[bulltaco]

I would appreciate any insight that might be offered on the S & W Models 57 and 657. What about barrel length? Mountain Gun?

[Nightcrawler]

I had a beautiful 6" model 57 that I ended up selling to a friend that collects vintage S&Ws. Mine wasn't that old, 1980s or so, but it was nice.

Why did I sell? Ammo was expensive as hell, and I was a broke college student. Other than that, I *love* the .41 Magnum. More ammo choices out there than ever before, but fewer guns. Kind of like 10mm, if you think about it.

Plus, older .41 Magnum N-Frames, even if fired with nothing but full power loads, didn't have the reputation for coming loose that the early .44s did. The N-Frame was designed for .44 caliber, so with a .41 caliber you've got a lot of steel between the chambers.

[Confederate]

I used to think there wasn't much use for the .41. Anything it did the .44 mag would do better, plus it would shoot .44 spc. But then I read somewhere that the .41 S&Ws were a lot more robust in shooting full throttle loads than the .44 mags. Sounded reasonable to me.

For personal defense, I believe a warm .41 would be great for use in the house and outdoor full power loads could be used for hunting or camping. My preference would be for stainless steel and a tapered 6-inch barrel. A number of years ago, Smith made its 29 in a 6.5-inch barrel; however, after doing some customer preference tests, they found 6-inches was the hands down favorite. I'm inclined to agree.

[Pumpkinheaver]

While I don't have a smith .41 magnum I do have a couple of others. It is a great cartridge but as stated above if your gonna shoot very much you better have deep pockets or roll your own ammo.

[.41Dave]

The .41 Magnum is my favorite big bore caliber, as you might surmise from my username. The .41 mag is easier than .44 magnum on the shooter and the gun, has better sectional density and thus better penetration than the .44 mag, and I guarantee no critter can tell the difference between a .410 bullet and a .429 bullet when hit with 'em. Plus, the road less travelled has a strong appeal to me. I never liked to be one of the herd. And lastly, .41 mag shooters tend to be more intelligent, wittier, and better looking. Really! :D

657 3"
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid216/pebac5f127389456d843f6a20a79d9d98/ec8b7e0e.jpg

57 6" Nickel
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid205/pad02ce47e2582e8427ed7e9d2f2296d9/ef205fe6.jpg

657 4" Mountain Gun
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid157/p4b13469d50c83667bb30d7c096394672/f52a1c9d.jpg

Ruger Old Model Blackhawk .41 Magnum
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid195/pdcceae7147f8bcd4beb11dfb88efe5c7/f12c92b4.jpg

[Standing Wolf]

Thanks for those photographs. .41Dave!

[bulltaco]

Should I look for a 4" or 6" barrel for my first 41 Mag? Great pics by the way! I hope to see more. I do believe I'm coming down with "41 fever"!

[critter]

I just got an older M57 P&R for a 'steal' of a price from an estate sale. Mine has an 8" barrel. I'm just learning about the .41 but so far it is a keeper to say the least. It shoots like a laser with that long tube and is much easier on the shooter than the bigger cannons.

I'm just gonna have to take her deer hunting next fall. (Used my .44 mag this past year.)

[Steve C]

I have four .41's, 3 S&W's and 1 Ruger BH. Its pretty much a handloaders cartridge if you want to shoot it much. The good thing is that its about inpossible to find a load that doesn't shoot well, I haven't found one yet.

[.41Dave]

Should I look for a 4" or 6" barrel for my first 41 Mag?

It depends on what you want to use it for, but I'd say 6" is a good place to start.

[svtruth]

the .41 and .44? Actual bullet diameters are very close. I've never shot a .41.

[Majic]

While I'm a .41 fan (I have 10 of them) the first thing you need to consider is how much you plan to shoot and your budget. They are not cheap to feed and someplaces don't have a lot of ammo for one (depends on your locality). Reloading is the way to go with this cartridge. So while looking at the guns be sure to keep the ammo in mind. Many people have sold their .41s because of the expense to feed them on a regular basis.

[bigmike45]

bulltaco,
Either one will be sufficient. I have had several guns in the 41 magnum caliber and they have all served me well.


.41DAVE,

Those are some gorgeous 41's you have there. I personally have always wanted one of the model 57's, but was never able to find one. Your photography skills are top notch as well!!

I started my love of the 41 magnun back in the 80's when I bought this Ruger Redhawk, with a 7.5" barrel and integral scope rings for hunting whitetail here in Texas. It's an excellent caliber and gun for that purpose and I hunted open sights with it for many years. But then 20 years ago my wife and son's gave me a Leupold 2X EER Handgun Scope for it and I have reexperienced that love of handgun hunting...but out to 100 yards with the scope. Here is my deerslayer!!!
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/mike_seale/RugerRedhawk41mag7Small.jpg

I always wanted one of the 5.5 stainless versions of the same gun and looked for one for over 20 years....I was about to literally give up when I came across one about two years ago. I then saw that a guy over at the Ruger forum had shortened a 5.5" Redhawk, a 44mag down to a 4" barrel and I decided to do the same. I started looking for another 5.5" and found another 41 mag with a 5.5" barrel to be my project gun. So I cut & recrowned the barrel, dehorned the whole gun, especially that grab your thumb and tear it off hammer spur. I did a trigger job by simply polishing all trigger parts except the sear surfaces. I rounded the corners of the grip frame and workd the original grips to match. I took it to a machine shot to have a slot cut into the rib for the new front sight. I then drilled and tapped the rib and ins.talled the new Weignd combat front sight. I chamfered the front of the cylinder to match a single action cylinder and I then took a purple Scotch Brite pad and brush finished the whole gun. It turned out pretty good and shoots like a target grade gun. Here it is.
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/mike_seale/HPIM0734.jpg

bigmike45

[.41Dave]

bigmike45, that 4" Redhawk is beautiful! I want one I want one I want one!!!

svtruth, the difference between the .41 and .44 magnums really depends a lot on the perceptions of the shooter, particularly the recoil impulse. Some shooters think they feel about the same, while others find the .41 magnum less brutal. .44 mag has the edge in raw power, while the .41 has better penetration (due to higher sectional density) and seems to be more accurate. I get good accuracy from my .41 mags even using ammo of indifferent quality. Not something I've seen in the .44 mag. Given comparable loads, no creature shot with either will be able to tell a difference.

