[Mastrogiacomo]

Just trying to get a sense of HOW bad it is in the Communist regions of New York and Massachusetts. Of the two -- which are incrediably bad for gun rights I know -- which state comes up on top and why?

[FPrice]

"which state comes up on top and why?"

I would have to say Massachusetts. The very existance of the AG's "good gun" list which limits what you can buy in this state is an affront to all honest and safe gun owners in this commonwealth.

[Mastrogiacomo]

You bring up a good point there. We recently had the list "updated" which basically said the same thing with a new visual format. The Para Ordnance guns have been on the list for years -- we have yet to see any in the stores. When I saw them still on the new list, I asked one of my local gun shops "Is this some kind of sick joke? Why bothering having a list if you don't honor it?" He couldn't figure it either...:fire:

[Graystar]

From what I've heard, MA is worst.

I live in NYC and the only thing I can't get is a license to carry. But otherwise, I don't have too many other restrictions. For example I just bought 3500 rounds of ammo from an out-of-state supplier. I didn't need any paperwork or approval. I don't need approval to take my guns to the range. I can have pre-ban mags. I can do pretty much most of the things that other people can in other states when they have guns but no carry license.

The main difference is in acquisition and disposal of guns. That's a real pain in the butt. There's paperwork, you have to get approval, the gun has to be inspected, and you might even be required to buy a safe. Still, these things don't make it impossible to get guns...just makes it more work.

[jmbg29]

In order to avoid the aftermath of the Gun Control Act of 1998, my father had to box up our family's guns and ship them out of The People's Demoratik Kommunewealth of Massachewsh*ts. He did that in order to ensure that they were not cataloged by the gun grabbing rat-:cuss: bastards that infest that God forsaken hole.

Since my father is elderly, and does not (as a general rule) make long-distance trips, he will likely never again set eyes on his beloved Parker 12 gauge. Nor is he likely to see his takedown Model 1895 Winchester in .405 W.C.F. ever again. All of his other guns that he worked a lifetime to own are gone. The rats, and the filth, won.

For the crime of having stolen (by forced exile) the treasured property of an elderly man, whose only fault was to have worked his entire life to be a good, honest, and contributing member of society, I find the P.D.K.M. guilty.

See if you can guess which state I hate most.

[FPrice]

"See if you can guess which state I hate most."

Please don't keep us in suspence.

I am curious, why did you feel the need to ship your father's guns out of state? While things are bad in some respects, they have not yet gone to mass confiscation. Nothing you mentioned has been affected.

[jmbg29]

I am curious, why did you feel the need to ship your father's guns out of state? While things are bad in some respects, they have not yet gone to mass confiscation. Nothing you mentioned has been affected.You are kidding, right?

Why don't you just keep telling yourself that it's not so bad, and leave it at that.

[CZ-75]

Why didn't dad ship them to you?

The Parker and 1895 should both have been kept in the family.

[jmbg29]

Why didn't dad ship them to you?Who said he didn't?

I guess FPrice isn't the only one missing the point here.

My father shouldn't have had to do anything at all. The two guns mentioned in specific, and many of the other unmentioned guns, have been in my family for decades. They were my mother's and father's property. They were theirs to do with as they wished, provided that they did not employ them for criminal purposes.

Get it demorat lurkers? Get it demorats on this board? THEIRS!!!!! NOT YOURS!!!! NOT THE FRIGGING STATE'S!!!! OR IN THIS PATHETIC CASE, NOT THE KOMMUNEWEALTH'S!!!!!!!!!!!:fire:

The People's Kommunewealth wanted to register the serial numbers of said guns (many of which were manufactured before anything as absurd as a serial number was invented), for the purpose of future confiscation.

The people of the P.D.K.M. are not worthy of one drop of sweat off of my father's :cuss:, much less the serial numbers off of any of our family's private property. Hence, they were shipped out of the People's Kommunwealth for what may well turn out to be forever. :fire: :fire: :cuss: :cuss: :fire: :fire:

[Jim March]

From what I hear, Hawaii is actually the absolute worst *state*. WashDC is the worst, period.

