The Marlin 39 Club


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AStone
March 11, 2007, 08:29 PM
Welcome! :)

This is a "club" thread dedicated to the venerable and historic Marlin 39A (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marlin_Model_Golden_39A) (.22 LR) and related models.

Membership in this club is open to any one - owner or not - who has an interest in any model 39:
39A (http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/22Rifle/Golden39A.aspx), 39AS, mountie...), and their ancestors (http://www.wisnersinc.com/additionalinfo/marlin_LARF_rifles.htm) (1891, 1892, 1897...)

I purchased my 39A recently. So far, I've only had two sessions with it at the range.
It's going to be my small game hunting rifle (especially squirrels & rabbits). I already love this rifle!

I want to learn as much about it as possible through reading and interaction with others
who own one (and those who don't but are interested anyway).

The goals of this club are to explore every aspect about this rifle:
its history, sights, stocks, slings, ammo, shooting tips,
upgrades, modifications (e.g., barrel shortening), repair issues, images, etc.

I plan to post some short essays here about those topics with relevant links to pages on THR and other web sites. I hope others will do likewise. This is a place to share information about 39s, learn, and have fun.

I'm reasonably sure there will be a few images posted herein, as well. :rolleyes:

Here's a link to an image of my current gun "toolkit" (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=54091&d=1172651793), one of which is my 39A.
(Context is important, I think. I'm attempting to gather a functional,
even if minimal toolkit that will meet all my needs.
I plan to add either a 617 or a K-22 to that kit,
and perhaps a K-frame at some point.)

(Suggestion (not a requirement):
Please consider posting thumbnails only instead of embedding images into your post
in addition to thumbnails. That will significantly increase page loading times.
If you need any help understanding how to do that, just ask or send a PM. Thanks. :o )

OK, ready or not, here we go ... :cool:

Nem

If you enjoyed reading about "The Marlin 39 Club" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
JustsayMo
March 11, 2007, 09:22 PM
Sign me up!

Mo
http://myfavoritemarlin.blogspot.com/

Brian Williams
March 11, 2007, 09:26 PM
This is one of my favorite guns, I have a real nice 39M that has a Lyman 66 receiver sight on it, I need to get a nice small gold bead for the front or maybe a nice Lyman 17 globe front sight.
Here is my daughter shooting it.
http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=30825&d=1131141883


Yes I already have been told about "no eyes"

saltydog452
March 11, 2007, 09:26 PM
PM inbound.

sd.

Wish I'd known that Mr Williams. I swaped my Lyman 17 AHB for something that I could see. My sight preferences with the Marlin kinda travel along the same path as my visual acuity.

Now I'm tryiong to put it back to where it was in '66. Still have the Lyman 66 mc rear peep, but there is now a folding rear in the dovetail where a slot blank was a decade or so ago.

sd.

Sistema1927
March 11, 2007, 09:39 PM
Goody, another club to which I belong.

My 39A wears XS ghost ring sights, just like my 336. Especially fun is loading the tube up with a fist full of Aguila Colibris and bouncing aluminum cans hearing nothing more than the fall of the hammer and the ping of lead hitting the can.

NailGun
March 11, 2007, 10:09 PM
Great Gun! My only regret is that we only have one, and it belongs to my wife.
Come to think of it....she has a 1897 Texan too! Life ain't fair!!!

NailGun

skeeter1
March 11, 2007, 11:02 PM
Marlin 39D that I've had since 1970. The scope is a Weatherby 4x. Both have been long since discontinued. The 39D is basically the same as the 39M but with a pistol grip. My late uncle had a Marlin 1891, but I have no idea whatever became of it. I have a feeling that my cousin had no idea what it would be worth today. Oh well, stuff happens I guess.

Brassman
March 11, 2007, 11:04 PM
Hey Nem
When I look at your photo it's almost like looking at my collection. I have everything there except the 686. My picture would have a GP 100 in its place and there would be another 336 in .35 Rem. also. You have some great weapons and I'm sure they're all enjoyed. I would be pleased to be a member of this club. I probably shoot the 39A more than any of the others anyway. I can even shoot in my backyard with CB Longs, which are so quiet my neighbors think I'm playing with an air rifle.

Sistema1927
How difficult was it to install your Ghost Ring? I just removed a scope from my 39A because I didn't like the way it looked. I was pondering going to an XS Ghost Ring system instead. Did you order the 336 version and just install it on the 39A, or was it made specifically for the 39A?

CrackerJim
March 11, 2007, 11:21 PM
Well, N-870; another club to be in. I was going to do a range report on my new 336 when this thread caught my eye.

We took the 39a that I inherited from Grandad to plink with while the 336 cooled. Had alot of fun this afternoon shooting both.

Does anybody have a link to dating Marlin's? I'll check their website. From the trim details at the pistol grip and butt, it looks older. The Win 94 he head was built in the 40's. I don't remember him getting any new guns while I was growing up.....

Sure shoots nice. We were lobbing them in at the 100 yrd berm and having a ball.

Jim

AStone
March 12, 2007, 02:16 AM
Well I posted the introductory post, then walked downtown on a fine early spring evening.
{It's down right balmy here for so early in March; hot and humid.}
Stopped off for a burrito and a beer (OK, two :rolleyes: ),
and came back to find a good start on club activity.

Good to see there's interest. Glad you're all here.

Below are links to a few THR threads that I've either read, participated in, or put up recently
that helped me form an opinion of the 39A, and that may provide some fodder for discussion.

This thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=226124) was one of the first to get me interested in a 39A.

This one on the "general opinion about the 39A (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=184608&highlight=39A) has also helped me understand its value.

Here's an interesting thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=252738&highlight=39A) for me since I just sold my beautiful little CZ-452 Style to a friend (and fellow high roader) after buying a 39A. (The CZ was my first bolt action rifle ever. Turns out I just wasn't a bolt action guy.
My motto these days is, "Levers, pumps and wheels".)

On my second trip to the range, I had several FTFs (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=259973) with my 39A. I think it's resolved now after a thorough cleaning, but I won't know for sure until I get back to the range, hopefully this week sometime.

Even though I love the rifle's action, stock, history, etc, I'm not satisfied with its barrel length. It just feels too long and front heavy for me. So, I'm going to commit heresy :evil: and cut it down. Here's a thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=237498)that I started to explore that option, even before I bought the gun. This thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=872&highlight=39A) has some discussion relevant to that issue.

Here's a useful current thread about sights for the 39A (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=259908&highlight=39A). It's too early to see any trends in preferences,
but I'm going to follow that one with great interest. We'll publish their results in the club.

And finally - for now - here's an interesting thread that I participated in a while back about
"which variant of the 39A Marlin should make (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=235426&highlight=39A)".

OK, off to bed. More on another day.

Nem

aka108
March 12, 2007, 10:36 AM
Bought mine in 1955 for 60 bucks. Before the gold triggers appeared. Great rifle.

Fred Fuller
March 12, 2007, 12:34 PM
Nem,

Add me to the list here too. Bought mine used about 15 years ago, when a friend and I were regularly collecting frog legs around the irrigation ponds in our community. Couldn't gig 'em, couldn't get close enough. .22 pistols didn't have the oomph to anchor a big ol' bullfrog with a less than perfect hit, so short handy .22 rifles were settled upon as the necessary tool for the job. He got one of the little Taurus copies of the old Winchester gallery pump design, and I happened across the 39 Carbine at my favorite FFL's used rack.

Yummm- frog legs...

lpl/nc

Bazooka Joe71
March 12, 2007, 01:45 PM
Ahhh, my first rifle...Pappa bought it for me when I was 8 or 9

I'm gonna try and dig up a picture of little me shooting it.:D

That sucker is still accurate as H***

Vaarok
March 12, 2007, 02:04 PM
I always wanted one, but thought it was ridiculous they went for $300 or more.

Finally found one for $200, and pounced.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v709/Vaarok/marlin39.jpg

Well worth it, ate two bricks in the first three days.

Sistema1927
March 12, 2007, 02:16 PM
Sistema1927
How difficult was it to install your Ghost Ring? I just removed a scope from my 39A because I didn't like the way it looked. I was pondering going to an XS Ghost Ring system instead. Did you order the 336 version and just install it on the 39A, or was it made specifically for the 39A?

Easy, very easy to install. You just need the proper sized screwdriver. They have these sights specifically for the 39, see here (http://www.xssights.com/store/rifle.html).

I can't remember whether it was the 336 or the 39, but one of my sets had too short of a front sight. A call to XS took care of it, they sent me a new front sight for free.

JustsayMo
March 12, 2007, 02:36 PM
Check out the Skinner Sights for the 39 (and 336,1896, 1894...). $45 shipped.

http://www.skinnersights.com/

I've tired the Williams. It was OK but I think the Skinner Sights look better than the others I've seen. Initial reports I've read are favorable and the guy who makes them is responsive and knows his product.

saltydog452
March 12, 2007, 05:15 PM
The sights on my Marlin kinda reflects the changes in my eyesight.

The original sights were good.

After I started using a sling and started to play, just for fun small bore competition games, I changed the sights and started using a sling. Lyman 66mc rear and 17 ahb front. Tried lots of apperatures...had lots of fun with the Marlin with targets at known dstance range or knocking pine cones around. Dry fire practice was with firing pin removed and a leather 'tab' placed behind the bolt. Even had a 'trigger job' done.

Fast forward a decade or two..

Then a 'blank' was placed in the housing of the 66mc, the 'blank' that was in the dovetail that once held the original rear sight has been removed and replaced with a fold down rear.

Screw on ramp that held the original front sight removed and a dovetail cut for a front sight that was a easier to see.

Fast forward another ten years..

I would have been better served by leaving the original sights as they were, and using a 'scope for range use with the sling and the original sights for woods plinking.

Just a suggestion, but the original sights are/were just dandy. No substitute for that shiny brass bead on the front..if the brass bead is in a shadow, slide the front sight housing off.

For precision shooting with a sling and prone position, use an inexpensive 'scope and QD sling swivels/mounts...For plinking fun, leave the OEM sights as they are.

I haven't eaten tree rodents in lots of years, but either option will put 'em in the skillet. Use lots of onions.

salty.

dfariswheel
March 12, 2007, 07:38 PM
Here's a link to a site that will date your Marlin's.

http://armscollectors.com/sn/marlinlookup.php

I'm in the process of restoring a 1950 Marlin 39-A.
I've already posted instructions on how to give the wood a durable oil finish that looks like the finish done on old British and American double guns:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=240961&highlight=oil+finish

JohnBT
March 12, 2007, 08:25 PM
Another member checking in. I got my Mountie in '63 and finally gave up on the sights and put a little Weaver rimfire scope on it a couple of years ago.

I'm still thinking about replacing the leather sling, but it's one of those things I never get around to.

Anybody got an original front sight hood to spare? :)

John

CrackerJim
March 12, 2007, 09:10 PM
dfariswheel,

Thanks for the link!

Jim

AStone
March 13, 2007, 04:27 AM
I'm in the process of restoring a 1950 Marlin 39-A.
I've already posted instructions on how to give the wood a durable oil finish
that looks like the finish done on old British and American double guns...Dfaris, this is good.

However, I don't see an image in that thread.

Can you post an image here, por favor?

Nem

AStone
March 13, 2007, 04:35 AM
No substitute for that shiny brass bead on the front...Salty, I can understand and resonate with your story. But somewhere along the way, my eyes quit working as well, and that brass bead was replaced by a white dot on a skinny post under a hood that causes shadows. It just didn't work well for me, so I put a scope on it. :)

Mo, do those Skinners come with a new front post?

AStone
March 13, 2007, 04:47 AM
The following have posted to this club since its inception,
and are hereby nominated as charter members.

Each user name is followed by the version of the name
that I would likely use to address them to save keystrokes.
(Feel free to specify your preference.)

Membership in The 39A Club does not require owning a 39,
only an interest in the concept and some participation.
(E.g., those not posting for several months
may be dropped from the official roster,
though not unsubscribed.)

Non-39'ers are welcome,
with the understanding that ...

... the topic here is 39.

;)
________

Aka108 (Aka)
Bazooka Joe71 (Joe)
borrowedtime69 (Time)
Brassman (Brass)
Brian Williams (Brian)
Buckinbroncobaby (Buck)
CrackerJim (CJ)
Dfariswheel (Dfaris)
Fast Frank (Frank)
F4t9r (F4)
JohnBT (John)
JustsayMo (Mo)
Laloremus (Lalo)
Lee Lapin (Lee)
NailGun (Nail)
Nematocyst-870 (Nem)
Saltydog452 (Salty)
Sistema1927 (S'tema)
Skeeter1 (Skeet)
Shrinkmd (Shrink)
SwampWolf (S'Wolf)
Vaarok (Vaarok)

Dr.Rob
March 13, 2007, 06:47 PM
This is the rifle I learned to shoot with, a Marlin Golden 39A Mountie with a hand rubbed finish my dad bought while in Alaska. He recalls it was 'almost a month's pay' which according to the reciept in 64 or so (maybe it was 65) was 60-some dollars.

I have no idea how many zillion of rounds have been fired through this rifle but it still shoots better than I do most days. Mountains of tin cans and a truck bed full of small game fell to this rifle before may dad somehow managed to swipe a Leupold 4X Gold Ring from me (he says it was a loan) and mount it for a rim-fire only prarie dog hunt. As I recall, he zapped a good dozen or more that day, making a number of shots past 100 yards.

This rifle was promised to my brother years ago, but we hope dad keeps enjoying it for many more years to come.

And that's the main reason I recommend Marlin rifles to this day.

Shrinkmd
March 14, 2007, 12:14 AM
Count me in! I haven't been to the range with it yet, but I can't wait. I'm sick and tired of my jammomatic 10/22, and at present, life is too busy to figure out what is wrong with it. So I'm hoping the lever action answers my prayers.

I am considering scoping it vs putting on a reciever or tang peep sight. I was thinking a peep would be fun, sight it in at 100 yds and have fun while the Mosin cools...

AStone
March 14, 2007, 01:17 AM
Shrink, welcome in. I just added your name to the roster above.

Ah, does my heart good to hear stories of 39's being favored over semi-autos.

Ahhhhhhh..... ;)

Now, for page 2 ...

Fast Frank
March 14, 2007, 02:50 AM
I wanna be a model 39 club member anyway!

When I was a kid of about six or so, my dad let me shoot his model 39. It was the first real gun I ever fired. I remember that day like it was yesterday.

It was a GREAT rifle, and we spent some really great afternoons breaking bottles in a creek with it. (I know... but back then it was OK to do that)

When he died in 1983, I inherited that rifle. It was my most prized possession.

In about 1985 or so, my house was burglarized and I lost everything of any value at all... including eight guns... and one of them was that model 39.

Yes, I'm still mad enough to shoot somebody over that, but I don't know who.

Cut to 2005. Twenty years later...

My grand kids range from seven down to months old, and I realized that I needed to do something to repay what was given to me so many years ago.

I started the search. I found several, but they just didn't "Speak" to me.

After a while, I ran into a brand new one at a dealer here in town.

It's a little nicer than the one my dad had, and I bought it.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a184/FastFrank4x4/oddball/marlin22012.jpg

That scope has been moved to another rifle, and I'm debating peep sights for it.

The grand kids are shooting a Red Ryder BB gun in the yard, and doing pretty OK with that.

I hope to find a place where we can shoot down into a creek somewhere, but it's looking like I'm going to have to buy some land for that.

I really hope I can give those kids what my dad gave me. If The opportunity actually comes up, I know that this model 39 will do it's part!

AStone
March 14, 2007, 02:59 AM
Welcome in, Frank. I added your name to the roster.

Yeah, I remember shooting bottles in the creek, too.
Like you, I wouldn't do it now, but it felt right then.

Glad you found another 39, and joined us.

SwampWolf
March 15, 2007, 06:28 PM
As a long time 39 aficianado, I hope my application for membership will be approved. A strictly personal opinion here but I don't like scopes on almost any lever-actioned rifles (Savage 99, Winchester 88, Sako Finnwolf and, perhaps, Browning BLR excepted) as I believe the handling/appearance of the rifle is negatively impacted by topping the receiver with glass (though I'm quick to concede that my aging eyes do benefit from the use of a scope). I am a hardcore advocate of receiver sights, however, and I've always preferred the Williams "Fool-Proof" and "5D" peeps.

Nematocyst (39?), you might want to consider selling your 39 rifle and look for a used 39 carbine (there are plenty of them out there) before you lop off those offending two inches of barrel- might be cheaper in the long run and you won't end up "desecrating "an original variant. I happen to much prefer the balance afforded by the longer rifle barrel but each to their own- size can matter in either direction!

AStone
March 15, 2007, 07:46 PM
S'Wolf, welcome in!

(I got your name added to the roster on the last page before the edit window closed.)

Glad you're here, too. You raised some interesting points. I look forward to more discussions about sights and barrel cuts soon, but I gotta go to work for about 5 hours first. :(

Nem39 :D

borrowedtime69
March 16, 2007, 12:27 AM
Heres a pic of my cowboy wanna-be collection, my long gun is my 1982 pre-safety 39A

http://www.hunt101.com/img/427069.JPG

it fits just right, lets me channel my inner John Wayne. even though it sometimes gets a feeding "hiccup" it's a great rifle i intend to pass down to my kids. -Eric

AStone
March 16, 2007, 03:36 AM
Time, welcome in.
You're on the roster.
Nice cowboy collection.

Wolf, back to your points.

A strictly personal opinion here but I don't like scopes on almost any lever-actioned rifles ... as I believe the handling/appearance of the rifle is negatively impacted by topping the receiver with glass (though I'm quick to concede that my aging eyes do benefit from the use of a scope).Your latter point is most relevant for me in terms of the 39A. In terms of the handling/appearance part of the equation, I agree. But in terms of bringing squirrels down for the pot, I'll take a scope.