[JE223]

Stay tuned for a gelatin test of the .41Magnum early next week.

As I am borrowing the gun from someone else, I don't (right now) know what ammunition or model of gun will be used - but in any case, I should have room on the block for 5 rounds.

JE

[warriorsociologist]

I just sealed the deal on another .41....this time on an elusive 98% cond. 657 Classic Hunter II... Can't wait to work up some loads for it! :cool:

Now I "need" a 657 Mountain Gun and a AccuSport Bisley .41 BH.



.41Dave, that's a fine looking OM Blackhawk you have there!

[Leanwolf]

BullTaco, as stated above, it kinda depends on for what use you intend, as to barrel length.

If it's just for a "packin'"gun, or perhaps a self defense gun, then a 4" barrel is desirable. If you intend to hunt, in addition to the other uses, I'd advise a 6" barrel.

Reloading opens up a whole new, wonderful field for the .41 Magnum. Nevertheless, there is some very good factory ammo out there.

I have a S&W 57 6" nickel revolver (just like .41Dave's, and a Ruger Blackhawk 4 5/8 bbl., .41 Mag. Years ago, I had Deacon Deeson make a custom pair of grips for my Model 57 on Skeeter Skelton's Bear Hug style. Handles very, very nicely.

I also have a Marlin 1894S lever action in .41 Mag., and that combo is really nice out in the field. I've killed both deer and Black bear with the .41 Mag. (Plus coyotes and ground squirrels.)

.41Dave, those are some very nice pieces. I am at the moment, looking for a 57 .41 Mag Mountain Gun just like the one in your picture. (Wish me luck!)


L.W.

[Moondoggie]

My Mod 57, 8 & 3/8 bbl was my first NIB handgun bought in 1984.

I will never part with it.

I also enjoy the road less travelled like 41Dave.

I think I may have bought 1 box of factory ammo once upon a time, other than that I've always loaded my own.

It's a fabulous handgun. Incredibly accurate. Perfect trigger right out of the box. I used it to win a $100 bet. A guy was sure that I couldn't hit a paper plate with it at 100 yds. I didn't miss once. Believe it or not.

Now that I can get a CCW in Nebraska, I'm looking at one of the Taurus model 415's at my local friendly gun store.

[bulltaco]

Besides the MG logo on the barrel, what are the special features on a mountain gun compared to a regular 4' barreled S&W?

[drj3828]

I have two Rugers in 41 mag one is a plain Blackhawk with a 7 1/2" barrel and the othe is a Bisley Blackhawk. I have been shooting them since the mid 70's when I was a teenager. Always wanted a Magnum Research Desert Eagle chambered in 41 just could'nt afford one.
DRJ

[Onty]

“41 Magnum Opinions?

I would appreciate any insight that might be offered on the S & W Models 57 and 657. What about barrel length? Mountain Gun?”


Here is my 0.2 cents, if you want anything with shorter barrel, I would opt for other two calibres; for CCW as a personal protection in urban areas 38/357 in small or medium frame, for outdoor one of 45 LC revolvers. As for 41 Magnum I wouldn’t go less than 6” (I have 7.5” Bisley). The beauty of 41 Magnum round is that it could be hot loaded but would not beat you like 44 Magnum, is flat shooting, still powerful and ideal for a longer ranges. For that purpose, longer barrel has definite advantage. That is why knowledgeable silhouette shooters love that calibre, and that is the exact reason why Freedom Arms is making it on their large frame Model 83.

Note: if you didn’t shoot 41 before, make no mistake, recoil is still there, most of the shooters agree that, in average, it is about 75% of the recoil of 44 Magnum in the same revolver. The point is that that level of the recoil is still OK for almost all shooters, even during prolonged shooting, especially in revolvers like Ruger Bisley and Freedom Arms M83. A number of shooters found that fully loaded 44 Magnum is bit more that they want, and switched to 41. Some folks who were long time in firearms trading could confirm that they had seen a number 44 Magnum revolvers for sale, basically NIB with no more that box of ammo fired. I had purchased S&W 29-5 that looked as unfired; we could not see any typical brass markings on recoil shield or around firing pin hole. However, 41 Magnum second hand revolvers are different story; a good number of them are used but they are usually in excellent mechanical shape. They are built on the frames designed for 44 Magnum and folks who shoot them knew what they have and were taking care of their firearms.

Yes, 44 Magnum could be loaded down in order to reduce recoil, but in that case it’s loosing advantage on longer ranges.