Illinois is also bad, with Chicago considerably worse than NYC. Upstate NY isn't actually that bad. NYC though is probably worse than most of MA.

California isn't as bad in SOME ways, in that we don't have "ownership permits" and defensive ownership inside of your home or business is a universal right. But the per-capita rate of legal gun carry in MA is far *higher* than California, with over 100,000 permits in MA (pop: 6mil or so?) versus 39k (pop: 35mil :eek: ). Upstate NY's carry permit rate is also probably better than Calif.

[CZ-75]

My father shouldn't have had to do anything at all.


Lotsa folks shouldn't have HAD to do anything. Wishin' don't make it so.

What counts is they didn't end up in the scrapheap.

I suggest you get mom and dad out before they have to get serial numbers too - tattooed right on their forearms. :barf:

[Mastrogiacomo]

There's plenty of really bad states for guns: New Jersey, California, Maryland, and yes, Hawaii -- glad I don't live there. I'm just interested in finding out between Massachusetts and New York -- which state makes it harder to enjoy gun ownership as a hobby.

[jmbg29]

I'm just interested in finding out between Massachusetts and New York -- which state makes it harder to enjoy gun ownership as a hobby.MA

[Ian Sean]

NJ

Once took three months for the permit to purchase a handgun to come through. Yes folks, THREE MONTHS to buy a handgun, talk about waiting periods. Normal wait is about a month, still to long. It isn't as long if you happen to know the local Barney Fife, but still a few weeks.

AND you have to get one permit for every purchase every time. Plus a $50 fingerprint check and $5 permit price. EVERY time.

One of my first acts as a citizen of PA. was to go to a gun store and 30 minutes later walk out with a gun (NICS is nice, to bad NJ doesn't use it).

"Welcome to New Jersey!, sucessfully fighting progress for 200 years" Sign seen outside a business upon entering NJ from Delaware.

[M1911]

I live in NYC and the only thing I can't get is a license to carry. I live in MA and while there's stuff that I can't buy, I do have a license to carry. YMMV.

[FPrice]

"You are kidding, right?"

No. I am not kidding. I merely asked you a simple question which you ignored and instread retreated into insults and a continued stream of ranting.

If you would bother to do some research you would find that I, and many others from the People's Commonwealth have repeatedly documented the problems which exist in this state and our combined efforts to fight this problem.

For those of us who either cannot or will not run the only option is to fight to turn the tide and try to restore the rights which belong to the citizens. And no, it's not an easy fight, but a lot of people are committed to at least trying. As opposed to those who run and then whine about it.

If you don't want to at least try to have an intelligent and respectful discussion, that is your choice.

Just one small request. If you choose the option listed above, please don't waste any more of my time with your responses.

But if you are willing to at least discuss the situation, then by all means let's discuss it as gentlemen.

Thank you.

[Graystar]

I live in MA and while there's stuff that I can't buy, I do have a license to carry. YMMV. Ha. Go figure, eh?

[Mastrogiacomo]

My guess -- probably lives in either Beverly or Springfield, MA. :D The only way I could own a gun is to get a job as an armed messenger in one of those armored trucks. Otherwise, I have to wait for 2005 or is it 2006?? to get my permit upgraded to an A.

Come to think of it, if the poster doesn't live in Beverly or Springfield -- maybe THAT'S how he got his Class A LTC.

[Poodleshooter]

The absolute worst laws are the registration laws. Without actual registration (as NY handles all pistols), movement of weapons out of state, or to safe locations in time of confiscation is at least theoretically possible. With registration, there is evidence that you have a specific weapon, and a case can be made by the confiscating government that you are liable for the weapon, even if they can't find it.
Does Mass. have any actual registration beyond the state purchase forms?

