[Redhat]

Hello all,

I have my reloading equipment up and running, except for a tumbler. Which do you guys recommend?

Frankford
RCBS
Lyman
Others

Thanks

[RustyFN]

IMO they are all pretty much the same. I would look for what is on sale. I bought a Chicago brand from Harbor Freight on sale for $32 and it has worked fine, no problems. If you are going to be loading mostly large rifle then you might want to look for a tumbler that is a little bigger that the common tumbler.
Rusty

[Redhat]

Thanks Rusty,

I have so far fire 100 rds of reloaded 230 FMJ and the brass is starting to pile up a little as my space is somewhat limited. I've heard good stuff about the Frankford Arsenals. More impottantly, I need a good media seperator that keeps the dust to a minimum as I have small children.

[Primersinmyshoe]

Dillon!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v423/primersinmyshoe/DSCN1874Small.jpg

[ReloaderFred]

Go to http://www.berrysmfg.com/81.php. I've got two of the Berry's tumblers and have sold several of them to customers. They back their products and this kit has everything you need, including either the rotary sifter, which I recommend, or the pan sifter, to get you started. I believe Berry's makes the tumbler for Midway, which they sell as their Franford brand. The price quoted may also include shipping, but check to make sure.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[The Bushmaster]

Dillon!!??!!...(insert cuss word here:D )...Just get a tumbler... Any tumbler...I've been using a Lyman 1200 for 20 years. Yes...The same one...Most any tumbler will do. Most are in the $80 or less catogory...Mostly less.:)

[revolverman357]

I've been using a Lyman turbo tumbler for a long time. It works great, no problems.

[U.S.SFC_RET]

I have a frankford Arsenal that's taking care of all of my backlog as we speak. Great tumbler from Midway and it came with a separater to boot. BTW get your tumbling meduim (crushed walnuts its bedding for the lizards you know) from the pet store. Very cheap that way.

[Dr.Who]

I have a Midway version prior to there re-naming it to Frankfort. No, Issues and most likely would buy it again if I needed one. I did spend a few extra bucks to get the see through lid. It let's me see inside, without opening the lid and venting the dust.

To aid in keeping the dust down, I use dryer softener sheets. Cut them up in 3 inch squares, and throw about a 1/2 dozen in at a time. Believe it or not they do last a while. I also helps the static cling in the media charge. Meaning the media does not stick to the sides, when it is poured into the sorter.

Just get what you fell is the best deal... They all just vibrate and shake....

[billp]

Senior citizen (http://www.prosefights.org/reigps/reigps.htm) has been handloading since about 1967.

Tumblers, if even heard of back then, were real expensive.

So we just wiped the cases off, then proceed through the reloading process.

I still have cases from 40 years ago.

Here's comparison between about 40 year old brass loaded with speer 180 gr propelled by 55 gr of 4831 and new winchester brass.

http://www.prosefights.org/funpics/thr/tumbler/notumble.jpg

Bullet seated so that it is close to lands.

Does tumbling to make brass shiny make a difference to performance?

PS

After buying 300 winchester cases and 200 130 gr speer hp bullets to go after varmints, I just bought a stevens 200 .223. Ugh.

[billp]

His nickname was Hunkesi, meaning "Slow" because he never hurried and did everything with care (http://www.incwell.com/Biographies/SittingBull.html).

[Walkalong]

Any tumbler...I've been using a Lyman 1200 for 20 years.

Me too. When Midway put their Frankford arsenal bowl on sale a few years ago I bought it and replaced the bowl on my 1200 to get more capacity. I keep looking at tumblers trying to decide what to get, but the Lyman just won't quit. I got it used about 21 years ago! I have been eyeballing the Berry's that ReloaderFred mentioned. If he likes em, they gotta be good.

