[Drjones]

Hello all and specifically Jim March, our resident CA weapons laws expert. :)

My Strider Tactical GB is waiting at home on the porch for me, and that thing is never going to leave my side. It is a VERY sheeple-UNfriendly ( :D ) folder with a 4" blade.

Is there any way I could ever get busted for brandishing or anything else if some stupid sheep or sheepish cop decides to say something?

YES, I know its illegal to carry folders locked open, but that's not what I'm talking about.

[Kjay]

Of course you can get arrested if you're being foolish or in the wrong place and time. The charge might not stick but you can get arrested. I've carried blades for years here in CA and never had a problem. But I keep my blades mostly out of sight and don't normally partake in activities that draw the attention of LEO's in an official capacity.

[Drjones]

Please allow me to clarify:

I too have carried a small (also legal) blade for a while without problem.

The thing is that this Strider, while being perfectly legal, is not very inconspicuous.

Of course I do not and would not do anthing in public to draw attention to myself, but my question was strictly in regards to me actually using the blade.

Say I'm cutting fruit or whatever....you know...and some sheep freaks out.

Whatever...I'll probably just get up and start moving towards them, thus instantly killing them with a heart attack. :rolleyes:

[Andrew Wyatt]

i've carried wicked looking knives for awhile, and you can greatly lessen the amount of problems you have by not worrying about having problems.


Sheeple can smell fear. if you don't look nervous, and use the knife like it's your divine right to do so, they probably won't even notice.


if someone does, and takes offense, they'd have taken offense, no matter what you did.

[Drjones]

Sheeple can smell fear. I guess it takes one to know one, eh? :rolleyes: :p


if you don't look nervous, and use the knife like it's your divine right to do so, they probably won't even notice. Good point.

I probably won't have any problems, but it was just a question I had....

Thanks

[Mute]

Lotsa people carry folding knives. Unless you have a samurai sword strapped to your back or you're waving that folder around like Norma Bates, most people won't give you a second thought. Not even LEOs.

[Skunkabilly]

People flip out when I do anything with my 3" Emerson. "Dang that's a huge knife, what are you going to do with that?"

I usually tell them: "It's less than half the size of your kitchen knife...."

[Ol' Badger]

anything bigger that a Sheeples penis scares them something awful!:evil:

[Jim March]

OK, first off, the "weapons use" rules for pulling a knife are more or less identical to the "gun rules".

But we're not talking about that here, are we? You're sitting at a park bench, you go to peel an orange or whatever, and somebody freaks.

You should take it as your responsibility to avoid freaking anybody out. It's a pain, but them's the breaks. I carry something even wilder than a Strider, so I also have a silly little keychain knife (Swisstech Utilikey) on me. If I think somebody around me is liable to get scared, the Swisstech comes out instead of the Sifu.

Second, a lot of this is about surroundings, and your "looks".

All of the following can magnify your personal "scariness":

1) Your age - late teens is the worst. It sucks, but...what can you do?

2) Your race. This REALLY sucks. It shouldn't be the case, but it is. Sigh.

3) Your gender. Chick pulls out a battle blade to slice cheese for a sandwich, everybody just grins, unless she's REALLY punked out and looks pissed :p.

4) Your clothes. Could you get mistaken for a gangbanger? Or a bum? Or are you doing the "armed gentleman" look? It matters.

A Leatherman Micra, Swisstech or micro-size SAK are all less than $20. In the days when blades were primary weapons, it was VERY common for armed individuals to have small non-threatening utility/food knives on their persons to avoid possibly lethal confusion as to intentions. The Bushido did this, the Ghurkas had the small knife in their Khukuri sheath, examples can be found all over the world for the same basic reason.

There's no reason we can't do the same. As a bonus, your "fighting edge" will stay sharper.