[Mastrogiacomo]

Not that I'm aware of but we are currently putting a bill to vote on prohibiting gun owners from buying more than one gun a month -- "to stop smugglers." Yeah, right....:barf:

[jmbg29]

Does Mass. have any actual registration beyond the state purchase forms?Yes, it does. That is why I asked the questionYou are kidding, right?of FPrice when he said Nothing you mentioned has been affected.Every firearm within the confines of the P.D.K.M. (People's Demoratic Kommunewealth of MA) was/is affected by the G.C.A. of 1998.

The G.C.A. of '98 required that in addition to having an F.I.D. card (Firearms Identification Card), that a firearms owner must also register the serial number and a description of all of their currently owned firearms, and obtain a L.T.C. (License To Carry) of which there are two classes:

Class "A"a) A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of firearms as the licensing authority deems proper; and (ii) rifles and shotguns, including large capacity weapons, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes; provided, however, that the licensing authority may impose such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of large capacity rifles and shotguns as it deems proper. A violation of a restriction imposed by the licensing authority under the provisions of this paragraph shall be cause for suspension or revocation and shall, unless otherwise provided, be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000; provided, however, that the provisions of section 10 of chapter 269 shall not apply to such violation.


and Class "B"(b) A Class B license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) non-large capacity firearms and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of such firearm as the licensing authority deems proper; provided, however, that a Class B license shall not entitle the holder thereof to carry or possess a loaded firearm in a concealed manner in any public way or place; and provided further, that a Class B license shall not entitle the holder thereof to possess a large capacity firearm, except under a Class A club license issued under this section or under the direct supervision of a holder of a valid Class A license at an incorporated shooting club or licensed shooting range; and (ii) rifles and shotguns, including large capacity rifles and shotguns, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes; provided, however, that the licensing authority may impose such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of large capacity rifles and shotguns as he deems proper. A violation of a restriction provided under this paragraph, or a restriction imposed by the licensing authority under the provisions of this paragraph, shall be cause for suspension or revocation and shall, unless otherwise provided, be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000; provided, however, that the provisions of section 10 of chapter 269 shall not apply to such violation.The issuing of these licenses are at the discretion of the local Chief of Police. For example, if one owned a firearm that had (by P.D.K.M. definition) the capability of accepting a "large capacity" feeding device, then one would need to acquire a "Class A" license.(a) A Class A license shall entitle a holder thereof to purchase, rent, lease, borrow, possess and carry: (i) firearms, including large capacity firearms, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes, subject to such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of firearms as the licensing authority deems proper; and (ii) rifles and shotguns, including large capacity weapons, and feeding devices and ammunition therefor, for all lawful purposes; provided, however, that the licensing authority may impose such restrictions relative to the possession, use or carrying of large capacity rifles and shotguns as it deems proper. A violation of a restriction imposed by the licensing authority under the provisions of this paragraph shall be cause for suspension or revocation and shall, unless otherwise provided, be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000; provided, however, that the provisions of section 10 of chapter 269 shall not apply to such violation. If the local yokels did not wish to be accomodating, one would be forced to:

A) Move to a free country.

B) Move to another town that had a Police Chief that was accomodating.

C) Be forced to sell or transfer the firearm to someone that had a "Class A" license.

D) Surrender the firearm to the P.D.K.M.

Any purchase of a firearm outside of the P.D.K.M. by one of its "citizens", must be registered by said "citizen" within seven days of the purchase.

Any transfer of a firearm from a "citizen" of the P.D.K.M. to a human being residing in another state or communewealth, must also be registered with the P.D.K.M.

The element of giving local "issuing authorities" the power to give/not give a person a license is meant to make the process so onerous and confusing; that people will just surrender their firearms rather than take a chance at being subject to the P.D.K.M.s $1,000-$10,000 fines, and quite possibly the MANDATORY one year prison sentence for firearms law violations.

Some people think that elderly people should take the chance of having their rat-&*#@ fellow "citizens" fine them, or put them behind bars for a year, for no longer possessing the intellectual capacity to sucessfully wade through all of the garbage contained in MA law, but I for one, disagree.

I could go on, and on, but suffice it to say that my disgust with the P.D.K.M. and the self-described "leaders" of "the fight" stems from their not even realizing what it is they are trying to fight.

