happened, I remember just a few years ago when 7.62 was 1.99/box. Apparently it's more volatile than gas prices.

Depending on what you're looking for, you may consider a .38/357 lever gun, these are really really fun, and when shooting .38 loads it's cheap. This is also a really easy caliber to reload.

The 9mm/.40S&W PCR (pistol caliber rifle) are a lot of fun to shoot, and with 100 rounds of 9mm going for about $15 and no sign of shortages this would be a _GREAT_ choice.

If you're looking for flexibility, perhaps get an AR-15, and then get a 9mm and .223 upper. (two for the price of 1.5)

It's really hard to compete with the russian import guns. Due to the difficulty in finding 7.62x39 I would probably go with a mosin in 7.62x54R. It is still fairly common. 8mm ammo is still out there, but it's getting rather more expensive than it was. Olympic is making the stuff which sells for about $8/box.

Hope all that helps!

Mr.Caliber
December 31, 2006, 12:40 PM
What other rifles shoot 7.62x39 besides the ak-47? I dont mind war guns but i really did not want an over seas assult rifle as my first centerfire rifle.

Thanks,
Mr.Caliber

JonB
December 31, 2006, 01:34 PM
The 9mm/.40S&W PCR (pistol caliber rifle) are a lot of fun to shoot, and with 100 rounds of 9mm going for about $15 and no sign of shortages this would be a _GREAT_ choice.

Where are you guys finding 9mm for this cheap?? Surplus stuff or what?

badbowtie
December 31, 2006, 01:41 PM
I used to buy my 9mm ammo for 10.96 for 100 rounds at walmart.

ArfinGreebly
December 31, 2006, 01:46 PM
Typically that's what Wal*Mart sells.

It's the Winchester "white box" Value Pack, 100 rounds of 9mm FMJ for (currently) under $15.

They also do Winnie White Box .38 special FMJ for $20/100.

They do Remington .223 at just under $5.50/20.

And, for what it's worth, their ammo is made in the USA. There's not much I buy at "Wally World" but the ammo is from here and their prices are often right at the bottom.

mountainclmbr
December 31, 2006, 01:48 PM
8mm Mauser is cheap, but most is corrosive. The C&R guns are usually very inexpensive too. I really like the Yugo M48 and M48A. This is a real rifle caliber and has some recoil. The .223 is easier to shoot all day long.

Juna
December 31, 2006, 01:49 PM
Around here 9mm goes for about $13/100 at Wal-Mart. I was in the same boat wanting a cheap rifle to shoot, and I considered the 9mm carbine (KT Sub2000), but I also wanted a rifle for more power to fill a niche my pistol can't. So I opted to postpone the KT Sub2000 & go for the WASR 10. Now I have a more powerful, longer range weapon, too.

Thylacine
December 31, 2006, 01:51 PM
What other rifles shoot 7.62x39 besides the ak-47? I dont mind war guns but i really did not want an over seas assult rifle as my first centerfire rifle.
To take it, just as you just typed it. Then get an SKS, it is not an Assault Rifle. :banghead: Or a bolt action like the M10A1, or CZ 527 in 7.62 x 39.

Diesel man
December 31, 2006, 04:39 PM
A mosin nagant is a good tack driver try m38 carbine and its cheap around $100 depending on condition.Its a very reliable bolt action rifle with cheap ammo that is almost equivelent to a 30-06 springfield.

270Win
December 31, 2006, 04:53 PM
All the recommendations so far have been good ones.

.223 Remington
7.62x39
7.62x51 (.308 Winchester)
7.62x54R
8mm Mauser
9mm Luger/Parabellum/9x19

All quite cheap. Do you have an idea about what kind of platform you want?

If cost is a factor for the rifle also, the cheapest would be a Mosin-Nagant 91/30 or one of the associated carbines (M38 or M44). Rifles are typically under $100, carbines are usually a hair or two over. Rifles recoil less and have less muzzle blast than the carbine, which some translate into being more pleasant to shoot.

SKS is an excellent choice as well; I hardly know a shooter without one.

Any Mauser is a good choice also, cost-wise, but some people don't care for the recoil. It can be stout if the stock doesn't fit you neatly.

The Ruger Mini-14 and Saiga both shoot .223, and can be good low-cost shooters. Saigas also available in .308.

You have a LOT of choices.