[diesel_furry]

I just orderd a S&W Airlite 41 mag last week , i cant wait to pick it up and try it out

[jimbeam]

drj3828, I also had a Bisley 41 mag, and one of the first Desert Eagles in 41 in the country. The Bisley was great, my son has it, the DE had a lousy trigger, it went down the road. I picked up a 41 Taurus tracker yesterday, and am loading shells at this time. Nothing wrong with this caliber, especially if you handload. jim

[.41Dave]

Besides the MG logo on the barrel, what are the special features on a mountain gun compared to a regular 4' barreled S&W?

The primary differences in the Mountain Gun are a tapered barrel and a "black powder" bevel to the front of the cylinder that make the gun somewhat lighter and quicker handling than the standard 4" model.

[bulltaco]

Well it happened. I called around to all of the surrounding gun shops and Four Seasons in Goldsboro had a previously owned S&W 57 with a 4" barrel and a custom rosewood grips (looks like Hogue's). I drove down Highway 70E to the shop and checked it out. Hardly used, no box, bluing 99% in my estimate, and pinned and recessed. They wanted $539 + 7% sales tax. I bought it and am very pleased. I am going out back to shoot it and see how it does. You guys are right about ammo prices! I'll give an action report later!

[Ranger 40]

Back in the late 1970s the city of San Francisco sold off its SFPD 41 mags. These were 4" Mdl. 58 S&Ws. They were marked SFPD on the side plates. I have one that was tuned and targeted at 25 yds. These guns had the HB non-adj. sights. Once the barrel was turned and and sighted in it was good to go from there on. Any way its my choice of the .41 Mags. OBTW these were carried by motorcycle cops.:cool:

[bulltaco]

I love this revolver. I shot 20 rounds of Winchester 170 grn Silvertip Hollowpoints and 12 rounds of Speer 210 grn Gold Dot Hollowpoints. Recoil was robust but not bad at all. Speer 210 grns kicked harder but were more accurate or so it seemed. At more than a buck a shot I gotta start reloading. The cylinder is getting a drag-mark but I don't care. Now I need some pretty leather for my pretty revolver. New love is so sweet!

[Ala Dan]

First large caliber handgun that I ever owned~! And also, the very first
gun (4" S&W model 57) and caliber I ever handloaded for. I remember
to this day, starting out with virgin brass- one pound of W-W 630P
ball powder (now discontinued), Federal LP primers, and Sierra 170
grain JHC bullets for the S&W .41 magnum. Seems like I was loading
either 12.5 or 13.5 grains into these cases with those compotents,
and squeezing out 'bout 1100 fps(?) from the 4" barrel. It was a
stout load, with a bright muzzle flash and moderate recoil; but I
really enjoyed shooting that weapon. When loading, and obeying
all the safety cautions; I couldn't wait to get back out on the
range. Too bad, that weapon and cartridge didn't enjoy a much
longer life span. Now days, its virtually impossible to walk into
your favorite gun hole and pick up a box of factory ammunition.
I wished that I had NEVER gotten rid of that weapon, as it was
definitely a fine piece~! :( ;)

[Chindo18Z]

In factory SD ammo flavor, both the 4" M57 or M58 are well served by Winchester's 175gr Silvertip. True .41 diameter, 1250fps (607 ft/lbs energy), good penetration/expansion, and recoil is comparable to that of mild .357 or hot .38+p out of an L-frame. The round (which I believe is near identical to their 10mm Silvertip bullet) is controllable and accurate out of the either of the big N-frames. It's nice to be able to match POA/POI with the adjustable sights on the 57, but the M58 is plenty accurate at self-defense distances.

If Winchester, Speer, Remington, et. al. would make a 210gr, 1000fps, LSWC-HP .41 Special OR a 1000fps reliably expanding Gold Dot...I'd be in heaven.

I'm biased... .41 Magnum is my personal all-time favorite handgun caliber. And those two Smiths are my favorite toys.

[Confederate]

The .41 mag is easier than .44 magnum on the shooter and the gun, has better sectional density and thus better penetration than the .44 mag, and I guarantee no critter can tell the difference between a .410 bullet and a .429 bullet when hit with 'em.
The critter may not, but your wallet may! If you buy the gun and a few case loads of ammo, you should be all set. The truth is there's just not much difference between the two rounds in performance.

As for who's better looking, .44 mag owners or .44 mag owners, I'm not sure there's much of a difference there, either.

http://www.booktrail.com/Guns_General/ElmerKeith.jpg http://www.bodrods.com/images/Overly-Pierced.jpg

The .44 mag owners (left) tend to be older and wiser. The
.41 users (right) tend to be open to new ideas.

[.41Dave]

Too bad, that weapon and cartridge didn't enjoy a much longer life span.

Waddaya mean? It ain't died yet! Actually, there are a greater variety guns, factory loads and reloading components for the .41 Magnum available today than at any time since the cartridge's inception in 1964.

[22-rimfire]

Great choice. Enjoy it. I personally find that the factory 41 mag ammo is priced about the same as 44 mag ammo where I shop. Walmart doesn't sell it of course. My old favorite was the PMC 210 gr HP or SP loadings packed in 50 round boxes. Someone mentioned them earlier, but I have not seen any PMC ammunition since their US operation went belly up. Please tell me that they are back loading the 41 Mag!!!!

The Remington 50 round boxes are expensive. They have always been just about the most expensive. They are currently running around $50 a box. That is painful. But, I still buy them and fully expect ammunition prices to continue to climb.

Check out Georgia Arms 41 mag ammunition. You will be pleased. Miwall also loads 41 mag but it is hard to find them in stock. Save your brass as eventually you will reload or a friend will and you can provide the brass.

I saw a 4" blue Model 57 a couple of weeks ago (about 96%) for $400 at a show. Would have bought it, but I already have two 4" Model 57's.