I grew up squirrel hunting with a Remington Nylon 66 with a scope. That rifle definitely was better handling without a scope, but with the scope, I brought home a LOT more squirrels for the frying pan.

I predict likewise for the 39A. Truth be told, I'm more interested in fried squirrel
(with extra garlic and onion) than appearance. ;)

I am a hardcore advocate of receiver sights, however,
and I've always preferred the Williams "Fool-Proof" and "5D" peeps.Not ruling out those FPs yet.

Nematocyst (39?), you might want to consider selling your 39 rifle and look for a used 39 carbine (there are plenty of them out there) before you lop off those offending two inches of barrel- might be cheaper in the long run and you won't end up "desecrating "an original variant. I happen to much prefer the balance afforded by the longer rifle barrel but each to their own- size can matter in either direction!I hear you.

I respect those who are offended by lopping off barrels.
If it bothers you, then I think you have the right not to do it to your gun.

But for me, a heretic:

1) Ain't no way in hell I'll sell this rifle. :neener: I like it too much, and waited too long to get it.
I did look a bit for a used carbine, but didn't find one.
And I'm just too busy with other projects to spend time looking more.
This one's just fine. ;)

2) More importantly, I see a gun as a tool in the same way that I might see a car or truck as a tool. The manufacturer makes the car, a fine tool, yet I might buy it and modify it greatly with different carbs, wheels, paint jobs. Hell, I might even chop it.

Same with my rifle. It's a fine rifle. But for my taste, it's just feeling a bit front heavy. Well, actually, it's feeling a bit heavy for a .22, period. (Remember, I grew up with that light weight Nylon 66.) And the heavy is especially prominent on the front end. The "balance" is just not feeling right to me. So, I'm thinking, best way to shed some weight is by lopping off about 4 - 6" on the front end.

After all, with .22, barrel wise, anything past 18" or so is not helping.
(Of course, they didn't know that when the rifle was designed.
Not faulting the original designers. But new information dictates new strategies.)

I've spoken with the local gun smith about this.
At first, he had the same negative reaction that you did.
But after some discussion, he admitted that it could be a good thing.
He even started talking about the better crown it would wear after he was finished.

I'm still sitting on the decision.

But, I'll bet I'm gonna do it.

And look at it this way: when I chop it, it'll be one of a kind.

:cool:

Nem

SwampWolf
March 16, 2007, 04:13 AM
Hey Nemo, I was in no way trying to disparage the proposed amputation of your Marlin. To each his own! But, I confess, ever since I received a Model 67 Winchester .22 from my dad back in 1957 for Christmas, guns have always meant a little more to me than mere tools. However, even though a degree of aesthetics count for me, I am not an advocate of "form before function". If it works for you-and you're certain you're not going to sell it later on-you sure don't need my blessing to break out the hacksaw.

Same for the scope vs open sights on a rifle. If I'm really hungry for a bushytail to eat, I'll opt for a scoped rifle (my little Steyr Zepher mannlicher .22 comes to mind). If I'm really, really hungry, a shotgun comes off the rack. But if I'm starving for some meat for the pot, it's off to Krogers I go!

All the best to you.

AStone
March 16, 2007, 04:22 AM
Hey, S'Wolf,
your comments didn't feel at all disparaging. ;)

I felt no disrespect.
We're just expressing
a small difference of opinion.
It's all good.

One minor point of semantics:
for guns, I can never use the term "mere tools".
They are more important for me than hammers and pliers
(which are "mere tools").

As for selling this rifle, it just won't happen.
I feel really attached to it, now.
I may give it to an appreciative friend at some point,
but I'm not concerned about selling it.

It's become a project now, along with my 336, it's big brother.

As for the shotgun for squirrels, yeah, been there, too.

But there's just something about .22 for squirrel meat.
Don't have to pick out all that #7 shot while you chew. :D

Glad you're here, S'Wolf.
We're going to have fun in this thread,
and learn a lot, eh?

Best,

Nem

JustsayMo
March 16, 2007, 09:25 AM
I've been following Nem's venture with great interest. Marlin Leveractions are my favorite firearms and the 39 is probably is the last one they'll pry out of my fingers in the end... I'm intrigued by his 39 PG carbine project and I am looking forward to the performance reports.

While I think the 39A is excellent as is I would like to see Marlin offer a carbine length with the pistol grip. I currently have two 39A Mounties that are as perfect as I can imagine but the PG carbine would be quite the looker IMHO.

I will respectfully disagree with Nem's "After all, with .22, barrel wise, anything past 18" or so is not helping." statement. In my testing of my Model 39 variations TDS (16"), Mountie (20") and 39A (24") the 24" barrel produced the highest velocity with most of the ammo I tested. The only exception was the Aguilla and Remington Subsonic. I also believe it is generally true that most shooters will shoot the longer barrel better given the longer sight radius and balance (off hand with iron sights) it affords. Another benefit of the longer barrel is the reduction is report. CB longs are VERY quiet in the 24" barrel with most of the noise produced by the bullet striking the backstop. The Subsonic's report is mild enough that I have on occassion forgotten that I wasn't wearing ear protection.

That being said I prefer the 20" barrel length. It carries well in the field and I'm capable of potting game with it at rimfire ranges. It is long enough to get 95+% of the performance hi-velocity ammo and reduce the report of subsonic ammo enough if noise is a consideration. In shorter barrels it is still loud.

laloremus
March 16, 2007, 01:13 PM
I own a 39-A rifle that an uncle buy in México in 1971 for $1,500.00 pesos, that was a good amount in that time. After that about two months, all the gunshops stop selling guns, all were collected by the army, since then only the army controlls the new guns market. I buy the rifle from my aunt, when my uncle died for about $400 dollars, its still 95% condition and I had fired about 20,000 rounds in it.
Try shooting going away standar clays, it's really fun and with a litle practice you can hit them easilly. Also you can try crossing rabbit clays. Just be carefull about where the bullets will stop.
Great rifle, great fun and time with it. Very acurate and reliable with all kind of ammo.

AStone
March 16, 2007, 05:45 PM
Laloremus (Lalo), welcome in. Wow, that's some challenge with the clays! I'm impressed. You must share some genes with Annie Oakley. :)

J'Mo, thanks for reminding me of your data on .22 in different barrel lengths. I do remember it now from this thread where we discussing velocity as a function of barrel length (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=872&highlight=39A). Mal had some corroborative input as well.

Ooh, ooh, Mr. Cotter! I just had an idea! If Nematocyst-870 does go ahead with his barrel cutting project, he can chrono the 39A before and after using the same batch of a standard velocity ammo. If there is any truth to the shorter=faster conjecture, he will be able to tell. If the bullet velocity goes down (as I fully expect it to), then we can call it a myth. That is unless someone here thinks a miracle is going to happen and the bullet would speed up to a velocity greater than in the first test if an additional 2 to 4 inches was cut off the barrel over the 4 to 6 he plans to cut off.Hmm, I need to go back and reread that thread again.

In the end, I think it's going to be a trade off between balance and feel v. velocity. I'm not really worried too much about losing a couple of dozen fps. I'm most interested in finding the balance for the gun that feels best for me in terms of carrying and fast pointing. This longer one just feels draggy to me. Mal recommended (in that other thread) that I just try carrying the gun in the woods some to see what the balance felt like, before going to extremes. Point taken.

Just for grins on a beautiful spring day (here at least), here's a photoshoped image of a 39A with an 18" barrel.

I'm leaning more towards 20" now - if I do it at all - but still...

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=51628&d=1169271362

dfariswheel
March 16, 2007, 07:32 PM
"I would like to see Marlin offer a carbine length with the pistol grip. I currently have two 39A Mounties that are as perfect as I can imagine but the PG carbine would be quite the looker IMHO."

Marlin DID. They mated the pistol grip stock and lever with a carbine front end.
It was called the marlin 39-D.

I do like the longer barrel of the 39-A, but I'm with Nematocyst-870 on this one.
I much prefer the rifle-type setup on the front end, but they only offered the carbine setup with the barrel band.

I gave serious thought to cutting a rifle down to a carbine length, but the 1950 39-A rifle I bought has a slightly lighter barrel that works for me.
Given that the newer Marlin's are not collectible, I wouldn't hesitate to cut one down to whatever felt right to me.

On a down note, the Marlin 1950 model I'm restoring was sent out for bluing the first of January with a projected 30 to 45 days processing time.
I called two weeks ago and was told they'd gotten behind and it'd be another 2 weeks.
I called yesterday and was told a man was out and they were swamped.
They said it would be another week.:(

The wood has been refinished with the super oil finish I posted about in gunsmithing a month ago, and all the other metal work and parts replacement has been done.

Once the rest of it comes back, I'll post some photos.

Shrinkmd
March 16, 2007, 09:23 PM
Mine has a dinged up stock, not nearly as horrible as the K31 I rescued. I am thinking about redoing my 39A. So...what is the correct finish? It is from the 70's, slightly different look than the new ones, with the little white line around the pistol grip cap and the butt plate area. I assume the wood is walnut, so should I just oil it, or is a stain required? I've read that for open figured woods a dye/pigment stain combo can be better than a straight wood dye, which can come out blotchy, may not highlight grain as well (although doesn't obscure grain...) Any favorite dyes or stain recommendations?

Anyone else read Great Wood Finishes by Jeff Jewitt? I utilized some of his techniques last time, and next time I will follow his advice to the letter. LOTS of work to refinish to perfection, as opposed to just slopping minwax stain on and then spraying polyurethane on it. If I could bill myself by the hour for stock refinishing...

JustsayMo
March 16, 2007, 09:40 PM
Every time Nem posts that picture it makes me want to do it too. That is a sharp looking carbine! D'far is right, it's better to do it to a new one.

I'm willing to throw a few bucks his way to help cover the costs of ammo before and after testing and the shortening of the barrel as long as he shares the results with us. "I gots to know." If a few more of us kicked in maybe Nem would agree to the experiement... in the name of science of course. :p

We'd need pictures too. Lab coats are optional.

f4t9r
March 16, 2007, 09:59 PM
One of my favorite
Had one for many years

buckinbroncobaby
March 16, 2007, 11:35 PM
Hi everyone it is nice to find a place where all the info is in one place. A quick question on dating these guns I am looking for a serial number and the one I found ahs a T and then numbers so when dating it which would I use. When using the site listed previously a "T" gives me a 1960 date and putting in the numbers gives me a completly different date. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

borrowedtime69
March 17, 2007, 12:52 AM
my fantacy 39 A would be the following:

straight pistol grip
16 1/2" BBL
large loop lever
buckhorn rear sight and a traditional old front sight with no hood.
saddle ring
narrow forearm

what do ya think? would marlin go for it? :D

-Eric

dfariswheel
March 17, 2007, 01:17 AM
buckinbroncobaby:
You go with the letter code.

Shrinkmd:
The 70's finish was some type of "varnish". Whether polyurethane or other I don't know.

One thing I don't like about the later rifles is that the walnut got lighter and lighter in color.
Personally, I'd use a good walnut stain, and my choice of oil or polyurethane.

For the look the pre-WWII American rifles had, you might try something like Pilkington's Pre-64 Red:
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/productdetail.aspx?p=9816&s=25383

This gives the walnut that Red-Brown color as used on older American guns that looks so classy.

For a great, waterproof oil finish that you only have to do once, check out my directions for Minwax Oil Finish:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=240961&highlight=minwax

AStone
March 17, 2007, 02:58 AM
f4t9r and Buck, welcome in.
You're both on the roster.

And Buck, welcome to THR! Greatest gun forum on the web.
How cool that we have a new member whose post here is their first. :cool:

16 1/2" BBL
large loop leverTime, I can definitely relate to that large lever loop.

I'm curious: why the 16.5" barrel?
Not being critical at all, just curious.
Why 16.5" v. 18"?

borrowedtime69
March 17, 2007, 04:13 PM
Nematocyst-870:Time, I can definitely relate to that large lever loop.

I'm curious: why the 16.5" barrel?
Not being critical at all, just curious.
Why 16.5" v. 18"?

dont rightly know, i like smaller carbines, they are lighter and easier to pack or carry. plus, i think it'ld be funner than #@&* to be able to cock it like the rifleman! LOL. i guess 18" BBL would be ok too. i also am a big fan of (just cant afford them) those new Puma mares leg lever guns in the centerfire calibers. they are similar to what Steve Mcqueen carried in "Wanted, Dead or Alive". wish to heck someone could make a Mares leg in .22 Lr affordably.

as you can probably tell, i grew up on westerns both TV and movies so i get some of my taste in guns from those memories.

another thing i would love to have (again $$$) would be one of those old style rifle scopes that they used to put on the old lever actions. the ones that take almost all the length of the rifle but are only 1/2-3/4 of an inch diameter. i want to hunt with the 39A i have , but my eyes arent doing well. but it seems sacreligous to put a modern scope on an old looking lever gun. im not knocking those who do, someday i may need to.

thanks! i'll be looking for more posts! -Eric

Brassman
March 17, 2007, 11:27 PM
I ordered some Skinner aperture sights for my 39A today. I will be anxiously waiting for them to come in sometime next week. I'll post the results of installing them as soon as possible. Temporarily, I put my Simmons 3X9 scope back on since my 50 year old eyes don't see as well as they used to. This is probably not too good, but I was getting 1/2" groups at 25 yards at the range today. That's about as accurate as I can be off-hand. I still don't like the way the scope looks on a lever action. Hopefully the aperture sights will allow at least the same acccuracy, but more speed in attaining a sight picture. We'll see. At least the price was good.

TCB in TN
March 17, 2007, 11:58 PM
a Marlin Golden 39A Mountie

Learned to shoot and grew up shooting with the same little gun. Best shooting gun I ever had my hands on. Love that little gun. It is my mom's gun, she could shoot it even better than I could. Re-finished the stock a couple years ago, it had a bunch of wear and needed some TLC. I still "borrow" it to shoot a little now and then. I have my 10/22, my pump remington, and my lever action winchester, browning, several other more expensive ones and others as well, but when its all said and done that little 39 is the "ONLY" 22 I have in my heart.:D

Henry455
March 18, 2007, 08:15 PM
Here is my 1958/59 "S" prefix Golden 39A Mountie. I inherited this gun from my Dad who was an avid firearms collector. Do not know the history of the engraving, wish I did. With my 60 year old eyes, the 2.5X M8 Leupy is a necessity:

39A Golden Mountie (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Henry455/Marlin%2039A/M39Mountie006A.jpg)

39A Golden Mountie II (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/Henry455/Marlin%2039A/M39Mountie014A.jpg)

AStone
March 18, 2007, 08:30 PM
Wow!

That's beautiful!

grizz
March 20, 2007, 12:12 AM
I'm very interested in a 39. After a year of buying several EBRs and hi-cap handguns, I think my lusting is now turning back towards the fine grained stocks and blued barrels of traditional hunting rifles and shotguns.

Besides a CZ Ringneck SxS 20ga, I'm considering a CZ bolt .22, or now the 39. I was thinking about the Henry Golden Boy, but I was just reading about how the Marlin is built like a tank, and is well regarded for its accuracy. I also love lever guns, expecially Marlins.

I don't want to hijack this thread with my decision making process so I'll stop here. I realize this is a club thread, and I'm sorry to say I don't own a 39 yet.

From the 10 minutes of reading I've just conducted, however, they seem like great rifles. The 39 just might beat out the CZ as my next purchase.

--Grizz

AStone
March 20, 2007, 02:45 AM
I think my lusting is now turning back towards the fine grained stocks and blued barrels of traditional hunting rifles and shotguns...I don't want to hijack this thread with my decision making process so I'll stop here. I realize this is a club thread, and I'm sorry to say I don't own a 39 yet.Grizz,

You've come to the right place.

Trust me, you're not hijacking at all. As long as the topic involves 39s in some way, it's on topic.
This thread ("club") is for anyone interested in (even exploring) a 39. Ownership is NOT a requirement.

If you'd like opinions about how bolt .22s compare with levers, just ask. You'll find them here.

The "club" concept is not about being exclusive. It's NOT about ownership. It's just a place in cyberspace where owners can come and discuss their guns, and those interested in the gun (whether they own one or not) can find information (or links to it) that they want/need in one place without having to search many different threads. "Club" threads are intended to be a clearinghouse for information with links to other threads (on THR or not). They are not meant to replace other threads. Far from it. They are meant to connect them, to help pull the pieces together into a coherent whole, kind of like an encyclopedia does.

In the end, the gun that is the focus of a "club" (just a metaphorical name for a thread) may be right for some, and not for others. That's cool. :cool: If people can find what they want/need to make a decision - pro or con - by visiting the thread, then it's successful. (If not, then just ask!)

It's very interesting that your decision involves a CZ. My path to the 39A involved a CZ 452. The latter is a fine gun. Truly a tack driver. But I realized I'm just not a bolt gun guy, so I sold the 452 to a friend who is more bolt oriented than me. (Actually, I bought my 39A even before I sold the 452.)

I never owned an EBR though I still own an EBS: evil black shotgun = 870P (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=49308&d=1166091441),
which is still my main HD gun (and will remain so; see user name).

But as one who has owned pumps (first: an 870 Wingmaster in 16 ga; now the 870P); then levers (first a 336C .35 Rem in my youth; now a 336A in .30-30); then revolvers (first was a Taurus .38 snubbie; now 642, 686 and soon another J or K frame), I came to understand that my love was for ...

... levers, pumps & wheels.

Welcome to the "club".

Nem

Piney Woods
March 20, 2007, 04:03 PM
Count me in, please.

I have a 1954 vintage 39A that I picked up in 2004. Put a Williams Foolproof FireSight on it and it's a real tack driver, even with my old eyes. I use it mostly at our 22 Plate Shoots, but I may put a tang sight on it for Cowboy Action Shooting side matches.