(Sidenote: The cultures that didn't do this often had built-in systems of signals/manners that made some places "no fighting zones" that nobody would ever think about violating. Part of the Native American "peace pipe" tradition was that around the campfire, it was a no-fighting zone and hence you could haul out your "weapons" to cut up dinner with no problems. Not all tribes, of course, but a lot of 'em did this. "Hospitality rules" of this sort or similar were common, esp. when nobody could afford more than one knife - Bedouin "tent hospitality rules" are probably a variant.)
--------------

So what do you do if you forget the small knife, use the big one for utility, and somebody goes "eek"? A sense of humor is a GOOD thing. God knows it's happened to me. I was waiting for a bus a couple months back, and couldn't get the plastic-wrap off a beef stick apart :). So I get frustrated, discreetly (or so I thought!) pull the Sifu, and solve the problem. Look up, and there's this dude standin' next to me, says "Daaaamn, you gots you a SHANK!". I just kinda grin and chuckle, he's OK.

As to the law? Proving intent is a major part of any crime, and if you've got apple peel or similar around, it's not hard to explain and apologize for scaring somebody. What happens then varies all over the map by individual cop and to a lesser degree, by department. Can you stay calm, apologize, explain what happened and not come off like a nut? You'll probably be fine. Cops may "verbally prod you" to see if you'll blow up in a hurry, in which case it's cuffs time or they take your knife. They'll snarl something like "waddya need THAT for!?". It ain't that they're necessarily anti-weapon (although God knows it's possible), it's that they're anti-short-fuse-nutcase-with-a-knife. Keep cool, understand what they're doing, don't get beligerent or sarcastic about somebody getting scared and you'll be fine.

But: if this happens too often, the odds will catch up to you.

[pytron]

Reminds me of the time I went to apply for my CHL in downtown Seattle. I walk through the metal detectors--they have conveniently :rolleyes: placed the permitting office near the courthouse. Of course, I throw my 3" Gerber folder in the tray along with my keys. The security guard goes "Whoa, what are you doing trying to bring that machete in here?"

Give me a break! They put it in a lock box and made it most inconvenient for me to get it back. Thank you so much government servants. You really saved the day on that one. :rolleyes:

-Pytron

[CWL]

Depends on what you mean by brandishing.

If you cary discreetly and tpically only open it to cut string & boxes at appropriate times, this is not an issue.

If you flick it open when in a movie line, you may be get in trouble.

There has been a case in Santa Clara county where a teen was prosecuted and convicted for approaching other youths with an exposed blade held flat against his leg. He then asked them for spare money. He was convicted for using an edged weapon during the commission of a robbery -although he claimed that he never threatened anyone with the knife, it was obvious what the intent was.

[gunsmith]

I used to be a messenger and would carry knives and all kinds of pepper spray,even the huge "grizzly bear" can that cost 35 $$
I had to deliver to the federal SF buliding and the security guard asked "why you have this for? it's illegal!"
I replied "why do you have the federal building
in the tenderloin for? it's surrounded by feral junkies.
He tried to confiscate it:cuss:
Not being "in the mood" I told the rent a cop from some bannana
republic that this is America & NO
he can not confiscate it & if he does not return it when I
have finished my biz I will need to a reciept and a talk with his supervisor.
when I got back a FEDERAL PROTECTIVE SERVICE Officer was holding my can and the smug nazi guard pointed at me and said "him"
the FPS guy said "is this yours?" yes sir ,I answered
he said "you cant use this on people":rolleyes:
& I said" I come across lots of dogs while I'm working,the small
can of spray is for people":cool: he smiled and gave the big can,knife and small spray back...Nazi guard had his panties twisted but good:neener:
so combat,the moral of the story is some folks you can stand your ground with,(stupid nazi wannabe's from anti freedom countries)
and some you just have to be "cool" with(Federal law enforcement officers)
Now I am an armed security & you would find it hard to believe
what my co workers believe!
I love whipping out my six inch cold steel vaquero and listen to them insist it's illegal
but until your 21 stick with the four inch,and do not use it unless your life is in danger

[45R]

Dr.Jones-
The campus that you attend also a no gun and knife policy. Becareful cutting your salad. Sad...you can drink on campus but you cant carry your tools with you.....