I have a Bianchi leather belt holster (#5BHL) for my Mountain Gun that I do carry out in the woods from time to time. Nice holster. Check them out. They fit all the Smith N-frames.

[Rollis R. Karvellis]

41Dave your nickel mod 57 will go very nicely with my nickel mod. 29 please send it immediately.:D

[Bullet Bob]

The great 58, and some "mid-range" lead loads, the "police" load - my favorites.

http://fototime.com/B6AD5860D0A71BF/standard.jpg

[Confederate]

Unless you're getting a Mountain Gun, I reckon your best bet would be a .44 mag. Anything the .41 can do, the .44 mag can do. The only real advantage of the .41 is that it doesn't beat up Smith N-frames like full throttle .44 mags. If you buy a Redhawk, it will just end up being heavier and offering no real advantage.

[.41Dave]

41Dave your nickel mod 57 will go very nicely with my nickel mod. 29 please send it immediately.

You're right Rollis, but you got your directions mixed up. You are supposed to send your nickel 29 to me. ;)

[Colt46]

Not too interested in the 57, but a fixed sighted, large bore, N-frame just makes me drool.

[warriorsociologist]

I have a 57-2 (6" barrel) that went back in for warranty work (rifling) a little bit ago and when S&W didn't have any 6" barrels left to replace mine with....I had them put on a 4" Mountain Gun barrel instead.

Now, in a round about way, I have the gun I wanted in the first place - a "no lock", hammer-mounted FP, M-57 MG.

:)

[koja48]

I picked-up a 6" Model 57 & it is rapidly becoming my fav "> .40" big bore. For my purposes, 6" is about right, but if I ever encounter another with a longer tube I won't pass it up, within reason.

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/koja48/PythonandModel57.jpg

[SaxonPig]

One word sums up what's wrong with the 41 Magnum: ammo.

If you don't reload then factory ammo is very expensive, can be hard to find in out of the way places, and is limited in variety.

If you load your own then you eliminate 95% of the problem. The remaining 5% is that bullet selection is somewhat limited compared to the 44 caliber and really, there's nothing the 41 can do that the 44 doesn't do about 15% better. If limited to one, take the 44 and don't look back.

I, fortunately, am not limited and have both (two 41s and but one 44 now that I think about it).

I looked for about a year for a 4" nickel Model 57 and found this one on AuctionArms where i bought it for the starting bid of $325.


http://www.fototime.com/D6E4AB9C95E7766/standard.jpg

[koja48]

Good point but since reloading & shooting are part & parcel of my addiction, I mean habit, er HOBBY, ammo is not quite so much of a factor, in my case.

Very nice, Sax! I think you should downsize to 1 of each & I'd gladly give the one in the photo a home . . .

[Hawk]

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=58366&d=1179886764

I give Fuff 98% of the credit / blame for my discovery, late in life, of revolvers in general and 57s in particular.

The little guy is a -no dash- the one with the longer barrel is a -3.

I'm currently agonizing over how I want to reload for the thing. There's not much question about whether to reload given the ammo prices.

They're great fun. Pleasant to shoot. Bystanders seem to think they're 44s but they're actually quite pleasant - recoil relatively mild with factory loads and accurate to boot.

[OLD DOMENION]

"The .41 Remmington Magnum"
Notice how I address the .41 Magnum. I have had one almost from the day it came out. At the present time I have a 4 inch 657 and a 3 inch 657. They shoot extremely well.

What I would like to know is should I go with HP or factory "Old Police Loads" for CCW?

[22-rimfire]

If you check around, the self defense loads are in the 170-180 gr range. They are not loaded as hot as the normal 41 mag loads in 210 gr. They should suit your purpose well. They are still pretty potent.

I'm not aware of any major companies loading the "old police load". Please tell me where to find them if they still are loaded by Winchester, Federal, or Remington. I would love to have a couple of boxes just to shoot and see how they do. I'm not paying collector ammo prices for them though as they will just get shot. That box of shells above must be from the days of old. GA Arms and Miwall have loads that are similar in a lead wadcutter. The Miwall ammo is hard to find for me. I know of only one place that sells it.

I'd probably snatch up a Model 58 if I found one now for a fair price even though in the past I was more interested in guns with adjustable sights. Same goes for a 657 if I found one since I don't own one that is stainless. It is not a huge priority though as I have had many opportunities in the past. May have to just start looking at a factory new one as the 6.5" barrel length is a good length.

[BigG]

I had the Model 57 with 4" bbl. Ammo was high, even back in the 1980s. I sold it and stuck with the 44 Magnum. You're right, though, they are as nice as any of the big N frame Smiths: 357, 41, or 44 Magnums - all winners!

[41magsnub]

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid216/pebac5f127389456d843f6a20a79d9d98/ec8b7e0e.jpg"]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid216/pebac5f127389456d843f6a20a79d9d98/ec8b7e0e.jpg

It is this gun exactly circa about 1990. It is in perfect condition, stored for the last 15 years in a blue bag in a gun safe. It has had maybe 100 rounds through it.

The only wear is a slight scuff on the wood grip on one side that is basic wear and tear carrying it. When I was a kid back packing with my dad it used to ride in the outside pouch on my back pack so he could get to it quicker.

I fired it for the first time last week and frankly I am not man enough to shoot it. The first round was on target, the last 5 were roughly down range since I was flinching so bad. That sumbitch hurts!

I'm not planning to get rid of it, but of all the guns I have this is the one that might actually be worth something so I would like to know what I have since it appears to be somewhat uncommon in this short barrel length. Maybe I am looking wrong, but I could not find it in any of the gun books.

