IMR4064 Powder for M1?


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pdh
March 24, 2007, 11:42 AM
I religiously use IMR4895 powder for reloading my M1. What about IMR4064?
I thought I heard that it is also a good powder for the M1......does not beat the op rod or damage the gas sytem ect????
I got some loads ready for testing with the IMR4064....just want to double check ..........................

Here is a 50yd target I shot a full clip.....with loads using IMR4895.


http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o312/hainespd/M1ftarget.jpg

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U.S.SFC_RET
March 24, 2007, 01:14 PM
pdh those are great looking groups with that M1. I've got a pound of 4064 that i'm getting ready to reload with and I have ordered 8 lbs of IMR 4895. From what I understand IMR is a true proven powder. 4064 I gues is the same way. Take it over to the reloading board and they will help you out there.

Steve in PA
March 24, 2007, 02:20 PM
IMR-4064 is indeed a good powder for the M1 and many shooters are happy with it. When I was working up loads for my M1, I got better groups using IMR-4895 over IMR-4064, so I stuck with 4895.

ADKWOODSMAN
March 24, 2007, 02:44 PM
When competing in High Power with the M1 I used IMR 4064 because I also used it in my .308 hunting rifles. It was very consistent but sheered a little hard in my RCBS powder measure. That wasn't much of a concern though.

Vitamin G
March 24, 2007, 05:56 PM
anyone who has already weighed in care to post a quick pet load? I'm going to be breaking out the m1 and the 4064 tomorrow.

pdh
March 24, 2007, 06:19 PM
Guys..I just heard that generally accuracy was better using IMR4064.

Will test these loads in the next few days and see what happens.

Thanks so much for the replies

SlamFire1
March 24, 2007, 07:38 PM
Arguing which powder is better, 4064 or 4895 is an old debate, and never resolved. I use 4895 because it meters better. Hate weighing charges, though I doubt it really matters with either.

4064 is the slowest powder you should use in a Garand. Or an M1a. I did some load testing and can recommend for a Garand the load I chronographed below. It is just within the proper velocity range for a Garand. The Garand is not to be hot rodded, keep the 150 grain bullet about 2700 fps, the 168 grain about 2650 fps, no faster either with the 175.

168 gr Sierra Match 48.0 IMR 4064 wtd LC66NM WLR OAL 3.30"
5 May 00 T=82F

Ave Vel = 2653
Std Dev = 9
ES 27
Low 2645
High 2672
N = 9

Sunray
March 24, 2007, 09:23 PM
IMR4064 tends to be more consistently accurate than IMR4895 with 165 grain hunting bullets and 168 grain match bullets. However, you need to shoot for group at at least 100 yards first. Shooting at 50 yards really isn't a good test of any load.
"...pet load..." There's no point. No two rifles will shoot the same ammo the same way.
"...keep the 150 grain bullet about 2700 fps, the 168 grain about 2650 fps..." Nope. .30 M2 ammo used during W.W. II ran at 2800fps. 2650fps was the velocity of the .30 M1 ammo the rifle was designed to use. 2700fps was the original velocity of the ammo that became .30 M2.

pdh
March 25, 2007, 06:49 AM
Thanks for your load data SlamFire1.....

Vitamin G
March 25, 2007, 10:11 PM
Jeebus! A standard dev. of 9 with a 9shot sample???

I'm gonna be trying that one!

cracked butt
March 25, 2007, 10:44 PM
I tried imr 4895 with 168 gr bullets and wasn't very impressed, 4064 shoots much better with these bullets in my M1. YMMV.

Swampy
March 26, 2007, 08:36 AM
IMR-4064 behind a 168-175 grain Match bullet has been the perennial Highpower target load in the M1 rifle for the last 5 decades.

Military 4895 has been the standard military powder in most of the M2 ball lots made by Lake City and most other US makers of M2.

Both are good in the M1 rifle......

Personally, I've never had much luck with 4064, but truthfully, I have not been extrememly diligent in pursuing loads with that powder.