Mr.Caliber
December 31, 2006, 04:58 PM
I want to stay under $250 for the rifle. what could i get for that price?

mio
December 31, 2006, 05:38 PM
mosins can still be had around here for $75 and if you look the sks can also be had under 250...if youre average height or taller i would avoid the sks because it has a very very short stock at least all the ones ive handled did

ArchAngelCD
December 31, 2006, 05:38 PM
Where do u get that kind of ammo that cheap archangelcd? very intrested if i can find stuff like that and intrested in the old war rifles anyway like the mauser so please help.
MrCaliber,
I get those prices from my local gun dealer. His shop isn't you trpical gun shop. He has a lot of old rifles and ued handguns. He fills the gap left by Dick's and Gander Mountian. Like I said, you can get those prices and better from online dealers. There is a thread on this forum listing MANY sites. (But I can't find it right now) Try these sites, There are others:
http://www.midwayusa.com/ebrowse.exe/browse?tabid=3
http://www.aimsurplus.com/
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/default.asp
http://www.ammunitionstore.com/index.htm
http://www.ammoman.com/index.htm
http://www.the-armory.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/index.html
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/default.php?cPath=10480


You said you don't think you want a AK-47 as your first rifle and I understand that. Why not take a look at the Mosin Nagant. See it here: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=244487
Information here: http://7.62x54r.net/ and here: http://www.russian-mosin-nagant.com/

Good luck in choosing...

Smokey Joe
December 31, 2006, 05:52 PM
Mr. Caliber--ANY of the milsurp rifles mentioned can be had for <$250, except for historically significant, "special" models, or rare variants. Most are 'WAY under that price. Well, except the AK-47 and its variants. Those will run you about 3 1/2 bills, ballpark figure.

My personal choice would be an M-48 Mauser, which will set you back some $150 or so. Cheapest, as noted above, would be one of the Mosin-Nagants, or perhaps a Turkish Mauser.

Do not, repeat, DO NOT, buy from Mitchell's Mausers--what they have is ordinary rifles, nicely cleaned up I admit, but then 'way overpriced. For the cheaper "ordinary, non-Mitchell" milsurp, you get to clean a certain amount of cosmoline out of the mechanism, but so what. Elbow grease, hot water, rags, brake cleaner (for the metal parts, not the wood!), kitty litter, and some of your time, are a LOT cheaper than Mitchell's prices.

BTW, referring back to yr earlier comment, reloading looks a lot more complicated than it is. If you want a complete, non-confusing explanation, get and read The ABC's of Reloading put out by Krause Publishing www.krause.com Or get it @ yr local sptg gds sto, gun sho, or off the I'net. It is the "standard text" on the subject.

plexreticle
December 31, 2006, 05:53 PM
Most .223 rifles with Mil.Surp. ammo with outshoot most shooters and it's relatively cheap and easy to find.

mrmeval
December 31, 2006, 08:28 PM
Interordinance
Mosin Nagant $78.95Rifle+12S&H+$25FFL = $115.95
Comes with cleaning kit and takedown tool.

Aim Surplus
800rd Spam Can of ammo: $69.95+$15 = 84.95
You'll need a spam can opener so might want to make sure it's included, might be extra.
Total 200.90

jesse485
December 31, 2006, 09:17 PM
What other rifles shoot 7.62x39 besides the ak-47? I dont mind war guns but i really did not want an over seas assult rifle as my first centerfire rifle.
Being that none of these rifles are fully automatic, the AK-47 you would be looking at is not an assault rifle. If you really mean assault weapon, that is a bastardized term used by anti-gunners to make some weapons seem more dangerous than others. The first centerfire rifle I ever purchased was the SKS, and it is still by far the most fun gun I own. For a little under $200, you simply cannot beat the SKS or its ammo prices (this "shortage" shouldn't last too long). FWIW, I long for a Saiga AK as well, and think it would probably just as much fun and useful as the SKS.

mrmeval
December 31, 2006, 10:06 PM
A Yugo SKS will run 99+S&H+FFL fees, they go up from there, one that's in particularly good to maybe unissued condition command much more.

The Yugo can have some issues, one is the gas cutoff for the grenade launcher. It's fixed with a paperclip or if really bad you can find a new made replacement. I really recommend a Murray firing pin mod and a Kivaari trigger job but that adds a lot to the price.

