"Clip" vs. Magazine CLARITY....


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CountGlockula
April 18, 2007, 01:09 PM
O.K. I apologize for beating a dead horse. Quoting my firearms instructor: "Magazines are for guns and CLIPS are for the hair."

I was watching either Foxnews or MSN last night and Ted "The 'Nuge" Nugent was on and gave an applaudable response to the VT massacre...then comes Brady Campaign president Paul Helmke gave his speil (sp?). Helmke being the "president", kept saying the killer, and note giving emphisis to the host, used "CLIPS"!!!! Another way to keep the public ignorant by misinterpreting, misdefining and supporting misinformation.

I just want to make sure that we, as intelligent and responsible gun owners, know the difference and need to teach others the truth. As I explained it to my wife, eyes were opened.

Definition of Clips:
A clip is a device that is used to store multiple rounds of ammunition together as a unit, ready for insertion into the magazine of a repeating firearm. This speeds up the process of loading the firearm as several rounds can be loaded at once, rather than one round being loaded at a time. Several different types of clips exist, most of which are made of inexpensive metal stampings that are designed to be disposable, though they are often re-used.
Definition of Magazines:
A magazine (also called a mag or, commonly but incorrectly, especially when removable, a clip) is an ammunition storage and feeding device within or attached to a firearm. Magazines may be integral to the firearm (fixed) or removable (detachable).

I made a nice picture too:
http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/6073/stripperclipsglockmagazjc8.jpg

Thank you, rant over.

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davera
April 18, 2007, 01:11 PM
R Lee said it best with "the clip loads the magazine and the magazine loads the gun".

bogie
April 18, 2007, 01:12 PM
It doesn't matter.

EXCEPT...

You're talking to a non-gunny person, who has a possibility of conversion. He asks a question about pistols and clips.

Rather than get bent outta shape, just answer the damn question. Because YOU KNOW what he means. HE KNOWS what he means. And you don't come across as a pedantic know-it-all and alienate the fellow.

steveracer
April 18, 2007, 01:24 PM
Why should I take a different position when they misspeak about firearms. We know the difference, and they should, too.
I have been in the Navy a little more than ten years, and every time a Sailor calls a ship a "boat" I correctly tell them they are mistaken and explain the difference.
When they call a surface combatant a "small boy", it's time to really give them Hell!
Non-gun types deserve the education we all got, and we need to remeber that, to them, we are mostly all nuts. Coming across as ignorant or contradictory isn't going to help our case. I hear someone refer to a magazine as a "clip" and it's like nails on a chalkboard. If we don't correct them, we are in effect encouraging their ignorance.
"I seen one the other day" is just as bad. My stance is the same.
Call me a Nazi, but they will become better educated if we help them. We cannot help them if we won't all get on board.

JesseL
April 18, 2007, 01:26 PM
Oleg did this one a while ago:
http://olegvolk.net/gallery/d/15649-1/clip-magazine0491.jpg

Joe Demko
April 18, 2007, 01:30 PM
Yeah, nothing helps bring people over to our side of the fence like correcting them on a (to them) arcane bit of terminology rather than answering their real concerns about the place of guns in modern society.

Popov
April 18, 2007, 01:33 PM
Nevermind, I can't figure this attachment thing out.

Mikee Loxxer
April 18, 2007, 01:40 PM
The bullet comes out of the muzzle the cartridge goes into the breech.
As you are mindful of your apparel you should be careful with your speech.-Paraphrased from Jeff Cooper.

Biker
April 18, 2007, 01:41 PM
Bogie and Joe share my views.

Biker

bogie
April 18, 2007, 01:42 PM
And for beginners...

The bullet goes in this end, and then comes out this end - do not point this end at anything other than that hill over there.

KEEP THINGS SIMPLE... And FUN!

SSTHitman
April 18, 2007, 01:43 PM
My thoughts exactly Joe...

Jim Watson
April 18, 2007, 01:44 PM
Mikee is of course correct, but I have heard all too many of the clip vs magazine geniuses refer to loading their ammunition feeding devices with bullets. Even shotgun bullets.

These people who think they know it all are a great aggravation to those of us who really do.

Sean Dempsey
April 18, 2007, 01:47 PM
Why can't "clip" become a lay colloquialism for a magazine, and the gun-nuts let it rest?

