University kid wants gun free school


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PILMAN
March 5, 2007, 11:33 AM
http://media.www.wkuherald.com/media/storage/paper603/news/2007/03/01/Opinion/Commentary.Guns.Have.No.Place.In.Classrooms-2750475.shtml

Originally Posted by Article
There are some things we as students never expect to see in a classroom. Things that are not a natural fit in that environment. I thought one of those things was a firearm of any kind. But, apparently I was wrong.

I was in a sociology class not long ago and noticed that an off-duty Bowling Green police officer was in the room. He was in his full uniform, including his utility belt, gun in holster.

Just thinking about it now, I am still in shock. A gun in a classroom! This is by far the dumbest thing I have seen as a Western student. There is no excuse for this. I do not care that he is an officer.

I was discussing this with some of my classmates and I am convinced that there is no logical reasoning for this officer to have his gun.

First of all, lets say he doesn't get out of class until 30 minutes before he is supposed to be at work. I don't care. If he can't find a place to lock his gun up until he is on duty, then he should reschedule his classes so that he gives himself more time.

Someone even argued that if something happened he could provide protection. Well, what if it happened to him? Now there is a gun in the room and anyone has access to it. If it were someone with a knife, then now the situation has become much more dangerous. God forbid it was a person with another gun, because now that person has more ammo.

This is a school. Have we all forgotten about what happens with guns in classrooms? I cannot think of one good thing that has happened with a gun in that environment, but a number of tragedies do come to mind.

The least of my concerns about this is that a gun in a classroom does not create the type of relaxed atmosphere that students desire in the classroom. There is no way that a gun will ever comfort me while I am trying to learn about Karl Marx's views on society.

And I am not even opposed to people owning guns. For all I care, an individual could own a fully automatic assault rifle and be using it for spotlighting herds of deer. As long as you keep it away from me in public settings, then fine.

This officer was obviously off duty at the time and did not have to be fully equipped. If he cannot arrange his work and school schedules in a more conducive way, then he should drop a class.

From what I understand, it's the law, not Western's policy, that says it's OK for an off-duty officer to carry his weapon if he chooses to do so. I understand the law, and I still disagree.

Our university buildings are supposed to be firearm-free. That rule should not change just because a person has a badge on their chest, unless they are there on official police business.

This was an idiotic sight to behold, and I never thought this was something I would ever have to write about. There was no excuse for this individual to be in possession of that firearm at that time. I do not care about any issues in this individual's personal life that might have made it a hindrance for him to have not brought his gun. Billy club, fine; pepper spray, fine; handcuffs, fine; but a firearm, no.

If I see this again I will have to address it with the department head. I pay my tuition to come to school here, and at the very least I should have the guarantee of a safe and relaxed study environment.

Simply put, under no circumstances should I ever see a gun in a classroom. Leave it behind. I do not care what you do with it, but do not bring it into a room full of people who are concentrated on achieving higher learning.

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waynedm
March 5, 2007, 11:38 AM
:cuss: :banghead:

kevin davis
March 5, 2007, 11:44 AM
This kid is phobic and exgtremely narcissistic! What would he do if he saw one of my knives I routinely carry? It seems as if everything around him should be there for his comfort only. Does no one else matter?:what: I think he should go get a private tutor so he never has to leave his home again and feel uncomfortable.:barf:

K3
March 5, 2007, 11:46 AM
:D

My favorite part was the bit about Karl Marx's views on society.

DontBurnMyFlag
March 5, 2007, 11:48 AM
This is a college educated student!? :scrutiny:

This is the exact reason why I hate college kids. Every day I deal with these idjits in my classes and it is mind-numbing to witness.

The man presented no logical arguments, just a fear of guns. :cuss:

I do like how he "allowed" me to own fully automatic assault weapons or what have you.

So all I got from this article was that this was a scared, sheltered kid who cannot form proper sentences and articulate his feelings intelligently in writing.

Its a cops gun too! So now whereever this kid sees a cop, he wants them disarmed? What if hes in a restaurant or a bar or a library or a internet gaming lounge haha?

This kid has a lot of growing up to do.