My Match Grade .308 M1's do just fine with 4895 for the short line loads, and shoot fabulous with Re-15 at the 600 line.

For my JCG rifles ammo is usually issued at the Matches. At those matches where you are allowed-have to bring your own, 4895 and the SMK 168 are difficult to beat.

Last Spring at the St. Louis Bench Rest Club's JCG I shot my old '42 Danish return M1 with the VAR tube. A very accurate M1 when fed handloads.... it won't shoot M2 at all. With 4895 and SMK 168's I cleaned the SR target @ 200 with 14 x's. Don't see much reason to even try another powder with this one.... :)

Just my 2 bits,
Swampy

Garands forever

10X
March 26, 2007, 10:17 AM
I have had better results with 4064 than with 4895. 4895 would give me groups of 1" to 1.5" depending on the rifle. 4064 would give me sub 1" groups, 48 grains and Sierra 168s for 30-06.

I found that 4064 was harder to load because it is longer grained and there was more shearing of grains with the powder dispenser. I also found that 4064 seems to heat the barrel sooner than 4895, not a big issue.

Good group by the way, looks like a keeper.

Dave P
March 26, 2007, 11:03 AM
I use 46.5 gr 4064 and 168. Produces sub-moa in my tuned Garand.

Steve in PA
March 26, 2007, 04:10 PM
Aside from a couple of flyers, my M1 loves IMR-4895.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid82/pf4a4eaf73f7a96ed057ea38f694d824c/faedc37c.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid82/pe0d59c6af7fd090e703757b1691ccae7/faedc37f.jpg

Steve in PA
March 26, 2007, 04:14 PM
The same 150gr load out of my 1903A3.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid144/pe3d48d4ce0201d134d0126fa64a96b0a/f681cf36.jpg

JMatters
March 30, 2007, 12:53 PM
Old adage: If it aint broke, don't fix it. You got a nice group, why mess around?

Ok, I know, I do it too. Used 4064 for years, but now I use Varget with Remington primers in my 7.62 Garand. Basically, fill the case, and shoot it. Wonderful stuff. Had a smith check my gun over after a few hundred rounds, and no issues.

44 or 45 grains of Varget with a 175 VLD work great. (My first round through the gun with this combo literally split the X at 100 yards.)

heypete
March 30, 2007, 03:02 PM
I've had exceedingly good results with the following load:

49.5 grains IMR 4064 Powder
CCI 200 Large Rifle Primers
150gr Sierra GameKings
Remington .30-06 brass. (Though I get comparable results with range brass.)

4064 meters well out of my Lee Perfect Powder Measure, and it produces good groups.

Here's an example (click to enlarge):
http://lh4.google.com/image/heypete1/Rg1cpljsTlI/AAAAAAAAB2k/0BQNXCBVY6M/s400/IMG_0866.JPG (http://picasaweb.google.com/heypete1/ShootyGoodness342007/photo#5047792626878402130)

http://lh4.google.com/image/heypete1/Rg1culjsTmI/AAAAAAAAB2s/G5h0D_Vt_vY/s400/IMG_0867.JPG (http://picasaweb.google.com/heypete1/ShootyGoodness342007/photo#5047792712777748066)

The central target is just "fun" shooting with friends, while the outer targets are 5-shot groups, mostly contained within the 1" stickers, with a flyer here and there (hey, I only scored Sharpshooter in my army marksmanship qualification, gimmie a break). Range was 500 yards, temp about 55F, humidity unknown. Rifle: Remington 700 on bottom and right groups, 1950s vintage SA M1 Garand for the rest. I was lazy and the RSOs wanted us to get back quickly on previous breaks, so I didn't get a chance to tape up all the previous holes -- I don't remember which were flyers and which were from previous shooting times.

I'm particularly proud of the bottom and right targets, as evidenced by my goofy smile.

I'm trying out a similar loading with 155gr Nosler Custom Competition bullets, as they're even cheaper than the FMJ GameKings, but seem to be comparable iin terms of quality with MatchKings. We'll see.

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