It fits right in with my other Marlins: an 1894 Cowboy Limited in 45 Colt and an 1895G 45-70 Guide Gun.

yodar
March 20, 2007, 06:59 PM
HOWEVER, HOW BADLY WAS MY 39a'S VALUE (CIRCA THE LATER 50'S) LOWERED by my discovering a bulged barrel and it's subsequent replacement recently by Marlin with a Golden 39A replacement barrel clearly not matched to the receiver's
era

Barrel replacement cost me more than dad paid for the Rifle

yodar

AStone
March 23, 2007, 03:32 AM
Piney and Yodar, welcome.

I've been away for a few days dealing with my last week of classes
and an equipment failure in the studio. Will get back to business here soon.

Piney, very interested to hear more about those William's FP sights.
How do you compare them with a scope? I've got a Leupold 2-7X rimfire on my 39A, and like it a lot. But if the FP's are as good ... :scrutiny:

Yodar, "bulged barrel"? Can we hear more about that? Never heard of it before. What would cause a bulged barrel? (Tell me so I can avoid it...:uhoh: )

Nem

Piney Woods
March 23, 2007, 07:05 AM
Piney, very interested to hear more about those William's FP sights. How do you compare them with a scope? I've got a Leupold 2-7X rimfire on my 39A, and like it a lot. But if the FP's are as good ...
I don't know how I'd compare them to a scope, other than the fact that - IMHO - a scope looks out of place on a lever action rifle. I have two 10/22s - one with a 3X-9X scope and one with Williams FireSights - and I can shoot equally well with both unless the targets are really small or get out too far, then the scope is definitely an advantage. One thing's for sure; they are waaaaaay better than traditional post and notch iron sights. As my CAS teacher kept telling me, "Front Sight, Front Sight, Front Sight!" The fiberoptic front sight is really easy to pick up.

koja48
March 23, 2007, 09:59 AM
Count me in!

AStone
March 23, 2007, 05:52 PM
Welcome, Koja. Tell us stories, please. Got one? Want one? Got one, want another? :D

Piney, that's a really compelling perspective on the FP's. Yeah, I gotta try a set. I'm a .22 scope guy from waaaaaaayyyyy back (Weaver or Swift 3x9 on a Nylon 66 often got my mom and dad 'n me dinner in my teens...), but I gotta agree: on this rifle, somepins' not qwight right 'bout a scope. :rolleyes: I'll just have'ta see how it pans out.

I've put XS ghost rings on my 336 (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=258000), and can tell that once I get to the range (soon, I promise myself, soon; just finishing up a term, got some time next week...), they're going to make a HUGE difference over the stock sights. I may put a scout scope on it eventually, but haven't decided yet.

I'm sort of in the same place with the 39: exploring options. I know I don't want GR's on it, and I don't like the open buck horns. Besides that, the sky is the limit.

This is largely why I'm looking forward to scope and sight summaries soon (gee; pardon my alliteration :D ): so's I can put all this information about options in one place, sit back and think about it ....

OK, back to work. "Vacation" doesn't start 'til tomorrow...:rolleyes:

Nem

skeeter1
March 23, 2007, 06:54 PM
I wouldn't do something like this any longer, but it was fun at the time.

Yeah, I remember shooting bottles in the creek, too.
Like you, I wouldn't do it now, but it felt right then.


This was probably 30 years ago at the Grand River hunting area (~7000 acres) in Ohio. I was squirrel hunting that day, but there were no critters to be found. So... there were some "slob" hunters upstream from me that were throwing their beer cans in the river, and there are few things better than sinking them with a 39 and a few boxes of .22LRs.

It was still a fun day, even if I didn't bag a squirrel. I think the inebriated hunters (I could hear them from about a quarter-mile away) scared them all off. :)

CajunBass
March 23, 2007, 07:20 PM
Will this one get me in? I think I got it in 1982. It's wearing a cheap Bushnell "Banner" scope, but will shoot 10 shot groups the size of my little fingernail at 25 yards.

I got a case of the dumbs last year, and thought about trading it. I'm glad I thought it was worth more than they did. Never again.

Pay no attention to that Ruger Box. I had just bought a 10/22 and the box was just there.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b292/CajunBass/Cajunshoots054.jpg

Rollis R. Karvellis
March 23, 2007, 08:06 PM
Bought mine about three years ago, and put the willims peep sight on. No failer to fire but a few failer to extrat, I, will findout sunday if this continus with remington.

koja48
March 23, 2007, 09:15 PM
Had mine since I was a kid . . . it's gathered lots of "character" over the years & spent countless hours with me on a combine in NE Montana wheat fields. Factory sights, extremely reliable, and when I was a lad, was the bane of jackrabbits.

Bentonville
March 23, 2007, 09:53 PM
I got a Marlin 39A last fall. It was manufactured in 1946 and the wood looks like it was made ten years ago. Beautiful gun. Just normal wear on the muzzle and one side of the hammer and the inner surface of the lever. I have a Problem...HELP if you can. I lost the rear sight elevator and I can not find one to match it. Marlin doesn't have them. The style of the rear sight changed in the early fifties. Numrich had one but the smallest end is a little too high and makes the gun shoot high. Brownell's had a kit and the same problem exists with that elevator. Does anyone have an original rear sight elevator that you're not needing? Thanks and keep those Marlins pumping out lead. My son is more accurate with my rifle than I am.

Brassman
March 23, 2007, 11:42 PM
I'm not familiar with the difference in your sight elevator and my new one, but is it possible to file the one you have down a little?

Brassman
March 23, 2007, 11:52 PM
I just received my Tim Skinner sights today. It took about 3-4 minutes to install them. My 39A and I are headed to the range in the morning to see how these things perform. That ring sure looks better than the scope that I removed. I just hope my eyes are still good enough to group shots like I could with the scope on. I don't think I could ever hold mine still enough to group small fingernail-size groups like Cajunbass, but I might could do dime-size groups. That's good enough for minute of squirrel head.

dfariswheel
March 24, 2007, 12:16 AM
Bentonville

Here's some possible sources for the earlier elevator:

Jack First
1201 Turbine Drive, Rapid City, SD 57701.
(605) 343-9544
Check here first, but be sure to explain exactly what you need.

http://www.poppertsgunparts.com/index.htm

http://www.wisnersinc.com/rifles/marlin/rflever.htm

Marlin 39 parts often turn up on eBay, and you could ask on the Marlin Collectors forum:
http://www.marlin-collectors.com/

tubeshooter
March 24, 2007, 12:56 AM
Obligatory club member post....

I saw this thread about 2 weeks ago, but haven't had time to say anything until now. I have a newer one (manufactured in 2006), got it back in October. So far it has lived up to my high expectations. Well worth the long wait.

Can't compare it to other .22 levers (never owned/shot any), but I think it was money well spent. Added a Williams 5D and a sling - that's about all I plan on doing as far as upgrades.


Makes a nice "little brother" to my 336. I've only got about 2 bricks or so through it, but I plan on shooting it a bunch and getting real good with it when the weather warms up some more.

skeeter1
March 24, 2007, 02:04 AM
I'm not familiar with the difference in your sight elevator and my new one, but is it possible to file the one you have down a little?

If you have one, and a vice, and some blueing touch-up, that sounds like a great smithy practice job. Won't cost you much, and it doesn't sound like you have much to lose. Sounds like a fun Saturday afternoon project! :)

AStone
March 24, 2007, 02:19 AM
Welcome to new members. :)

Remember, readers: you don't have to be a 39 owner to be in the club,
just express an interest or have questions or opinions. ;)

Please let me know if I left anyone off the list.
________

Aka108 (Aka)
Bazooka Joe71 (Joe)
Bentonville (Ben)
Borrowedtime69 (Time)
Brassman (Brass)
Brian Williams (Brian)
Buckinbroncobaby (Buck)
CajunBass (Cajun)
CrackerJim (CJ)
Dfariswheel (Dfaris)
Dr.Rob (Rob)
Fast Frank (Frank)
F4t9r (F4)
Grizz (Grizz)
Henry455 (Henry)
Jkingrph (J'King)
JohnBT (John)
JustsayMo (Mo)
Koja48 (Koja)
Laloremus (Lalo)
Lee Lapin (Lee)
Moondancer (Moon)
NailGun (Nail)
Nematocyst-870 (Nem)
Piney Woods (Piney)
Rollis R. Karvellis (Rollis)
Saltydog452 (Salty)
Sistema1927 (S'tema)
Skeeter1 (Skeet)
Shane333 (Shane)
Shrinkmd (Shrink)
SwampWolf (Wolf)
TCB in TN (TCB)
Tubeshooter (Tube)
Vaarok (Vaarok)
Yodar (Yodar)

Bentonville
March 24, 2007, 09:51 AM
Thank you for the suggestions. I am calling the suggested companies now. I will try filing if I can't find the original article. I know it won't affect function but I would like to have the original parts. I have to say that without the elevator the gun is scary accurate at up to 25 yards with bead dead on target.

AStone
March 24, 2007, 03:27 PM
Ben, if you can't find originals, it could be worthwhile in this case (to preserve the aesthetics of an older rifle) to consult a metal fabricator or a machine shop. If you at least had an image of the original part, they could probably make one for you for not too many bucks.

skeeter1
March 24, 2007, 04:44 PM
I was afraid my Marlin 39D would get lonely in the safe, so I got him a big brother to keep him company -- Marlin 1894C in .357 Magnum.

As you can see, I'm a Marlin levergun fan. All things considered, though, the 39 is my favorite. I can shoot all day for a few bucks (.357 ammo has gotten rather pricey), and it kills tin cans just as well. ;)

AStone
March 24, 2007, 04:54 PM
Skeet, what's that scope on the 39, please?

skeeter1
March 24, 2007, 11:10 PM
Nemato--

The scope on the 39 is a Weatherby 4X-50, intended for a Weatherby Mark XXII.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=68377932

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=68405192

It's not the best fit in the world, but optically, it's the best scope I have. Long discontinued.

Brassman
March 24, 2007, 11:12 PM
Finally got to try out my Skinner aperture sights today at the range. I did not install the front, only the rear sight. There was a little adjustment to be done at the first. The rear was a little low. It took about 3 turns of the aperture post to get it high enough. The lane that I was given was not a full 25 yds because of cable problems the last 5 or 6 yds. But at about 20 yards I could group about a nickel-size diameter. I left the small aperture in the sight and had absolutely no problem getting a sight picture. I think I'm really gonna like these things and they sure look better than my scope did. I keep thinking Roy Rogers (childhood hero) would have used a ghost ring, not a scope.

Moondancer
March 24, 2007, 11:19 PM
39D owner here. I bought it used at the big (semi) local sporting goods store back in around '72 or early '73. It, along with my Stevens bolt-action I got for my 16th or 17th birthday are the oldest guns I have.

I love my Marlin. It's going to go to my daughter when I die (as my son's wife is vehemently anti).

FWIW, I'm taking my wife shooting tomorrow for the first time (third wife... don't ask) and I'm planning on using the 39D to break her in right. As opposed to the AK in 7.62x39.

AStone
March 24, 2007, 11:20 PM
...at about 20 yards I could group about a nickel-size diameter. Hey, that's impressive.

I left the small aperture in the sight and had absolutely no problem getting a sight picture. I think I'm really gonna like these things and they sure look better than my scope did.May I ask, what age are your eyes, and how good are they? Do you wear reading glasses?

I'm trying to decide if I could make good use of apertures on my 39 with the only part of my body that's really not aging well: my eyes.

Scope is fine, but apertures, I'm not sure of yet... :scrutiny:

AStone
March 24, 2007, 11:22 PM
Welcome in, Moon.

third wife... don't askWhat happens in the 39A Club stays in the 39A club. ;)

Brassman
March 25, 2007, 12:39 AM
I just turned 50 in Dec. I have been near sighted and wearing glasses since the age of 17. In the past few years I have put on reading glasses and wear progressives as a perscription. I have always hated wearing glasses and tried contacts about 25 years ago, but at that time I was in textiles and every fiber in the air was attracted to my lenses, so I gave that up. I wear the progressives to shoot so I can see both front and rear sights really well, while the target is a little blurry. But from everything I've heard that's the way folks with normal eyesight see a sight picture. I really think I can handle the aperture, at least for a while until my eyes get older. I can see both sights really fast. Sometimes the scope wasn't so fast. Today at the range I was wondering if I could use a smaller aperture for even more accuracy. I'm going to experiment with what I have now and maybe later get Dr. Skinner to make me a smaller one.

AStone
March 25, 2007, 12:47 AM
B'man, that makes sense. Thanks. I'm encouraged.

Please keep us posted about your experiences.

Nem

skeeter1
March 25, 2007, 01:55 AM
If you'd like opinions about how bolt .22s compare with levers, just ask. You'll find them here.


My dad had a Winchester 52B Sporter (bolt-action) which is now owned by my cousin. Most accurate .22 I've ever shot, and probably the most expensive. Dad paid $240 for it in 1948.

For "fun value", the 39 beats it hands down. Dad helped me pick it out as my first rifle in 1970, and he knew what he was talking about. When he was a kid, he had a Marlin 1891 that he got from my grandad.

My 39D has been known to take down a crow at 100yds on the first shot. As the barrel warms up, what with the barrel band and pinned magazine tube, shots tend to string down vertically.

I won't pretend that It's a target rifle, but for me it's just perfect. :D

AStone
March 25, 2007, 02:02 AM
Had to google that.

Found this. (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_year_and_where_do_you_get_parts_for_Marlin_Model_39D)

this model was produced 1971-1973, all internal parts are same as the 39a,
the 39d is basically a 20inch barreled pistol gripped 39a

Is that about accurate?

skeeter1
March 25, 2007, 02:55 AM
Yes, that's probably accurate. I thought I got my 39D in 1970, but maybe it was in 1971. My reference (2007 Standard Catalog of Firearms) also shows them as having been made from 1971 to 1973.

Well, you made me get off my bum and check the papers in the safe. I bought it on 11/12/1971 for $68.50, brand new. I think I've gotten my money's worth, and the some! :D

AStone
March 25, 2007, 06:00 AM
Well, you made me get off my bum and check the papers in the safe. Oh, sorry, Moon. Didn't mean to make you do paper work on a Saturday night. :)

I bought it on 11/12/1971 for $68.50, brand new.
I think I've gotten my money's worth, and the some! :D Wow, that's very cool:
a new 39D w/ 20" barrel for $68.50.
And you've still got the receipt.

Now, that deserves some pics.

I can see a great set of images: at least one of the 39D
accompanied by a scanned copy of the receipt.
Lots of creative potential to be had with those in a photo editor.

:cool:

PS: does the D have a pistol grip?

PSS: Just googled "Marlin 39D image".
Below is the only image that came up; it's from here (http://www.cqbarms.com/photos/albums/userpics/10021/thumb_Marlin%2039D%201.1.jpg).
(I looked around the site a bit, and that's the largest image of it I found.)

I can see it's a pistol grip with a shorter barrel than a 39A (Mikey likes it),
but I can't see much other detail other than some kind of short scope.

http://www.cqbarms.com/photos/albums/userpics/10021/thumb_Marlin%2039D%201.1.jpg

Bentonville
March 25, 2007, 08:59 AM
Well, no one has the rear sight or the rear sight elevator. I was hoping someone here had mounted a different type of sight and wouldn't mind letting me buy the rear sight or elevator not being used anymore. I think the last step on the original is very thin, more so than those bought as replacements. Anyway, the gun is accurate without it so I guess I need to just relax and continue enjoying my beautiful .22. Thanks for the input, all.

Shane333
March 26, 2007, 12:21 PM
Owner of a 1952 Marlin Model 39.:D

AStone
March 26, 2007, 04:01 PM
Welcome in, Shane. You'll now find your name on the roster on page 3. :)

The age of your 39 leads me to a question out of curiousity:
who in here owns the oldest 39 (or predecessor of 39) amongst us?

And speaking of older 39 predecessors, does any one know where Annie Oakley's first (or other) Marlin rifles are housed? Museum? Private collection? Marlin headquarters maybe?

The lever action 22 repeater (now Model 39) even became the favorite of many exhibition shooters, including the great Annie Oakley ... A special Model 1889 was made for her.
(Source: The History of Marlin Firearms (http://www.marlinfirearms.com/About/History.aspx))

Annie Oakley holding Marlin 1890 (http://www.bbhc.org/img/bbm/AO_08L.jpg) over right shoulder and mirror in left hand, ca. 1890. (Source: here (http://www.bbhc.org/bbm/biographyAO.cfm))

Using a .22 caliber rifle at 90 feet (27 m), Oakley could split a playing card edge-on
and put five or six more holes in it before it touched the ground. :what: (Source: Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annie_Oakley))Yeah, I was doing that just the other day, too. It's easy with a 39A.

:rolleyes:

jkingrph
March 26, 2007, 04:18 PM
Dad bought me mine when I was in second grade in 1952. It looks better than most new models. Also have one of the "cowboy" models of a few years back. Have not fired it. I installed a tang sight so it's a nice companion to my 1894 cowboy.

borrowedtime69
March 26, 2007, 04:24 PM
And speaking of older 39 predecessors, does any one know where Annie Oakley's first (or other) Marlin rifles are housed? Museum? Private collection? Marlin headquarters maybe?


If memory serves Annies guns, most of them, are housed and displayed in Cody Wyoming, Buffalo Bill Historical Center. link:http://www.bbhc.org/home/index.cfm

They have several areas in the huge building that deal with artifacts, paintings, etc. However, they have an Enormous section that is dedicated to firearms of all typs , ages, and makes. they have a wonderful collection of guns from the old west as well as makes of the very first firearms made over the world to ones that are made in moderen day. my wife and parents had to finally drag me out LOL. -Eric

AStone
March 26, 2007, 04:41 PM
Jkingrph, welcome. Can we call you "J"? Or "King"?