I am also surprised at how one little article has gotten me so riled up on my day off. :D

Duncan223
March 5, 2007, 11:50 AM
I don't know what more can be added. This student is a complete moron. Not a partial moron - a full, complete, and total moron.

Sistema1927
March 5, 2007, 11:51 AM
"Brains full of mush".

What would he think if some deranged whacko started shooting up his campus? He might just be glad that the uniformed armed officer (or a CCW holder) was there to stop him.

waynedm
March 5, 2007, 11:56 AM
Damn hippies. :cuss: :banghead:

K3
March 5, 2007, 11:57 AM
Y'all should read the responses to his editorial on the provided link. Hope is not lost. :)

modifiedbrowning
March 5, 2007, 12:03 PM
There is no way that a gun will ever comfort me while I am trying to learn about Karl Marx's views on society.

Oh, the irony. Marx's views on society are exactly why a gun in the classroom should comfort him.

TexasRifleman
March 5, 2007, 12:04 PM
I do not care what you do with it, but do not bring it into a room full of people who are concentrated on achieving higher learning.

A baseless fear of inanimate objects sounds like a bigger impediment to learning I'd say, but that's just me.

RNB65
March 5, 2007, 12:06 PM
One of the toughest lessons to learn in life is that you can't always get what you want. This kid just needs a little edumacatin'.

hagar
March 5, 2007, 12:06 PM
Hopefully the next gun in school he sees, will not be some Arab Muslim carrying an AK47 over the dead body of an unarmed security guard.

frostbiker
March 5, 2007, 12:09 PM
MONEY QUOTE #1: If it were someone with a knife, then now the situation has become much more dangerous. God forbid it was a person with another gun, because now that person has more ammo.

MONEY QUOTE #2: And I am not even opposed to people owning guns. For all I care, an individual could own a fully automatic assault rifle and be using it for spotlighting herds of deer. As long as you keep it away from me in public settings, then fine.

GRAND PRIZE MONEY QUOTE: There is no way that a gun will ever comfort me while I am trying to learn about Karl Marx's views on society.

What a maroon! Thanks for posting that. I had to wipe the coffee from my monitor this morning.

wagoneer1019
March 5, 2007, 12:16 PM
the safest place for that gun to be is in the officer's dudy belt

Robert Hairless
March 5, 2007, 12:24 PM
From ParentReport.com: (http://www.theparentreport.com/resources/ages/toddler/behavior/112.html)

Terrible or terrific. However you look at it, one thing is certain and that is two year olds are a challenge. It's an extraordinary time in a child's life, and in a parent's. Suddenly it seems your baby has grown up with a mind of his own and a will that is increasingly determined. For the toddler, this can be an overwhelming period in life says child psychotherapist, Rosalind Kindler. "Two year olds must accomplish many things such as speech, nursery school and even becoming an older sibling," explains Kindler. "A two year old takes in more and learn more things than at any other period in his life."

With all of the feats that two year olds need to accomplish, it's no wonder that they sometimes lose control and have a temper tantrum. But sometimes parents can help toddlers avoid having a tantrum in the first place by figuring out just what is upsetting them and then helping them cope. Infant psychiatrist Dr. Peter Sutton elaborates. "They become aware that other people, bigger people can do things that they themselves cannot do. These things may be very difficult for them to do, none the less they try to do them and become angry when they can't accomplish these tasks," explains Sutton who adds, "if a parent tries to help them they'll get angry because then they are being shown that they can't do something themselves."

Kindler says "having a temper tantrum is a very unhappy thing to a two year old. When they get to that point of losing it, it's really a way of them saying "please hold me together." The best thing for poor distraught parents to do is to stay calm and let the child know they're there. Parents may feel better knowing that the child isn't doing anything to them, rather he is struggling with inner turmoil that he just doesn't know what to do with. It ends up in a tantrum."

It's important for adults to remember that the two-year-old's world centers around himself. He makes the rules.

In this situation our toddler doesn't understand that the police officer has rights too. The two-year-old wouldn't care if he did understand. What he wants is for the school and the officer to follow his rules.