HTH

45R

[tw1112]

Is it legal to carry a fixed blade of any sort in CA? I am looking into a strider knife right now and wanted to know. I am planning on taking this with me during hikes and such, but don't want to get in any trouble with 'officials' at the parks or whatnot.

[Bruz]

My understanding is that you can as long as it is not concealed...but you will be hassled carrying a Strider!

[Sir Galahad]

Verily, I say unto you, you shouldst not use your personal protection tool (you know, your blade, the shiv, the knife, the dag) to cut stuff, for one never knows when one may have immediate need of said article as sharp as it can possibly be at any moment. If your work wants you to cut stuff, insist that THEY purchase you a carton cutter. That way, you don't incur uncompensated wear and tear on your knife and your whetstones cutting THEIR stuff with YOUR knife. Plus, co-workers won't come ask to use your fine knife to pry a stuck quarter out of the coke machine. People, verily, they will ask, can I borrow your knife? You will say, no, I don't have a knife you can use. Where did you see a knife? If they see it, you can say, that's not a knife for people to use. Go find a carton cutter. This way, you:

A.) Avoid "brandishing" problems.
B.) Avoid wear, tear, and abuse of your knife.
C.) Maintain your knife in a high state of readiness at all times.

I pack a steak knife in my lunchbox to cut my food with. Bear in mind, too, that if you cut some foods with your folder and don't clean it, you'll run the risk of giving yourself some kind of food-borne illness using it on food later after it's been in your hot pocket a while. Bacteria gets in the many nooks and crannies of folders very easily.

[Jim March]

I agree 100% with Sir Gal, 'cept that the "secondary peaceful use knives" I recommend are all basically keychain-type - Leatherman Micra or numerous clones, Swisstech Utilikey, small 2" blade SAK or functional equivelent.

A full-size multipliers of any sort is also a worthy "tool-use knife". If you can find it, the Spyderco version has a better blade steel than most others, with the Kershaw or Leathermans tied for second.

The Kershaw based on a "vice grips" type pliers is unusual in that first, it's longer than normal (jaws don't fold) and second, with a thumbstud linerlock in the 3" class, it's probably the best "combat in a pinch" multiplier there is. Some of the other linerlock multipliers like the Wave or Gerber semi-clone are also "good enough fighters" that you might think twice about loaning one to a stranger. So with these better mutipliers, you might think about also having a smaller "keychain class" piece.

"Warrior societies" all over the world commonly carried smaller blades specifically for food prep/table use or similar social situations to avoid "conflict by misunderstanding". The Vikings did this, Samurai, European knights (movies aside, do you REALLY think they used combat daggers on dinner in the King's presence?), the Ghurka's smaller blades in the sheath of a Khukuri probably had that sort of function (esp. since the grip of the small knives of a Khuk appear to be designed to limit stabbing ability and hence weapons utility - dunno if that was deliberate or not, but it seems possible).

If it worked for them, it'll work for us. Cultures change, but human nature doesn't.

[Drjones]

tw1112:

No offense to him, but disregard Bruz's statement. (At least the last part of it.) It is perfectly legal to carry a fixed blade of any length anywhere in CA so long as it is not concealed.

I don't know what parks you are planning on visiting, but I can't imagine an officer hassling you over a blade.

Which Strider do you have? :)


Sir Galahad: While you do make excellent points, I don't really worry about my blade dulling with everyday use.