If memory serves Annies guns, most of them, are housed and displayed in Cody Wyoming,
Buffalo Bill Historical Center. link:http://www.bbhc.org/home/index.cfm B'Time, that looks like a fantastic facility. Hope to go there someday.

I'm a relative of Jim Bridger (via my mom's side of the family). Men in our family even look like him (as compared to photos of him in later years). Looks like they've got a fair amount there about him, too.

I just sent them a query from their "contact us" page asking if any of Oakley's .22 lever guns are there. I'll let you all know.

jkingrph
March 26, 2007, 05:45 PM
Whatever you wish, it is J. King, RPh( pharmacist)

AStone
March 26, 2007, 05:55 PM
J'King works well.

Pharmacist, eh? Cool.

I'm a biologist teaching college-level classes in biology, including cell molecular stuff. I'm one of those teachers that you had to tolerate on your way to pharmacy school, you know, the ones that made you understand the citric acid cycle and chemiosmosis and write essay questions about them? :evil:

jkingrph
March 26, 2007, 06:04 PM
Yeah, endured all that, remember a little about the Krebs cycle. Most of that was foundation for future courses and did help in understanding, especially pharmacology. Sorry to say so many years have past that I have forgotten much of it. You tend to remember what you need and use routeinly.

JustsayMo
March 28, 2007, 12:24 PM
Just got my Skinner peep sight for my 39A Mountie.

Delivery was quick, the product quality is excellent. Installation was easy.

Mini Range Report: Indoors, 10 meters, sitting and standing positions.

The sight picture looks to be perfect for field use. I prefer a little smaller apeture for targets but this is just seems just right for all-purpose use.

Another thing I noticed was that these sights are easy on the eyes. My mid-forties eyes tire quickly using the stock open irons. With the Skinner sights my eyes did NOT strain to find the front post and target. The apeture frames and sharpens the front sight bead making alignment on the target effortless.

I can not speak to ease of adjustment as the first 30 rounds all printed point of aim. :D It looks far mor simple to adjust than my Williams 5D sight (which I will now sell to buy more Skinner sights), and far more precise than adjusting (drifting) the stock open sights.

The sights improved my groups, especially the groups at the end of my shooting session. My best groups are usually the first few as my eyes are 'fresh' and my concentration the best. The last two groups of the session were equal to or better than the previous. I had less flyers.

I did purchase the optional ($5) front sight but did NOT install it. The stock front bead (1965) worked fine.

Aesthetically this is the most "organic" or natural looking peepsight I have seen for the Marlin 39A (in my opinion). I will give it an enthusiastic two thumbs up and will be ordering another set for my 1895GS.

Posted before but worth checking out http://skinnersights.com/

Dean C
March 28, 2007, 03:14 PM
Got my first 39A in 1981 to have a match for the 336A. I can't even begin to guess how many rounds I've put through that rifle. I replaced the firing pin a couple of years ago but that's all I've had to do with it. Just love it.
Well, the other day I was at my favorite gun store. Lo and behold, there was an old 39A that just got put in for sale. It's a 1951 and they wanted way too much for it. I talked and talked and finally got them to just budge a little and I caved in. Payed too much but just had to have it. I'll be restoreing it to original condition. Not really too much to do though.
dean

AStone
March 29, 2007, 12:08 AM
Dean, welcome in. Congrats on the new one. Please post pics when you get some.

J'mo, glad to hear the skinners are working out so well. I may have to try a set eventually, although I confess I'm enjoying my Leupold Rimfire 2X - 7X on mine (even though I respect that a lot of you think I'm a heretic for putting it on a 39A. What would Annie Oakley say?)

I've still got some work to do. Still learning how to pilot it. Even with a nice rest, I'm still barely getting consistent 1"+ groups at 25 yds. My sense is so far, no tack driver, but still very decent. I'm sure my groups will improve with practice and experience.

{Added by edit: I just got out my ruler and measured the groups. Not as bad as I thought. Most of the 25 groups were well under an inch, in the 3/4" realm. Only 4 of them extended out to 1" territory and beyond. So, I feel better about that.}

I'm finding the trigger to be a little heavy, and I haven't learned how to relax with it yet. I need some instruction I think with trigger control.
______

OK, now for some bad news.

A while back, in another thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=259973), I reported that during my first trip to the range with my then new (NIB) 39A, I got several (~ 5 or 6) failure to fires. They were ammo independent. That is, it happened with both American Eagle and CCI Minimags.

(Most of the participants in that short thread are here now, so I'll discuss the issue here instead.)

The recommendations before were that it was most likely either: 1) a broken firing pin or, 2) light strikes caused perhaps by too much oil and gunk in it.

So, I took it down and - with help from Salty and others - examined the firing pin. It appeared fine. No sign of breakage.

I did notice that it was pretty gunky with a bit too much oil. (I had cleaned it right out of the box before going to the range the first time, but left too much oil in the action.)

So, I cleaned it out real well, and added only the lightest, thinnest coat of oil, extremely sparingly. I felt surely that would cure the problem.

Got it to the range to day, and within the first magazine load, started getting FTF again. Today, I fired around 75 rnds, with 4 FTFs: 2 with AE, two with CCI.

I reloaded the first two, and they fired fine. I did not reload the second two.

I brought about 15 home cases, including the two unfired ones and only one of the ones that fired the second time (the other one got away from me in a pile of cases), for a closer look with a magnifying glass.

Only one of the "fired twice" cases has a clear, unequivocal "light strike signature": one of the two imprints is noticeably less deep than the other.

Neither of the unfired ones has a "dent" that looks substantially different from those that fired. They do not appear to be light strikes in a recognizable, obvious way (says the amateur who really doesn't have any experience with this up until now).

So, I'm at a loss. This is not what I wanted to experience with a brand new rifle, of course. :(

Any suggestions? Take it down and clean it again?

I think tomorrow, I'll call Marlin and discuss it with their customer service department. I may also call my local gunsmith and discuss it.

But I'm very open to suggestions from you folks.

I'll keep you posted, of course.

Thanks.

Nem

AStone
March 29, 2007, 12:20 AM
Above, I wrote this after B'Time told us that Annie's .22s are housed at the BBHC:

I just sent them a query from their "contact us" page asking if any of Oakley's .22 lever guns are there. I'll let you all know.I had a very pleasant and informative email exchange with the director (I think?) of the museum there.

He was very prompt, courteous and helpful, and offered a lot of information - including (kindly) correcting a mistaken impression that I had about the progenitor of the 39A. (I had thought it was an 1889. I was wrong. It was an 1891.)

Here is part of his response, posted here with his permission.

The progenitor of your Model 39A, which was also an improved version of the Model 39, was the Model 1891 side-loading, lever action caliber .22 rifle that was invented by L. L. Hepburn. The fundamentals of the Model 1891, which was a rim fire rifle, and the first Marlin to accept the .22 Short, Long, and Long Rifle cartridges interchangeably, were carred over into the Models 39 and 39A. The 39A has been produced in 17 different models/styles, even as the Model 1891 was produced in 3 variations.

We currently hold in our collection, and have on display, twelve Annie Oakley guns. The most famous of them are: a Model 1893, chambered for the .38-55 cartridge that she donated to help with the War Bond campaign in World War I; a Model 1897 Deluxe, chambered for the .22 Rim Fire cartridge, with a half-round, half-octagon barrel; and a fabulous Model 1881, chambered for the .45-70 cartridge, was serial number 1 in the model, and made exclusively by Marlin for Oakley. One of my personal favorites is her splendid L. C. Smith Side-by-Side Shotgun. The others you will be able to see personally on your visit here.

Annie Oakley had in her possession a very large number of firearms during her illustrious career. The ones that belonged to her personally are still a matter of speculation and controversy. The ones in our collection have been extensively authenticated as hers.

I hope the above information is helpful to you. Our data is very solid because we are the only repository for the original Marlin, L. C. Smith, and Winchester production records.

Warren Newman
Cody Firearms Museum
Buffalo Bill Historical Center
Cody, Wyoming

grizz
March 29, 2007, 01:32 AM
So, what's a good price for a NIB 39? Do they still make variations, or just the model on the Marlin web site??

Also, how would accuracy compare to the CZ 452 or 453 (American or Varmint models)?

AStone
March 29, 2007, 01:43 AM
Grizz, I paid $475 for mine (plus about $30 in diesel fuel driving to a different city to get it because no one here had one, and couldn't get one at the time).

As far as I know, they only make the 39A Golden now.

As for comparison with CZ 452, I can tell you (because I owned a 452 until a couple of weeks ago) that, IMO, the 39A is not quite the tack driver that the 452 was for me ... at least yet. My groups with the 452 were tighter, although not by much. But the fact that I could immediately get tighter groups with it (first time I shot it) says that wasn't just a fluke.

That may change after I get used to the 39A.

In fact, I think I read earlier in this thread (or maybe another one) that someone was arguing that the Marlin is just as accurate as a CZ, so YMMV.

The CZ had a better trigger from the get go. This one feels a bit heavy for me, and I haven't figured out its nuances yet. (I wish it were possible to dry fire rimfires ... wait, didn't someone just post something about how to do that with leather or something ... ? I'll double check.)

Having said all that, I'm still glad that I bought the 39A, and I don't regret letting the CZ go. (A friend bought it.) I'm just not a bolt guy.

JustsayMo
March 29, 2007, 11:09 AM
Grizz,
I have a CZ452 American and with its prefered ammo (RWS Target) it shoots tiny little groups. 50 yard target pic http://www.grovestreet.com/jsp/onepic.jsp?id=1168549

I don't have scopes on my 39's so there is a lot of human error involved but I can still manage some pretty good groups even with the cheap ammo. 50 yard open sight target with Federal Bulk ammo can be covered by a nickle http://www.grovestreet.com/jsp/onepic.jsp?id=1114275

The advantage the 39 (or most leverguns in general) has over a bolt gun is its field utility. It carries and points like it's part of you, especially from field postions. It's lighter and thinner. Easily operated left or right handed (great back-up guns for that reason). It is more than accurate enough to take game humanely. Quicker follow-up shots are possible. Large capacity Magazine that doesn't project from the rifle and interfere with carry or handling and won't be misplaced. They are among the most reliable, least finicky firearms.

I enjoy punching targets with my CZ and Rem 700 but I hunt with my leverguns.

Outside is the venue the levergun rules supreme.

-Mo

JustsayMo
March 29, 2007, 11:30 AM
Nem,
Disassemble your 39. Remove the bolt. Look at the rear chamber near the top. Use something like a dental probe to feel for a burr.

Then look at the firing pin. It should be profiled where the farthest point forward is on the bottom edge (when oriented right side up). Look for a shiny spot or burr there.

It should not be so profiled it comes to a point. Just enough to clear the rear most chamber edge. Cases will reveal if the firing pin is not striking close enough to the edge.

Now look at the bolt.

Push the firing pin fully forward. The retention pin (looks like a golf ball marker) should allow the firing pin movement with minimal friction. The older models don't have this pin. It might (unlikely) that the rention pin is too loose and it allows the firing pin's forward edge to become misaligned as it travels forward.

The firing pin should also project far enough forward of the bolt face to make a good dent. I had a 39 with the rebounding hammer that required some filing on the underside firing pin projections that limit forward travel. I think I took about .030" off and it never had a problem again.

Your problem is not uncommon with the rebounding hammer 39's. I like the safety but the rebounding hammer seems to increase the likelyhood of FTF. I've never had a FTF with my pre-safety 39's.

AStone
March 29, 2007, 01:38 PM
J'mo, thanks much for your suggestions. They are encouraging.

I'm just getting to work, and have a few brush fires to put out here first.

Later, I'll take a closer look at your directions. I may have a question or two ... writing and reading technical directions about parts with complicated shapes without diagrams can be challenging sometimes :o .

Again, thanks for taking the time to offer them.

More later ...

Nem

Brassman
March 29, 2007, 04:20 PM
Your groups with your 39A and 452 look great to me. I've never shot targets at 50 yds, but my 25 yd groups with a rest look kinda like your 50 yd. shots with a few flyers common to most rimfire ammo. I love my 39A, especially with my new Skinner aperture sights. Maybe with some more practice I can get my groups to look as good as yours.

Nem,
Sorry to hear you are having some trouble with your 39A. I have not had any FTF's, but 2 FTE's in about 1000 rnds.

tubeshooter
March 29, 2007, 05:00 PM
Nem, I hope you get everything worked out soon. I had issues from the factory, so don't feel bad. Once you get straightened out, everything will be fine.


I'm strongly considering those Skinner sights. I like the overall profile much better.

skeeter1
March 29, 2007, 10:04 PM
I wish it were possible to dry fire rimfires

They don't get any easier or safer than the 39. Remove the takedown screw, take out the bolt, drop out the firing pin, reassemble without the firing pin, and you can dry fire to your hearts content. Just remember to put the firing pin back in before you go to the range, or you'll have egg on your face! :)

AStone
March 29, 2007, 10:38 PM
...drop out the firing pin, reassemble without the firing pin...Skeet, unfortunately, I don't think I can do that.

My firing pin seems to be "pinned in" by some sort of metal dowel (or plug) that's flush with the top of the bolt. The pin moves freely back and forth in it's little grove in the bolt under the dowel, but it doesn't seem to come out. (I've even wondered if this configuration is related to light strikes somehow ... purely speculation. I have no idea or evidence ...)

When he was helping me with this problem before, Salty also recommended removing the pin, but I can't find a way to do it.

Maybe they've changed it, making it not removable in the newer ones ... ?

Anybody know?

JustsayMo
March 30, 2007, 01:14 AM
The firing pin is pretty easy to remove.
1-remove bolt.
2-locate firing pin retaining stud on top of bolt.
3-on the opposite (lower/trigger) side there is a hole. Place bolt upside down on a piece of wood with a hole slightly larger than the retaining stud head.
4-Take a flat punch and drive it through.
5-The firing pin will fall out.

AStone
March 30, 2007, 01:53 AM
Excellent! Thanks, 'Mo.

This thread is a gold mine.

skeeter1
March 30, 2007, 09:49 PM
Skeet, unfortunately, I don't think I can do that.

My firing pin seems to be "pinned in" by some sort of metal dowel (or plug) that's flush with the top of the bolt.

That could well be. Mine dates to 1971, and has nothing to support the firing pin. I just turn over the bolt and it falls out. Why it would need to be pinned into place is beyond me.

Then again, I've got a crossbolt safety on the 1894 (hasn't been a problem for me yet, but I don't like it. :(

AStone
March 31, 2007, 09:50 PM
Using J'mo's directions, I got the bolt out and firing pin (FP) removed.

Since this may be a common problem,
I'm posting an image to guide our understanding of what's up.
(Pardon the fuzzy image)

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=55815&stc=1&d=1175391923

Interestingly, the side of the FP was "sticky". When dragging a cloth over it, it felt as if someone has spilled a soft drink on it and allowed it to dry. It was tacky. I guess that could have impeded it's movement. I'm cleaning it with solvent.

Disassemble your 39. Remove the bolt. Look at the rear chamber near the top. Use something like a dental probe to feel for a burr.J'mo, I'm not quite sure what you mean by "rear chamber". I've indicated what I think you mean. You can guide me from there.

Then look at the firing pin. It should be profiled where the farthest point forward is on the bottom edge (when oriented right side up). Look for a shiny spot or burr there.Sorry, I'm not following that one. :confused:

It should not be so profiled it comes to a point. Just enough to clear the rear most chamber edge. Cases will reveal if the firing pin is not striking close enough to the edge.I'm not sure how close to the edge the FP should be striking. Examining about spent 12 cases, it's clear that there is some variation in how close to the edge it's hitting. Some hits actually cause a tiny burr on the outside of the case rim, where as others leave a tiny un-imprinted space (guessing 0.1 mm) between the outer end of the FP imprint and the rim of the case. Not sure if that is normal variation or not. (That is, I don't know how close to the rim the FP has to hit to get firing.)

Now look at the bolt. Push the firing pin fully forward. The retention pin (looks like a golf ball marker) should allow the firing pin movement with minimal friction. The older models don't have this pin. It might (unlikely) that the retention pin is too loose and it allows the firing pin's forward edge to become misaligned as it travels forward.See above for stickiness of the FP and variation in it's imprint on the case. However, the retention pin seemed well seated; its top was flush with the bolt surface.

The firing pin should also project far enough forward of the bolt face to make a good dent. I had a 39 with the rebounding hammer that required some filing on the underside firing pin projections that limit forward travel. I think I took about .030" off and it never had a problem again.OK, this is getting down to brass tacks, er, firing pins.

Which of those "projections" that limit forward travel of the FP should be filed? #1, #2, or both?

Thanks.

Nem

bluedsteel
March 31, 2007, 10:51 PM
Count me in as a 39 fan as well. I bought my 39AS about 10 years ago. I wanted one since childhood...loved the solid steel and walnut. Mine is scoped with a Leupold 2-7X33 Rifleman...great rig.

My only complaint is the trigger pull. Mine is around 5-6 pounds...this wears on me during extended sessions shooting at small targets.

Has anyone had any luck with getting the trigger pull lightened on their 39? Did a gunsmith do the work?

Thanks.

bluedsteel

AStone
March 31, 2007, 11:27 PM
BluedSteel, welcome to 39A-ville AND THR.

For short, would you prefer "blued" or "steel"?
The other option is "BS", but I don't think you'd want that moniker. ;)

I'll add you to the roster at next listing. (My edit window has closed.)

Has anyone had any luck with getting the trigger pull lightened on their 39?
Did a gunsmith do the work?That's a good question. I feel the same about my trigger: it's heavy.