There is a potentially serious problem. People who remain emotional and psychological two-year-olds as they enter adulthood can be dangerous to themselves and other people. Their behavior becomes increasingly anti-social because they demand that the world conform to their rules and attempt to punish anyone who does not. If they fear cigarette smoke, they insist upon banning cigarettes. If it's firearms they fear, they insist upon banning them.

As the retarded behavior is allowed to continue, an adult two-year-old might accumulate sufficient power from other anti-social people and murder whoever they hate or fear, collectively and individually. In that light, Adolf Hitler exhibited a most dangerous form of two-year-old behavior. So, of course, do other kinds of racial and religious bigots.

Even a moderately well-adjusted adult recognizes that the world does not center on him. An adult who found himself distracted by the presence of an armed police officer as another student in his classroom would try for better mental health. Should he be unable or unwilling to do so, he would simply transfer to another class instead of demanding that the university conform to his wishes. He would recognize, immediately and without being told, that an unarmed policeman in uniform presents himself as a target for other deranged people.

This adult infant attacks the policeman verbally. Others with similar or worse pyschological disorders might choose more fatal weapons for their attacks. None of them care about the policeman--or about anyone else--in their distorted world they are the only people who matter.

This two-year-old demonstrates the complete and utter failure of his parents' child rearing skills. They produced this monster. Unfortunately they are not alone in encouraging their children to become monsters and anti-social deviants. Perhaps the most effective way to attempt those big children's integration into society would be to require a long course of psychological treatment at the parents' expense. It would be far better to do that now than to face the possible need to incarcerate him later for offenses such robbing, beating, or even murdering people he considers insignificant.

Of course it is ironic that the writer of this tantrum is in a discipline that attempts to study human social behavior.

frostbiker
March 5, 2007, 12:24 PM
tee hee! you said dudy! :p

geekWithA.45
March 5, 2007, 12:29 PM
I'd point out to that kid that one of the things you're supposed to get from college is to learn how to deal with people and circumstances different from himself, and his own narrow world view.

That'll serve him better than Karl Marx ever will.

Manzanita
March 5, 2007, 12:32 PM
Well, the kid is a journalism major...

I do like the responses on the page where the article appears. I do love my home state. If WKU is anything like the university where I work, he'll find a bit more sympathy among the faculty than the students. But just a bit more.

Welcome to Kentucky, Brandon! The place where, not too long ago, "He needed killin'" was a valid defense. :D

longeyes
March 5, 2007, 12:44 PM
Future Chinese houseboy or harem eunuch.

michael_aos
March 5, 2007, 12:55 PM
I'm a little concerned that everything thinks its perfectly OK for an off-duty LEO to carry a gun in class.

But any other citizen student would be expelled immediately.

Why they double-standard?

The concept that only government and police can be trusted with firearms is disturbing.

Can JROTC / military bring their issued / non-issued firearms to class also?

Mike

Cosmoline
March 5, 2007, 12:58 PM
Don't be too hard on him. He's just saying what he's been taught.

K3
March 5, 2007, 12:58 PM
I'm a little concerned that everything thinks its perfectly OK for an off-duty LEO to carry a gun in class.

But any other citizen student would be expelled immediately.

Why they double-standard?

The concept that only government and police can be trusted with firearms is disturbing.

Mike

Methinks you create a strawman. The subject being discussed is specific. Not mentioning other citizens does not imply anything, one way or the other.

MikePGS
March 5, 2007, 01:12 PM
Every single comment in response to that is ripping him apart. Fun to read:) Since when does what he thinks have any bearing on the second amendment of the constitution? If he doesen't like guns, don't carry one.

Ragnar Danneskjold
March 5, 2007, 01:13 PM
Unfortunately, with an attitude and intellect like that, the author will probably become a world famous "journalist". It wouldn't surprise me to see him making up stories as a war correspondent in a few years.

svtruth
March 5, 2007, 01:17 PM
is higher learning, you're starting pretty low.

the pistolero
March 5, 2007, 01:22 PM
This is the exact reason why I hate college kids. Every day I deal with these idjits in my classes and it is mind-numbing to witness.

I promise, we're not all that bad. And I was a journalism major too. :D

Robert Hairless
March 5, 2007, 01:22 PM
Mike, I don't think that anyone here has supported a double standard. So far everyone is staying on track, responding to what the "kid" said. Notice the comments here and on the web site that published his article: so far no one supports him, because his position is clear and clearly unpalatable to many people.

