If you carry cocked and locked, have you ever at days end found your safety off?


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jlh26oo
March 9, 2007, 08:08 AM
And said yikes how'd that happen?

Just furious.

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CajunBass
March 9, 2007, 08:09 AM
no

gpr
March 9, 2007, 08:58 AM
not a problem...DA only...gpr

Marshall
March 9, 2007, 09:28 AM
Never happened to me.

ID_shooting
March 9, 2007, 09:48 AM
Hmmm, the three guns I carry (not at the same time of course)...

Ruger Security-Six, Kel-Tec P3AT, or a Glock G19, lemme think, nope, never did find a safety on or off :neener:

azredhawk44
March 9, 2007, 09:55 AM
On my 1911 Charles Daly. The safety detent is pretty well broken in on it.

hagar
March 9, 2007, 10:15 AM
Used to carry a Star Firestar with a hair trigger job. One time I took it out of the holster to find it cocked and unlocked, and it scared me a lot. Nowadays I carry a Glock 26 and a Kel-Tec P32.

Grayrider
March 9, 2007, 10:32 AM
Yes, but the grip safety is on there for a reason.

We are talking 1911s right?

:D

John

jmorris
March 9, 2007, 10:37 AM
On a 1911, you can change the shape of the safty where it contacts the plunger to adjust the ammount of pressure required to move it. My carry gun requires a little more pressure than my comp guns and I haven't had any problems it also has an ambi safty.

Coyote3855
March 9, 2007, 10:49 AM
No. I carry a 1911 C&L mostly on weekends working around the ranch. Desk job carry gun is a Kahr P9. Years ago, I was carrying a Ruger Blackhawk .357 in a Lawrence Elmer Keith model holster while working cattle on horseback. I looked down and saw the hammer at full cock. Had to stop and clean off the saddle.

Coyote3855

Devonai
March 9, 2007, 11:08 AM
It happened with my 1911 once, but it was because I was using a "universal" holster. When I've stuck with wet-formed leather it has never been a problem.

Chuck R.
March 9, 2007, 01:01 PM
Yes, once a long time ago when carrying in a cheap IWB holster without a slide guard.

Now I use Spark's holsters and I can't swipe the safety off when holstered.

Chuck

AndyC
March 9, 2007, 01:45 PM
Yes - before switching to an IWB that actually covered the safety

Black Majik
March 9, 2007, 01:46 PM
Never had the problem of the thumb safety snapping off safe.

michael_aos
March 9, 2007, 01:58 PM
Yes, on a Browning Hi-Power Practical 9mm.

http://homepage.mac.com/michael_aos/.Pictures/Guns/BHP/BHP-1.jpg

psyopspec
March 9, 2007, 02:02 PM
Had it happen with a 1911 in a Fobus, likely from my cover garment coming between the gun and my body while getting in & out of the car. The holster kept the trigger covered; when I pulled it from the holster for a wipe down at the end of the day I kept my finger off the trigger and the weapon pointed in a safe direction, so it was really a non-issue.

Odd Job
March 9, 2007, 02:11 PM
No, because it was a Vektor CP1 :neener:

Spartacus451
March 9, 2007, 02:17 PM
Nope, but even if it the safety does flip off there is nothing to worry about. The trigger is protected and even if the sear bumps out of the full cock notch it will catch on the half-cock. Although... if you maintain your gun correctly the sear would not be able to bump out of the full cock notch.

mattw
March 9, 2007, 02:23 PM
The best safety is between your ears.

Slvr Surfr
March 9, 2007, 02:35 PM
Mine does it even with a expensive quality holster. Not the holsters fault by any means. It just happens that my 1911 has a sharper than normal strong side safety. It cut itself into the holster and every now and then likes to slide itself to off. Its a non issue to me since I practice the 4 safety rules anytime my hand touches my weapon.

Cosmoline
March 9, 2007, 02:48 PM
It happened to me with a Star BM once, and I stopped carrying C&L after that. Of course I was using a cheapo holster, but still it made me want to go back to wheelguns. Esp. since the Star has no grip safety. I've never been comfortable C&L.

ezypikns
March 9, 2007, 03:00 PM
Your safety is always covered.

kokapelli
March 9, 2007, 03:03 PM
Exactly why I usually only carry DAO or DA/SA pistols.:uhoh:

f4t9r
March 9, 2007, 03:10 PM
NEVER !!

