.22 Autoloaders


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Combat-wombat
June 1, 2003, 04:43 AM
I have a couple questions about .22s. First, should I go with the Ruger 10/22 or the Remington Model 597? I need something accurate, and the M597 is advertised as being the most accurate, but I like all the cool accessories you can get for the 10/22. Are they both as accurate? Second, what's the advantage of a heavy barrel or "bull" barrel? How do they make the rifles more accurate? What do you think I should go with?

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craigz
June 1, 2003, 05:10 AM
It all depends on whether you want to build up a good shooter or get a good shooter out of the box. Out of the box, the 10/22 is a cheap piece of assembly line junk, but it's a great rifle because of all that you can do to it, without the need for a gunsmith. If you want to buy a gun that shoots great as it comes, look elsewhere. Personally, I would go for a bolt gun, rather than a semi-auto. (Think CZ 452).

Byron
June 1, 2003, 09:59 AM
The Browning Buckmark Sporter is a fine auto loader. Mine is accurate and flawless. It is very light and has a nice balance.

Dave Markowitz
June 1, 2003, 10:46 AM
My pick would be -- and was -- a 10/22. I have a standard model which is surpisingly accurate. I put a Weaver 4x scope on it. One major advantage of the Ruger is that it'll be easier for you to find a 'smith to do a trigger job, or to put in a good trigger yourself. I don't know that getting a good trigger will be as easy with the Remington.

In my experience, 10/22s fed with ammo they like are exceptionally reliable.

BlkHawk73
June 1, 2003, 10:53 AM
the M597 is advertised as being the most accurate,


Why would they advertise it as anything else.

Anyways...I have two 10/22 currently. Both are very accuarte. I have seen a 597 shoot just as accuartely. Alot depends on finding the particualr ammo for a given gun. The shooter has quite a bit to do with it also. I can shoot my gun accurately while another shooter may not.
What one to purchase? I would suggest the 10/22. Simply because of the vast amount of aftermarket accessoeries avail. if you ever decide to make changes. I've the basic model shoot just as well as the "T" model and my "T" model has outshot some boltguns.

45R
June 1, 2003, 02:42 PM
Go 10-22 if you ever want to tinker. :)

You can put so much money into these things it sickening!
I did :)



45R

Redlg155
June 1, 2003, 03:10 PM
I'd say get the Ruger 10-22.

I've owned and traded off two 597s. The first one a standard. It worked ok, but mags were unreliable and no aftermarket mags were available.

The second one was a laminated stock bull barreled model. Excellent accuracy and really nice looks. It felt like a regular big game rifle. The problem with this one was erratic ejection/extraction and again....sorry mags. Remington really needs to do some redesign on these mags.


Good Shooting
Red

larryw
June 1, 2003, 06:46 PM
I have a FrankenRuger 10-22; just love the gun. Absolutely reliable tackdriver. Out of the box it was reasonably accurate and reliable, but I love to tinker.

If I wanted another autoloader 22 tackdriver without it becoming project, I'd take a serious look at the TC Classic or Benchmark. http://www.tcarms.com/

Sactown
June 1, 2003, 07:00 PM
I too possess a FrankenRuger 10/22. If you don't like the trigger, buy the Volquartsen Hammer for $30 and you'll think you bought a new rifle. Checkout www.rimfirecentral.com for more specific info about .22s.

Sylvilagus Aquaticus
June 1, 2003, 09:02 PM
The 10/22 is the tweaker's wet dream. I plan to add a suppressed one to the vault as a varmint/nutria/etc. popgun someday. I've got a 77/22 somewhere but that's another story. Of the two, I'd go with the Ruger simply for all the bling you can add to them. They're like Harleys; fun enough when you get it out the door, but that you do to it later is what makes it uniquely yours.

If all you wanted was something to go bang every time you pull the trigger yet be cheap get yourself a Marlin model 60 from a pawn shop. I've seen them as low as $50. US. If you want something to use as a starting place for your ultimate .22, get the Ruger.

Regards,
Rabbit.

redneck
June 1, 2003, 11:05 PM
Might want to see which is most comfortable for you to shoulder first. I've found the 10/22 to be kind of short and awkward, like it was made for a little kid (I'm pretty tall though)

Personally, I don't understand spending $100-$150 on a rifle only to turn around and replace almost everysingle peice tryin to make it work like you want. Seems like it ought to just be offered like an AR15, where you can just buy all the parts :confused:

P95Carry
June 1, 2003, 11:18 PM
I know this ain't one of your choices but ... I gotta say.... the Marlin 60 i got from Wallyworld near 3 years ago is a real driver.