Thanks for any input.

Oh yeah.. turns out I have the original box, manuals, and etc. Found them in a basement. Does that affect the value at all?

[warriorsociologist]

My guess, is you could probably get $700 for it. A bidding war may get you a little more. Now, if you happen to live in WI, we should talk. :)

[Bob R]

I love the .41mag. In fact, I don't even own a .44mag. I figure anything I would ask of the 44, the 41 can do just fine.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Bob8251/100_0944.jpg

I just missed one wth the long barrel the other day. I guess I will have to keep looking.

bob

[billhilly66]

I'd sure like to find a 4" pinned and recessed.

[tkendrick]

Have owned a 6" Ruger BH since 1971. Far as I'm concerned (with possible exception of my 1911:rolleyes:) there's 41 mags.....then there's all the rest of that crap.:neener:

[DrLaw]

Not that I would not like a .41 Smith, but...

http://www.handloads.com/articles/default.asp?id=12

The Doc is out now. :cool:

(probably stirring up some trouble here)

[Bob R]

Doc, Doc, Doc.......


You have a very good point.

This is why I skipped over that "in between" caliber, the .44

With this a a bookend to the .41mags, what more does a person need?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/Bob8251/100_0476.jpg

S&W 25-5, worked over by one of the greats of old school gunsmithing, Austin Behlert.

I actually prefer this one to the 41mags, just don't tell anyone.

bob

[bulltaco]

I want to bag a deer with mine this coming hunting season and there is a possiblity of a hog hunt. I think it will be perfect for my hunting situation around the house between the hog farms and the sub-divisions!

[DrLaw]

As I recall, but I could be wrong, Dick Metcalf, the gun writer from the west central Illinois area, (and one-time PASA Park official) likes the .41 to hunt with. Might find him and ask him, if he is not already a member of this forum.

The Doc is out now. :cool:

[DrLaw]

Interesting look there to your .45 long barrel there, Bob R. I take it the frame was rounded off? What else was done to it (besides the hammer jeweling)

The Doc is out now. :cool:

[Rollis R. Karvellis]

Here is my 657

[warriorsociologist]

Here's a blurb I just posted to another thread (since I don't want to double post, here's a link): CLICK HERE (http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=3739000&postcount=42) :cool:

[Rexster]

San Antonio PD adopted the M58 about 1974, and sold them off as surplus in the 80's, and I bought one of those surplused sixguns about '84, and used it as my duty pistol through much of the rest of the 80's. In spite of weighing a bit less than a 4" M629, the .41 full magnum loads beat me up much less than any full magnum load from the 629. When I later owned a .44 Mountain Gun, I noticed that the M58 seemed to weigh less than it, too. I figure the M58 was a Mountain Gun before S&W made designated Mountain Guns, except that the M58 obtained the weight savings my eliminating the barrel rib and underlug instead of tapering the barrel. Mine is not for sale for any sane amount of money. After firing countless rounds, and being loose and a bit out of time, it is resting in the safe until I decide whether to just have it tightened and tuned, or go for a full restoration.

[Jimmy Newman]

I killed a deer last season with my 6" M57-1. I was shooting the Federal castcore loads, those being what was available locally in a hunting round (I have since started to reload, and have a box of 210gr Gold Dots to load for hunting). I had never shot a deer with a pistol, so I got very close to make sure I could get a good shot. I shot once, broadside, at about 25 yards, the deer jumped, ran about 10 yards, and stopped and looked confused so I shot again at about 35 yards. At this point she ran off into the trees. I got down a few minutes later and found her about another 30 yards into the trees.

The shots were about 2" apart, both were clean through, and one of them went right through the heart. There was vastly less damage to the meat than with a rifle - I could sort of just cut out the .41" hole and have only good meat left, as opposed to the bruising and clot that I always end up with when I use a rifle.

I plan to mostly hunt with the revolver from now on, I think. I plan to use the gold dots for deer hunting, but I think if I were after big pigs I'd still use the Federal castcore (hard cast) or similar handload.

On a side note, the revolver is presently at Briley having some work done, mainly just a bit of a trigger smoothing and action cleanup and a polish and reblue (bought it used, and the finish was a bit spotty). Here it is in its pre-prettied up state:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/jnewman606/Pistols/SW/left.jpg

[warriorsociologist]

Hey Jimmy,
You may want to check out Hornady XTPs as well. They are probably my favorite 200-210gr. jacket bullet for whitetail-sized game. YMMV.

[Jimmy Newman]

I'll check them out - I have shot exclusively Hornady cartridges through deer rifles for years, but don't have any real experience with their handgun bullets/cartridges.

[warriorsociologist]

RE: XTPs

I "got into them" after seeing how well they did on deer for me in my 10mm (200gr.) and in .357 (the 180gr, not the 158gr.). The other jacketed .357 bullet I like is Nosler's 180gr. Partitian...but they are expensive.

[warriorsociologist]

FWIW, here's my Deer-getter

6" S&W 657-0 w/ Tung oil finished Morando grips.

:cool:

[earplug]

I think the 41 is A dead end. Bill Jordan had A bad Idea. He should have worked on the 44 spl or the moon clip 45 ACP. The Big N frame S&W is A fine frame for big bore.
The new reissue of the S&W 610 is A great game gun for IDPA. Its the same story with shooting steel targets. The 41 was A game gun.
The 41 was made to be A ideal service revolver round. It was factory loaded to two differant power levels for hunting or shooting people. There were better guns that did the same thing better.
A cut down 4 inch M-25 with full moons would have been better then the
Police model 58 that was offered to law enforcement. Or can we say Model 1917.