Logan5
March 9, 2007, 05:08 PM
Yes, also with a High Power with the big ambi safety.

TheWanderer
March 9, 2007, 05:59 PM
I used to have a Hi Power that did this constantly. The only thing I intensely disliked on the HP was its safety system. I found it unstable.

jlh26oo
March 10, 2007, 02:32 AM
So apparently, it's mostly happening when using a holster that doesn't cover the safety, and with oversized or ambi safeties. INteresting. Thanks all for sharing.









Hey, someone found my secret poll easter egg!
Which do you feel is the BEST safety?

external manual safety
trigger safety
the safety between your ears
grip safety

The best safety is between your ears.
You got dat right!

slabuda
March 10, 2007, 02:45 AM
found it like that but i think it was a back pack belt that did it. holster completely covered trigger though. and i clicked it right back on after taking the pack off. made sure i didnt use that holster and pack combo again. FYI 1911 style

Moral of the story, watch what you slide down around the holster.

helpless
March 10, 2007, 02:52 AM
Held it, bought it. Shot it, loved it. Carried it...

After carrying the gun for about a month It started falling apart. The slide lock broke off "OFF". After replacing the part, the safety started coming undone. Not from the holster either. it just wouldn't stay.

Finally returned the gun and got an XD. Which is ironic because it has not manual safeties but I feel completely comfortable. Best thing I ever did.

jon_in_wv
March 10, 2007, 09:42 AM
I have carried my Hi-Power and a Star BM C&L often for the past few years. Both have a positive working safety and I wouldn't carry then otherwise. I have never found the safety off.

Kevinch
March 10, 2007, 11:26 AM
Yep - once or twice on a 1911 - but since it is 1 of 2 safeties (the grip safety being the other) what I was concerned with was how it happened - not a ND. Since then I check the gun upon holstering & it hasn't happened since, so I think it was occurring somehow as I inserted the gun in its holster (IWB in a Sparks VMII).

I also sometimes carry a PT940 C&L too (OWB in a Hume JIT SLIDE) & have never seen it with that combination.

Moral: practice safe gun handling as diligently when holstering and carrying as when pulling from your holster & you won't have a problem.

jlh26oo
March 11, 2007, 01:13 AM
Yep - once or twice on a 1911 - but since it is 1 of 2 safeties (the grip safety being the other) what I was concerned with was how it happened - not a ND.

What, specifically, is the problem with the safety being off at all then, since you are concerned with how it got off, but not about potential ND's.

Thank you for sharing your experience.

Ala Dan
March 11, 2007, 06:41 AM
I've NEVER found MY safety off on any 1911 that I have carried~! :scrutiny: :cool:

Mark in California
March 11, 2007, 07:47 AM
NO.

Piney Woods
March 11, 2007, 08:44 AM
Yes, many years back. That's why I stopped carrying my 1911 in an X-15 shoulder rig. Scary!

Kevinch
March 11, 2007, 05:24 PM
What, specifically, is the problem with the safety being off at all then, since you are concerned with how it got off, but not about potential ND's.

Thank you for sharing your experience.

I would never intentionally carry without the thumb safety engaged on a 1911 that is C&L. There are 2 safeties, both the thumb & grip safety, & IMO the safest way to carry the gun is with both engaged.

My point was that the grip safety, acting as a "back up", would prevent any ND while the gun was holstered. Had I pulled my weapon, depressing the grip safety as I did so, my gun would have been completely off safe - not good at all.

My gun has ambi safeties. The first time, I thought it was a fluke & really didn't make any changes to my routine. The second time, when I looked at my gun to remove it from the holster, I saw that the thumb safety had been deactivated. It really unnerved me -to the point that I considered selling the gun (a Kimber Ultra CDP that my wife gave me for my birthday). The only thing I can believe is that somehow, someway, when holstering my weapon, I pushed the safety off. For a while, I carried the gun around the house unloaded in an attempt to duplicate it. Since that second incident, I've been very diligent in holstering & it has never happened again. We are talking years of IWB carry. Even to this day, I still reach down & check the safety from time to time while carrying & it has always been activated.

Bob M.
March 11, 2007, 05:34 PM
Not With my Ruger P90DC....DA/SA

EricTheBarbarian
March 11, 2007, 05:40 PM
:D what safety?

orionengnr
March 11, 2007, 05:48 PM
A friend of mine had it happen with his ambi-saftey equipped Kimber 1911. Suspects it was the right-hand (outboard) side of the safety and it snicked to "off" while he was getting into/out of his vehicle.