You musta missed the part where I said my blade is a Strider. ;)

[Joe Demko]

Okay, it is a Strider. It will still dull with use, especially if you use it on cardboard or other abrasive material or if you grind the edge into a ceramic plate using it as a steak knife. Sir Galahad and Jim March were right. If you have the money for a Strider, then I expect you can also afford a non-descript little folder for inconspicuous use or for utilitarian tasks. As it happens, I carry some good-sized folders on a daily basis. As I post this, I have a Spyderco Police model clipped into the waistband of my running shorts, for example. You will also find several little SAKs and the Victorinox multitool nearby.
You can massage your ego all you want by calling people who don't understand your desire to carry a knife "sheep." Guess what though? If you whip that bad boy out to "peel an orange" and you alarm one of those folks, it is you who is going to be the one explaining himself to the po-po. It is going to be you possibly making inconvenient trips down to the station trying to reclaim your property if an officer decides to informally confiscate it. In short, they may be sheep, but you will be the one who is treated as an ???.
Just food for thought, if I were out and about, and I saw an individual making what seemed a needless show out of using a large "taktikewl" folder for some small, mundane task, I'd do the following:
1. I'd keep an eye on him just in case he proved to be one of those "short-fuse-nutcase-with-a-knife" type people and require me to take other steps, too.
2. I'd question his level of maturity in needing to show off in such a fashion.

Buy yourself a little knife, too.

[Drjones]

Golgo:

Do you consider an individual who is openly carrying a firearm in an area which it is legal to do so a "short-fuse-nutcase-with-a-gun"?

And if you wish to call it "massaging my ego" when I label hoplophobes as sheep, go ahead.

I simply think hoplophobia in any form to be the sign of a weak mind, and such people hardly worthy of any respect, let alone my trouble to not offend or scare them.

[Joe Demko]

Do as thou wilt, Dr. However, please be assured that I will post a link to this thread should you , down the road, post about the dratted po-po seizing your beloved Strider when you wazn't doin' nothin' agin' the law.
For the record, if I saw somebody making a big show-offy production out of open carrying, I would indeed keep a wary eye on him. People who are comfortable with their weapons and don't have to make a "hey everybody! Look at ME!" production out of it don't much concern me.

[Drjones]

I believe I said above that it has never been my intention, nor will it be, to make a production out of using my knife.

[Sir Galahad]

What's a Strider? I have yet to see the knife that does not dull or the rifle that does not need cleaning. Some people fool themselves into thinking they have such an article, but many find out it is not so, much to their chagrin, well, chagrin at the very least, later.

Can't say much about cutting fruit. I haven't eaten a piece of fruit in two years now. Don't recall I ever needed a knife to peel it. Except with citrus, the peel is the best part. Kind of like brie.

One thing I don't like is for people to see exactly what I'm carrying. It's a "need to know" kind of thing and they don't need to know. If they see the clip on the outside of the pocket and a bit of the handle, well, that's all they're going to see. Let their imaginations run wild with what's inside the pocket. I might carry a smaller knife for utility depending on the circumstances. But the knives I carry aren't for public show and tell.

"Hey, can I use your knife?" "No, I don't have one." "Well, what's that?" "What that is---is none of your business. I'm not asking you what that strange humming sound I hear coming from your office is during your lunch break, so don't ask me about my personal property, as it were."

"Hey, can I use your knife?" "What knife? Who saw a knife?" "What's that?" "A clip-on pocket comb." "Oh..."

"Hey, can we use your knife to cut our pizza?" "Sure, and after that, can I come over and sleep in your bed with your wife?"

"Hey, can you cut this fruit for me?" "Do you need me to change your diaper and tuck you in for a nap afterwards?"

"Izzat a knife??!?" "No, it's a portable personal sexual gratification device. Would you like me to demonstrate how I use it? Go get your coffee mug."

"How come you won't let us use your knife?" "How come you won't let me use your wives? But you don't hear me whining about that, do you?"

[Tamara]

Sir Galahad: While you do make excellent points, I don't really worry about my blade dulling with everyday use.

You musta missed the part where I said my blade is a Strider. :)

Knives dull with use, be they Striders or $10 flea market Chinese knock-offs. If you use a knife for day-to-day cutting chores, you are dulling it, no matter the tactical hype surrounding the name on the blade. This is why so very many knowledgeable blade folks recommend that if one is going to carry a knife for potential self-defense usage, then it should be dedicated to that and nothing else: so the edge is as sharp as possible should you need it for its purpose. OTOH, if you're just carrying the Strider around as a day-to-day utility knife (which, unless you work in construction or some field where a beefy, ugly knife may come in handy, strikes me as something like plinking tin cans in the back yard with a LAW rocket), use it as one and keep it sharp.

