4473s/Records retention/BATFE

[orionengnr]

How long do FFLs have to keep 4473s?

How about if a Gun Shop gone out of business? What are the laws regarding BATFE keeping records from a shut-down gun store/dealer?

[Geronimo45]

Forever, methinks. When they shut down, I think they have to ship them all to the ATF.

[Gator]

FFLs must keep the 4473s for completed transfers for at least 20 years. Forms for uncompleted transfers must be kept for five years. If the FFL goes out of business they must turn the 4473s over to the ATF within 30 days and the ATF puts them on microfilm and keeps them FOREVER.

[Steelcore]

I don't think they use microfilm anymore.I think they have all the info in a computer.

[hotpig]

ATF&E does not have enough money to do anything with them right now. They are just pilling up in the warehouses.

A change in the Political climate could make the monies available for better record keeping.

[DMK]

But no, there's no gun registration in the US. :rolleyes:

It's poorly done, true (like eveyything else big govt. does), but it's there nonetheless. :banghead:

[OLD DOMENION]

When a FFL closes up the are required to ship their records to FALLING WATER, West Virginia.
Over 20 years ago I needed the sserial number from a 4473. When I contacted the BATF they told me that records were only kept for 3 years?

[JimmyN]

The BATFE has created a paperwork monster that they can't administer. More likely they just can't find any records more than 3 years old, they are buried too deep in the warehouse piles.

[22-rimfire]

If the 3-year retention is correct, I think it's time for all that paper to be shreaded and recycled. That would be a good governmental task!

If current 4473's are scanned, they will be saved forever in digital form.

[GreenFurniture]

Unless your gun is used in a crime, what does it matter?

[WVleo]

Hi From Falling Waters, Wv............................WVleo
PS why then does it still take Me forever to recieve anything in the mail from the ATF LOL LOL !!....Leo

[orionengnr]

Unless your gun is used in a crime, what does it matter?

Ummm...maybe you want to look North to Canada.
...East to Great Britain.
...South to Australia.

Then look forward two years on your calendar.

Why does it matter?

Maybe it doesn't and never will.

I wish I were so optomistic.

[Onmilo]

A dealer can shred the 4473 document after twenty years.
He must maintain his bound book records for the life of the business and surrender all of them to the BATFE when he closes shop.

No matter, the BATFE has at least thirty years of unproccessed records on hand.
I know this because I went out of business in 1994 and have since then received trace calls on a couple of firearms that I have to refer them back to their records division since I no longer have the bound book records of these sales anymore, they do.
They traced the guns from manufacturer to distributer to dealer,(Me), but could go no further.

I only kept my sales receipt books for ten years after I went out which is the limit of the law in Illinois so I couldn't even refer to those as a starting point for their traces.

[NORTEXED]

I dropped my FFL in 88, and my friendly BATF agent in Ft. Worth (nice guy actually) came by and picked them up. I even offered him both sets (I kept an exact duplicate set in another location in case of fire or whatever) and he laughed and said most people weren't that OCD. I told him I had a great deal of respect for what his agency could do to a person, and thought it best. I still have them under lock and key should a question from them ever arise.

[Jim Keenan]

If things ever got really bad, there would be no need to track every gun you own. They would simply mark you as a suspected gun owner and dangerous subversive, and wipe out your house and everyone in it. That's what smart bombs are for, aren't they?

Jim

[orionengnr]

Jim--
If I ever run low on tinfoil, I'm calling you... :)