You could try arguing your point, of course, but I think it would be self-defeating. People who can see what's wrong with the kid's thinking now might not see it if the issue is turned into the same argument that they heard before.

It's usually a good idea, when talking to people who don't agree on big issues such as the Second Amendment rights of individuals, to see if there is common ground on small parts of those issues such as the right of an armed police officer to attend class as a student. At least that's my thinking.

The people who responded so far believe that the police officer has that right, but they might not--and probably won't--agree that you have that right too. Some agreement is usually better than none, I think, because it could lead forward to even more agreement. That strategy seems more useful than cutting off any agreement right at the beginning. Of course I could be wrong.

ZeSpectre
March 5, 2007, 01:29 PM
This is classic hoplophobia.

Did anyone do anything threatening to this kid? Apparently not.
Did this kid -feel- threatened? Apparently.

Where's the problem ownership here.


I wonder what this kid would do if you had a banquet and the centerpiece was a cake that looked like a rifle.

romma
March 5, 2007, 01:30 PM
Maybe this kid saw the "Glock 40" video and thinks all police are alike!!

1911austin
March 5, 2007, 01:42 PM
http://hobbes.ncsa.uiuc.edu/onsheepwolvesandsheepdogs.html

offthepaper
March 5, 2007, 01:46 PM
What a whinnin' ninny!
There's way too many options to tear into this kid. His own writings seem to be his undoing. As stated earlier, no solid arguments against the FA, only that he's scared (I bet this happens a lot in his world). My own daughter is in college right now (small community college), thankfully she does'nt buy into all the "evil gun" hoopla being passed off as "higher education". But there are some in her classes that do. It's a shame that some poor parent is paying big bucks for this type of indoctrination, being passed off as "education".
People (you know, the smart ones) like this never seem to realize that as soon as they come into a threatning, or life and death situation, who do they immediatly call for help?......SOMEONE WITH A GUN!!! :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

Turkey Creek
March 5, 2007, 02:00 PM
Journalism major eh?- With this attitude and a sound background in Marx, he should have no trouble finding employment in one of our fine newspapers :banghead:

Deanimator
March 5, 2007, 02:10 PM
My reply on the site:

"The original poster seems immature, narcissistic and craving of unearned attention. It is in part people like him who cause violent Islamists to have such contempt for us and which led them to believe that they could attack us without retaliation on 9/11. At some point the realization that the world does not revolve around him will come crashing down upon his head. It will doubtless leave a quite a mark."

Robert Hairless
March 5, 2007, 02:13 PM
Deanimator, I just dashed in because I saw that you had commented. Your thinking is always interesting. That comment is especially so. Thanks.

kd7nqb
March 5, 2007, 02:35 PM
Ok so this kid is a moonbat thats clear, but beyond that this kid needs some education. I love how he assumes that if a bad guy has a gun then now he has more ammo. Since we know that ALL guns take the same ammo loaded in the same magazines. Second of all his argument about what good things have come from guns in classrooms. What about Grundy Virginia? 2 students who were armed stopped a school shooting, but I guess he gets to ignore statistics that hurt his case.

I would go on and on an refute this guy but on THR I would be preaching to the choir so I will save myself the time.

michael_aos
March 5, 2007, 02:42 PM
I don't think that anyone here has supported a double standard.

OK, my sentiment may have been premature.

I just hope people don't say "it's OK for the cop to have a gun in class -- because he's a cop". It should be OK for him to have a gun in class because he's a citizen of the United States.

I think it's safe to assume the administration wouldn't allow him to carry the gun if he wasn't a cop. But you're right, that is just an assumption.

Mike

ArfinGreebly
March 5, 2007, 02:57 PM
Holy spit.

What a ball of lint.

What I want to know is where were all the other guns?

In grade school the teacher would have asked, "did you bring enough for everybody?"

But this is big boy school, so you're supposed to bring your own.

And only ONE student remembered to bring his gun?

Gawd. What do they teach these kids nowadays?