Opinions?

skeeter1
March 31, 2007, 11:55 PM
Once again, you guys got my curiosity up:

My only complaint is the trigger pull. Mine is around 5-6 pounds...this wears on me during extended sessions shooting at small targets.


So, I pulled out the gauge and checked. The trigger went off at exactly 4lbs, nice and crisp. Maybe the older ones were made with a lighter trigger, or maybe shooting however-many-thousand rounds through it in the past 36 years has lightened it up. The trigger on my 39 is a lot better than my 1894C. :)

dfariswheel
April 1, 2007, 01:04 AM
A good gunsmith can lighten the Marlin trigger nicely, BUT, I'd caution that as simple as the Marlin 39 trigger looks, trigger work is no place to be learning.

The older Marlin's actually had an adjustable hammer spring assembly that allowed lightening both the hammer strike, and through it, the trigger pull.
On my 1950 model, the hammer's coil mainspring seats in a flat plate which can be moved forward or rearward to adjust tension.

Simple use will lighten the Marlin's trigger over time, and you can help it along by applying a good grease to the hammer/trigger interface.
A friend of mine bought his 39-A in the 1960's and always applied Gunslick Graphite Gun Grease to his action and trigger.
Over the years, the graphite has smoothed the parts until he has about a 3 pound trigger, and the action is so smooth it seems to operate itself.

Since most people don't want to wait 40 years or more, I suggest seeing a good gunsmith for a trigger job.

I just got my 1950 restoration job back from being re-blued, and as soon as it stops raining I'll take some pictures and post them here.

Rollis R. Karvellis
April 1, 2007, 10:07 AM
Well last Sunday I, went shooting with the 39A and once again had several f.t.e. at first I,
Thought it was the mart-mart Federals with there small rims but then the Remington’s were also doing it, so I, had my gun mechanic order a new extractor. Hopefully this will cure the problem.

bluedsteel
April 1, 2007, 11:38 AM
Thanks for the trigger info. My local gunsmith says he can improve my 39's trigger...I was just curious if anyone had this type of work done, and how it turned out. I see that Midway offers a Wild West Guns trigger for the Marlin 336, 444, 1894 and 1895 models, but I didn't see anything offered for the 39. It requires a gunsmith installation anyway.

My 39 seems to be quite accurate, but the trigger makes using that accuracy a bit difficult. Lately, because of the trigger, I have been favoring my Anschutz Sporter...


bluedsteel

JustsayMo
April 1, 2007, 11:48 AM
Nem, I'll give it another try. My appologies for my clumsy discriptions.

Nem wrote:
"J'mo, I'm not quite sure what you mean by "rear chamber". I've indicated what I think you mean. You can guide me from there."

The rear chamber is on the barrel half of the rifle. With the rifle halved look down barrel from the reciever end. The very rear end of the bore might have a burr or be dented if the FP is not profiled correctly.

Quote:
Then look at the firing pin. It should be profiled where the farthest point forward is on the bottom edge (when oriented right side up). Look for a shiny spot or burr there.
Sorry, I'm not following that one.

With the firing pin removed examine the forward most point. It will look like a little knub forward of the main shaft. That knub should be beveled down from the top so that the longest dimention of the FP is taken on its lower edge. I can't quite tell from your picture.

A burr on the rear chamber top is evidence that the FP needs more profiling. Take care not to file too much though. Fine line.

If there is NO burr/dent/shiney flat spot on the chamber and the bevel on the FP seems to be uniform with no burrs, dents or localized shiney spots... then I would look for another cause.

Quote:
It should not be so profiled it comes to a point. Just enough to clear the rear most chamber edge. Cases will reveal if the firing pin is not striking close enough to the edge.
I'm not sure how close to the edge the FP should be striking. Examining about spent 12 cases, it's clear that there is some variation in how close to the edge it's hitting. Some hits actually cause a tiny burr on the outside of the case rim, where as others leave a tiny un-imprinted space (guessing 0.1 mm) between the outer end of the FP imprint and the rim of the case. Not sure if that is normal variation or not. (That is, I don't know how close to the rim the FP has to hit to get firing.)
Quote:
Now look at the bolt. Push the firing pin fully forward. The retention pin (looks like a golf ball marker) should allow the firing pin movement with minimal friction. The older models don't have this pin. It might (unlikely) that the retention pin is too loose and it allows the firing pin's forward edge to become misaligned as it travels forward.
See above for stickiness of the FP and variation in it's imprint on the case. However, the retention pin seemed well seated; its top was flush with the bolt surface.
Quote:
The firing pin should also project far enough forward of the bolt face to make a good dent. I had a 39 with the rebounding hammer that required some filing on the underside firing pin projections that limit forward travel. I think I took about .030" off and it never had a problem again.
OK, this is getting down to brass tacks, er, firing pins.

Which of those "projections" that limit forward travel of the FP should be filed? #1, #2, or both?


If you are getting shallow FP dents in your cases, and the sticky FP and the FP knub check out then I would carefully file tab #1 on the forward most edge. (DO NOT FILE #2. When the lever is opperated tab#2 is engaged and pushed back to the cocked position). About .010-.020" should be plenty. More than that and the cause is likely elsewhere.

Nem, I have some pictures but my (lack of) computer skills don't include posting here at THR. I can email them to you if you PM me your email address

Bentonville
April 1, 2007, 11:53 AM
When using Remington Golden Bullet, which seems to have a gummy lubricant on it, my rifle had FTE after about 50 rounds. In fact, I had to use a cleaning rod to push down the barrel to get the shell out. I used Federal after a thorough cleaning and my son and I shot about 300 rounds without one problem. I still need a rear sight elevator for my C5000 manufactured in 1946. Anyone install a scope or another type of sight and want to sell your sight? Just asking.

AStone
April 1, 2007, 04:07 PM
Good info coming in on triggers, fte's, ftf's, and "gummy lubricant" (which could be related to my "sticky" FP). Thanks.

Dfaris, good advice about the trigger issues.

Rollis, please keep us posted re the repair issue.

J'mo, thanks for the clarification. Much better. I'm starting to get it. I'll send a PM in a little while ... after coffee ... (I had it all written, complete with email addy, a question about the FP, and instructions on how to post images into a thread, then hit the wrong button and it vaporized ... :eek: :banghead: )

OK, coffee ... I need coffee ... :uhoh:

jimrichter
April 1, 2007, 10:11 PM
I'm glad I came upon this thread. I love Marlins (truly the "workingman's" rifle--solidly built and affordable) and especially the 39s. I've got a few Marlins--including a new .357 1894 and a '57 336 30/30. But my favorite two rifles are my '52 39a (pre-microgroove) and my '73 Mountie. And actually, of those two, I probably prefer the Mountie more, due to the carbine length barrel.

I don't have any photos immediately available of the mountie, but I do have some of the '52.

Jim

AStone
April 1, 2007, 10:23 PM
Jim, welcome to 39A-ville and THR.

That's a fine looking rifle with beautiful furniture. Amazingly rich color.
________

39A gang,

As I wrote earlier in the 336 club, this is going to be an extremely busy week for me. :eek: I'm in charge of a very large project that's going to be culminating next Saturday. :what:

I'll be checking in some this week, but less so as Saturday approaches.

The week after that will be another busy one (but less so than this one).
After that, I should be back to "normal" for a while. (What ever "normal" is ... )

So, if you folks will look after the "club house" while I'm out, it'd be great.

As long as you knock most of the mud off your boots at the door, boots on the coffee table are fine.

Drinks are in the fridge. .22 rnds are in the large wooden cabinet behind the couch. Help yourself. ;)

Nem

RandyB
April 2, 2007, 11:12 AM
I have 39m

Sniper X
April 2, 2007, 12:08 PM
I see you don't have to own a 39A to be in the club!!?? Cool! Count me in, it was my first gun I purchased with my very own money in 1968 when I was ten....I loved it shot the heck out of it and only sold it to get my first handgun, a Colt Dimondback, so you can;t fault me "that" much!

I WILL have another as soon as I find one!

SwampWolf
April 2, 2007, 04:17 PM
Absolutely can't fault you on that deal, Sniper X! However, I've got to admit that my very stupidest deals happen when I'm trying to rustle up some cash to get the latest gleam in my eye. I've come to understand that a little patience will save me a lot of heartache! Anyhow, welcome to the club and don't waste too much time in replacing your 39...

Sniper X
April 2, 2007, 04:29 PM
Thanks Swamp, I did just Saturday replace my 336RC vintage 1968 so I am on my way to finding a 39a! Heres the 336RC I picked up Saturday for 250 out the door...deal and a half!

skeeter1
April 2, 2007, 04:30 PM
I loved it shot the heck out of it and only sold it to get my first handgun, a Colt Dimondback, so you can;t fault me "that" much!


Can't fault you at all for that trade. Colt Diamondback is one of my favorite revolvers. One of my reasons for hanging onto the 39 (other than it's a great rifle) is that it's the first one that my late dad helped me pick out for myself. The only way the 39 is going away is when I'm pushing up daisies.

Shrinkmd
April 2, 2007, 11:34 PM
I know there is an upgraded trigger for the marlin centerfire rifles, but what do people recommend for tuning the 39A trigger?

Also, a pity you can't dryfire a .22lr (although I've read/been told that a ruger 10/22 doesn't matter, but not to dryfire a 22lr revolver or the marlin 39a)

Any advice?

Sniper X
April 3, 2007, 11:36 AM
linky to the up-graded trigger for the Marlins!! Actually if it would get rid of my pretty gold trigger on my 1968 336RC forget it! I think the trigger is GREAT on this thing! Just curious though!!

SwampWolf
April 3, 2007, 01:37 PM
Hey, Sniper X: Did you warn the seller of that Marlin to keep his hands up and to not call the police until after you left the scene of the "highway robbery"? Great deal!

Sniper X
April 3, 2007, 03:53 PM
I know! I felt like I should have been wearing a mask when I bought that one! I am still all giddy about getting a 336RC from 68 that is as new condition, especially for 250 out the door!

kola
April 4, 2007, 03:23 PM
Hey all...new to the site,,just bought me a Marlin 39a...sweeeeeeeet rifle

she cost me 500 clams and I put a bushnell 1.5-4.5 scope on her.

..can't wait to shoot er'

I could have bought alot of other guns for cheaper but I wanted this baby bad...there is something to be said about tradition and quality.

I bought some remington cyclone 22lf high speed hollowpoints for starters...any suggestion on good/bad ammo for this beauty?

..I also have a Marlin 336W 30-30..now big brother has a little sister.. :)

peace courage and fight for freedom!!!

Kola

Sniper X
April 4, 2007, 03:52 PM
I could have bought alot of other guns for cheaper but I wanted this baby bad...there is something to be said about tradition and quality.

Kola, in here you are prechin to th Chior my freind! No justification here for buying a Marlin!!!!!

Brassman
April 4, 2007, 03:56 PM
My experience is that the 39A will literally eat anything you feed it. My normal ammo is the Remington Gold Bullet from Wal-Mart which cost about $10 for 550 rounds. I also shoot in the backyard with CB Longs. If you shoot very many CB's at a time, you should run a boresnake through the barrell or rod with a brass brush. CB's will make a mess of your barrel in just a few rounds. You'll love that rifle, maybe even more than the 336. It's a little heavy and a little long, but that's what makes the 39A so accuarate and fun to shoot. Like I said, it'll eat anything you feed it and not cost an arm and leg while doing it. Happy shooting. Oh, and welcome to the club too.

batex
April 4, 2007, 09:45 PM
Had to jump in here and add my .02. I found this nice 39A in a local pawn shop last week for $200 out the door. The bluing shows very little wear, it's from 1979 so before the crossbolt safety, and check out the wood! If you can believe it, this wood was covered over with a thick paint like varnish. I took a chance, stripped it, and followed recommendations of an article I found to refinish it. I was astounded! Makes me wonder about it's history if someone covered up this sort of wood with a paint. In short, I've become a big Marlin fan lately. So much so that I bought a nice 336 CS in 35 Rem also for $200. Love this thread. Thanks for listening!

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c147/batex/IMG_1253.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c147/batex/IMG_1262.jpg

Brassman
April 4, 2007, 10:26 PM
Beautiful wood! Why would anyone want to put paint on that? You did a really nice job. Your price was less than half of what I paid for mine about a year ago, of course mine is new and doesn't have the character that yours has. I wouldn't want to let it go, but I would like to find an older one to work on. I think the older woods work up to look better than the newer stuff. Again, really nice work!

skeeter1
April 5, 2007, 12:14 AM
Baytex--

That chunk of walnut on that 39 is probably nicer than on my fairly expensive trapgun. How someone could paint that is beyond me. Great restoration job! :)

kola
April 5, 2007, 12:16 AM
wow..that imitation black walnut laminate almost looks real..:what:



JUST KIDDING!!! LOL
you got a deal!

Kola

AStone
April 5, 2007, 02:06 AM
...check out the wood! :what: :what: :what:

Wow. After a long day that is still hours from over, I needed that pic.
Jolted my nervous system. I'm good for another few hours of work, now. :cool:

I bought a nice 336 CS in 35 Rem also for $200.Have you dropped in over here (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=258000) yet?

Come on over.

Nem (surviving one of those weeks from hell, but not especially enjoying it ...)

Sniper X
April 5, 2007, 11:11 AM
Baytex, that is beautiful. I am glad someone like you got it and did the right thing by refinishing it! That rifle was destined to be yours! Great job, now don;t ever sell it!

And, let me put in my suggestion, another Marlin but 336RC or C in 30-30 for your other needs. The 30-30 still to this day I think if you looked at the stats the 30-30 has taken more game world wide than any three calibers combined.

MP-43
April 5, 2007, 04:45 PM
Excellent! A discussion devoted to my favorite .22! I've enjoyed reading the last six pages and thought it was time to jump in.

I've been shooting since I was a kid, but last year was the first time I owned or fired a 39. It's hard to imagine going to the range without one now. In the last year I have been fortunate enough to find two mounties ('56 and '69) and a standard 39A ('61). I love the handling qualities of the mounties, but the longer barrel really keeps the noise down when shooting CBs.

Here are some pics of the '56 mountie--the prettiest of the bunch. BTW--when I first got her, the area where the tang fits into the stock had what looked like dried brown glue filling in the the gap between the stock and the tang. I took off the stock and cleaned it out--real crusty stuff. Since then I have seen two other Marlins of similar vintage with the same treatment; it's a small point, but it still made me ill to think I might have fubar'd the factory treatment, if that's what it was. Live and learn!

Sniper X
April 5, 2007, 05:11 PM
Nice collection of 39s there! I love the Mountie but am lookig for a 39A rifle as soon as I can find one. I especially love the older ones from the 50s and 60s. My 336RC is from 1968 and like new.

Shrinkmd
April 6, 2007, 11:08 PM
I'm really thinking about refinishing my stock, but I'm concerned about all the metal/wood surfaces and not wanting to round edges or cause any mismatch when its reassembled. I have done several stocks now, so it wouldn't be my first time, but the shape of the stock seems challenging.

Also, any favorite stain/filler recommendations? I wonder if the Brownells Herter's French Red would be the ticket? http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=7605&title=STOCK+FILLER
Has anyone used that one? And what finish over it? I have used wiping varnishes so far, finished with 0000 wool and wax to get to a satin finish.

TideMan
April 7, 2007, 01:48 AM
Hello. I own 22 firearms but the 39D I received for my 14th birthday in '71 is still the classiest. - TJ

batex
April 7, 2007, 08:02 AM
Shrinkmd,
Yes, I used Herter's French Red stain/filler in the pictured of the stock I posted above. I applied this after sanding. final finish was with several coats of Tru Oil, then when dried, poslished with birchwoodcasey Stock Sheen and finally a coat or two of their wax. The french red filler really made the stock look nice.

I really wish I had taken pictures of the stock before when it was covered with the paint/varnish. I was really just expecting to find plain walnut or mabe even birch. I'm still in awe of the wood on this gun.

ScotZ
April 7, 2007, 08:43 AM
I have a 39A Golden Mountie..........I am told it was made in 1953. The action is as crisp today as it was when I bought it in the early 80's. Glad I found this thread. Of all my guns. I love this one the best.

pgbenak
April 7, 2007, 12:11 PM
I have had a Marlin 39D since the early 70s, and would like to know where I can find a sevice/owners manual for this. Thanks!

edwardyoung
April 8, 2007, 09:00 AM
http://www.marlinfirearms.com/customersupport/manuals.aspx

Marlin Main Switchboard: (203) 239-5621
Marlin Gun Service (800) 544-8892

yodar
April 8, 2007, 09:14 AM
SOMETIME during the life of the gun apparently I had a squib followed by a fired round. I could feel the bulge with my cleaning rod.

For year I had presumed it was a spot of corrosion caused by poor gun care (Preposterous! because I am OC about cleaning even with non-corrossive ammo)

But that's the operating hypothesis I retained for decades till I showed the gun to a friend who "felt" the bulge and pointed it out to me on the outside, barely perceptible unless you looked for it.

Henceforth, If I ever hear a off-sounding bullet discharge, I take the gun down and inspect

yodar

Brassman
April 8, 2007, 01:42 PM
This may sound dumb, but has anyone ever used Johnson's Floor Wax on a stock? I did. I refinished a Remington Model 33 single shot bolt stock and the last 5 coats were this Johnson Wax that my wife has had on the panty shelf for years. It really set the wood off! The rifle was my father's and my brother and I took it to the range about a year ago. I let him take it home to take back to my mother and I haven't seen it since, at my house or hers. Well anyway, before I let him take it, it really looked top notch.

yodar
April 8, 2007, 01:50 PM
Your proposal is excellent!