They say things likethey have not yet gone to mass confiscation.andNothing you mentioned has been affected.And I just roll my eyes, shake my head in near disbelief, and remember to thank God yet again for delivering me from that pathetic excuse for a state.

[Peetmoss]

I would have to say MA is worse then NY. NY does suck but it depends on were you are. Some area's you pay your fee and pass your background check and walla you have a full carry permit not a problem. However you can do the same excate thing in say my county and walla you got a restricted permit. However you don't need a permit or special permision for a long gun NY and any permit will allow you to buy any handgun you desire.

[Mastrogiacomo]

I've heard it varies in New York but I'm told the city is down right Communist -- but places outside the city is a roll of the dice depending on where you live. How do New Yorkers find out where areas of the state are better than others? Meaning, Long Island vs Manhattan, Brooklyn vs. Bonx, etc?:confused:

[Mastrogiacomo]

Sorry, that's the Bronx...:o BTW, does it vary in Manhattan or Long Island also depending on where you settle? I just ask because they're big communities. Peabody where I live is an hour north of Boston and very restrictive but nearby Beverly and Danvers I'm told are much better.

[FPrice]

"And I just roll my eyes, shake my head in near disbelief, and remember to thank God yet again for delivering me from that pathetic excuse for a state."

It's too bad that you could not put some of that energy into helping organize people in this state to fight these laws.

Imagine if Sam Adams or John Adams had said back in the early 1770's, "Aw the heck with this &*^%$( colony! Let's go somewhere else." Why, we probably would not even be having this conversation right now because none of us would even know what it's like to own a gun.

[M1911]

The G.C.A. of '98 required that in addition to having an F.I.D. card (Firearms Identification Card), that a firearms owner must also register the serial number and a description of all of their currently owned firearmsThat is incorrect. Chapter 180 of the 1998 laws did not change registration in MA. All transfers of firearms in MA are registered -- that is, you must report when you purchase, sell, lose, or find a gun. That's been true in MA for quite a while. If you move into MA and already own guns, you do not need to register them. The specific portion of the law governing registration can be found in Chapter 140, Section 129c: A seller shall, within seven days, report all such transfers to the executive director of the criminal history systems board according to the provisions set forth in section one hundred and twenty-eight A, and in the case of loss, theft or recovery of any firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun, a similar report shall be made forthwith to both the executive director of the criminal history systems board and the licensing authority in the city or town where the owner resides. Failure to so report shall be cause for suspension or permanent revocation of such person's firearm identification card or license to carry firearms, or both, and shall be punished by a fine of not less than $200 nor more than $1,000 for a first offense and by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $5,000 for a second offenseNote that persons moving into MA are specifically exempted from registering in paragraph J: The provisions of this section shall not apply to the following exempted persons and uses: ... J. Any new resident moving into the commonwealthDon't get me wrong, MA is far from being a 2nd ammendment heaven. There's many, many bad parts about the laws here. But let's not imply that it is worse than it is.

I interview all applicants to the gun club that I belong to. Consequently, I get to see many LTCs. There are quite a few towns that are very difficult (if not impossible) to get an unrestricted LTC. But there are also many towns that issue only unrestricted LTCs. It is quite easy to get an unrestricted LTC from Arlington, Wayland, Weston, Wellesley, Stow. I've also seen unrestricted LTCs from Natick, Marlboro and Framingham, but they are somewhat more difficult. Sudbury is difficult, but I know people who have done it. Waltham was quite difficult, but I hear that it is easier now. Boston, Watertown and Cambridge are quite difficult. I believe Brookline is basically impossible. Newton used to be quite difficult, but then got easy. However, they've got a new chief and I don't know what their policy is now.

[Poodleshooter]

If you move into MA and already own guns, you do not need to register them.
This is one aspect in which NY is MUCH worse for the new citizen who owns handguns. There's no way to legally bring your handguns into NY unless you pay transfer fees and give up your weapons for a minimum of 6 months while you establish residency and hope for your permit to be approved.