[RustyFN]

Does tumbling brass make a performance difference?
I don't believe so. I think the point of tumbling the brass is that while the brass is tumbling you can be reloading or doing other things. In your case having to sit there and wipe off the brass you are dedicated to that and unable to do anything else at the same time.
Rusty

Edit: One example is I have a load of 223 brass in the tumbler right now.

[billp]

What increase in cartridge performance did you notice?

[billp]

I don't believe so.

I think the point of tumbling the brass is that while the brass is tumbling you can be reloading or doing other things.

Like drinking beer?

:)

regards from senior reloader ... and occasional beer drinker (http://www.prosefights.org/reigps/reigps.htm).

I plan to pitch all of my old winchester, norma, ... brass, then try some pressure tests with .30-06, 130 gr hp with VARGET [not 4895 which I got burned with with .22-250].

So, I could use both 40 year old brass, and new winchester brass to see if there is a difference?

Or is is this a waste of time?

Like counting all of the bees in the hive? (http://www.prosefights.org/reigps/reigps.htm)

[Walkalong]

Dirty brass can shoot just fine. But it is just to easy to clean it.:)

[billp]

I did with a rag.

What do you suggest?

[billp]

I must think about this. For a nanosecond.

[billp]

Wait.

Think this out.

Does shiny brass make sense?

[Walkalong]

Not if you've had too much beer.:eek:

[billp]

Question is does shiny bass make any difference in gun
performance or not?

Or is it just a waste of money? More unnecesary stuff?

"Not if you've had too much beer" may not contribute to the correct answer.

I've been thinking about buying a tumbler from Harbor Freight. And the merits.

I'm more inclined not to buy unless I hear a good reason to buy.

[agd1953]

Clean brass is good for your dies and the chamber of your weapon. No grit to scratch either. It's like writing with your finger on a dirty car. You just shouldn't do it.:)

[DWARREN123]

Most basic models are near enough the same that price matters. Where it gets different is in the larger ones, or ones that actually tumble instead of vibrate and other special features.

[Matt Dillon]

Folks, for me, (and with 50 plus year old eyes) I can review my brass a lot better once I tumble it. I tumble in corn cob before depriming, then after depriming, the cases go into the walnut tumbler. I have found splits in cases that I didn't catch prior to tumbling them; case inspection for me is much better with clean and polished brass. Dirt and Grime can hide too many things!

[1911user]

I'm not going to sit with a rag and wipe off 2000+ cases when I can dump them in a tumbler (in batches) for the same effect. Lots of things that work OK for low volume loading just don't make sense when shooting 1000+ per month.

The weather is getting nice here and I'm looking for a second tumbler. My old midway model is getting a little small especially for rifle cases and it'd be nice to have one for grungy range brass and one with relatively clean, newish media.

[alucard0822]

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=587176 this is my recomendation, got one when they first came out to replace my older frankford model after it burned up the last time my basement flooded. Works great, holds a lot of cases and cheap, I clean all my cases just out of habit, but use it mostly to remove resizing lube from rifle cases. 1 hr to clean with corncob media, 3 hrs and they look better than factory, I don't think cleaning cases helps accuracy or anything like that, but it can't hurt, I keep my guns clean and try to keep them in good shape, why not do it with my loads, Im proud of them too.

[Walkalong]

"Not if you've had too much beer" may not contribute to the correct answer.


I was just funnin' billp. I could care less if you clean your brass. :)

[byf43]

Clean brass is good for your dies and the chamber of your weapon. No grit to scratch either. It's like writing with your finger on a dirty car. You just shouldn't do it.


+1!!!!


I have two Lyman Turbo 1200 tumblers. (Been using them since they were first introduced. 1982-83, maybe???)

One cleans the brass to go into the dies, the second cleans off the lube after sizing and depriming.

Clean brass is happy brass!