Dravur
March 5, 2007, 04:24 PM
Wow, Hysteria is alive and well on our college campi. You have the right to be uncomfortable. You even have the right to wet yourself at the site of a gun. You however, have no right to impose your beliefs on others.

That officer and other CCW carriers are law abiding people and have no childish sense of firearms as you seem to. They don't have the "Mommy, make them stop or ill hold my breath till I turn blue" mentality. They see the firearm as a tool, neither evil or good. It is used in self defense, in defense of person, property and country. It is a tool. Get over your childish sense of entitlement and please, for the love of god, don't go into journalism. You are far to involved with yourself to be an objective journalist.

SoCalShooter
March 5, 2007, 04:41 PM
Sounds like a spoiled brat to me. Its all about them its what they want.:cuss:

Archer1945
March 5, 2007, 11:06 PM
Here is what my comment was to this student's? little rant.


"I hope this student is not an example of the type of journalism majors the university is turning out. If he is so interested in Karl Marx maybe he should find out about journalism in a Marxist society. Not too mention the fact that Marx gives all RIGHTS to the government and none to the people."


It is interesting in 37 responses there is not one defending him. In fact the majority seem to think Brandon Wilson has a MAJOR problem. I have a feeling the real world is one day going to give this guy a good sound kick-in-the-teeth.

Ragnar Danneskjold
March 5, 2007, 11:08 PM
You would think a Marxist would be fine with armed State employees in the classroom.

Professor K
March 5, 2007, 11:08 PM
There is no way that a gun will ever comfort me while I am trying to learn about Karl Marx's views on society.

About sums it up.

Aguila Blanca
March 5, 2007, 11:10 PM
I'm not sure what state this idiot is writing in/from, but in my state an off-duty police officer is a police officer 24/7/365, and pretty much every department in the state requires off-duty officers to carry.

What a jerk!

The Deer Hunter
March 5, 2007, 11:10 PM
I bet when someone busts down his classroom door with a glock(not to pick on anyone) and noone has a viable mean of defence he'll wish he never pressed that issue.

:barf:

Pilgrim
March 5, 2007, 11:37 PM
When I worked for the Sheriff, I also held a position as adjunct instructor at the local community college. Everyone in the administration office knew I was a deputy sheriff, I frequently came into the office to retrieve my mail, etc., but after Columbine everything changed. I went by to get my mail and visit a colleague, and the administration staff had kittens.

"He had a gun."

"Why didn't he leave it in his car?"

"Something could have happened...."

I was in and out of the office and didn't register the shock. However, some administrator worked up her courage and called my colleague and voiced all these hoplophobic fears. He told her to get over it. Most of the adjunct instructors in Administration of Justice carried weapons and even some students who were peace officers.

Pilgrim

ArfinGreebly
March 6, 2007, 04:02 AM
posted 3/05/07 @ 2:21 PM EST

Evidently Brandon has somehow missed that the world does not revolve around him. He "understands the law" and still disagrees.

Evidently he also "understands" the constitution and still disagrees.

It's hard to imagine that someone so committed to violence against society would have a problem with guns. Then again, anyone who subscribes to the idea that forcible confiscation of another's property is a good thing, probably understands all too well why guns are needed. Feigning fear to provide a plausible basis gun elimination makes sense.

In any case, it doesn't seem like logic has played any major part in the composition of this article. Quite the contrary: it is emotion-driven and self-centered.

Young "man" (if I may use that term), America has rights and liberty baked in. You don't get to change that.

Here's a quote: "Look at it this way. If America frightens you, feel free to live somewhere else. There are plenty of other countries that don't suffer from excessive liberty. America is where the Liberty is. Liberty is not certified safe."

I was unable to find a single response supporting him.

Robert Hairless
March 6, 2007, 04:57 AM
What would be much better is a headline reading "University kid wants free gun school." I'd like to see state supported institutions of higher education include firearms training in their curricula. It would benefit the state and keep the kids off the streets.

shaggycat
March 6, 2007, 10:09 AM
I am surprised to see that coming from WKU, a university in a very pro-RKBA part of Kentucky. I think that this guy's opinion is probably the minority among peers.

Jacka L Ope
March 6, 2007, 10:19 AM
University kid wants gun free school? What a maroon. Where are a lot of dramatic crimes committed we see in the news? None other than "gun free zones".

