[Mikel]

I know this sounds stupid, but I just took my PM9 apart for the first time to clean it (Don't shoot me, I picked it up last week and haven't shot it yet, plan on going tomorrow). What's the secret to getting the recoil spring back in? Is it just a horrible pain in the ??? or am I missing something?

[Mikel]

Well, I got the spring back in, but the take down pin went in the wrong way, and now the gun is locked up, about half an inch back from battery, I guess I'll be sending it back to Kahr to see if they can fix it.

[denfoote]

How can you put the pin the wrong way!! The gun only goes together one way!! You probably have the slide stop/ take down pin either forward or behind the barrel link. In other words, you missed the hole!! :rolleyes: Try tapping on the end of the pin with a plastic mallet, while trying to work the slide. I would think there should be some play in it!!! Once you have it away from the frame, pull it out!! Get it apart, read your directions carefully and try again!! Hint: Think 1911!!! :D

[WonderNine]

Uggh, sorry to hear that. Maybe you can take it back to the shop have have the gunsmith sort it out for you alot faster than sending it back to Kahr?

[Doc]

ok.
I have had trouble if the trigger gets reset prior to reassembly, see if you can pull the trigger and drop the hammer. If that doesn't help
try pushing on the slide to relieve spring tension, then (with another set of hands) put a punch thru the empty hole for the take down pin goes and strike the punch with a mallet.

[KarlG]

In addition to what Doc said, it is very important that the guide rod is CENTERED IN THE SLIDE. The looks are a little deceptive as the feed ramp is slightly offset.

[Mikel]

I don't see any possible way to get it out, it's all the way in and the slide won't go back far enough to allow it out, because the take down pin is blocking the barrel from moving back or droping down like it should...

[Gordon Fink]

Mikel, can you show us a picture of the problem? It sounds like something I’ve experienced with my K9—the off-center guide rod locking up. I assume, though, that the PM9 uses a captured recoil spring, like the MK9, which should avoid that problem … I think.

~G. Fink

[Mikel]

I'll try and get a picture of it later today, I left it at my office to ship back to Kahr monday, and I'm off today.

[FlyinGN]

This is a commom Kahr reassembly problem. You did put the pin in the incorrect hole. Pull the slide back as far as you can and knock out the pin and make sure the slide is in the exact right position before knocking the pin all the way in..
Push the pin in 1/2 way and move the slide back and forth slightly to 'find' the hole and then the pin will fall right in and the slide will not lock up. You had the slide back too far when you put in the pin. I do this a lot too. Once you get the hang of it it becomes second nature..

Frank

[Mikel]

Well, the problem is, it went ALL the way in, the slide is now covering the little tab that retains the lineup pin, and the pin is restricting the slide from moving back far enough to get to the notch that the tap is supposed to slide out of. (Hope that's semi coherant)

On an unrelated note, I own an 87 GN :p

[FlyinGN]

Hmmm. Try to pull back the slide to get the pressure off th epin and drive it out..
From One TR owner to another, I know you can get this gun repaired.. :)

Frank

[Doc]

you know you could mail it to the first one of us on the list and then on to each in turn until one of us gets it repaired!

[Gordon Fink]

I kind of like Doc’s idea, and at this rate, it’s the only way I’ll get to handle a dangerously “unsafe” pistol like the PM9 here in California.

~G. Fink

[XavierBreath]

Definitely run it by a gunsmith before you send it back to Kahr. It sounds like a 5 minute job that a smith can easily accomplish and likely not even charge for. Chances are the smith will let you watch him work, and you will see how to deal with it if you accidentally do it again!

[Mikel]

Gunsmith messed with it for a few minutes and said to take it to Kahr. I'll take pics tomorrow.

[bad_dad_brad]

I can't imagine what you did to cause this condition. I have a Kahr MK9 and it is a snap to take apart and reassemble.

But I have heard of others that are confused by the Kahr's mechanisms. The problem is at first, the Kahr is really tight, and it is difficult to pop the take down pin out. Later it get's much easier and you can easily take down a Kahr blindfolded.

As far as the double spring - I have had no problems re-installing it at all.

I will wait for the pictures, because I can't visualize what you did wrong in re-assembly.

[dsmith3512]

I did the same thing to mine the first time I put it back together. The pin is in front of the ring on the bottom of the the barrel that its supposed to go through. The diagram in the instruction book isn't very clear on reassembly.
My local gunsmith took it apart and polished the feed ramp for $17.00. He didn't say exactly how he got it apart, just he went through the back end somhow. He told me to look through the hole the pin goes through as I push the slide back and watch for the ring to pass by and make sure the pin goes through it.
Your going to like the PM9. I've put about 1000 rounds through mine. I carry it everyday in a Hedley pocket holster. Also check out the "A Grip" from the Kahr website, it helps eliminate irritation from the rough plastic grip.

[denfoote]

Gunsmith messed with it for a few minutes and said to take it to Kahr. I'll take pics tomorrow.

He must not be a competent gunsmith!! Either that or he could not be bothered with it!! ;)

My friend did the same thing to his MK9. He took it back to the gunshop and the smith did the same thing I suggested. In fact, that's where I learned the trick!! ;)

[jungleman]

My Kahr PM9 is easy to get the recoil spring in and out.
My Colt Pocket Nine is extremely hard to get the recoil spring in and out.:confused:

[bad_dad_brad]

Ah dsmith3512, now I see what happened.