[Graystar]

This is one aspect in which NY is MUCH worse for the new citizen who owns handguns. There's no way to legally bring your handguns into NY unless you pay transfer fees and give up your weapons for a minimum of 6 months while you establish residency and hope for your permit to be approved. This is true...so true. :(

[Mastrogiacomo]

I imagine the only way to get around it is to have an armed job waiting for you....

Or again, is it different depending where you settle? Long Island, Manhattan, etc? Or is all of New York this tough?

[jmbg29]

That's been true in MA for quite a while.That may well be. It wasn't true when I lived in that hellhole.

[Jrob24]

It is quite easy to get an unrestricted LTC from Arlington, Wayland, Weston, Wellesley, Stow.

Maybe it is for you, but the issuing authority in my town seems to think my young age must imply I'm up to no good. I'm expecting a rejection letter soon and then I'll take him to court.

[M1911]

Jrob24: As I mentioned previously, there are may towns in which is difficult or impossible to get an unrestricted LTC. But in recent years, I've only once seen a restricted LTC from Wayland and none from Weston.

I'm not suggesting that I like this situation. I don't approve of discretionary licensing. But at the same time, we shouldn't paint this as worse than it is. For example, it is my impression that it is almost impossible to get a carry permit in NJ. In contrast, many people in MA have unrestricted carry permits.

[Blain]

You ask me which state has the worst gun laws.....

There is only one correct response.......MA!

Anyone who dissagrees is either ignorant of how bad things are are, or is just plain in denile.

Note that just because getting a license in MA was easier for YOU doesn't mean that 90% of the other subjects have it quite as easy.

If you need to know why MA is the worst, all you have to do is visit this thread I posted last week describing the horrors of MA gun laws.

Here is the link

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=24630

Here is also a transcript of the post:


"Obtaining a Class A License in MA – The Trials and Tribulations"

Sigh……as many of you may or may not know just recently I tried to apply for a class A license in the Socialists state of Massachusetts. Now, those of you who know MA know how extremely left wing, anti-gun, communist, socialists, pinkos they are. For those of you who don’t know, let me give a brief run down of the firearms policies of MA.

1. To obtain any type of firearm, even a BB gun, you need to obtain an FID card. You NEED an FID card to buy a firearm at all. If you have an FID card you can purchase;
- Non large capacity firearms and shotguns (doesn’t matter if they are semi or not), NO handguns at all.

To obtain an FID card you must be 18 years of age, you must fill out the detailed paperwork, you must take a 4 hour firearms safety course which costs $50, you must hand in two current photos, you must have ALL your fingerprints taken, and to top it all off, you must hand in an additional $25 to the police station. Tell me again who has the worst gun laws?



2. If you wish to purchase a NON high capacity handgun, or a large capacity rifle or shotgun you need a class B license.

To obtain a class B license you need to be 21, + all the requirements needed to obtain an FID (course, money, prints, etc.) This means no high power shooting until you turn 21 (no AR’s, etc)

3.If you wish to purchase both high capacity long guns AND handguns you need a Class A license. Now, a class A license CAN also be a license to carry, IF the police chief approves it. It is totally up to his discretion if you will be able to carry with your class A, or if it will be just for target and hunting, or if he will even issue you one at all.

To obtain this license you need to do all the requirments of the previous licenses ( at age 21) and submit two in state references!


Now before I go into what happened today, I just want to make a quick point. When I first stopped by the police station to pick up the paper work to get my license the officer asked me flat out.
“What you want this license for, you want to shoot people? You want to shoot people?”

To which I replied that I didn’t want to shoot anybody. He then asks me,
“But if someone was coming after you…” to which I replied
“I would shoot to defend my life if someone threatened it, yes”

He then said, “ok” and handed me the paperwork!

Ok, now to make a long story short, I just went into the police station today to submit all the garbage that they make you do. The officer on duty looks it over and sees my reason for wanting the card, “All Lawful Purposes”. He looks at me and says, “I can not issue this to you, the card can only be for target and hunting only”.

How loving.

He reiterated that point and told me again that the police chief wouldn’t accept it unless it was for sporting and target purposes only.