I prefer a satin finish and get it from a bottled antique wood finish product labeled for wood and leather made with beeswax, carnauba, a dash of turps and citrus oil. I have used it successfully for some time.

It works excellently on wood, leather, and shoes!

You can make yer own with 50:50 linseed oil turps, melted beeswax and carnauba.

You'll feel like a sorcerer mixing it up ;>)

I just go to the antique mall and buy the stuff.
yodar

Frandy
April 8, 2007, 02:14 PM
I'm in. A year ago March I picked up this used but never shot 1897 Cowboy.
Made in 2000.

http://homepage.mac.com/franman/.Pictures/LongGuns/MarlinCowboy36FirstShots.jpg

Brassman
April 8, 2007, 05:23 PM
Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful rifle Frandy!

Arcli9ht
April 8, 2007, 10:26 PM
http://www.phido.org/guns/39a.jpg

I'm in :-p

Rescued it from almost certain death in the hands of NYC's Finest.

Brassman
April 8, 2007, 11:06 PM
Good to have you Arc. Nice shootin'! How far was your target? If that's more than 25 yds, a lot of folks have their hats off to you. Especially if that was just off the rack ammo, not match stuff.

johncolo
April 8, 2007, 11:11 PM
I have a old 39a I think its the model that was given to me by my pops its going on 52 years now still going strong and shoots just as good today as it did 50 years ago good shooting there arc If thats 25 yard or so I can do just about that well out to 50 yards with brass sights no need for a scope

dfariswheel
April 8, 2007, 11:47 PM
I finally got the restoration done of the 1950 Marlin 39-A rifle.
The wood was a badly flaking varnish over the original oil finish with the usual dents and dings, most of the blue was either gone or turned brown, someone years ago had done a "trigger job" and ruined the hammer and trigger, the butt plate was a mis-fitted replacement, and all the screws were badly "dinked up".

Surprisingly for an old rifle that had been through several peoples hands in that family, there was very little pitting or corrosion, and amazingly, the bore and chamber's original Ballard rifling is absolutely mint.

I refinished the wood with Minwax Antique Oil finish as I described in an older post:

http://www.coltforum.com/forums/showflat...=true#Post40913 (http://www.coltforum.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=UBB1&Number=40913&Searchpage=2&Main=40818&Words=minwax+oil+finish&topic=&Search=true#Post40913)

I either repaired or replaced the screws, replaced the ruined hammer and trigger with new parts and did a trigger job, replaced the original front sight with a new ramp and a hand built blade sight, replaced the open rear with a Williams receiver sight, re-fitted the butt plate, and had it re-blued.

The rifle was sold to me by a friend who just wanted someone to have it who really wanted it and could restore it.
Prices:
The rifle itself from a friend: $50.00
New sights: $65.00
Replacement parts from Jack First: $56.98
Blue job by Mahovski's Metalife: $79.00
Total: $245.98

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/dfariswheel/MarlinReceiverRight2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/dfariswheel/MarlinReceiverLeft.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/dfariswheel/MarlinStockRight.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/dfariswheel/MarlinStockLeft3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/dfariswheel/MarlinStockLeft2.jpg

AStone
April 9, 2007, 12:12 AM
rifle from a friend: $50.00
New sights: $65.00
Replacement parts from Jack First: $56.98
Blue job by Mahovski's Metalife: $79.00
Total: $245.98Restored 39A: priceless.

Wow. Looks like I got back at a good time.

Dang fine looking rifle, Dfaris.

Likewise, Frandy.

Good shooting, Arc.

Welcome Johncolo. What's your secret for good groups at 50 with irons?

Nem (who just survived a week from hell)

johncolo
April 9, 2007, 12:18 AM
nice work there wheel How thats a nice rear site where did you happen to pick it up at ive been thinking of getting something like that or the old sharps sites with the big slide in back for my 336 thanks for the welcome nem

dfariswheel
April 9, 2007, 02:04 AM
The rear sight is a Williams 5D receiver sight.
It has adjustments that are made by loosening screws and moving the sight.

Williams also make a target version as the "Foolproof".
It has very fine "click" adjustments.

The 5D is about $35.00 from Brownell's, with the Foolproof costing $67.00.
I debated spending the extra money for the Foolproof, which I had on a 1980's Marlin 39-A, but practically, once you get a .22 sighted in, you seldom change the sights.

jkingrph
April 9, 2007, 09:31 AM
In reference to Shrinkmd's post of 2 April. You can dry fire the 39 easily. On older models, simpely remove firing pin. On newer models with cross bolt, engage safety and hammer does not strike firing pinl.

Last week took my wife to range with me. She shot the 1897 cowboy with tang sights and liked it. I have had gun setting in safe 3 or 4 years unfired and for the life of me do not know why we have not taken it out sooner. These are fun guns. I guess my interest in the last few years in old Swiss rifles and single shots has trumped everything else. The old 39a Dad got for me roughly 55 years ago sports a lyman receiver sight, and I'm sorry to say I have not shot it in years. The wife wants to get a concealed handgun permit here in Texas, so I'm starting her with a S&W mod 41 and will progress to a Browning Hi-Power. I shall probably take some of the little 22's out and reaquaint myself with them.

After finding this thread earlier this month I never realized that there was so much interest in these little guns, but can understand why. They are quality and full sized

Seven High
April 9, 2007, 09:43 AM
Does anyone own and have photos of a Marlin 39TDS?

SwampWolf
April 9, 2007, 05:01 PM
I agree with dfariswheel's rationale for choosing a 5D over a Foolproof Williams aperture sight when it comes to sighting a .22. Sure, everything else being equal, I'd always opt for the Foolproof. But at less than half the price, the 5D makes more sense when you probably aren't going to change the settings of the sight anyhow and, because the rimfire ammunition is so relatively cheap and the recoil so mild, there is no real penalty in having a cruder (less precise) sight adjustment when you do.

All of my centerfire lever-action rifles wear a Foolproof peep, including a Winchester 94 carbine and an 1886 "Lightweight" (I confess to having one lever-a Savage 99 in .358 Win. cal. , that wears a 1.5X5x scope), in addition to an older (greater drop on the stock) Remington 760 pump. But my 39 sports a 5D and I've never missed the micrometer adjustments on it.

AStone
April 9, 2007, 05:59 PM
Oh, man, it's good to be back...:)

In reference to Shrinkmd's post of 2 April. You can dry fire the 39 easily. On older models, simpely remove firing pin. On newer models with cross bolt, engage safety and hammer does not strike firing pinl.
JKing, that's great news. Not sure why I didn't think about that.

Mine's new, so has the CB safety.
(So there IS at least one benefit to having one of those, despite their draw backs... :neener: :p )

So, just to double check: there's no potential damage to hammer from doing this, even a lot?

That is, I wonder if anyone would make the argument that the hammer hitting the cross bolt could eventually cause it to weaken or something.

Not saying it will, just double checking that it won't.

Opinions?

Nem

tubeshooter
April 9, 2007, 08:29 PM
My opinion is that I still wouldn't dry fire, safety or not.

[EDIT: Thanks for the pic of the 5D also - gives me visual evidence I'm in the right ballpark with my elevation setting.]

skeeter1
April 9, 2007, 08:34 PM
My older 39D has the easy-to-remove firing pin, so no dry firing worries there. My much newer 1894 has the cross-bolt safety, and though I haven't dry-fired it a lot, so far no problems.

Brassman
April 9, 2007, 11:09 PM
Mechanically, there's no way the hammer could contact the firing pin with the safety on, on a new 39A. Just make sure the safety button is pushed all the way to the right. No red showing on the left.

Shrinkmd
April 9, 2007, 11:39 PM
While I'm debating peep tang vs receiver, any thoughts on replacing the front sight with something a little more modern, light gathering fiber optic? I know that mixing a peep tang with a fiber optic front sight is like putting a cell phone antennae on a horses saddle, but it would make iron sights a bit more useful, no?

What type would it take? Dovetail, or ramp? I'm browsing the Midwayusa catalog and getting a little bleary eyed, so many choices!

dfariswheel
April 9, 2007, 11:43 PM
Depends on what type of base you have on your rifle.

Most newer rifles have a ramp base. In that case, all you'd need is a front sight blade with the standard dovetail.

Measure the existing sight blade from the bottom of the actual sight blade's dovetail to the top of the blade to determine the height to order.

tubeshooter
April 10, 2007, 07:05 PM
Mechanically, there's no way the hammer could contact the firing pin with the safety on, on a new 39A. Just make sure the safety button is pushed all the way to the right. No red showing on the left.


I am glad to know this, even though I don't really plan on making a habit of putting it into action. I appreciate the info.


BTW, there have been some beautiful pics posted. Very nice.

AStone
April 11, 2007, 03:16 AM
My opinion is that I still wouldn't dry fire, safety or not.

I don't really plan on making a habit of putting it into action.

Tube, would you mind telling us why you object to that mode for dry fire?

I'm not being critical. Such a thing is a personal decision, and if it's just gut level,
that's fine and just as valid as some rational argument for doing it. :cool:

I'm just trying to evaluate the option and considering all angles.

Nem

yodar
April 11, 2007, 05:25 AM
Nematocyst

The reason why I never dry fire a .22 is that the firearm is targeted to crush the rim of the cartridge to ignite the primer. the absence of the rim means that force hits the receiver unbuffered by any brass rim.

yodar

tubeshooter
April 11, 2007, 08:18 AM
Nem:

Just a personal preference thing, I guess. Even though it may be mechanically safe and sound, I don't take it as a license to do it.


I can practice sight picture without dry firing
Waited too long/rifle is too nice for that IMO
Good way to get a ND/AD
Might be some unknown, unforseen impact on the gun



I have witnessed the result of a .22 that had dry-fire-itis. I don't want to do that to any of my guns. But like I said, it's nice to know that it should be alright "on paper".

Brassman
April 11, 2007, 09:54 AM
Even though it's not going to hurt anything to dry-fire the 39A with the safety on, I still don't do it. I don't dry fire anything except my double action revolvers for which I'm smoothing out the triggers. I dry-fire them all the time shooting the heads off of people on TV. Over the last 2 years or so I bet I have dry-fired my 642 and Ruger GP over 100,000 times and the triggers are still getting better. It's just a poor man's trigger job.

AStone
April 11, 2007, 05:04 PM
Thanks for your thoughts on dry-firing, folks.

All good food for thought.

I'll confess, I'm reluctant to do it with my 39A, too.

I like to dry fire my revolvers to smooth actions and triggers, and I'm even OK with doing it with my 336, but in this case, I think I'll just get my smith to do an action and trigger job on the 39, and be safe with it.

I'm learning a LOT here. Thanks to all for participating. Looking forward to MUCH more to come ... ;)

Nem

tubeshooter
April 11, 2007, 05:25 PM
Yeah, I'm in the Brassman camp. I'll dry fire my DA centerfire wheelguns, but that actually has the whole "poor man's trigger job" reasoning behind it.


Past that, I don't dry fire at all.

jkingrph
April 11, 2007, 07:27 PM
I was only commenting on the possibility of dry firing, looking at the mechanics of the old and new models, with considerations only to effects on the chamber. Personally I do not dry fire my rimfires.
Jeff

AStone
April 12, 2007, 02:29 AM
I'll dry fire my DA centerfire wheelguns, but that actually has the whole "poor man's trigger job" reasoning behind it.LOL.

Is that what it's called?

So, a real trigger job is better.

OK, let me go break my piggy bank....:rolleyes:

MP-43
April 12, 2007, 02:17 PM
I have been running into this problem recently with one of my 39s--with rounds in the magazing, the lever gets jammed in the fully open position. I assume that the cartridge stop is letting more that one shell out of the mag, as the usual remedy is to remove the mag tube and any ammo, and then shake out the offending round(s)from the receiver. When dissassembled, the cart. stop spring seems to work fine--loading the mag and depressing it manually yields good results. As far as I can tell there are no burrs or stickyness that would keep it in the down position.

I've tried swapping the cartridge stop from another 39 that works well, and it still jams...

Anyone else experience this, and if so, how did you fix it?

Thanks in advance,
Todd

dfariswheel
April 12, 2007, 07:33 PM
Without actually seeing the rifle, it's hard to diagnose something like this.
Some things to check:

Is the rifle clean? No fouling impacted around or under the cartridge stop?
Is the spacer under the cartridge stop?
Is the cartridge stop centered in it's cut? Not catching on one side of the cut?
Is the stop tightly locked in place with the screw tight or is the stop loose?
Any burrs or wear on the bolt where it activates the stop?
Is the rifle's magazine outer tube properly seated in the recess in the receiver?

MP-43
April 12, 2007, 11:02 PM
Thanks for the reply--to answer your questions:

Is the rifle clean? No fouling impacted around or under the cartridge stop?
-I gave it a thorough cleaning, paying extra attention to the cart. stop recess

Is the spacer under the cartridge stop?--It's in place with the flat side against the cart. stop and the contoured side against the receiver.

Is the cartridge stop centered in it's cut? Not catching on one side of the cut?
-It is centered--I tried pressing it different ways to see if I could make it catch--seems to work great. When I load the magazine and manually move the bolt back and forth (the gun is in two pieces at this point), it only feeds one cartridge at a time. When it's back together, it jams.

Is the stop tightly locked in place with the screw tight or is the stop loose?
-The screw is tight, but not over-torqued.

Any burrs or wear on the bolt where it activates the stop?
-The bolt has the usual wear, but nothing excessive. It is a '61 vintage rifle that worked well up until I gave it a good cleaning and replaced the lever spring-likely unrelated but it's really the only thing that I changed. The previous spring allowed the lever to flop around a good deal.

Is the rifle's magazine outer tube properly seated in the recess in the receiver?--It appears to be snug--no perceivable movement.

I have swapped out the cartridge stop and loosened up the lever spring for kicks, and the jamming has reduced in frequency, but it still happens once in every other mag full. Does wonders for your confidence.

Thanks again for any tips--

-Todd

dfariswheel
April 13, 2007, 12:16 AM
I suspect the cartridge carrier.

I'll take a look at mine tomorrow and see if I can narrow down where it might be a problem.

Fast Frank
April 13, 2007, 01:07 AM
Interesting that you guys would post about dry firing the model 39.

I recently found a pretty good sized stash of used golf balls in a box on a shelf at work.

After asking around and finding out that they had been sitting there for years and nobody remembers who they belonged to, I claimed them.

We have been having a grand old time with them.

Two or more rifles stand ready, a ball gets chunked out there, and it's on!

Hitting the ball requires that you get your shot off faster than the other guy.

The rapid fire thing means misses, and fast follow up shots.

SEVERAL times while doing this, I have pulled the trigger on my 39 and heard "click".

Bummer. I shot my rifle dry again.:eek: I hate it when that happens.:mad:

I've inspected the daylights out of it.

There's no sign that the firing pin is hitting the chamber.

The arms that hang down off of the bottom of the firing pin are designed in such a way that it stops the firing pin before it can hurt anything.

While I'm quite sure that dry firing the model 39 won't help it in any way, and I will never dry fire it on purpose, I'm also believing that it doesn't hurt it either.

This is a new style 39AS with the rebounding hammer, so what I just said might not apply to the older rifles.

MP-43
April 13, 2007, 11:01 AM
Thanks dfaris for the advice to check the shell lifter. Tried successfully to get the jamming to occur regularly. When cycling rounds thru with the muzzle pointed up, it jammed repeatedly. I was wrong when I assumed that the cart. stop was allowing more than one round to slip past; what appears to be happening is the cartridge rim gets stuck between the cartridge lifter and the pointy nose on the lower front portion of the bolt. A couple times I was able to clear the jam by smacking the lever with the palm of my hand--the ejected shell showed a decent nick on the outside edge of the rim. The other solution to clearing the jam was to simply point the muzzle down, at which point the shell slides forward and the mechanism works again. In cycling my other two 39s in the same fashion, no jams occurred, and from what I could see through the ejection port the shell never got as far back to cause any stoppage.

I'm going to polish the nose of the bolt and see what happens...

MP-43
April 13, 2007, 12:13 PM
Polished the edges and tip of the pointy part of the bolt that sticks out beneath the bolt face--rounded some of the roughness off and smoothed the angle where the rims were catching--so far the problem seems to be fixed! Cycled 200 rounds through w/o incident. On a separate happy note, Fed Ex just dropped off a long awaited CMP remington 513... Shaping up to be a pretty lucky Friday the 13th!

AStone
April 13, 2007, 04:35 PM
MP, glad to hear that you've making progress on the jam issue. I haven't had time to sit down and read carefully yet, so I'm still not quite sure I understand the parts that you and others are referring to, but reading with interest. I'll get out my manual this weekend and see if I can parse the situation for myself.

However, this statement rang a bell for me.

When cycling rounds thru with the muzzle pointed up, it jammed repeatedly.Very interesting. I've had two or three jam problems in my new 336A at the range. (I've only put about 100 rnds through it so far; still working on sighting issues.)

The jam was with the new cartridge being loaded in from the magazine. The spent case was ejected fine. The jam occurred after the new cart. had exited the magazine and was being lifted, but would not enter the chamber. I didn't pay enough attention at the time to the particulars. (Next time I go to the range, I'm going to carry my digital camera so I can record it if it happens again.)

And, to the point of your statement, it's interesting that all of them happened when I was working the action as I was pointing the rifle up (or at least significantly more up than horizontal, even if not totally vertical).

In all cases, I was able to quickly clear the "jam" simply by working the action gently and repeatedly (even if partially, since the jam prevented fully cycling) until the cartridge fell into place in the chamber.

I'm wondering: is it conceivable that something similar could be happening in my 336 that is going on in your 39? I'm not learned enough in the two guns yet to be able to know how similar their actions are at that detailed level.