Pretty much sold me. No ambi safeties for me.

CSA 357
March 11, 2007, 09:55 PM
YES ONE OR TWO TIMES, it was a 1911 , you can change the spring tension on the safty so this will be less likely to happen, csa:)

cochise
March 11, 2007, 09:58 PM
I posted pics on the 1911 forum thread a few years ago. Shot my arse down throgh the sofa, and killed the tv. Boy what a wake up!
I blame the asmbi-safety. I still don't know why the "grip safety" didn't prevent this, but it happened. I never carry cocked and locked anymore unless with a Milt Sparks holster or Safriland level 11 holster.

Mat, not doormat
March 11, 2007, 11:44 PM
yeah, with an ambi safety. was carrying at the time in a kydex paddle that kept the gun too far from the body. my arm was always brushing against it. I was walking along, felt a bush, and heard a click. Found a stall, checkrd, and found safety off. Last time I used that combo.

Mac Attack
March 12, 2007, 06:50 AM
Yup more than once and with a well known brand of customer IWB holster. I used to be very concerned about it but then I came to the realization that my gun is no less safer than it would be if the safety was on. As long as I do my part and keep my finger out of the trigger until I am ready to shoot then I have nothing to worry about.

Don't get me wrong, I think the thumb safety is a good thing but not the end all be all when it comes to making a gun safe. Heck, I sometimes carry a Glock and it doesn't have a grip or thumb safety and I don't feel unsafe. Keep your finger out of the trigger.

TheotherMikeG
March 12, 2007, 09:28 AM
Nope

delta53
March 12, 2007, 10:10 AM
I had a Detonics Combat Master and dropped it with the hammer down and a empty chamber it hit so hard on the hammer that the firing pin stop came out with the pin and spring (hammer back safety on always)

MythBuster
March 12, 2007, 10:28 AM
The thumb safety both blocks the sear and to some degree the forward movement of the hammer should the sear fail to hold it.

Some of you assume it is OK to find your 1911 cocked but unlocked.

You should never assume that. The manaul safety is an impotant part of the overall drop safety system on the 1911.

If you safety keeps working itself off you need to fix it.

03Shadowbob
March 12, 2007, 10:44 AM
I have found one 2 occassions that my PT140 had the safety off by the end of the day. I carry in a Done Hume IWB and it doesn't cover the safety so that's probably why along with the fact that I get in and out of cars a lot and the holster does move around some. The safety is also prety tight so whatever movement I did must have been just right to get it in the off position.
I am not that worried about it though as the trigger is inside the holster.

GARY1911A1
March 12, 2007, 11:24 AM
With a Les Baer Premier II with a wide thumb safety. I also think the holster had something to do with it, but the holster didn't do that with any other 1911. I replaced the thumb safety and it didn't happen again.

Spartacus451
March 12, 2007, 02:18 PM
You should never assume that. The manual safety is an impotant part of the overall drop safety system on the 1911.
Not all of us assume.
:scrutiny:
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e243/1911Tuner/1910.gif
Though it was intended to be carried hammer down (down, not halfcock) it still needed to be drop safe during handling. It did so without a manual safety.

glocktoberfest
March 12, 2007, 02:56 PM
what safety?



+1

mljdeckard
March 12, 2007, 03:33 PM
One time I pulled it out of a fanny pack to find the safety off, I don't know what caused it. I carry hammer down with that rig now.

Khornet
March 12, 2007, 04:29 PM
my S&W 1911Sc. Had been lugging a lot of heavy sacks braced against the hip where the pistol rides, and must have knocked it off doing that.

I probably wouldn't have found out until much later, but I have this habit of sneaking a feel as I go through my day just to be sure, and that's how I found it.
Hasn't happened since.

I can't imagine any thumb safety that couldn't be swiped off with the right activity, such as what I was doing.

MD_Willington
March 12, 2007, 04:32 PM
Here is my setup:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/MDWillington1976/Firearms/Hpim0837small.jpg

Sniper X
March 12, 2007, 04:40 PM
Of course, but I usually check it from time to time along the day when no ones around say about 15 times a day. Just good safe practice. Just reach down and place a finger below it and lock it up....1911 of course.

Kevinch
March 12, 2007, 06:17 PM
what safety?

:) getting a kick from the Glock guys!