I assume you all actively blow your nose or use a tissue? Do you correct someone every time they say "kleenex" when it is not, in fact, a Kleenex brand of tissue.

A man sneezes, "ACHOO!! oh jeez, can you hand me a kleenex?"

Gun-nut01 drops and does a tactical roll, pointing his Glock Fotay (wich a clip full of bullets) at the man, "IT'S A GENERIC BRAND TISSUE, NOT A KLEENEX, WHICH IS ACTUALLY JUST THE BRAND NAME OF A POPULAR LINE OF TISSUES!!! NOW SAY IT RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1"

JesseL
April 18, 2007, 01:48 PM
Whenever I'm having a conversation with someone who is using incorrect terminology, I simply continue using the correct terminology. Usually they catch on or ask me about the different terms, allowing me an opportunity to educate them.

It's a struggle for me to not come across as arrogant and pedantic, because I truly am (just ask my wife). Incorrect word usage hurts my brain.

Biker
April 18, 2007, 01:49 PM
That got a belly laugh outa me, Sean!

Biker:)

Hawk
April 18, 2007, 01:56 PM
The magazine v. clip thing has been dissected sufficiently I would think. I give anyone and everyone a "pass" on the terms with the exception of those that would legislate against the things. Helmke doesn't get a pass, Marlin does.

Someone (certainly not me) should start a thread in the handgun section as to whether or not there is any such thing as a .45 long Colt, and whether Colt using the term makes it legitimate.

ravencon
April 18, 2007, 01:57 PM
A number of the giants of the gun world have referred to magazines as clips. Having just read a couple of his books, Col. Charles Askins comes to mind.

According to the pedantic gun experts someone like Col. Askins is ignorant when it comes to guns. Yeah, right.

JesseL
April 18, 2007, 01:59 PM
Why can't "clip" become a lay colloquialism for a magazine, and the gun-nuts let it rest?

I can't let it rest because they have very different meanings and they are important. What am I supposed to call a clip when everyone assumes I'm talking about a magazine?

Is it the end of the world when you ask for a Kleenex and someone hands you a Puffs facial tissue? No.

Is it the end of the world when you desperately need a clip and someone tosses you a magazine? For you, it could be.

Language becomes useless when nobody cares about using it correctly.:fire:

steveracer
April 18, 2007, 02:00 PM
"whether or not there is any such thing as a .45 long Colt"
No such animal. Major pet peeve of mine.
Steve

Biker
April 18, 2007, 02:02 PM
Well Hawk, my main carry gun is a Taurus 450 which just happens to hold 5 rounds of 45 LONG COLT!
Got a problem with that!!??

Biker:)

kellyj00
April 18, 2007, 02:07 PM
it's a video game thing. a lot of shooter games call them 'clips' instead of magazines... maybe because it's four letters or maybe because computer programmers aren't too keen on the verbage.

In an interview with one of the VT students, he kept saying "clips" ... "he looked like he knew what he was doing, he was very fast when he put in new clips"

Unfortunately, too many guys have played a lot of video games and not done the real thing. A real tragedy, I think, that young American's think video games are so close to the real thing.

Geronimo45
April 18, 2007, 02:10 PM
In response to this thread, I've made sure to top off the clips for my 1911. :evil:

CLIPS! CLIPS! CLIPS! CLIPS! CLIPS!

All done now. Have a nice day.

AndyC
April 18, 2007, 02:11 PM
Jeez - what a complete non-issue :rolleyes:

Joe Demko
April 18, 2007, 02:13 PM
I can't let it rest because they have very different meanings and they are important. What am I supposed to call a clip when everyone assumes I'm talking about a magazine?

Is it the end of the world when you ask for a Kleenex and someone hands you a Puffs facial tissue? No.

Is it the end of the world when you desperately need a clip and someone tosses you a magazine? For you, it could be.

Language becomes useless when nobody cares about using it correctly

I'm interested in exactly what circumstances you foresee this becoming an end of the world issue for you.

RNB65
April 18, 2007, 02:13 PM
Who cares...

Sean Dempsey
April 18, 2007, 02:14 PM
Is it the end of the world when you ask for a Kleenex and someone hands you a Puffs facial tissue? No.