Nem

dfariswheel
April 13, 2007, 06:10 PM
I sat down this afternoon and took a good look at the 39 action to refresh my understanding of the design.

HOW THE MARLIN 39 WORKS:

When the magazine is loaded, the first round bypasses the cartridge stop and feeds slightly into the receiver, being caught by the flat front face of the lug on the lower front of the bolt.

When the lever is operated and the bolt moves to the rear, that cartridge is actually dropped onto the trough of the cartridge carrier.

The NEXT round in the magazine is caught by the cartridge stop and prevented from entering the receiver.

As the lever is raised, the cartridge carrier pivots upward, positioning the cartridge in line with the bolt, which moves forward to chamber the round.

As the bolt moves forward, the cartridge carrier pivots downward, the lug on the lower front of the bolt presses the cartridge stop into it's recess, and allows the next round to be fed out of the magazine, which is caught by the flat front face of the bolt lug.

The reason the Model 39 can feed Short and Long, as well as Long Rifle length cartridges is because the cartridge stop is NOT what really regulates feeding from the magazine.
All the cartridge stop does is to prevent double feeding from the magazine.
The TIMING of the feed cycle is actually the lug on the lower front of the bolt.

For this reason, actual double feeds are caused by problems with the cartridge stop, but jams that SEEM to be double feeds are actually caused by problems with the bolt lug, or the cartridge carrier.

Because or the unique two-piece 39 receiver with the feed mechanism split between the two halves, it's difficult to diagnose whether you have an actual double feed, or a stoppage cause by something else.

What you want to see with the bolt, is that the triangular bolt lug is reasonably smooth on the front face and no unduly sharp edges or corners, with no burrs or roughness that might cause sticking or catching on the cartridges.
Bright polishing of bolt features does nothing for reliable operation, and may actually destroy the bolt.
SMOOTH is best, not mirror bright.

Some stoppages in the 39 are caused by the cartridge guide, (or lack of a guide) in the RIGHT receiver half.
Earlier rifles have a stamped, formed flat spring in a deep recess in the right receiver wall.
Later rifles have a heavy, spring-loaded pivoting steel block in the receiver wall, and newer rifles dispensed entirely with any cartridge guide in the right side at all.

If the cartridge guide is weak, dirt impacted, mis-formed, or otherwise defective, the rifle may jam, especially if it's not held level when the action operates.
The latest rifles with no cartridge guide are especially prone to this.

To check for proper operation and to look for possible stoppage causes, disassemble the receiver, press down on the ejector and rotate the slotted rivet to lock it down in the cleaning position.
Remove the firing pin from the bolt.

With the bolt OUT, load a single cartridge into the magazine.
(Needless to say, BE CAREFUL WHEN WORKING WITH LIVE AMMO).
That cartridge should be held in the magazine by the cartridge stop, until you press the stop into it's recess, at which point the cartridge should be pushed out of the magazine.
The stop should immediately spring back into position to catch the next round.

To test cartridge feed, load one two rounds into the magazine.
Install the bolt, then push the bolt forward to the closed position.
As the bolt is pushed forward, the lug on the bolt bottom should press the cartridge stop into it's recess, and allow the first cartridge to move partially out of the magazine, and be stopped by the flat front face of the bolt lug.

Move the bolt to the rear, the cartridge should drop into the receiver, and the next cartridge in the magazine should be caught and held in the magazine by the cartridge stop.

MOST mis-feed problems in the 39 are double feeds caused by the cartridge stop.

In the case where it's clearly not a double feed caused by the cartridge stop, or when the rifle is held level during operation, you should be looking for problems with the bolt lug or cartridge carrier.

dfariswheel
April 13, 2007, 06:16 PM
Nematocyst-870:

The Model 39 also has an UPPER cartridge guide in the "roof" of the receiver.
This is a simple curved flat spring that serves to prevent the cartridge tipping upward during brisk operation, and mis-aligning with the chamber.

In the case of your 336A, I suspect this is what's happening.
As the action is operated, especially with the barrel pointed upward, the cartridge is tipping upward and the bullet is catching on the rear chamber face.

You might look for a sharp edge on the upper rear of the barrel.

tubeshooter
April 13, 2007, 06:53 PM
Thanks, dfariswheel.


This thread is turning out to be a great resource, indeed. The 336 thread, too. I'm glad to see it.

AStone
April 13, 2007, 07:08 PM
Wheel, thanks. Makes sense. I'll check it carefully this weekend and report back.

Nem

IV Troop
April 15, 2007, 09:57 AM
Marlin Mountie 20" w/ 2x7 Burris compact


http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/IV_Troop/dec2006212.jpg

Brassman
April 15, 2007, 02:31 PM
Hey Mo,
That rabbit makes me want dumplin's really bad. Nice picture! Where was it taken? The landscape almost looks like the Outer Banks of NC around Buxton with snow, which doesn't happen too often. I'm sure it's from somewhere different, but that's where I thought of when I saw it.

AStone
April 15, 2007, 03:16 PM
Welcome, Troop. Nice mountie.

That shorter barrel just appeals to me so much. Raises thoughts again about lopping a few inches off of my 39A ... (that is, letting my smith do it).

What kind of groups can you get with it at, say, 50 yds and 100 yds when using a bench rest?

Where was it taken? I'll put my quarter on somewhere in the great basin desert between NW NM & eastern WA.

SwampWolf
April 15, 2007, 04:33 PM
Great photo- I'm going to guess Arizona.

AStone
April 15, 2007, 05:05 PM
It really is a great photo. The earth tone colors just balance out so well ...

Brassman
April 18, 2007, 12:39 PM
I can't believe it's been almost three days with no posts to this thread.

I will be taking my 39A out to a friend's farm on Friday to pick up some tomato plants. I think I'll hang around the edge of his woods and call a few crows to join me and the 39A. Maybe we can have a party! If I have no luck, there's always tin cans.

IV Troop
April 19, 2007, 01:53 AM
Thanks for the positive comments on the photo.

This was taken this last December while I was home. I was hunting down on the Idaho/Nevada line out on the "sagebrush sea" of the Great Basin.

IV Troop
April 19, 2007, 01:57 AM
I forgot to add a reply to 870s question. I cannot recall group sizes but if my memory serves correct at 75 yards where it is zeroed a quarter will cover five shots.

Basically it is minute of Jackalope out to 125 yards or so.;)

AStone
April 19, 2007, 03:10 AM
...at 75 yards where it is zeroed a quarter will cover five shots.Very nice, and good enough for me.

I'm thinking I'll end up cutting my 39A barrel down. I just really like a shorter barrel for handling. <heresy>

MP-43
April 19, 2007, 11:57 AM
Final update--my 39 is feeding well--haven't been able to make it jam, regardless of the angle I hold it at. A little careful smoothing of rough edges made all the difference.

Now to spur discussion--Got a couple questions for the group--first one is: what vintage 39 has given you the best performance overall--build quality, accuracy on paper, etc? I saw a cherry '78 39A over the weekend for a decent price, but I know nothing about Marlin quality control in the 70s. I know it looked nice, had good polish, and the seams were tight, but they wouldn't let me crack her open to peek inside. Given that there are tack drivers and lemons in every bunch, are there any conclusions that can be drawn? I had an 39 made in 1985 that looked and handled great, but wouldn't do better than 1.5" @ 50 scoped, and with the ammo it liked best(traded for the '61 I have been working on), while the Mountie I have, made in 1969 will do .5" at 50 with a $30 scope.

Second question--having decided to upgrade to a scope that is worthy of the gun it is mounted on, what kind of scopes have you found to give good performance at a good price? I checked out the rimfire Leupolds, and while the quality is evident and the size just about right, the friction adjustment knobs (no click adjustments) turned me off. Looking for the good/bad/and ugly of your search for the perfect scope for your 39A.

Thanks!

Brassman
April 19, 2007, 01:18 PM
Yes I certainly do have news access. I just didn't want this thread to remain off the front pages too long and needed something to get started with.

I meant no disrespect or irreverance to the victims or their families at Va. Tech.

dfariswheel
April 19, 2007, 05:39 PM
MP-43:

With Marlin's there really is no preferred era for accuracy, they all seem to shoot with a high degree of accuracy.

As for quality, meaning fit and finish, like most things, the earlier the better.

It seems that the super tight fit of wood to metal started dropping the most in the mid-1970's, but doesn't seem to have gotten much worse since the mid-1980's.

The older rifles made up until sometime in the late 1960's?? had the butt stock fitted by induction heating the receiver tangs, and pressing the wood on.
This actually "scorched" the wood to a tight fit, and on many older rifles you can see scorching on the wood if you remove the stock.
I don't know if Marlin still does this or not.

It looks like at some point Marlin stopped fitting the wood as closely to the rear tang areas, leaving a gap between the tangs and the wood and the receiver bolsters, but still very tight on the tang sides.

In any event, more recent rifles have gaps at the rear of the tangs, and don't meet the receiver bolsters as tightly as older guns.
The quality of the actual metal work seems to still be high, and accuracy is as good as anything in the past.

Where Marlin has compromised is in the use of the rebounding hammer and the cross-bolt safety. This is an abomination to traditionalist, but DOES make the rifle safer for the average shooter.

Another area where things have fallen is in the walnut. It's gotten lighter and lighter since the late 1970's, until it's an almost blond color today.
This is a pattern that seems to have affected all gun makers over the same time frame, and is probably due to the expense and difficulty in getting good American walnut.

In the older guns, every now and then you see some really fancy figured walnut turn up. Today's guns seem to be pretty plain wood without even the nice straight grain as used on the guns made in the late 1940's and early 1950's.

Bottom line is, for shooting purposes there are seldom bad Marlin's of any era.
For quality of fit and finish, and appearance of wood, the older guns are better.

JustsayMo
April 19, 2007, 11:03 PM
My oldest 39 is a 1964 39A Mountie. It has a identical twin 1965 vintage. Both seem to digest most rimfire ammo and keep it under an inch at 50 yards (sometimes better, sometimes worsel. operater caused) with iron sights. Wood is not spectacular but I've grown to appreciate the non-shiney finish that was used in that era. Fit is pretty good.

My 1974 vintage 39A with the PG stock and longer barrel is probably the smoothest of the bunch. Wood is the best too, but still pretty plain. Accuracy its very good. I''ve managed nickle sized groups with it at 50 yards. It is somewhat finicky but likes more ammo than it dislikes.

My late eighties/early nineties 39TDS (unsure of exact vintage) is with its prefered ammo the most accurate of the bunch. It is very finicky but luckily one of the ammo brands it shoots well is the Federal Bulk. Amazingly, it shoots the CB longs quite well too. I've managed some impressive 100 yard groups with this rifle. I can't fairly access the fit and finish of this carbine because it came to me in bad shape. It was abused and neglected. Some cleaning, a few new parts (ejector group) and some firing pin truing and the little TDS impressed me. Eventually I found the Mountie(s) to be better suited for my needs and traded it off. Probably should have kept it... but that's the way it goes.

IV Troop
April 19, 2007, 11:48 PM
Another pic of my Mountie:

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/IV_Troop/dec2006061-1.jpg

AStone
April 20, 2007, 03:31 AM
Well, another week at work just ate my lunch. Two more days (yep, got to work Saturday again). What ever convinced me that owning my own business was a good idea?

Catching up on reading this thread along with a can of my favorite beverage before bed. Such interesting reading. Wishing I could get to the range tomorrow, the only dry day in the next several. My firing pin issue on the 39 is not yet resolve. Firing pin is still sitting in the window sill awaiting filing down the stop according to Mo's directions. Soon, I hope.

I checked out the rimfire Leupolds, and while the quality is evident and the size just about right, the friction adjustment knobs (no click adjustments) turned me off. Looking for the good/bad/and ugly of your search for the perfect scope for your 39A.MP, I like my Leupold rimfire a LOT even with the "clickless" adjustments. In fact, I gotta say, I appreciate the "clicklessness" of it, but I like the ability to use my own gut-level sense of how far to move it without being constrained by the makers clicks.

Troop, another great photo. What's the scope?

Wheel, until tonight I missed your masterpiece essay in post 186 on how the 39A works. Excellent writing. Even without my 39 in my hands, I followed most of your descriptions. Look forward to working through it again with rifle in hand ... once work lets up just a bit ...

This continues to be an informative learning experience for me. Thanks to all who are contributing.

Nem

IV Troop
April 20, 2007, 07:03 AM
870,

The scope is an old Burris 2x7 compact that I had for the longest time on my lightweight 270 I use for hunting in the steeper stuff. The last 4 years or so it has been on the marlin and I think that is where it is staying.

I also have the same scope on an AR/M4. It is an ideal scope for that purpose too, at least it is about perfect for me.

AStone
April 21, 2007, 12:26 AM
Rabbit recipes. (http://www.bowhunting.net/susieq/rabbit.html)

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-tailed_Jackrabbit):

The high prevalence of disease and parasites in jackrabbits also affects human predation - many hunters will not gather the jackrabbits they shoot, and those that do are well advised to wear gloves while handling carcasses and to cook the meat thoroughly. Most hunting of jackrabbits is done for pest control or sport.But then, if you're hungry, just cook it thoroughly...

Brassman
April 21, 2007, 11:33 PM
Was just curious as to how much everyone cleans their 39A's. I have heard a lot of folks never clean the barrel, just the action. I've had mine for a little over 2 years, and it probably has 1000-1500 rounds through it. The only thing I've ever done to the barrel is run a boresnake through it. I have cleaned the action with Hoppe's #9 several times, but have not been religious about cleaning up very much on the .22 like I have my 336C. What do you think? Should I get ready for a crucifixion for not cleaning more?:uhoh:

AStone
April 21, 2007, 11:51 PM
Should I get ready for a crucifixion for not cleaning more?OK, get the nails out. Let's get this guy. :fire:

Only kidding. :p

My cleaning habits seem to be evolving,
but I'm not saying from what to what until I read some other opinions. :uhoh:
(Hey, no sense in getting two of us strung up... :D )

Looking forward to reading opinions about this one .... :scrutiny:

dfariswheel
April 21, 2007, 11:53 PM
THAT opens a huge can of worms.

Whether to clean a .22 rim fire or not is a popular topic on the internet.

The 1950 Marlin I now own was owned by an extended family and an unknown number of people used it over the years.
I doubt the bore was ever cleaned in all those years, and it's in mint condition.

On the other hand, I prefer to protect my guns with a rust proofing lube.
So, after shooting the Marlin, I disassemble it, lock down the ejector, and put a rod down the bore.
At the muzzle I attach a loop-type patch holder and a patch. I coat the patch with CLP Breakfree, and PULL the patch back to the chamber, where it's removed.
Since all rods will flex, this prevents bumping or rubbing the bore, and pulling it from muzzle to chamber prevents damaging the muzzle.

The CLP removes any fouling, and prevents rust. I've done this on .22's for many years, and I haven't had one rust or degrade in accuracy.

Modern .22 ammo is not corrosive like the old 1920's and 1930's stuff was, but make no mistake, a .22 bore darned well CAN rust under the right conditions, and modern .22 ammo does NOT "coat the bore" with rust preventing materials.

Modern .22 ammo isn't corrosive, and the lead bullets don't foul most RIFLE barrels like jacketed ammo.
So, you can get away with not cleaning it and you'll be OK UNLESS you happen to hit on a situation where it can rust.

The action is another story. It should be cleaned fairly often to prevent corrosion, and wear caused by gritty fouling.

AStone
April 21, 2007, 11:57 PM
...and PULL the patch back to the chamber, where it's removed.
Since all rods will flex, this prevents bumping or rubbing the bore, and pulling it from muzzle to chamber prevents damaging the muzzle.Ah, very smart.

I think I've been told that elsewhere, but had forgotten. Great idea.

And, I've got some CLP on hand.

Do you like it better than Hoppes, or is one about as good as the other?

Brassman
April 22, 2007, 12:08 AM
Wheel - Do you use CLP on the action also?

I'll have to look for your answer tomorrow. I just realized it's after midnight and I gotta go to work in the morning! (Lutheran music director) I'll be back on after 12:30 edt. Thanks so far for the replies.

Danny Creasy
April 22, 2007, 12:11 AM
Here is my Model 39A:

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f169/sheffieldshootr/Marlin39A-1.jpg

It is actually my daughters favorite plinker. But, my 9422 is a bit more accurate.

AStone
April 22, 2007, 01:28 AM
Welcome to the club, Sheff.

Right nice lookin' rifle.

SwampWolf
April 22, 2007, 02:39 AM
If not crucified I might get burned at the stake for this bit of heresy: because I suspect that, over time, disassembly and reassembly of firearms like the 39 can result in a gradual degradation of the fit between parts and because, as others have noted, I feel that the main purpose of running a cleaning rod down the bore of a typical .22 rimfire serves more to protect the bore than to clean it, on those times I think it needs it I VERY judiciously run a rod with a patch containing a preservative down the bore from the muzzle to the breech. I take extreme care to avoid touching the crown of the muzzle with the rod. There are times, of course, when a disassembly and thorough cleaning is merited.

This procedure isn't so unusual as many rifles (and, with the exception of Dan Wesson, all revolvers) are made so that cleaning/protecting the bore can only be done practically via the muzzle.

Brassman
April 22, 2007, 01:11 PM
I forgot to mention that when I run the boresnake through the barrel that I soak the snake in Hoppes #9 after the first pass. I guess that could qualify as giving the barrel a dose of rust prevention. I'm still curious about the CLP on the action though. If I switched to using CLP on the barrel, could it be used on the action too?

dfariswheel
April 22, 2007, 01:59 PM
CLP Breakfree does include a "cleaner" function, but it's somewhat misunderstood.

The "cleaner" part of CLP really means the lube keeps fouling soft and allows the action to "sweep" it out of the way of moving parts, allowing the gun to continue to function.

