Saiga and AK (G2) Triggers (PIC HEAVY)


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rbernie
January 28, 2007, 05:52 PM
In this thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=250753), I promised to post some Saiga and AK G2 trigger group pics for comparison. I decided to split them into their own thread, to make them easier to find in a search. Here they are.

First, the G2 trigger group in a filthy Romanian:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=52192&d=1170022234

These are obviously top pics; the trigger hangs straight down and is pulled to the rear (right in the pic). Pulling the trigger to the rear causes the rear of the trigger to move up, as it pivots on its pin. As the rear of the trigger moves up, its front moves down and releases the hammer. Note that the Romanian AK has a pistol grew screw/escutcheon; that's where the Saiga will exit the trigger lever.

The Saiga 223/7.62x39 action trigger:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=52193&d=1170022246

The 223/7.62x39 Saigas use a pretty normal lookin' AK-design hammer, disconnector, and they use a trigger that's had the finger hook removed. They then move the trigger back to the slot in the receiver where the pistol grip used to bolt. To get all this married up, Ishmash inserts a rocker arm to push up on the trigger in place of the standard trigger finger lever (minus the finger hook). To make that happen, they have to insert two new pivot pins into the receiver, one for the relocated trigger (now sticking out of the pistol grip screw hole) to pivot, and the second for the rocker arm. In operation, the new trigger pushes down on the back of the rocker, which pushes up on the front of the rocker, which pivots the 'old' trigger in the same direction as it would have moved had it just stuck down and given you something upon which to pull with your booger hook. This is why the Saiga 223/7.62x39 triggers are not up to G2 quality; there are just too many sliding/rotating pieces in motion for it all to come out smoothly in the end. It works, but it's not match quality.

And finally, the Saiga 308 trigger assembly:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=52194&d=1170022257

The 308 Saiga gets a whole new trigger group. The hammer and disconnector look purpose-built and the rocker arm/multiple pivot is gone, replaced with a really really long trigger that pivots off the original AK trigger pin. This reduces the parts count and number of mating surfaces to a minimum, giving the 308 a superior trigger compared to other Saigas. It also means that the trigger doesn't pull straight back; it wants to rise slightly thru its travel, since it's pivoting at the end of a very long arm. It's not something that I really notice in operation, but some folks complain about it.

The pics should also help make obvious how conversion of a Saiga back to an 'original' AK configuration would be accomplished; you move the trigger guard back into its old location and re-rivet it, insert a standard AK trigger group and remove the two Saiga-specific pivot pins, bolt up a pistol grip and buttstock, fit the mag catch (Ishmash tended to cut them a bit long relative to normal AK dimensions), and figure out a clean way to cover the holes in the side of the receiver where the Saiga-specific pivot pins were. Of course, if you start off with a 308 Saiga you don't have those extra pivot pins to worry about... :)

The best conversion instructions, by the way, are still here (http://www.cross-conn.com/Saiga_Conversion/Step_1.htm), if anyone wants to consider doing a Saiga conversion.... Bullet guides and other fun Saiga conversion stuff can be found here (http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=13403), but you'll need to register to look at 'em....

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jagdpanzer347
January 29, 2007, 01:03 AM
Thanks for the picks and info.

-jagd

Highland Ranger
January 29, 2007, 06:54 AM
What am I looking at that appears to be braided wire?

rbernie
January 29, 2007, 07:51 AM
What am I looking at that appears to be braided wire?Springs. It's common in high-stress applications to use multi-wire springs instead of single-wire springs. They twist the wires into a braid and then form it to shape.

For example, my Sig and CZ pistol recoil springs are made this way as well...

benEzra
January 29, 2007, 08:12 AM
That's the hammer spring. Kalashnikovs use braided springs (for both fatigue characteristics and redundancy in case of breakage, I suspect)

Highland Ranger
January 29, 2007, 08:05 PM
I have a Saiga.

Don't like the looks of the funky spring though . . . .

blackhawk2000
January 29, 2007, 10:51 PM
This should go in the library.

Great post.

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