[RustyFN]

Like drinking beer?
Exactly, billp if you ever make it to WV PM me and I will buy you a beer.
Question is does shiny bass make any difference in gun
performance or not?
My guess would be no it doesn't. It does make it a lot easier to find on the ground at the outdoor range.
Rusty

[telecaster1981]

I'll second the Harbor Freight vibratory tumbler...no problems at all...well, except for that one time I sat it on the carpeted floor while it was running so I could do some work on my reloading bench...the motor cooling vent was blocked by the carpet, so, yeah, it overheated and quit. Not to worry, it came back to life after a few minutes of cooling down. But that was my fault, not the tumblers! It's been a great tool so far!

Also, you might check out the ultrasonic cleaning option. There's a great write up on this method at the 6mmBR website...just do a websearch for it. I'm planning on getting an ultrasonic cleaner in addition to my vibratory tumbler.

And does clean brass give better performance? I can't really tell a difference on paper, but a lot of guys claim that clean brass does less damage to your reloading dies, so perhaps over time, dirty brass could affect the performance of your dies, which in turn affects the performance of your reloads.

Like someone else said, it is much easier to inspect your brass once it's been cleaned. There's also less baked-on or burned-in gunk on your brass if and when you decide to anneal your case necks. The "heat line" will be easier to see on clean brass too!

So, polishing/cleaning brass may not be necessary at all when you first get started reloading, it's a nice bit of icing on the cake!

Ben

[Walkalong]

So, polishing/cleaning brass may not be necessary at all when you first get started reloading, it's a nice bit of icing on the cake!

Yep. I just wiped mine off for a while until a got a used tumbler. I really like them nice and shiny.:)

[USSR]

I just thought I would mention that, while brass should be clean so as to not damage your dies, it don't have to be "shiney" to be clean. The results of tumbling will vary according to the media and any additives you use, and the length of time.

Don

[g56]

Clean brass is important, shiny is nice but not needed.

Back in the 60's the vibratory brass cleaners hadn't come out yet, the only thing available was the rotary tumblers which are expensive, and chemical cleaning, very few people owned a brass cleaner, I just cleaned my brass with soap and water.

In the 70's the vibratory brass cleaners came out, they were an immediate hit on the market, individuals could actually afford a brass cleaner, they ran from about $70 to $100. The vibratory tumblers were tremendously faster than the old rotaries, they sold like hot cakes.

Something that is very interesting is that prices for brass cleaning tumblers are a lot cheaper than they were when they came out, you can get a nice model for about $50 or less, back when they first came out a comparable model was about $80, there aren't very many things on the market that are cheaper now than they were 30 years ago.

[The Bushmaster]

Amen John...Ain't that the truth...:)

[billp]

I've avoided shining brass for about 40 years.

And have some pretty raunchy cases which I'm about to discard. ALL OF THEM.

Winchester, Norma, Remington, and whatever.

Now that I have 300 new 30-06 winchester cases.

Hey, Winchester cases seem, in the last 40 years, to be softer than other cases.

Work really well if not overloaded.

Since I'm 70, in June - a ... willing, I might not buy a tumbler?

If the brass lasts half as long as it did since 1967, perhaps I'm safe?

I hope, of course, I'm wrong.

Senior citizen (http://www.prosefights.org/reigps/reigps.htm)

[Dr.Who]

Billp Said "Hey, Winchester cases seem, in the last 40 years, to be softer than other cases."

If your Comparing the new to your old brass cases, I'd agree with you... The other cases have had 40 years of fireforming, heat treating and possibly annealing to them.

[sb350hp]

Not required but the real qeustion is "why not".

It is a good habit to start and you will never regret having shinny clean cases. How much do you care about your gun if you don't car what you put in your gun?

With auto's it only makes sense to have clean cases without all the grime.

Plus I like my stuff to look nice.

[dcloco]

I have a Midway (Frankford Aresenal) tumbler kit that I purchased for $50 on sale.

I also have a Dillon CV500 - the motor is bad in it. Received as a gift. NO warranty past one year on the Dillon.