[warriorsociologist]

Personally (IMHO) it's a better match for the N-frame than the 10mm.
I do however agree with several of the positive attributes you point out with regard to the others. To each his own, I guess.

FWIW, in case it matters to you, I became a .41 user after moving back and forth between .357/10mm/.44/.45LC over the last 18-20 years for hunting. After careful consideration of MY needs and what it the .41 had to offer, I chose to consolidate my calibers to .41 mag and .38 spec/.357 mag. in wheelguns. Again, for me, I especially like the .41 in N-frame platforms.

Now, truth be told, I’m not a formal gamer anymore (where the 625 does shine…and the 610 isn’t a slouch) and now shoot mostly to hunt and informal (but frequent) target practice. I have owned 3 different 610s (two 6.5” and one 4”) as well as several other 10mms (1006, 1066, 1086, G-20, G29) and still own & shoot several of these (but I have sold off my 610’s in favor of keeping & shooting .41 Mags in the “.40 cal range”). I do still like my remaining 10mm’s a great deal, but mostly have returned to revolvers and like the .41 better than the 10mm in them. Now, besides .41 and 10mm, I shoot mostly .38/357…but the .41 is my go-to gun for handgun hunting. I guess FOR ME, the move “up” from a K/L frame to an N-frame made me want more than “just” a 10mm round exiting the bore – and the .41 was, for me, the natural choice.

[22-rimfire]

The 41 was made to be A ideal service revolver round. It was factory loaded to two differant power levels for hunting or shooting people. There were better guns that did the same thing better.

Earplug, which caliber did it better than the 41 magnum with factory loads when it was introduced in 1964?

Frankly, I disagree with you almost competely. The 41 magnum far surpasses the 45ACP in power. It is probably more popular today than it has ever been.

I think this is one of those situations where I just choose to disagree and for you, to each his own.

[Walkalong]

657 3"
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=66640&d=1194120981

[Iggy]

I spent an afternoon shooting and visiting with Bill Jordan. He was pleased to see that I was shooting a S&W model 58.

I had to fire that gun four times in "serious social engagements" during 13 years as an LE.

The gun and cartridge did what it was designed to do.

I have a lot of guns, but that old .41 magnum will never leave my possession as long as I am alive.

[Magnum.35744]

Nice pictures everyone:D!!! Thanks for sharing:cool:!

-Tre

[jimmyraythomason]

I bought one from Wal-Mart in early '80s. It was a 4" barrel,beautifully blued with wood grips. Price was $260 so I bought it. It was VERY accurate with 210gr semi-wadcutters until the barrel lead fouled after about 10 rounds. Jacketed ammo cured the problem(after cleaning). Loved the gun,warmed to the caliber,traded it anyway!:(

[Majic]

The 41 was made to be A ideal service revolver round. It was factory loaded to two differant power levels for hunting or shooting people.
You must remember the rural and open highway LEOs of that day had more concerns. Shooting people wasn't a problem but stopping vehicles were. Times were different back then. A powerful handgun was needed and the .45acp just wasn't up to the task. The cartridge wasn't designed with the city LEO in mind, but for the officers who patroled the open and back roads.

[Iggy]

Exactly right. I was a HP nearly 40 years ago. That's back when cars were made of metal.The .41 magnum would easily penetrate the body of vehicles and such in rural applications.

I used it to keep a guy busy in a barn about a 100 yds away, until I could get off the bullseye.
Another knocked me down on a traffic stop with a Ford Bronco. I put a round through the tailgate of the vehicle as it fled, and knocked out the radio in the dash.

That got the driver's attention.:uhoh:

[MCgunner]

From that link posted back last summer sometime.....


We get several calls and letters here weekly asking for information and load data for the various .45s on the market.

The toughest and best built by far are the Ruger Blackhawks and Bisleys. These are fine hunting and utility guns and in 4-3/4" barrel length make what could be considered by many the ultimate packing gun.

Now, there's a man after my heart! :D When you got a .45 Colt Blackhawk, you don't need no stinkin' .44 mag, let alone a .41. :D

I've always liked the .41, though, because it can approach the .44 mag with good handloads and in a lighter standard Blackhawk rather than a superblackhawk. However, I've got a .45 Colt, another caliber I like better than the .44 mag, and really, that's all I need. But, one day I just might get a .41. It's a cool caliber for handloading. .44 is the choice, I guess, if you're too lazy to take up handloading.:neener:

[warriorsociologist]

In general I agree with all of that.

I think a .41, .44, or .45 Colt will all perform pretty much the same on all the animals anyone would likely plan to take with any of them. Most of the "mine's better than yours" arguments between champions of these three often seem more about the poster's ego and emotional attachment to his pet chambering than anything else. I happen to prefer the .41 since I think it leaves more "meat" in all critical areas in the N-frame platform...but I'd feel perfectly happy hunting with the others. I guess since I already HAVE a .41 mag though, I see no "need" IMHO, to get any of the others - unless I just want to have another toy to feed & load for...

[Walkalong]

When you got a .45 Colt Blackhawk, you don't need no stinkin' .44 mag, let alone a .41. :D
Hard to argue that one, but I still like my .41's. :D

[22-rimfire]

I won't argue with that logic. I like 41mags, but when I want something more powerful, the 480 Ruger comes out to play. Wish Ruger offered it in a Black Hawk.