Cost then very little over $100 .... and all I have added is an old Herters 3-9 x 33 scope I have had for ages. Shooting against other guys at the club ... most of whom have 10/22's ...... it is every bit as good ..... and does not need any add-ons IMO. Only reservation and frankly I'd apply this to any semi 22 ... there is a need to clean main components at times cos of the crud build up .. to ensure good function. Plus ... the 15 rnd tube mag is a bonus for me.

larryw
June 2, 2003, 12:07 AM
Redneck, I'm 6'5" and the standard 10-22 fits me fine.

762x51
June 2, 2003, 12:45 PM
Go with the 10/22. The 597 has way too much plastic and is too complicated IMHO. My friend has broken his 3 times, and lost parts during disassembly a couple of times. it now just sits in the case.

Selfdfenz
June 2, 2003, 02:15 PM
Have owned 10/22s and have my first 597.
They were/are both "ok".

I'm with redneck on the "buy it and then replace everything but the receiver" concept. Never seemed logical but that' s just me.

My 597 has been pretty accurate. They come with poor triggers but two companies have started offering parts for them too. The metal mags are better than the plastic ones. Some of the extraction and ejection problems have been corrected with the new extractor installed on newer models. I'm not a big and tall fella but the 10/22 always seems small and contray to handle for me also, so again I have to agree with redneck. The 597 is dimensionally, an adult's rifle. The 597 is not a "bad" plinker with the iron sights that come on it if you do something about those triggers.

Mayhaps Remington was wise as a wizard offering a gun that could be 10/22ed a-part-at-a-time. Trying to copy Ruger??

My experience with several 10/22s has been they were reliable right out of the box but lacked something in the accuracy dept.
The Remington was accuarate right out of the box but lacked something in the reliablity dept. I'm not a tinkerer but if the gun will not shoot fairly well with at least one cheap kind of ammo and pretty DANG good with something off the higher priced table (like Wolf/SKJ, not Laupa), it's sold. Period.

Lately I find the CZs offer great accuracy and great quality at a great price. I'll spend my $$$$ on big scopes and better quality ammo. The CZs will get your money's worth out of both!

I recommend rimfireforms as a place to get info on all three types of rifles. Like THR, there are many good, no make that (THR) great, folks over there.
Good luck C-W,
S-

Hawkman
June 2, 2003, 04:21 PM
I gotta go with P95Carry on the Model 60. Fun, cheap, and accurate! I shoot while my buddy with the 10-22 tries to figure out how to get his mags to feed.

Master Blaster
June 2, 2003, 04:33 PM
I have a 597 SS laminated 2 years now, I also have a standard 10/22, I use Iron sights on both, both are stock.

They are both good plinkers, I shoot metalic silhouettes mostly with both. 50 yards and 25 yards Rams, geese, pigs and chickens.

The remmington is more accurate than the Ruger, but I like the ruger as well. Triggers on both improved after the 500 round mark.

The 597 will start to jam at bout 100 rounds, the chamber is tight and needs to be cleaned with a CLP Q-tip a bit.

The remmington was $200, and the 10/22 was $140.

I like them both and would not change a thing on either, the rem does feel more like a real rifle though. I have two plastic and two metal (magnesium aluminum alloy ) mags and both work fine.

I would give a slight edge to the 597 SS laminate, on paper its more accurate, and has a nice stock and balance.
The trigger guard and magwell / trigger assembly holder is plastic.

I have about 4000 rounds on it mostly federal 550 bulk pack copper plated from wally world. I had it out of the stock about 2000 rounds ago and when it was new. It hardly had any fouling in it after 2000. the chamber and boltface get dirty, but you can clean them with a toothbrush q-tip and a little clp.

A little lube on the underside of the bolt and you are good to go.

I think many folks clean and dissasseble reassemble these things to death, when they dont need it. Buy and shoot at least 500-1000 rounds before you change anything on it.

JMHO YMMV.

Pilot
June 2, 2003, 10:09 PM
Well I'll weigh in here. I have some great bolt action .22's, but I enjoy shooting my 10/22 more. I modified mine with a 16 in. bull barell and Fajen stock combo from Midway along with the Power Custom trigger group and VQ mag release. Its very reliable and very accurate. If I can work on this rifle anyone can. I bought the Clark video and did all the mods myself. It is a blast.

makdaddy03
June 2, 2003, 11:01 PM
Remington 597. In accuracy My 10/22 doesnt even come close.

Omaha-BeenGlockin
June 3, 2003, 11:12 AM
I have 2 10/22's---both with absolutely no modifications---both function with no problems---accuracy is good enough---I mean, come on, its just a .22 with a max usable range of what??---25 to 50 yards???

Seems to me if I were going to sink a $1000 into a .22----I'd just get a Sako or Cooper and be done with it.