On the main part of your question, I carry two rather large folders every day, and use them frequently with nary a murmur from the folks around me, but I refrain from dramatic wrist flips and various other tacticool knife-fu moves, and use them as what they are: utility pocketknives.

[Drjones]

Sir and Tam:

I did not mean at all that I actually believe my Strider (or any knife for that matter) to be free of the need for sharpening.

I meant it kinda tongue in cheek. :)

[Bruz]

but I can't imagine an officer hassling you over a blade. Which Strider do you have?

I was referring to most of Striders fixed blades as being "bad" looking...

http://webpages.charter.net/advantagerealtyca/shelbychanphotomickstridercustom.jpg

You don't think a cop would talk to you if you were carrying this Strider?

[Joe Demko]

(which, unless you work in construction or some field where a beefy, ugly knife may come in handy
I have a number of relatives and friends who make their livings in construction and who are also enthusiastic outdoorsmen/women. Just for the sake of conversation, when it comes to construction related tasks, none of them use any kind of folder, much less a relatively pricey one like a Strider. Every last one of them does, however, carry and use your common, everyday utility knife. I guess the convenience of replacing, rather than sharpening, blades outweighs tactical concerns.

[Tamara]

You don't think a cop would talk to you if you were carrying this Strider?

No, but I might laugh at someone carrying that Strider; for some reason it just screams "Someone's watched Conan too many times." That strikes me as the bladed equivalent of a gold-plated Desert Eagle with live goldfish swimming in hollow plastic grips. ;)


Golgo-13,

I know a few folks who use big, thick knives like Striders et al for what they were intended for; cutting rope, prying the lids off crates, et cetera. For some reason, there are folks who believe that specops guys are running around with these things in their teeth to use for killing people. Why anyone would think that somebody would use a knife to kill someone when they have everything at their disposal from pistols to silenced SMG's to laser designators for airstrikes that can do the same job more efficiently is quite beyond me. ;)

[tw1112]

Thanks Drjones for the info. Currently I don't have a strider...yet. I was going to buy the WP clip point from TAD but they sent me an email saying that I won't get my strider for another few weeks. I contacted a guy about buying a MT Mod 10. Big difference(price) between the two, but after looking at the MT, sigh...I just want it. More ramen this month I suppose. :D

[Drjones]

For some reason, there are folks who believe that specops guys are running around with these things in their teeth to use for killing people. http://www.delawareonline.com/newsjournal/local/2003/07/08touristkillerge.html

He used a Strider BT.


:neener: :neener: :neener:

[Mute]

He used a Strider BT.


This is for you Drjones:

http://www.theonion.com/onion3205/navyseal.html

[dav]

Tamara wrote:
a gold-plated Desert Eagle with live goldfish swimming in hollow plastic grips. Ooh, Tamara, Oh! Where can I get me some of those? I just gotta have 'em for my CCW AR-15! :D

[Joe Demko]

He used a Strider BT.

Thanks for the link. If I ever need to murder and dismember unsuspecting tourists, I now know which brand is best for the job. :rolleyes:

For the record, in the meat packing industry, largish animals are dismembered with knives not particularly Strideresque. Some places, they still kill those animals with knives, too. Those knives aren't very Striderish either. As Tamara noted, your boyish enthusiasm over your new possession is very endearing; but, there is no magic sword.

[Andrew Wyatt]

there is no magic sword.

http://webpages.charter.net/advantagerealtyca/shelbychanphotomickstridercustom.jpg


I think there is. ;)

[tw1112]

woohooo..Put in an order for the DB with OD green wrap right now. I wanted something smaller first...then maybe I will go with a folder or the mt mod 10 a little later. :)