[Jakkar]

I have just managed to put 50 rounds through my new to be 80's era Blackhawk since I picked it up but I am sold on the 41 Magnum. I have gathered all of the reloading supplies I need with the exception of the dies which hopefully will be here early next week.

http://myweb.cebridge.net/elearn/blackhawkred.jpg

[Brian Williams]

Quote:
When you got a .45 Colt Blackhawk, you don't need no stinkin' .44 mag, let alone a .41.
Hard to argue that one, but I still like my .41's.

But when you have a 41 you don't need no steeenkin' 43s or 45s

[warriorsociologist]

^ LOL...


Nice grips on that BH!

[First Shirt]

I bought my first .41 Mag, an OM Blackhawk in 1970, along with a Lyman bullet mold, bullet sizing die, reloading dies and a small cast-iron pot and ladle for casting bullets, all for the princely sum of $85 dollars. And I've had at least one .41 Mag ever since. I've taken deer, wild hogs and coyotes with the round, and used my first one to earn enough money to buy my first rifle, by betting that I could hit a one-quart oil can three times out of five from 100 yards away. If a .41 won't do it, a .44 probably won't either.

And if you reload, a .41 is a better buy, simply because it's not as popular, and they usually sell for less than a similar model in .44

JWB

[stevereno1]

a .41 mag was invented for deer hunting. go bag a buck with your .41 it's the law!

[MCgunner]

I've not taken a deer with my .45, yet. I've taken two with a .357 Blackhawk. I need to remedy that situation. I'm sorta wondering if I get a .41 Blackhawk, if I should get the 6 1/2" barrel for hunting or the 4 5/8" gun for packin'. I haven't hunted with the 4 5/8" .45 I have, but to tell ya the truth, I can shoot it pretty danged well at 50 yards and think it'd be a good hunting gun despite the short barrel. The 4 5/8" gun totes better and, as you can tell from the above picture, just looks SO good! :D The .357 NEEDs the extra barrel length for performance, but the .41, as with the .45, has enough umph out of the shorter tube to get the job done. A blue one weighs a little less than my stainless .45, too, which would help as far as the packin' goes.

[22-rimfire]

MC, I need to just get more deer. :) I have only shot one with my 480 SRH. Prior to reading and participating on the gun forums, I never knew how popular handgun hunting is. I have a 6.5" 41 mag Blackhawk too that I have yet to shoot much. I'm used to lugging a pretty substantial handgun around for hunting and the 6.5" Blackhawk would feel light to me.

[MCgunner]

Well, my primary hunting handgun is pretty hefty, carry in a UM's shoulder holster. It's a 12" scoped .30-30 caliber TC Contender cheater gun. :D I've shot 5 with it so far. But, I get the urge to use irons and a revolver once in a while. Cost me a hog last year when I shot too high. :banghead: But, hey, that's what handgun hunting is about, the challenge. :D

[Ratshooter]

I have a 57 no dash with a 6" barrel. Have the dies, brass and loose bullets. Haven't shot much and not in a long time. I have been kicking around the idea of selling it but after reading all the post i may need to shoot it sometime instead.

It has an s2479xx s.n. Anyone have any idea when it was made?

[Ratshooter]

I've had two Ruder Blackhawks in .41 mag and both shot very well. I carried one for awhile trying to kill a deer. No luck. They were alittle more pleasant to shoot than the 44 Blackhawks.

[22-rimfire]

Ratshooter, you do know when you touch off a 41 mag. The recoil is no 22 or 357. Break out that Model 57 or.... hmm, Christmas is coming up... I know a good home!

[M-58]

Congrats on your new m-57. I rescued a 4" nickle model 57 from a pawn shop about 8 years ago. There is just something about that big bore S&W revolver that just does it for me, looks right, handles right and shoots damn fine. 41 mag will handle everything that a 44 mag will without beating you to death as well. My 57 is a no dash p&r'ed about 98% in condition. Yes, it costs more to keep it fed, but that's what reloading is for. Enjoy your 57, but keep your eye peeled for a model 58, they are the cat's meow! I purchased one about a month ago. Its a 85% shooter grade and my 1st fixed sighted revolver to boot. Every time I handle it I keep thinking , man -o-man..what was I missing all this time! As you can see from all of these responses..the 41 mag and S&W revolvers haven't faded into the sunset yet and probably will not for a very long time to come.

[Majic]

Ratshooter your M57 was made in 1964-65. If you decide to part with it I know a good home for it. :D

[Ratshooter]

Thanks for the info, I'll think about it.

[bulltaco]

I am taking the S&W Model 57 deer hunting tomorrow. I saw a buck and doe in the field right next to my house yesterday morning. The rut is starting to peak here in NC and I have my corn pile the deer are feeding on. I also have my deer calls, a buck grunt tube and a little breeding doe bleater that really works. The weather is cool and breezy. I am shooting the PMC 210 grn hollow points I have been practicing with and I will carry it in a belt and holster I had made for the pistol by the Chief at Little Feather Leather! I'll check in on how I do!

[22-rimfire]

Bulltaco: Good luck whitetail hunting. I hope you have the opportunity to use your new 4" M57. I am hoping to do the same on Saturday. I still shoot those PMC loads too! Bought 5 boxes or so earlier this year.

[bulltaco]

I bought 6 boxes for a deal from SG. Good hunting Rimfire!