Just look at it this way - even if the thumb safety does snap off, with the grip safety you still have 1 more active than a Glock, although I wouldn't advocate carrying that way.

Sniper X
March 12, 2007, 06:28 PM
A lot of guys who use 1911s for competition disconect the grip safety, they say it provides a better feeling trigger. One of my 1911s is like this but I bought it that way. It does have a standard safety, and no I wouldn;t carry it. One reason is it has about a 2lb trigger....no good in the court room if I had to shoot someone with it.

B52Wing
March 12, 2007, 06:42 PM
I sometimes carry my Para. It has the LDA trigger so it isn't much of a concern. I do carry with the safety on and have checked and found it was off. Again, not much of a concern and I sweep the safety off on my draw so no issue there.

TexasRifleman
March 12, 2007, 06:59 PM
A lot of guys who use 1911s for competition disconect the grip safety, they say it provides a better feeling trigger.

It does, my Colt Delta here has the grip safety pinned but I sure won't carry the thing. It's also nice if you are drawing at a match and don't get a perfect grip, you can fire once or twice then re adjust the grip as you move.

The other one,the Razorback, I've carried off and on since I got it and have never had the safety disengage accidentally.

Carried in shoulder holster, OWB and IWB and never had problems.

http://homepage.mac.com/jayc67/1911.jpg

DaltonSpringfield
March 12, 2007, 07:17 PM
Cheap-O Holster + Extended Ambi-Saftey + swinging arm when walking = *click* YIKES

Got a better holster, never happened again.

CWL
March 12, 2007, 07:37 PM
Yes. Cheap Galco holster. Have never had it happen when using better-designed holsters.

AK103K
March 12, 2007, 08:27 PM
A lot has to do with your holster choice, gun, and how physical you are.

Early on I learned not to use a holster with a thumb strap. The strap on the Galco holster I was using would take the safety of every time. It stopped when I cut off the strap, and I usually didnt have a problem with any of the open top holsters after that, but on occasion, especially after heavy exertion, it would be off.

I've also found my Firestar and High Powers safeties off on occasion. Its not really an issue with any of them, grip safety or not, if its in a holster and the trigger is covered.

What annoyed me more than my 1911's safeties being off was getting out of the truck and continually finding my HK P7's mag on the front seat. The pressure from the seat belt would release it every time.

stevelyn
March 13, 2007, 12:04 AM
Yes, lots of times. Nothing to worry about as long as there are no fingers inside the trigger.

jlh26oo
March 13, 2007, 02:15 AM
(disengaging the grip safety is) also nice if you are drawing at a match and don't get a perfect grip, you can fire once or twice then re adjust the grip as you move.
Hey, that might be a nice feature for ANYtime, not just a match!



Well, the results of this poll surprised me. Over a third of you HAVE found safeties off while carrying... except that you have to consider since a few posted here who don't even carry c&l'd, there might have been a few point & clickers who confounded the poll results.

What's most interesting to me is not so much the numbers themselves, but how attitudes toward this phenomenon vary so wildly. Breaks down into these groups:

-those who have never found their safeties off declare so with so much conviction that they are often surprised this is even a question- much less that it could actually happen to anyone.

-some who have found their safeties off consider it to be more of a curiosity than a safety liability, with the manual thumb safety being only one link in the entire safety system.

-then others it alarms enough to alter their carry rig, swap safety configuration (ambi, oversized), or change ccw's or carry type altogether.

hnk45acp
March 13, 2007, 01:55 PM
on my HK uspc 9mm
safety: never
thumb break: yes

FJC
March 13, 2007, 02:07 PM
I've never had it happen, but I always carry a 1911 in a leather holster that covers the safety. All the quality holsters I've used have held that safety in place properly.

MythBuster
March 13, 2007, 07:50 PM
It does not really matter what they say. If one carries , handles, and uses a cocked and locked 1911 on a regular basis sooner or later you WILL find it with the safety worked to the off position.

LiquidTension
March 13, 2007, 08:23 PM
The safety on my 1911 has disengaged in the glove box, but never in a holster. I started keeping a cheap Uncle Mike's holster in the glove box and that helped. It also keeps things from getting scratched.

Titan6
March 13, 2007, 08:40 PM
Never off safe but once I reached down and the whole gun was gone.

It had fallen out of the holster when I had gotten out of a vehicle and I did not notice it. Thank whatever G-d looks over 2LTs. It was still attched to my lanyard. Still that was a heart pounding moment I will never forget

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