I then asked him why not, to which he asked me if I had received any death threats. To which I replied no, of course. He then went on to say that the chief only issues the license as “All Lawful Purposes” to those who are either; armed security guards, working in a jewelry shop, or police officers.

He then asked me if I was going to shoot and kill someone. I said, “If I was in fear for my life, I would shoot to defend it”. He then asks me,

“Have you ever been carrying your gun in a situation where your heart was racing and you were nervous and sweating?”

When I replied with no he goes on to say,
“Well, if you do it’s a totally different situation, and if you shoot someone, you’re going to be in deep *$#% (curse word for crap).”
He then said that if I shot someone with the guns I had now, I would be in BIG trouble too!
I then told him that I would only shoot someone if I felt my life was in serious jeopardy, and that in such a situation I would rather be alive and facing legal action than dead.

So then he goes to ask me,

“Who told you to put the reason as “All Lawful Purpose”? This instructor, Peter?” (Who was the instructor for my firearm’s course, a police officer of a neighboring town who’s class I took).

I told him, “Yes!” to which he shook his head in disgust.

He then goes on to ask me if I shoot a lot, and I told him that I target shoot quite often. He then goes on to say,

“Well you need to shoot, MORE, “Blain”!!!” to which replied that I did.

We argued on and on for about this for 5 more minutes or so, I, trying to act as civilly as possible. I told him that I was applying for a job as AMSA, Armed Motor Services of America, and to be applicable for that I needed to have my class A. He argued that I needed to be an employee first with a written letter requesting the license when I told him, “No, you don’t understand, I NEED a Class A to get the job!!!

Then we both sort of dropped the arguments and he set up an appointment to get me finger printed. Note, I didn’t have him change my reason to just sporting and target, I left it as all lawful purposes so maybe, just maybe, I will be approved for that.

It should also be noted that our town is scheduled to receive a new chief of police soon….if he will be more pro gun or anti gun is anyone’s guess..

I don’t know what any of you think, but this is absolute BS!!!!!!! I am so sick and tired of being treated like a criminal here! This is why I am going to move to NH when I get out of school! If, when I go into get my prints, they give me a hard time I am going to explain how they are all being fascist tyrants who value their lives more than the lives of “lesser citizens” like myself. I will then ask them if their life is worth more than mine, and if they answer “no” than I will ask why they have special privileges to self defense that I don’t? I will then go on to tell them how they make my sick by enforcing these draconian gun control, and other, laws and that they are no different than the Nazi SS officers.

I can think of so many things to tell them, but at the end of it all I will say “This is the reason why I am moving to New Hampshire, where citizens have rights and are all treated as equal, not the sheeple of some power elite control system!

Yes, if I say this I will not get a class A at all, so no high caps for me. But, heck, I am just so fed up with this BS and I am not going to take it anymore! I’ve been civil…..now I’m going to get some service!!!!!

Now……..WHO’S WITH ME?????????

[jmbg29]

It's too bad that you could not put some of that energy into helping organize people in this state to fight these laws.I was actually rather widely known for it in the western portions of MA for many years, but a lot you know.

The so called 2nd amendment advocates in MA usually have one thing in common. They are Demorats.

MA, as you well know, has been for many years, among the only states to always vote for the Demoratic Presidential candidate. Even in times when the remainder of the country has made a decidedly pro-freedom shift, the denizens of MA persist in voting for the people most likely to take their rights in exchange for some fleeting form of "gimme".

Sometimes that tendency is both embarassing and hysterically funny. Picture if you will, the runt Dukakis making believe he was a tank commander, and the numbnutted wonders of the P.D.K.M. lined up around the block to vote for the twirp. I would do it, but I would hurt myself laughing.

Socio-political influences ranging from the stranglehold of Unions/Organized crime (one and the same), and the strong socialist sensibilities of the Catholic Church, and the egghead rarified air wafting from the many Ivory Towers of Academia that blight the MA landscape; have led to a permanent slavish mentality that causes otherwise good people to avow obeisance to the collective.