Heck--for the amount that some guys put into a 10/22----you could have an uber-tactical AR-15---and a more usable all-round weapon.

I guess what I'm saying--is buy right the first time----instead of the piece meal 10/22 money pit.

Don't get me wrong---I like .22's and currently own 6 total---but none of them has a ton of money dumped in them either.

Rupestris
June 3, 2003, 11:43 AM
3rd vote fot the Marlin model 60. I picked mine up for $129 WITH the synthetic stock and Williams firesights. Put on a Simmons scope for $35 on clearance and its been an outstanding .22.
I was sold on the 10/22 until I shouldered both and compared them side-by-side. Sure the 10/22 has more to offer in custom/aftermarket parts but the marlin came with everything I'd have added anyway (synthetic stock, better open sights). The Marlin was just a more comfortable fit for me.
The only ammo it has a hard time with is the Winchester XPert.
Rupe

Tropical Z
June 3, 2003, 03:12 PM
Back to back shooting with my 597 and a friends 10/22 has proven the superiority of my rifle.Its not just THAT 10/22 either.I am constantly fascinated by their fan club.If you get a 10/22,plan on replacing the child sized stock.Ill take my MAN sized 597 ANYDAY!

Handy
June 3, 2003, 05:07 PM
If you don't like tube fed, Marlin also makes the model 795, a clip fed gun similar to the 10/22, but perhaps nicer. They also make a version for a scope only, with heavy target barrel called the 7000 for about $200.

Savage might make something as well, not sure. But I think the Marlin firearms are really nicely made and VERY accurate.

lawboy
June 4, 2003, 06:04 PM
Let us be honest. I have about six custom 10/22 rifles, including a custom 10/22 magnum. I have never owned a 597. I have fired several though, including one of the now-discontinued custom shop jobs in 22 magnum. I've fired examples of both rifles that were great right out of the box in the reliability department, and examples of both that were jamomatics. Same goes for accuracy. The Remington may have a edge on average out of the box accuracy, but so does the Marlin 60 so if that is your criteria, the oracle has spoken, so to speak. That said, I would never by a Marlin 60 because they seem cheap, are not attractive to me, and do not lend themselves to tinkering, which, after all is my main interest in firearms of any kind. I like to tinker. Therein lies the gravamen of this debate. The Ruger is a rifle for those who like to tinker and want to build something special, unique just for the joy of doing so and to see how good they can make it. The Ruger design and suport in the industry makes it the choice for these kind of people ... and there are a ton of us. The Remington is becoming an alternative choice for this brand of folk. The Marlin never will due to design problems and the cheapness of the build. For now though, the Ruger is the only real game in town for the dedicated tinkerer, and because of fhat, it can be BUILT into a very accurate gun quite easily. Yes, it is expensive, but tinkerers are not typically interested in that. I mean, consider the average wildcatter. Most wildcat cartridges aren't really doing anything that some standard cartridge can't do. The tinkerer and wildatter are in it for the creativity and learning, same as the guy who buys an old Camero and buts 25k into making it a hotrod. Hell, he could have spent 20k and bought a new Camero ... but then, where's the fun in that, if you are a tinkerer?! regards.

sm
June 5, 2003, 02:06 AM
Marlin 60
tweak trigger forget it--once you find ammo it likes, me x22lr or powerpoint.

I like "sleepers" low profile . I was talked out of all the 10/22 's, I once had-factory wood deluxe stock, wood and blue appearance . Out shot the tricked out ones. They are used for gaming now. Good 4 x scopes.

My "vehicles" same way, low profile, til you turn the key...throaty. Big kick , whipping a trans am butt, 300 zx, z3... in a "old man's car"... or "truck".
;)

Old Bulls...sneak down get 'em all--young'uns rush down scare 'em all away, get nothing

six 4 sure
June 5, 2003, 03:56 AM
Another vote for the 10/22 here never had a single problem with mine.

Six

Ky Larry
June 5, 2003, 10:11 AM
Take a look at the T/C .22 Classic. Fit, finish, and accuracy are all outstanding. Also, mine has a beautiful piece of walnut. I haven't seen any aftermarket parts for it but I don't know what you would want to change. Try it; you'll like it!

musky hunter
June 5, 2003, 10:20 AM
It is the most enjoyable rifle i own. The problem with 10/22s is that you cant only own 1, you will get addicted and buy many more. here is one of mine. http://members.rogers.com/muskyhunter/images/1022small.jpg

Med 10
June 5, 2003, 04:09 PM
Dude, that is an AWESOME shooting range you have there.

BTW I like my Marlin model 60. Flawless for under 100 bucks.

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