[sau99rb]

I'm going sailing around the phillipines and need something just in case of piracy. It can't be a real gun because going in and out of different nations water's will cause real problems. I can't get a license everywhere I go, but if I keep one, don't declare it and somehow get caught, then I'm in serious trouble in some asian jail. So I figure some kind of high pressure air gun that can fire a bolt or something? but then I know nothing about guns.
If anyone knows of anything that might be of use to me, I'd be delighted to hear from them.

Thanks a lot

Rob

[Texas9]

Personally, I wouldn't intentionally put myself in a place where pirate activity is a likelyhood and firearms possession is a crime. Furthermore, any gov't that deems firearms bad enough to ban will likely look at any device that could hurl a projectile hard/fast enough to penetrate as a "zipgun," and dump your butt in jail just the same.

My advice would be to check out the laws that govern all the waters you will sail through, and find out what you can do to protect yourself there. If you don't find a suitable means of self-protection, I would find someplace else to sail.

[Chief 101]

There's all sorts of things that can be used as weapons such as "flare guns" and "spearguns". Select your defense wisely as pirates with machine guns and nothing to lose are a fearsome opponent. Chief

[SniperStraz]

Spearguns I suppose would do the trick on one or two people, but the accuracy isn't great especially if its windy. Boats are pretty CQB type places. A nice hunting spear from ColdSteel might do quite well, or maybe a machete. I'm no sailor but I'm sure someone with a similar problem will chime in shortly and give you a better solution.

[Nomad, 2nd]

Most places allow a pump shotgun.

You will probably have it locked up in port...

Sailing forums can help you more...

[tepin]

are you kidding?

[sau99rb]

Thanks for all your help.

I'll checkout coldsteel, many thanks.

Anyone know of any other high powered non explosive type weapons?

Rob

[Gord]

Again, you need to check the laws where you will be sailing - "I think" or "I'm pretty sure" doesn't cut it, and nobody here can give you a solid answer unless we know the limitations.

As others have said, a lot of countries around the world define even an airgun as a firearm; you'd get dumped in jail just the same whether it's a Daisy pump or a Mossberg pump.

Your best bets are probably a big scary knife, lots and lots of "for the love of God, someone help me" flares, a hefty insurance policy or not sailing in waters wherein you're disarmed and piracy is rampant.

Personally, if I were a Kalashnikov-toting Phillipine pirate I'd just unload on you and see what was left afterwards.

Registering on a gun forum to ask "what can I take sailing with me besides a gun" seems a bit counterintuitive; you should probably try to find some like-minded people who've been-there-done-that and see what they did and what advice they have. Experience still counts for somethin'. :)

[TimboKhan]

Even beginning to address someone looking for a gun where it is illegal is about as against high road rules as you can get. I am not a mod by any stretch of the imagination, but this conversation should not be happening. I understand that he is looking for a non-firearm, but it is still shady, if nothing else.

[Zundfolge]

Did a quick google search and came up with this link:

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f51/ -Appears to be the firearms forum of a sailing forum

[Sniper X]

Just don;t take anything of value you don;t intend to loose and then replace if the piracy thing is a reality. Shoot that's crazy that piracy is norml and you can't have a gun!

[horge]

Where around the Philippines are you sailing?
If you're just doing the Visayas, no worries.

The problem areas for piracy are out South towards Malaysia and Indonesia.
Out there, a shotgun is borderline useless against pirates.
If they're close enough for an escopeta to actually count,
the game's already lost. Think full auto (M14), or at least several HP semiauto rifles.
Most smuggler vessels routinely carry several RPG's against pirates.

Sorry, but I can't think of a non-firearm weapon that would help vs. pirates,
down in the South. In the Visayas, it's quite safe (and beautiful), so a shotgun or
handgun is plenty, and IIRC*, you only need declare them at the first port of entry,
and then keep them discreetly to avoid unnecessary hassling at every stop.


hth,
horge

*best to double-check, as my info's semi-dated.

[The Deer Hunter]

Just don;t take anything of value you don;t intend to loose and then replace if the piracy thing is a reality. Shoot that's crazy that piracy is norml and you can't have a gun!

To bad you cant leave yourself at home. Alot of time people end up getting raped/kidnapped/killed so its a good idea to be as hostile as you can. I saw a show on the History channel and said most pirates dont leave their victims unscathed.

For a weapon, i would get a couple flare guns and some spear guns. Do you want to get shot with a 2000 degree flare? If you jumped someone with a flaregun they would most likely be pretty disoriented and you could possible disarm them. A speargun is also a common naval item and can do some damage.

If you do consider arming yourself with said weapons you should get more than one seing as how they are single shot and pirates usually have hi-cap. ak-47's and such.

Oh, and btw, if a country doesn't allow firearms, it would be a wise choice not to go. Most counties like that have very corrupt systems and its the cops robbing you alot of the time. (cop-killers get shot)

[hso]

You've essentially got 2 layers of questions. How to carry a firearm in the waters you'll be sailing in? If firearms aren't permitted then what are viable alternatives?

We can't be of much help in the first case, but the firearms forum on the cruiser website should be able to help tell you how to carry a firearm in the area you're concerned with. If the response is that you can't have a firearm aboard then the next question becomes almost pointless to ask.