[Joe Gunns]

FWIW I was reading the late lamented Skeeter Skelton's book GOOD FRIENDS, GOOD WHISKY, GOOD GUNS, which is a collection of some of his various SHOOTING TIMES columns. He wrote one in '70 or so on the 41 mag in which he says the he hopped on Bill Jordan's bandwagon and talked up the concept to S&W and others and was one of those consulted by them for ideas about the loads. He says that many cops, not being gun enthusiasts, where not able to shoot as accurately with the 357 mag load as with the 38 special. Therefore idea was for the 41 to have two standard loadings. One a law enforcement load at around 950 fps or so and the other a hot load for hunting and shooting through things. He and Bill believed that the milder loading would give recoil about equal to the 38 special with energy closer to the .357 and thus give the average cop more power in a managable package. Hence all the initial talk of the 41 as the ideal cop gun. He said that when the gun was actually introduced no commerical loads were available so a lot of folks ordered dies, which were available, and rolled their own on the hot side. Then when Remington (IFIRC) came out with commercial rounds 5 or so months later, they were all the hot loads. The intended "law enforcement" loadings didn't begin to appear until a long enough time had gone by that the gun scribes, and the law enforement agencies had by and large made their judgements. Those agencies that had adopted them had stocked up on the hot ammo. So as a result of the poor coordination of the product releases the gun never caught on.

In my youth, being a Skeeter fan, I lusted after a .41 but didn't have the funds to get one. The urge has ebbed and I am a contented .45 LC/ACP fan.

[bulltaco]

They came by me about thirty yards at twilight. I stood still and they went out into the field next to the woods. I drew a bead on the largest doe but the road was behind her, it was a poor shot at best, and I did not feel like dressing a doe tonight! I was hoping a buck might follow them but alas no. Good karma though! I will be in the woods before sunrise and who knows, maybe a buck will be around. I want to score with the Model 57!

[Jakkar]

With all the .41 Magnum love in this thread I couldn't pass up this Mod-57 Mountain gun at the show today. Now I have two .41 Magnums to load for this weekend :evil:

http://myweb.cebridge.net/elearn/S&W57.jpg

[warriorsociologist]

Hi Gents.

FYI: If anyone here is a cast boolet shooter ....and wants a new mould for their .41 mag, you should check out this ongoing group buy on a custom Lee 6-cavity .413-265gr. Keith-style plain base boolet. :)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=21912

[munk]

The problem with the 45 Colt, and I love the round almost as much as the .41, is that SAAMI will never re-write the cartridge specs for it, and chambers are going to be loose, even in a nicely made N frame Smith. This means cases stretch and wear a little faster, and you lose some velocity. I can live with this. But it is worth mentioning. Yes, the 45 Colt can outperform the 44 mag with less pressure as well, a very good thing. For a number of years I skipped the 44 altogether.

But the 41 is a more efficient cartridge than either the 45 Colt or 44 mag. Metcalf used to chrony velocities out of various factory goods and the 41 lost less fps in a short tube than the 44. I don't see why a warm 45 Colt also wouldn't lose more in the same length tube than a 41.

There is something the larger rounds can do the .41 can't, and that's usefully propel a 300 gr bullet. There is a place in this world for 300 gr bullets. I was almost ready to give up on the .429 as a cartridge that made much sense until I tried 300 gr bullets with handloads. This was before the load became semi pop. The heavier weight settled the 44 mag right down.

There is a feel to a good cartridge, a well designed cartridge, not unlike the feel you get hitting a baseball with the sweet part of the bat, and with a bat that fits you. Both the 41 and 45 Colt have this intangible feel. The 44 mag with 240 gr bullets in my opinion snorts and blows and jabs far too much. It settles right down with the heavier bullets and joins the other two cartridges.

I've never had any problem loading the .41 for accuracy, and it may eclipse the other two. At full power loads you can still get the second shot out faster with accuracy than with a 44 mag. The all important follow up shot.

In truth if a Grizzly was atop me any of our large bore handgun cartridges would seem to me to be underpowered and insufficient. For all the reasonable jobs a hunting revolver might do, the 41 will do them as well or better than the 44, until it comes to large game like Elk, where the 44 has the 300 grain bullet. I'm not sure the 41's 250 to 265 gr bullet is not as good or better, but there is very little data out on that while the woods are full of happy 44 shooters with their 300 grain bullets.

There isnt' a better deer cartridge made in a revolver than the .41, at least Metcalf thought so. And attempts to find a perfect man stopping round seem to keep gravitating back to near 40 cal, where the 41 had been living for at least 20 years prior to our Age's 10mm and then 40 SW.

I like the Ruger 480 very much also, and one day will own one of those. Then I can ask the 44 what purpose it serves?


But we like them all. They're all good, and it's best to have choice.

munk

[.41Dave]

For all the reasonable jobs a hunting revolver might do, the 41 will do them as well or better than the 44, until it comes to large game like Elk, where the 44 has the 300 grain bullet.

Ok, so the .41 doesn't have a 300 grain bullet, but it DOES have a 295 grain bullet! I suspect a 295 grain .410 bullet zipping along at 1300 fps is just as good for elk as a 300 grain .429 bullet.

http://www.pennbullets.com/41/41295ssk.html

[munk]

is there a 295 gr 41 cal bullet zipping along at 1300 fps?

Sounds great to me.

No, a game animal will not know the difference between that and a .429 300 gr at 1290 fps.

The 41 penetrates better, many say it shoots a little flatter with better BC, and it handles much better than the 44.

I own four of them.
I'm not lukewarm on this cartridge. It is one happy design. It makes sense. It comes darn close to being a perfect round.
The biggest resistance to its existence comes from withint the gun community, the 44 mag owners who question the reason for the existence of the 41.




munk