As such, they will talk a good game about their desire for change, but close that voting-booth curtain on them, and they will flip those Demorat candidate levers like rhesus monkeys trained to the task by the negative reinforcement of electrical shocks to their genitals.

The overwhelming majority of the gun owners in MA that I know, say that they want their gun rights. Unfortunately, their votes at the ballot box have never, not even once in my lifetime, reflected that stated desire. Never.

Most people in MA will say that they vote Demorat because of the poor RINO choices (can you say Jane Swift?) that they face at the ballot box. What they fail to understand, is that they are the reason for the non-existence of real Republican candidates in MA. The overall consensus in MA, is now, and has been (as long as I have been alive) an unwavering belief in dependency on, and a sense of entitlement from, the government. And so who can really blame the Demorat party of MA for all of the property that they steal, all of the wealth that they confiscate, and all of the liberties they destroy with the power of government? Hell, at this point the Demorat party could probably even get away with collecting all of your guns tomorrow, and still count on a landslide victory in November. On second thought, strike "probably".

In short, there are many things in this world that are "too bad", and for me, MA and 99.99% of the people that live there, top that list.

[FPrice]

"I was actually rather widely known for it in the western portions of MA for many years, but a lot you know."

Very easy to say. A bit more difficult to prove. And even MORE difficult to show that you actually accomplished anything while you were here.

It kinda reminds me about baseball and the best players.

If you go to a baseball game and want to know who the best players in the park are, go listen around the grandstands. Very often you will find that the best players are sitting in the stands watching and critiqueing the action - not out on the field actually playing.

[jmbg29]

When listing the many influences that contribute to the "groupthink" mentality that most (certainly not all) folks from MA suffer from, I forgot to mention their idiotic facination with corporate sports.

Thanks for the reminder.

[FPrice]

"Thanks for the reminder."

You are more than welcome. I knew you needed it.

We will continue to expect to see you on the sidelines in future discussions of this nature.

[sonny]

Let's go Yankees!!!!!!:D ......just kidding!

[Mastrogiacomo]

People, I know of some of you love ranting but can we stick to the subject and not wander off on this thread? I'm only trying to compare between two tough gun law states. So for the folks that have some pretty big opinions of this state -- keep it to yourself. I didn't ask this question for people to unload on my topic. I may be from this state and voted Democratic but I'm a registered Independent and voted Republican too. I did so for Romney and he's NOT pro-second amendment regardless of his membership in the Republican party. That aside, I don't care to listen to what's wrong with this state, especially from people that don't live here...:rolleyes: I love a good discussion but let's lighten up on the tone please.

For the person that plans to take the Chief to court, please let me know how that goes. I'm told I can do the same thing here but I've been lead to believe it's a no win situation. Wish I could afford to hire a lawyer...

[sonny]

It's difficult to come up with an answer to your question because it really depends on what part of either state you are talking about .
I live in NYC...Manhattan to be exact and the fact that some non leo's or non rich folk's can get carry permits in some parts of MA trumps me and my situation......period.
Overall?.....I wish I could answer you.......If you don't mind saying ...is there a specific place in NY that you're asking about?

[FPrice]

"People, I know of some of you love ranting but can we stick to the subject and not wander off on this thread?"

Agreed. I apologize for enabling you-know-who in his rant.

I am curious about one thing. In the Commonwealth's search to reduce expenses due to our finances, I wonder if anyone has suggested doing away with the FA-10 and the costs associated with maintaining those files in Boston? I am also curious if any crime has ever been solved because all these registrations are on file? Doing away with this requirement would help to reform our laws AND save some money.

[Mastrogiacomo]

To be honest, I know zip about New York. If I ever had the job and financial resources to move, I would and possibly look to Long Island or near some Italian community -- but I guess you'd know more about where they're located than I do. :) Again, this thread was just about comparing the two to get some idea how bad it would be there if I moved. Being from this state, I'm kind of used to restriction and I seriously doubt all of laws against gun owners has done a damn thing to stop crime. It's just prevented a lot of law abiding folks for enjoying a hobby and from carrying for protection in areas where there's rarely any cops.