____hoot____
December 31, 2006, 10:53 PM
You could do much worse than a SKS. Sturdy and reliable, can be found in as-new condition in your price range, 5-40 round mags available, 7.62X39 easy on the shoulder to shoot but powerfull enough
for deer, usually ammo is among to cheapest to buy, easy and cheap to add a scope, more accurate than the AK's and some of the bolt actions. I much prefer the shorter stock and I weigh 200+ pounds as it fits just right when I have the heavy clothes on needed durring our northern Michigan deer season.

rangerruck
January 1, 2007, 05:39 AM
any milsurp. 223 . 30.06, 6.5 swede, 308, 8mauser, 762.54, 762.39, 9mm through a carbine, 303, etc.

jrfoxx
January 1, 2007, 06:37 AM
I'll add another vote for 8mm Mauser.Guns are cheap, I just bout 760 rounds for $60 OTD, and if you shop around and get one that was taken care of and has good, sharp rifleing, can be plenty accurate (unless your planning SERIOUS long(er) range and/or competition shooting).Lots of other very good options mentioned by others though too.

Mr.Caliber
January 1, 2007, 01:22 PM
TESTING sorry

Mr.Caliber
January 1, 2007, 01:24 PM
what do u guys think about this one?http://http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=9935_13987_14114&products_id=91328

here is the link if u cant get the pic.http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=9935_13987_14114&products_id=91328

The Deer Hunter
January 1, 2007, 01:29 PM
.17

Mr.Caliber
January 1, 2007, 01:32 PM
NO i already have 3 i need a real centerfire rifle

MrDig
January 1, 2007, 02:01 PM
As far as Caliber goes the .223/5.56 Nato, 7.62x39, and the 308/7.62 NATO are common as dirt and inexpensive to shoot.
Look into the H&R/NEF Handi's if considering a single shot, No they are not the Remington brand name but they are great shooters. I own one in .243, and I love it. The Draw back on them is the Accessory Barrels can only be fitted by H&R ( Pinhead legal Dept IMHO ) so if you want one with interchangeable barrels you need to send them to H&R, or buy one with other barrels as a package.

wnycollector
January 1, 2007, 02:59 PM
For the money you CANNOT go wrong with a m-38 or m-44 mosin-nagant! I have collected have a half dozen nagants and I love each and everyone. I also own several sks' and ak's...they are wonderful weapons but really limited if you want to have your gun double as a hunting rifle! My m-38 will group 2-3" with open sights at 100 yards and only cost $59!

The 7.62x54 is as capable as the venerable 30.06 for ~9-10 cents/round. Pop off the rear sight and add a scope and then loaded it with brown bear or silver bear 203gr soft points you should be able to take ANYTHING in north america minus the grizzley.

I suggest you check out www.surplusrifle.com for a nice overview of the various guns out there currently.

Mr.Caliber
January 1, 2007, 03:44 PM
ok so if i go with the mosin-nagant how bad is the recoil? cuz i want to be able to shoot this alot without ripping my arm off:p

Mr.Caliber
January 1, 2007, 03:47 PM
so where do u get the cheapest 7.62x39 ammo?

lionking
January 1, 2007, 03:53 PM
Mrcaliber.

I say also get a AR-15.They are fun,they are accurate,ammo is plentiful.

Smokey Joe
January 1, 2007, 05:09 PM
Mr. Caliber--OK, starting back several posts--The single-shot you mention: It would do, it looks nice, go ahead & buy it if it calls your name. It may or may not be The Rifle For You, but you won't know that for sure until you try it, and the same thing can be said of any other rifle you might purchase. Nice thing abt rifles is that if you decide to resell you can take it to a gun show and hawk it (Don't sell to a dealer--walk up & down the aisles with it on yr shoulder and a sign, "Rifle for sale" or some such. Guys will ask, guys will handle it, you can dicker, and, no middle man--you sell for what the dealer would have sold it for! :) ) You could buy a milsurp for less, however.

Jesse's comment abt an assault rifle is right on--if it won't go full-automatic firing (like a machine gun) it is NOT an assault rifle. No matter what Sarah Brady says.