The fact of the matter is that pirates will probably be better armed than you are and anything that isn't a firearm is going to be woefully inadequate. Consider that they will kill you and take the boat and it's contents and you should realize that you've got to outrun or outgun them. If not permitted to carry a high power rifle then you have very few viable options that are not based on high tech sound technology that costs thousands to implement.

Good luck.

[karz10]

I'm not going to get into my background w/ this, but although the Philippines is an ally to the US, and there's not much to fear throughout most of the region, these days, you can't be too careful.

Knowing what I know, I wouldn't go anywhere in the Philippines alone, land or sea, I wouldn't go anywhere w/out locals or Filipinos intimately familiar with the exact area I was traveling in, and as a Westerner (American or otherwise), or as a Christian, or anything else that might be offensive to, or desirable in a kidnap victim (to militant extremists), I most certainly under no circumstances go anywhere near the southern region of Mindanao (with or without Filipino friends or guides).

FWIW, here is the state department link on current conditions in the Philippines, it's a good read if you're going there, aside from any security concerns: http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_999.html

Nonetheless, terrorist activity and armed banditry in certain areas of the Philippines still poses security concerns. The Communist Party of the Philippines and its terrorist military arm, the New People's Army, operate throughout the country and have issued public threats against U.S. citizens and interests in the Philippines.

In Mindanao and the Sulu archipelago, kidnapping, bombing, violence, and insurgent activity make travel hazardous in many areas. The Abu Sayyaf Group (ASG), which the U.S. Government has designated a Foreign Terrorist Organization, has kidnapped several Americans and other foreign tourists since April 2000. Some were freed after payment of substantial ransoms, some escaped or were rescued by military action, and some were killed. Other kidnapping gangs operate in the same general area and have abducted a number of foreigners for ransom.

------------------------

Don't get me wrong, I love the Philippines and Filipino people, but I'm pretty sure any Filipino friend you have would caution you just the same. Just like you wouldn't go to certain cities or neighborhoods in the US, or anywhere else in the world, w/out a group of people, some form of self defense, etc., and you have to maintain awareness anywhere you go, the same would apply to the Philippines, obviously you are somewhat aware of this, given your concerned post over warding off pirates at sea, except that there are certain regions that you should avoid at all costs, i.e. Mindanao...just repeating what my Filipino friends tell me.

Unless you're up to no good, work with some kind of relief/journalism gig (and don't mind dying for it), I don't know why you would want to go to Mindanao, or similar areas if you are one of the potential victims described above, after all, the Abu Sayyaf,mentioned in the above quote from the state dept, have killed their own people that crossed them, and people on mission for relief work trying to help poor regions in the south. As someone else mentioned, in this scenario, you're probably going to lose, multiple ships w/ heavily armed terrorists are going to win, don't go there. The President of the country there has no control over these people, they don't consider themselves a part of the Philippines, they consider themselves to be their own government down there. At least in the central and northern regions there is some accountability to the government, and you'd only be worried about isolated incidents, not wide spread incidents. JMHO, again based on experience and insider knowledge from close sources.

Hope you stay safe, and find another more helpful forum as to self defense options for overseas travel.

Regards,

Karz

[22-rimfire]

If I were worried, I would not go.

Pirates and smugglers will all have full auto weapons. Some will have gernades and other explosives, possibly cannons. You will be dead meat.

[CZ.22]

My brother knew a guy who improvised a mortar that fired paintball CO2 tanks. Don't know how he did it, or what its range was. If you strapped some sort of explosive to it... I don't know.
You really should have some sort of hi-powered rifle, backed up by a good, reliable pistol with some serious stopping power (I'm thinking GLOCK .357 or Ruger GP-100. If nothing else, a Mosin-Nagant will set you back about a hundred bucks and has the same, if not greater range than, an AK. High-tailing it out of there would be my first choice.
An Orion flare pistol can be bought at a local Wal-Mart for around 35$. Personally, I wouldn't want one of those things to hit me, if I was a pirate. I don't know much about spearguns, but they would work well at close quaters. For hand to hand comabt, something like a Kukri or a hatchet, or maybe a nice fishing spear.
What about a bow? Sure, its no rifle, but it will get the job done. Probably quicker to reload than a speargun.
Don't forget the carbuerator cleaning fluid and lighter.

[scrat]

buy a 2x4 then a 1 1/2 inch dowel. cut the 2x4 to about 14 inches. cut the dowel to around 24 inches. mount dowel in front of 2x4. on the back of 2x4 cut a piece of ply wood to resemble a circle in which to grip. mount in back of 2x4 now if you really want to go balls out. cut a a 2x4 about 4 inches put it on the left side of 2x4 to resemble box. Now paint it all black


you just made a 50 caliber

now send me any dollar amount for payment
:) :) :) :) :) :) :)

[JShirley]

I wouldn't go anywhere that was high risk that I couldn't possess a firearm, if I could help it.

I'm a big fan of manual weapons (of course!), and a spear is an easy, effective non-firearm weapon to learn, but no-one with a firearm is going to let you get close enough to use it.

Know the laws where you're headed, and plan carefully. Few things are worth risking your life.

John