While it can be used as a field cleaner, it has no effect on copper fouling, and isn't all that good a bore solvent, EXCEPT it can work with .22 rim fire as long as there's no leading.

When I actually clean the bore, I use Hoppe's. I also use it for the action, since it works better/faster than CLP for that.

With that said, other than .22 revolvers and autos, I seldom see any real bore fouling in rifles, especially not in high grade barrels like the Marlin.
So unless your particular rifle OR ammo produces fouling, all that's really necessary is to prevent corrosion.
This is a matter of how you store the gun, and hows the weather where you live.

Although there was one occasion where I was staying at a cabin for a week, and a mouse PEED on a Colt Trooper Mark III .22 and caused the muzzle and bore to corrode.
I have to say that that was a special case.
(Never did get a clear shot at the little vandal).

Brassman
April 22, 2007, 02:15 PM
Most of the time I store my 39A in its Marlin cloth case or it is stored by the door awaiting the casual squirrel. The last I looked we didn't have too much trouble with mice in the house, so I should be OK just staying with my Hoppe's for both the barrel and the action. Besides, I use Hoppe's so much that my wife thinks it's some kind of expensive aftershave lotion anyway.

skeeter1
April 23, 2007, 02:01 AM
At the muzzle I attach a loop-type patch holder and a patch. I coat the patch with CLP Breakfree, and PULL the patch back to the chamber, where it's removed.
Since all rods will flex, this prevents bumping or rubbing the bore, and pulling it from muzzle to chamber prevents damaging the muzzle.


That's a good tip. I'll give you one more that I learned from my dad: Don't screw the bore cleaning tool tightly into the rod, particularly a bore brush. Screw it in, and then back it out about two turns. That way it can follow the rifling rather than scratch across it.

My 39 has micro-groove rifling, and lead fowling has never been much of a problem. I'm also a big fan of using Breakfree CLP for just about everthing, and since it's still going strong after 36 years, it would take a lot to convince me to change.

MP-43
April 24, 2007, 07:34 AM
Anyone else get a sling from marlin lately? The one I received a couple months back smelled like it was tanned in gasoline. I wrapped it in newspaper and left it on a radiator to mellow out a bit...turned the paper translucent each time. The smell was distinctively petroleum-related, and three months later it still reeks. Any idea what I can do to clean it w/o ruining the leather?

Thanks,
MP

AStone
April 24, 2007, 03:45 PM
MP, if it were me, I'd call Marlin and ask if that's normal. :scrutiny:

If they say "no", get them to replace it. If they say "yes", I'd return it promptly for a refund or credit.

I've got Quake Claws on all 3 of my long guns (even my shotgun), and couldn't be happier. Not exactly a classic look - they're synthetic, not leather or cloth - but at least it doesn't smell like petrol.

Nem

Brassman
April 26, 2007, 03:53 PM
The Padded Super Sling is what I have on my 39A. It does double duty on the 336 as well. I think I got mine at Wal-Mart for about $25, but you can go to Outdoor Connections and order one online for about the same price. What attracted me was the ease of adjustment with one hand. Sometime I wish that I had bought the unpadded version as the pad sometimes gets in my way, but if I have to carry the rifle a long way, I appreciate the pad.

AStone
April 28, 2007, 05:09 AM
I just finished another week from hell at work.

For now, I'll just write this:

This thread is an inspiration.
It helps me keep going right now.

It's nice to come here
to read such ... knowledge, wisdom and ... well, fun.

I'd rather be at the range (or better, in the woods)
this weekend with my 39 than at work (which is where I'll be).

Glad you're all here contributing to a knowledge of 39's.

Nem,

(who's 39 is still without a functional firing pin -
it's sitting on one of my two work benchs waiting for modification;
did I mention that "week from hell at work"? -
but who is living 39-dom vicariously in this thread,
and who will get my barrel cut down to 18-20" asap...<heresy!>)

Bentonville
April 28, 2007, 09:49 AM
dfarriswheel, or anyone else who has replaced their rear sight, do you want to sell the rear elevaror or the complete sight you took off that beautiful rifle so I can put it on my 1947 39A? I presume not but if I don't ask, I sure can't receive. Thanks anyway.

xx78
April 28, 2007, 04:21 PM
I'm in. My Dad bought the 39 Mountie in the early 60s and gave it to me when I was 13 or so. I still use it to hunt tree rats and such. Its a great rifle that will be passed down one day.

AStone
April 28, 2007, 04:51 PM
There's a great little thread over here (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=184608) singing the praises of 39s.

I think xx78 joined us from there.

Welcome, XX. :)

Hopefully, others will drop by the club as well.

Nem

utgopher
April 29, 2007, 09:16 PM
I have owned my 39A since I traded a nice Remington pump .22 for it in the early 60's. I've it ever since and it is agreat gun. I shooot it weekly at our public range and of course take it hunting. I have a "thing" for .22 of all kinds.

Sturgeon333
April 29, 2007, 10:26 PM
I'm a first time gun owner. Or I will be when my Marlin 39 arrives--ordered it new last week. I looked at the Browning BL-22 and the Henry Golden Boy. Both seemed decent models, but the Browning was too small for me and the Henry a little too much "bling" for my tastes. So the Marlin it was.

I intend to use the Marlin to learn to shoot and have some fun at the same time. Not yet a hunter so the squirrels will be safe for now.

In Canada there is a fairly lengthy licensing process to go through before you are able to own a firearm. So I've been a little bit like a kid waiting for Christmas. Ordered the gun the day I got my license.

Thanks for starting this thread. I've learned a lot already.

AStone
April 29, 2007, 10:39 PM
Gopher and Sturgeon, welcome.

I see you're both new at THR. Fantastic forum. Let us know if we can help you find anything. (Sturgeon, we're honored you made your first post here. Glad this thread has been of value.)

MP-43
May 1, 2007, 12:00 PM
What has been your most spectacular long-range shot (dumb luck or pure skill) with a 39? There are few things I like more than setting up reactive targets at well beyond .22 range, and then walking the shots in. My best effort was hitting a clay pigeon at 200 yards, off hand, iron sights, on the second shot out of a Win. 9422. This falls into the "dumb-luck" category for sure, but I for one would like to hear about other feats of .22 stretching, planned or otherwise.

Thanks for making a slow work day a little more interesting..

AStone
May 1, 2007, 02:56 PM
Sounds like an interesting exercise, MP.

I can't claim any thing significant with my 39, since it's new. And really, even though I've owned .22 before, even with them, I've got no impressive stories to tell about marksmanship at excessive distances.

But I'll read with interest. I'm betting there are potentially some useful ... um, knowledge and even skills that we can learn from such a discussion.

AStone
May 2, 2007, 03:59 AM
Every once in a while, just out of curiosity, I open Rifle Country, then click on "Views".
That action ranks all the currently active threads in rifle country by number of views.

Consistently, this thread about the 39 ranks at or near the top of the list.

Tonight, we're at the top (just below the stickies) at 5,485 views.

I find this fascinating in an age of AK, AR, long-range bolt guns, etc,
that a "lowly" lever gun can garner so much attention.

I struggle to understand it.

Opinions?

panther22
May 2, 2007, 09:12 AM
I'm in. I recently found one I've been looking for, for awhile. A Golden 39A, takedown model, in excellent shape. I had to pay $350 for it. They don't come cheap around here.

Brassman
May 2, 2007, 11:45 AM
Simplicity is the word that best describes any lever gun, espcially a Marlin. There are so many things that can go wrong with a semi-auto that I can see why people are in love with levers. Then there's the nostalgia thing, "my Grandpa had one and he loved it and relied on it, so it must be fitting for me to own one too". It's a take-down arm and so easy to store in a backpack, etc. It's purty...it's made of wood and steel the way it's supposed to be.....compared to a fancy black rifle that somehow, at least for older people, resembles something out of science fiction and cannot be more than a toy. Of course we know black rifles are far from just toys, it's just an old perception. Just my opinions.

Brassman
May 2, 2007, 12:27 PM
Now that I have my Skinner aperture rear sight and have taken off my scope, I can't think of anything I dislike about my 39A. Yeah, it has a 24" barrel and it makes the weapon a little long and heavy, but more accurate than most other .22's. I can live with a little extra weight and length if I know where I aim is where the bullet is going to go.

plattski
May 2, 2007, 01:25 PM
I've got a grooved scope mount rail supposed to be for a 39A that came with a .22 scope I bought on eBay. I'm keeping the scope and rings but I'll give the rail and mounting screws to the first reply to plattski at hotmail.com. Send a shipping address.

saltydog452
May 2, 2007, 10:12 PM
I lost mine. E-Mail follows. Thanks.

salty

plattski
May 2, 2007, 11:14 PM
Saltydog,
I got your email and will send the mount tomorrow. I hope it works for you. Enjoy!

saltydog452
May 3, 2007, 12:24 AM
I've had mine since the late 60s and its been fun.

I changed the original front sight to a Lyman 17 AHB and the rear to a 66 MC sometine in the mid 70s.

Then my eyesight started changing and I gradually started using larger aperatures untill I finally had to remove the rear peep altogether.

A couple of deades later and another sight change was required. A 'flip up' rear with a dab of paint under the notch and a humongus front with a wide stripe on the face. Together, they made a kinda, sorta vertical 'post'.

Now it looks like I will need to use a telescope if I am going to be able to get anywhere near what I know the 39 to be capable of.

Thank you for the offer. Please include a return address.

salty.

borrowedtime69
May 3, 2007, 02:35 AM
so, in keeping with the old west rifle style, how many 39 marlin owners remove the front site hood, or do you just keep it on anyway to prevent glare? has anyone replaced the modern front sight with an aftermarket one that is, i think, the bead site?

also, do any of you get feeding "hiccups" while working the lever? for me, it happens approximately between every tube mag ful to every 2-3 mags full. i'll get one round that refuses to go in unless i back off on the lever and pull it back up again to feed the round into the chamber. i took it to a VERY reliable smith who did some cleaning, polishing, etc, but said it didnt happen for him and he saw nothing wrong with the gun. is the 39 a bit sensitive to slight anomilies while working the lever? ive switched from cci mini mag HP's to Mini-mag solid LRN and the feeding got a little better, but every once in a while, i get the hiccup. any thoughts? thanks -Eric

SwampWolf
May 3, 2007, 03:28 AM
Actually, I like the looks of the hood even though I prefer traditional appearance. Most Winchester standard Model 94s were equipped with sight hoods for decades even though not many hoods were in place on 94s during the waning years of the "Wild West" when the carbine started its long and illustrious career. I keep the hood afixed to my 39 unless I'm hunting squirrels when there's little ambient light.

Brassman
May 3, 2007, 07:52 AM
The hood is still on mine, but I painted the post with glow-in-dark paint. I can still barely see it in low light. Just enough to put the front sight on target.

MP-43
May 3, 2007, 10:38 AM
Does the round get caught on the top edge of the chamber, or does it not even make it that far up? If it's the top of the chamber, it could be that the flat cartridge guide spring isn't doing its job. Among other minor issues, my 39 had this problem on and off until I replaced that part. When a 39 is running right, it should be able to feed well, regardless of how the lever is worked (at least in my limited exp.)

Brassman
May 3, 2007, 10:16 PM
Can someone who uses aperture sights tell me if a thin straight post for a front sight improves accuracy that much? I have the original front sight on my 39A still, but it seems to cover up most of small targets beyond 25 yds. I was just wondering if I could do better with a thin post without the ball on top up front. I really like the Skinner aperture rear sight for fast sighting, just wondering about the front sight now that I have the new rear one installed.

VA27
May 3, 2007, 11:36 PM
I'm currently in the process of restoring a 1906 vintage model 1897. The gun belonged to my wife's grandfather on her mother's side. She remembers shooting the gun when she was very little, and that her grandfather always carried a coat hanger to knock the empty shell out because it wouldn't extract.

Well, her brother recently "discovered" the old gun and brought it to her. The only internal parts in the gun were the hammer and trigger, the bolt assembly and the lever! All other internal parts and the butt plate are gone.

The bore is so bad you can "chamber" a cartridge in the muzzle. When I get all the parts together and get it running, I'll have the bore lined, but I'll leave the outside looking just as is. The wife said that if a total refinish was done it wouldn't be grandpa's gun anymore!

Yesterday my gun shop called and they finally found a carrier! It's been so long collecting the parts that I can't find the rest of them! I put them away and now I can't remember where! The search begins...again.:D

dfariswheel
May 4, 2007, 01:10 AM
Brassman:
A military typer post sight works very well, since you align the top of the sight on the target, and the aperture rear is automatically centered by your eye.
I've never been a fan of the bead type front sights.

Unfortunately, it's very hard to find post sights.
I had to resort to fitting a blank sight on my recently restored 1950 model.
I ordered this .065" sight from Brownell's, and fitted it to the ramp:

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/productdetail.aspx?p=55&s=333

Most of the filing is done to the bottom of the SIGHTS dovetail, and a slight amount to the sides of the dovetail, NOT the ramp.
You can do most of it with a triangular needle file. To remove metal from the base, lay a sheet of metal-type sand cloth on a flat surface and rub the sights dovetail over it.

After you have it a nice, tight fit in the ramp, carefully shorten it to get it on target, and shape it to suit how you want it to look.
Finish with cold blue or flat black paint.

VA27:
Here's some sources for Marlin 39 parts.

http://www.jackfirstgun.com/ (PRIME source, you have to CALL).

http://www.e-gunparts.com/

http://www.gun-parts.com/index.html/

http://www.poppertsgunparts.com/index.htm

http://www.wisnersinc.com/

http://www.hoosiergunworks.com/catalog/comm_misc_m_z.html#marlin

http://www.parts4guns.com/ (click on Marlin and WAIT).

http://www.chasjonesgunparts.citymax.com/page/page/1800461.htm

JustsayMo
May 4, 2007, 09:39 AM
Brassman wrote: "Can someone who uses aperture sights tell me if a thin straight post for a front sight improves accuracy that much? I have the original front sight on my 39A still, but it seems to cover up most of small targets beyond 25 yds. I was just wondering if I could do better with a thin post without the ball on top up front. I really like the Skinner aperture rear sight for fast sighting, just wondering about the front sight now that I have the new rear one installed."

I use the Skinner Sights on my 1895 and 39A Mountie. I have a straight post on my 1895GS and and the original on the mountie. I believe the straight post does improve precision, but it took me a few trips to the range to get used to it. The trade off for me was it is a little bit tougher for me to see in lower light.

I've also found that a slightly smaller, ~.065" aperture is a good compromise (for me, anyway). The Skinners come with .096" apertures which I believe is great for field accuracy, lacks precision on the paper. The smaller aperture gives up some field of view but sharpens the sight picture and target better for me. I'm able to achieve better precision with even less eye strain.

The typical Marlin front bead covers 6" at 50 yards and 12" at 100 yards, which is somewhat handy for range finding (i.e. if two or more bead widths measure on the side of an Elk, he's inside of 100 yards, two in a deer and he's inside of 75 yards) it does make precision shooting challenging. It took me a lot of repetitions to consistently center the bullseye on the top edge of that bead, but I had fun the whole time I was doin' it :D

Doublet
May 4, 2007, 09:44 AM
I noticed a owners manual on ebay for a Marlin 39M

AStone
May 5, 2007, 02:50 AM
I cut and pasted this (below) from the 336 club to here (with slight edits). Not much energy left after this week. Please know that my absence from the club house is NOT an indication that I've lost interest. Far from it.

I'm just overwhelmed with work ... and will continue to be for a while.
But I'm reading with interest.

I miss being here more ... Keep it up, folks. Glad to see new members.

_________

Well, another work week done.

(Actually, since I have to work weekends right now - new business - the next one begins tomorrow. I'll be at work both Saturday and Sunday (for weeks to come...) But at least the client presence pressure is off for Saturday and Sunday since I'm "closed" those days doing catch up work ... I'd sure rather be at the range ... )

As a result, I haven't been around my favorite threads much this week. I miss them. I am reading, with interest on every break I can afford. It's nice to take a few minutes break and read up on my favorite rifles.

My business has shifted gears. I've got three major projects that started up unexpectedly, and all at the same time. They're a good thing for the business, but they're going to reduce the time that I have to spend in the club here significantly for a while. ... But the business must take precedence for a while. It'll slack off some by summer.

I'll be here as often as I can, learning new stuff. I'm reading everyday.

Nem

Brassman
May 9, 2007, 11:43 AM
I'm not sure I need a thinner front post! I took the 39A to the range the other day and was shooting quarter-size groups with just my elbow on the bench for support at 25 yards. If the target gets more than 50 yds away I probably couldn't see the target well enough to notice that my factory front sight is covering it up. Still practicing with the new Skinner rear aperture and getting used to it. I did order a Skinner front straight post, though. It was only $15. I'll install it maybe later this summer and experiment with it to see if I get better results. I still love shooting this rifle, especially when it costs about 2 cents per shot.

tubeshooter
May 9, 2007, 06:51 PM
Quick question....

I currently have a Williams 5D on my 39A.... it was a newer non-D&T'd rifle, but when the sight came in the gunsmith went ahead and did a D&T for me since the sight that was sent required it.

Well... the 5D works fine, but it sits higher that I'd like and I'm concerned that the "apeture arm" (for lack of knowledge of the proper terminology) could break if it gets hit just so.


So I'm thinking about trying a Skinner, which installs on the top of the receiver and has a classic look that I like better. My question is... can I just remove the "aperture arm" on my Williams, get the Skinner put on and still retain the Williams base? It's secured in with blue loctite, and I would consider it a backup; if the Skinner gets damaged or I don't like it, I'll just take it off and put the 5D aperture arm back on.

I don't see any reason why this plan shouldn't work, but if somebody knows something I don't please let me know. Thanks, y'all....

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