Of course the natural arguement is why don't I move down south, to Texas etc. The only Italians that probably live there re are in the witness protection program and to be blunt, I'm a city girl who loves the theater and a good Italian restaurant once and a while. I've been to New York a few times and although I know it's got it's problems, I still love the idea of moving out there some day.

[Poodleshooter]

Of course the natural arguement is why don't I move down south, to Texas etc. The only Italians that probably live there are in the witness protection program and to be blunt, I'm a city girl who loves the theater and a good Italian restaurant once and a while.
Don't move south. It took me over a year to find a decent calzone down here after living in NY.
I'd have to say that Massachusetts sounds pretty crappy for gunowners. NY is one of those states that panders to hunters by allowing rifle and shotgun possession with few restrictions, but severely restricts handguns. It's not quite in the league with IL,MA,NJ and other states in which gun culture is being systematically eradicated.

[Mastrogiacomo]

I'd agree with your about the calzone -- let alone finding a decent plate of gnocchi. No, I'd definately like to find something in New York but yeah, I know it sucks for handgun owners. What else is new? For me though, it'd still beat Massachusetts on the gun list alone. We have a slew of guns we're supposed to be able to buy here but can't because our Attorney General won't allow them in -- and for stupid reasons. At least I could get a Cougar in NY or an old Italian made Beretta. The gun choices available to buyers would be worth the move -- even if it can only be for the range and home.

[12GA]

There are lots of counties in Upstate NY where you can obtain a carry permit fairly easily. What differs from Upstate county to Upstate county is whether the carry permit issued includes any Administrative restrictions e.g., Hunting, Trapping, Target to/and From. I live in Albany county and the judge here issues all carry permits with these restrictions handwritten across the top of the permit. The gun club I belong to is located in the next county over (Rensselaer county). From what I've heard from my fellow club members, the issuing judge there does not place these restrictions on the carry permits. It's politics. :rolleyes: Mike Breslin, the county executive in Albany, is a Democrat. Kathy Jimino, the county executive in Rensselaer county is a Republican. FWIW, the administrative restrictions are not backed by law. The only penalty you might face if caught carrying outside of the restrictions would be possible loss of the permit.:uhoh:

[jmbg29]

Don't move south.Although you might want to consider Florida. It has all of the cultural requirements, and is extremely gun friendly.

[sonny]

Mastrogiacomo...Unless you're a felon.....You will be able to have the things you wished for in your last post in any part of NY including NYC...........plus plenty of culture......good and bad!
The Italian community's are still here.....but shrinking fast.....most move out to long island or jersey......Me and mine are still holding down the fort ..............Florida is a great place....I'm down their several times a year and it seems half my family and friends have made the move .....some are glad some are bored to death.

[Mastrogiacomo]

My Uncle Sal made the move to Florida -- kind of in the middle of nowhere. He seems to enjoy it but his wife was bored to tears until she got more settled in. I'm sure Flordia is great but just not my cup of tea. To live so far away from it all -- why not buy a home in Quebec? I do envy the gun laws in the Sunshine State and I'm sure it's great to get away for the winter. :) I just don't think I'd find a pizza made right without some Cuban influence added...:scrutiny:

[sonny]

You will NEVER get pizza ANYWHERE like you do in the northeast cities.....NY, BOSTON, PHILLY,NEWARK....not even in ITALY.
Some say it's the water.....I say it's magic!
I love Cuban food,when it's good it's real good.
If you are serious about moving ,feel free to contact me by PM and I'll give you the scoop on where and how much you'll be looking at.........rents are INSANE.
Florida is deep in history and culture .....it's not the same culture we may be used to but it is rich in it's own way....check out st.augustine on the web......you want history?

http://www.ci.st-augustine.fl.us/

[twoblink]

PRDC,(yes, I know, it's not a state) PRNJ, PRMA, PRNY, PRK. PRChicago might be in there... (yes, not referring to the whole state, just the city)