Interesting.

The thought must have been to move the slide to the witness mark on the frame, perhaps a little too far backward.

Trick is, you don't have to move the slide much at all to reinsert the pin. Just a jiggle or two, then once the pin is in, then move the slide back to reallign the little piece of steel that fits under the slide and locks the pin.

Dang.

[Mikel]

Now for the pictures.

This is the problem:
http://www.midgetse.cx/images/kahr.jpg

Can't take it back down because this is as far back as it will go, no way in hell will the pin line up.
http://www.midgetse.cx/images/kahr2.jpg

Any way I can take it down without destroying the gun or should I just send it back to Kahr and see what they say? I'm relatively mechanically inclined, but I'm not familiar at all with this pistol, so I don't want to do anything stupid.

[SouthpawShootr]

You're better off contacting Kahr. They'll just tell you to send it in and they will take care of the problem. I understand that you don't want to loose use of the pistol for the month or so that it will take for factory service, but if you or anyone else does anything unorthodox to get this thing apart and happen to do more damage, you'll have to pay for that too.

Brings to mind an old saying a local gunsmith had printed up and framed in his shop underneath his prices: "Tried it, couldn't do it, add $25 to above prices."

[FlyinGN]

This is what I was talkin about. YOu can knock out the pin. This has happened to me a few times. Its not easy but it will come out. Hold it as far back as you can and drive it out. Its stainless you won't hurt it..

Frank

[bad_dad_brad]

From the pictures, it is pretty clear what has happened. The take down pin was inserted in front of the barrel link up instead of into the cam, and is now wedged between the underside of the barrel, and above the recoil spring.

There is a tiny little notch that locks the take down pin under the slide. Somehow that got under the slide, I suspect by inserting it through the slide stop notch. Anyway, it got under there.

I have an MK9, and can see how this could be done. Your gun is jammed, and probably should be returned to the manufacturer for inspection. It may need a new recoil spring.

The trick is, the witness marks on the slide and frame are only used to press the takedown pin (which is also the barrel link up pin) into the slide when that little notch fits into a little indentation to the rear of the slide stop notch.

You have to align the witness marks to take the pin out. You can put the pin back in after you put the slide back on the frame and then align the witness marks to push the notch in.

[Mikel]

You're better off contacting Kahr. They'll just tell you to send it in and they will take care of the problem. I understand that you don't want to loose use of the pistol for the month or so that it will take for factory service, but if you or anyone else does anything unorthodox to get this thing apart and happen to do more damage, you'll have to pay for that too.

Brings to mind an old saying a local gunsmith had printed up and framed in his shop underneath his prices: "Tried it, couldn't do it, add $25 to above prices."



I don't see how that's going to happen, there is a tab on the take down pin that has to line up with the slot in the slide to come out, there's no way to line it up with the gun in it's current state. The second pic shows the slide as far back as it will go.

If there's a way I can safely (as far as not breaking the gun further) get it out, I'm all ears. Otherwise, I'll call Kahr tomorrow. Losing the gun for a month is not a big deal, I also have a Sig P239 and a Glock 17, so I'm not without a gun.

[bad_dad_brad]

The fact that you can't see the barrel in front of the slide also indicates that the take down pin may be jammed in front of the link up, and the gun, is as they say "boogered up."

Send it in to Kahr, unless they have a better suggestion. It may also have something to do with the polymer frame being more flexible. I sort of played with my MK9 and would have a tough time duplicating what I think may be happening.

No matter, you could have a damaged recoil spring and should have it checked out. I have found that a lot of gunsmiths (and dealers) don't know that much about Kahrs. They are a pretty unique kind of pistol with very tight specs.

Mikel, please let us fellow Kahr owners know the outcome of your fix via this thread. I for one am very curious about what is going on here.

Good luck with Kahr customer service.

[Mikel]

I'll give them a call tomorrow morning and report back :p

[denfoote]

From looking at the pictures, missing the hole and driving the pin ahead of the barrel link is exactly what you have done!! Did you try using a appropriate size punch and a rubber or plactic mallet to drive the pin out??? That is what a gunsmith is going to do!!! That is the solution!! ;) This is exactly what my friend did to his ex-MK9 (I own it now)!!! He took it into the shop where he bought and and the smith performed the operation described above!!! Once the pin is out, your slide should come right off!! With the MK, you have to look through the hole to line up the link, frame hole, and the pin!! Do not depend on the "witness marks" for guidance!! The Kahr is just like a 1911 in this respect. Oh, and the recoil spring was fine after he got it freed up!!! :D

[bad_dad_brad]

denfoote says it pretty good, but I would still be concerned about potential damage to the recoil spring.

Even though it may not be apparent visually, with the the take down pin in front of the barrel link, I can only imagine the odd stresses that could be put on the recoil spring.

Best to let Kahr check it out. It does not cost anything other than your time, and you will have a record of the transaction.

Witness marks on the Kahr are only used to remove the pin for take down, and to reset the pin into the slide only after inserting it into the barrel cam.

Good luck, and I am sure your gun can be easily fixed, but I do think you should use the manufacturer to make this repair. Again as related, most everyday gunsmiths are not that familiar with Kahr designs.