Why would Dillon use a cheap motor? They will NOT sell a motor to me either. Must be shipped to them plus $30 for the repair.

[ilbob]

I doubt the dies or you gun cares if the cases are shiny. Clean, yes, shiney, probably not.

I do think it is easier to visually inspect the case for problems if it is shiney, as others have said.

[The Bushmaster]

Shiny brass=PRIDE in workmanship...:) I won't tell you how many times I have had positive comments on my loaded rounds at the range and those who have had the honor of visiting my Reloading/Gun Room. When you open a box of factory loads do you see any stained cases in the box?

[Robert Farrar]

Hi Redhat,

I've used a Thumler's Tumbler since '95. It's a rotary, heavy duty (originally for
rock tumbling), and has held up well. Only problem so far is that the o-ring drive belt finally seperated at it's seam recently.

I echo previous posts on clean brass - easier to see any problems such as incipient case seperation, etc.

Take your time, read your load manual(s), and work up loads carefully, and have fun :)

Bob

[sb350hp]

Just got my Franford arsenal. Works great, quite and tumbles/cycles brass very well.

[billp]

I'm still not convinced about shiny brass.

+

1 how do you get all of the cleaning material out of the inside of the case?
2 does cleaning material residue make any difference to propellant and pressure?

My old many-type .30-06 brass looks so bad that I am planning to toss it.

With new winchester .30-06 bass I'm in the thinking stage of trying a pressure test using imr 4895 vs VARGET in my remington .30-06 using speer 130 gr hp bullets.

My new stevens 200 .223 using VARGET with 55 gr v-max and ss109 bullets really works well.

Last five shots at 50 yards using Black Hills 68 gr match.

http://www.prosefights.org/funpics/thr/shootingrangepark/blackhillslastfive.jpg

[RobW]

I'm still not convinced about shiny brass.
In addition to the pro-tumblers I might add: Some people wash their cars and even polish it to a shiny appearance from time to time. It doesn't enhance the car's performance either.

My old many-type .30-06 brass looks so bad that I am planning to toss it.
May be if you had tumbled it regularly, you wouldn't have to toss them? :D

[billp]

Think about electric power. Global warming.

Think again about wiping cases off by hand.

And, MOST IMPORTANT. Think about you attaching a hand crank to your vibrator.

How long is this going to take you?

We maybe "green shooters?"

Hey, guys I'm thinking of buying some horonday sst about 130 gr sst to compare them to speer 130 hp in 130 hp using imr 4895 and hodgdon VARGET to see if I can do as well with stevens 200 with remington .30-05 adl.

Another senior citizen project (http://www.prosefights.org/nmlegal/voidjudgments/voidjudgments.htm#void).

[Dr.Who]

Quote:"Think about electric power. Global warming.

Think again about wiping cases off by hand.

And, MOST IMPORTANT. Think about you attaching a hand crank to your vibrator.

How long is this going to take you?

We maybe "green shooters?" " Quote End....

billp,

Let me get this straight.... You’re a "Green Shooter" Because you wipe off your cases and do not use any electricity.... However, every round you create uses electricity somewhere. How where the Bullets, Primers, Cases, Powder, etc... Created? They all used power/electricity someplace. What about the light bulb and heat you use in your re-loading area? Every round you fire is probably more of a detriment to the environment than the little bit of electricity your tumbler could use. Exposed lead, powder residual, carbon monoxide, etc...

As the pendulum swings, your argument has gone too far off center. It's is a bit too early for April Fool's Day... Don't you think? :o

Let me ask you this.... When you wash your car, do you just wipe off the mud and dirt or do you use water and soap? If you just wipe off the dirt, the finished would be ruined. Use soap and water, your not being "Green" to the environment. Does a clean car effect its operation? Not really, as long as it is maintained. But a clean car sure looks nice and shows pride of ownership. I look at tumbling my brass the same as nice clean car.

So you can continue to wipe your brass. I'll continue to be happy with my clean brass....