The Mosin-Nagants are cheap, and so is the milsurp ammo, though much of it is corrosive. (Just means you have to wash yr bbl. w/hot soapy water right away after shooting, before going home to clean normally. Not much of a big deal. But you need to know to do it.) 7.62x54R is clearly a big-game cartridge, and it has a recoil to match. Mosins have a reputation for kicking particularly vigorously, although as with any rifle, (a) that depends on how you hold it to yr shoulder, (b) it can be got used to, (c) it affects some folks more than others, and (d) when shooting at game, you will never feel it. The carbine version will kick more so than the full-length rifle, just because the rifle weighs more--Newton's Laws of Motion apply
here.

7.62x39 and 7.62x54R are NOT the same cartridge. The '39 is for SKS's and AK-47's and the like--it is about equivalent to a rimless .30-30 cartridge ballistically. The '54 is for the Mosin-Nagants and some other Russian Army rifles--they still use it for their ultra-modern sniper rifles. And as has been said, the '54 is very much like our .30-'06 ballistically.

Cheapest 7.62x39 is yr own handloads. Buying it cheap requires shopping around. It's in short supply currently, but that is supposed to be a temporary problem.

And lastly, an AR-15 will set you back at least 5 bills or so to get into the game, and they go up, up, up in price from there. The .223 ammo is cheap, but that initial investment...ooh la la.

ArchAngelCD
January 1, 2007, 08:17 PM
ok so if i go with the mosin-nagant how bad is the recoil? cuz i want to be able to shoot this alot without ripping my arm off.
The recoil isn't as bad as you would expect. since the Mosin Nagant is so heavy the gun absorbs a lit of the energy so you don't feel it. As I have said several times in this thread already, I highly suggest you buy a Mosin Nagant, you won't regret it at all... M44 Carbine will run you about $85, the longer 91/30 will cost you $10 more. I have both, shoot both and like both. (I like the 91/30 more lol)

Have you read the links I provided in my previous posts?

You will need 7.62X54R ammo for the Mosin, not 7.62X39 BTW. It's all explained in the links I provided.

rangerruck
January 1, 2007, 09:33 PM
yeah i'd get that rifle. it was origionally made by Izmash i believe, then remington bought the company , to get rid of some competition, and to adopt a couple new styles. But that would work just fine, and of course that ammo is about as cheap as it gets for centerfire.

Mr.Caliber
January 2, 2007, 11:05 AM
If i decided to go with the 9mm carbine what could i get for under $250?

fugi
January 2, 2007, 12:46 PM
last gun show I went to here in Austin TX, wolf 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 cost more per case of 1000 than 5.56x45 which was irritating. you can get a nice semi-auto m1919 in 7.92x57 for like $1500 from militarygunsupply.com, ammo is really cheap, it's also really crappy.

wnycollector
January 2, 2007, 12:53 PM
Mr.Caliber ok so if i go with the mosin-nagant how bad is the recoil? cuz i want to be able to shoot this alot without ripping my arm off

There is no doubt about it either the m38 or m44 kick (and shoot a nice fireball :evil: A 91-30 will kick less. The last gun show I was at a guy was selling arsenal refinished 91-30's with 440 rounds for $129 tax included! Get the nagant (and an SKS!)

Juna
January 2, 2007, 05:15 PM
If i decided to go with the 9mm carbine what could i get for under $250?

Hi-Point 995 can be had for under that price range. Kel-Tec Sub-2000 is a little more, I think ($250-300ish). Both have excellent warranties.

Hi-Point will basically send you a new gun and extra mags if you ever have a problem, even if you're the 20th owner of the gun. So that's nice customer service. People throw a red dot on and have a blast. The down side is it doesn't fold (though it's pretty small to begin with relative to other rifles) and it only takes the Hi-Point 10 round mags.

The Kel-Tec folds in half, which is great for portability and storage. Plus, it is made to accept other pistol mags (e.g. Glock 17 mags, which can take the 33-rounder). So that's great if you have one of the pistols that it shares mags with. You have to specify which version you want (e.g. Glock, S&W, etc.) when you order it.

wnycollector
January 3, 2007, 09:30 AM
Mr. Caliber...for $250 you could get a VERY nice 91/30 nagant AND a yugo SKS plus a couple hundred rounds!

Check out www.classicarms.us

Also I generally buy my ammo at gun shows since shipping is SOOOOO expensive!

If you enjoyed reading about "Cheap Caliber" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!