MagSafe Opinion


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arizona
March 1, 2007, 06:53 PM
For those for you that have used or are using MagSafe in your autos, what is your opinion of the round?

If the advertising is true, I would think the MagSafe would be excellent in hotels, condos, apartments, businesses, etc.

Anyone know if this is what the Sky Marshals are using?

What are the pros and cons?

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StrikeEagle
March 1, 2007, 07:04 PM
Well... I used to use Glasers in my pocket .38's. I'd go first two rounds Glasers and the rest 158 LHP. I was very young when I started doing that and somehow it all made sense to me. :)

But about 5 or 10 years ago I started reading reports and found that this trick round just doesn't penetrate. So I load all five LHP rounds now.

I don't think MagSafe is a lot better than Glasers... I just don't think those quirky rounds actually work when you need them.

PedalBiker
March 1, 2007, 07:13 PM
I don't know what Sky Marshals are using, but any decent lightweight HP would be fine. A small hole in an airplane is of little consequence and a flight attendent could plug it after things settle down.

Sorry, I'm not familiar with MagSafe.

TBeck
March 1, 2007, 07:38 PM
Magsafes have their place. But if you choose to carry them, especially in a semiauto, you need to verify their reliability in your particular gun. I consider 200 rounds a minimum on function testing a semiauto. Are you willing to spend $1,200 to test it out?

Also, the trajectory for Magsafes is VERY different from standard ammunition. Yet another reason to shoot a bunch and see where the shots print at different ranges. You will likely find that they shoot very low to what you are used to.

When I was living in an apartment I loaded a .38 revolver with Magsafes, but I don't consider them an all-purpose carry round due to their range and penetration limitations. I doubt the Sky Marshals use frangibles either for the same reasons. Penetration of an airplane fuselage at 30K feet is no big deal, especially when you consider that the plane will be landing immediately if shots are fired.

Go with a tested, well-proven hollowpoint that you can afford to practice with regularly.

kokapelli
March 2, 2007, 09:48 AM
I doubt the Sky Marshals use frangibles either for the same reasons.

I remember reading that the Sky Marshals were indeed carrying frangible rounds (not magsafe or glasser), but have since changed to JHP, because the frangible round was not good stopper.

Tezcatlipoca
March 2, 2007, 02:49 PM
Sky marshalls = Gold Dot Hollowpoints in 357SIG.

Yummmmmyyyyy

Mike Harbour
March 2, 2007, 05:09 PM
...the LEOs everyone is calling sky marshalls are actually known as air marshals or FAMS, as they're part of TSA's Federal Air Marshal Service. OK, back on topic!

A recent gun rag from Harris Publications recently had a .38 Special ammo test that included MagSafes. I think the crux of the piece was that particular brand did indeed, as stated here, have it's place. The writer noted, IIRC, penetration through surfaces other than FBI denim would be minimal at best.

When I find the gun rag in question, I'll post the issue info if you'd like to look it up yourself.

Mike Harbour
Texan by birth, Montanan by choice

230HB
March 2, 2007, 05:14 PM
I`ve heard varying reports on the MagAfe & Glaser rounds, enough for me to just load with hp`s that I can afford to run through for reliable function and use for defense.

kokapelli
March 2, 2007, 06:38 PM
.
Magsafes have their place.
Just curious, but what would that place be?

TBeck
March 2, 2007, 08:41 PM
Just curious, but what would that place be?

Anyplace where excessive penetration can be a major liability. Such as? Apartments. A couple layers of gypsum board aren't going to slow a 9mm hollowpoint down much at all. In fact, the material may plug the cavity and increase penetration. Several years ago I read an article testing the penetration of standard police calibers through common building materials. Oddly enough, a 5.56mm 55-grain bullet had less penetration than a 9mm 147-grain bullet. The 9mm zipped right through the equivalent of several rooms worth of interior wall partitions. When I had my kids sleeping on the other side of the bedroom wall, you bet I was concerned.

A Magsafe is much less likely to make it through with much energy left. These things aren't "magic bullets" by any stretch of the imagination and I'd like to see tests done against several layers of heavy clothing instead of just a T-shirt and a layer of denim. But they were engineered for a specific niche and are pretty effective at filling that niche.

s&w 24
March 3, 2007, 04:43 AM
trajectory diff is minimal at 10 yds and under,count on shallow wounds as well. SWAT loads will break up on heavy clothing, and max loads will make instant hamburger out of limbs and a softball portion of chest cavity.

Used to pack magsafes in my 10mm. put 15 rnds down range of magsafe every 60 days, no ftf or fte.

kokapelli
March 3, 2007, 09:34 AM
Is there any law enforcement agency that uses PFB rounds? If not, why not?

I know that even the very PC NYC police do not use PFB ammo.

From "firearmstactical.com":
The most important quality is penetration because a handgun bullet cannot damage what it does not touch. If the bullet you shoot into an attacker’s body doesn’t pass through a major blood bearing organ, there’s no reason why your bullet should suddenly compel him to stop whatever he’s doing that’s endangering your life or the life of a loved one.

Despite the marketing claims of the companies who manufacture these bullets and the assertions of gunwriters who are preoccupied with velocity and energy transfer, PFBs do not reliably penetrate deeply enough nor produce the kind of wound trauma that is needed to quickly and reliably stop a determined attacker, and this is why we feel they’re dangerously inadequate for personal defense.

Plink
March 3, 2007, 09:57 AM
I wouldn't want to trust any prefragmented round for self defense. They don't reliably penetrate deep enough. Back in the 90's I did a lot of ammo testing. As part of that testing, I shot wild hogs (something East Texas is over ran with and needs removed anyway) with a number of different rounds. Glaser Silver from a .44 magnum wouldn't effectively put down a 150 lb hog at close range with multiple shots. That was not inspiring and a test I won't ever repeat.

Energy isn't what stops perps. Damage to tissues and organs is. All the fancy paper numbers in the world means nothing if there isn't enough damage to shut off the machinery. That means getting bullets deep enough into the engine room.

Odd Job
March 3, 2007, 10:04 AM
What Plink said.

opd743
March 3, 2007, 02:09 PM
We were just shown a video at the department a few weeks ago of .45 cal Magsafe ammo going through a level IIA vest from about 10 ft. They then shot the same vest with Hydrashocks to prove it was a real vest. I think the .45 shoots a 95gr bullet but I'm not sure. The people that showed the video said the velocity was getting close to rifle speed and thats why the vest failed to stop it.

Plink
March 3, 2007, 10:57 PM
Velocity is what overcomes vests, and in many cases, hard obstables also. Momentum is what penetrates tissue though, and that requires a bullet that holds together and has enough weight to keep penetrating.

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