ArfinGreebly
March 7, 2007, 03:36 AM
What would be much better is a headline reading "University kid wants free gun school." I'd like to see state supported institutions of higher education include firearms training in their curricula. It would benefit the state and keep the kids off the streets.

Hear, hear.

I had to read that twice.

:D

Autolycus
March 7, 2007, 03:47 AM
I think the kid is just your typical college hippy. Just an idiot overall.

Originally posted by Hagar:
Hopefully the next gun in school he sees, will not be some Arab Muslim carrying an AK47 over the dead body of an unarmed security guard.

Or some crazy white supremacist type from Columbia, South Carolina carrying his 1911 and a Tacti-cool AR style rifle over the bodies of dead minority students and people who believe in diversity.

Ragnar Danneskjold
March 7, 2007, 03:55 AM
"and people who believe in diversity?"

What on earth does that underhanded comment have to do with anything?

skinnyguy
March 7, 2007, 04:14 AM
If it were someone with a knife, then now the situation has become much more dangerous. God forbid it was a person with another gun, because now that person has more ammo.
Unless the person with the knife or gun the writer speaks of has put that item under HIS chin, it doesn't bother him. Should that scenario happen with a police officer in the room, I do believe that our future journalist would be glad to see the officer's gun being used to save his neck.

I'm sure he doesn't understand calibers either, due to the assumption that the officer was using the same ammo as the imaginary gunman. Can you imagine a BG telling everyone in the room to just hold on while he strips the cop's ammo out of his gun and then loading it into his own? Most BGs who are as dumb as a box of rocks know that if you can gain access to the cop's gun, you use it.

But then I guess that shows the intelligence level that we are dealing with here, doesn't it?

BobCav
March 7, 2007, 04:18 AM
"tis a tale told by an idiot,

full of sound and fury,

signifying nothing."

Macbeth (Bill Shakespeare)

Neo-Luddite
March 7, 2007, 09:36 AM
Not to second guess or play psychologist but I think the young fellow is having a sexual identity/inadequacy crisis of some sort. He may also be 'experimenting' with behaviors and substances that cause irrational fears.
He is afraid of the policeman and his uniform and gun, scared of some imagined 'other' that the officer might have a gun battle with, and appears to see the 'classroom' as some sort of sacred or ritual chamber where outside reality and occupational trappings must never enter.

In short he thinks that by adopting this worldview that he might stand a better chance of getting lucky with some vegan hippie chick this weekend. He hasn't figured it out yet--she's already dating the cop.

.cheese.
March 7, 2007, 09:46 AM
All I'll say is this.

I was OFF-CAMPUS at a school-related event (Law Fair - where all the nation's top law-schools bring representatives).

I was just helping out giving out flyers and making people were "on the list". I'm involved in a lot of things, so I donate much of my time.

I brought a small assisted-opening folder knife with me because I remember in the past I had to open a lot of boxes. It was a little Buck Rush.

When I took out the folder to start opening boxes, the director of recruiting for my law school saw me and freaked.

She said, "Is that a switch-blade?"
Me: Um.... no?
Her: Is that a bowie knife?
Me: um..... wouldn't that be at least 8 times the size of this? so... no?
Her: Why did you bring that?
Me: Oh... I'm sorry - I should use my fingernails all day to open boxes.... how stupid of me..

She scoffed and walked away.

Rude schmuck. :rolleyes:

cambeul41
March 9, 2007, 10:09 AM
A few years ago, a Detroit police detective enrolled in one of my classes. Before the first meeting, he asked if it was permissible for him to take off his suit jacket in class. Of course I said yes, then I asked why he even bothered asking. He showed me his departmental ID and opened his jacket to reveal his gun which would be exposed if the jacket was off. I still saw no problem since I had had several uniformed LEOs in class without the other students showing concern. He said that people reacted better to those in uniforms with guns than to those in plain clothes.

He was right. For the full term, the other students in the class carefully avoided looking at him directly. They seemed to think that looking at him would attract unwanted "police attention." For my part, I could hardly keep from laughing out loud when I saw his classmates steal glances then immediately look away.

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