Is it the end of the world when you desperately need a clip and someone tosses you a magazine? For you, it could be.



Well, if you're going to go that far, you better start saying "handgun magazine full of ammunition that goes into my weapon", because god forbid it's the end of the world and you say "TOSS ME A MAGAZINE QUICK!" and you end up with a well used Hustler (sticky pages and all).

CountGlockula
April 18, 2007, 02:21 PM
LOL.

Some agree and some disagree with the right terminology. Thanks for responding folks.

03Shadowbob
April 18, 2007, 02:33 PM
Sean,
You owe me 3 ounces of beer and 3 KLEENEXs for those two posts. :D

GEM
April 18, 2007, 02:37 PM
Great post - maybe I'll print and then Xerox this page.

At the local shows, a big deal is Clips R' Us.

The big deal is semiauto vs. full auto. So many folks think we have MGs.

Hoppy590
April 18, 2007, 02:40 PM
simple.

Magazines have springs
Clips dont

NM234
April 18, 2007, 02:41 PM
I just learned something, I actually wasn't aware of the common usuage of disposible clips, from the guns I have used before (two .22s and a .357 magnum) they either used a detachable magazine or were bolt action. Now I had seen those clips before but actually did call the magazine for the glock a clip before reading this. Most of my research has been on safety, and then on certain gun types. It never sunk in that the glock has a detachable magazine as opposed to a clip, I assumed that both were clips. I did know what a magazine was though.

Thank You

NM234
April 18, 2007, 02:42 PM
I just never thought about it long enough to make the connection that a glock has a detachable magazine because of the spring.

steveracer
April 18, 2007, 02:44 PM
You just made my point, thank you.

JesseL
April 18, 2007, 02:48 PM
I realize it's rarely going to be a life-or-death issue and that most people will understand you perfectly well either way.

But still, why would anyone (especially those who know better) want to use the wrong terminology? Why would you defend the idea of making your speech more ambiguous?:banghead:

eliphalet
April 18, 2007, 02:56 PM
So does it really matter? not! Get over it would be my advice.

clemco51
April 18, 2007, 03:05 PM
I am some what new to handguns.. and yes, I called the magazine a "CLIP" and some ******* called me out - instead of just explaining it

yes I now know that magazines have springs and clips do not :banghead:

but i promise you - if i shooting my pistol and someone wants to shoot it - and I say to them "here you go, load a clip - and go at it" they will know what I am talking about


Again, I am new - but I hate hearing this Magazine vs clip thing :banghead: :cuss:

JesseL
April 18, 2007, 03:07 PM
Let me put it this way:

Suppose your name is 'Jim', but there's one guy you work with who always calls you 'Joe'.

Do you:

Change your name to Joe.
Politely correct the guy who calls you by the wrong name.
Say to yourself "what's it matter? I still know who he's talking to.", and ignore it.

steveracer
April 18, 2007, 03:10 PM
The problem is when we are perceived to be ignorant about the very things we support. Every time I see someone shooting with his or her child, I think to myself, "that's wonderful." If one or the other of them is not wearing hearing or eye protection, I think to myself, "stupid buggers".
When we teach new people about firearms, and we KNOW BETTER, but use incorrect terms to identify components or assemblies, we are spreading, needlessly, ignorance. My point is that WE KNOW BETTER, and we are obligated to pass this knowledge on to the new folks.
Steve

Sean Dempsey
April 18, 2007, 03:20 PM
Suppose your name is 'Jim', but there's one guy you work with who always calls you 'Joe'.

Do you:

1. Change your name to Joe.
2. Politely correct the guy who calls you by the wrong name.
3. Say to yourself "what's it matter? I still know who he's talking to.", and ignore it.


That's not a equal comparison.

Magazine and clip are more akin to pronouns, like "guy" or "dude". There are Glock Magazines, Springfield Clips, and so forth.

Glock and Springfield are nouns, like "Jim" or "Joe".

If a shooter were to say "Hey man, can I run a few clips through your Glock?" I would say "It's actually a Springfield XD, but sure."

I have no idea why we are even in this thread, any of us. Are the rest of you as bored at work as I am? What type of awesome world do we live in that here we are, on a wednesday in the middle of the day, and so many of us have access to computers. I for one am sitting in an empty, air conditioned office, listening to music and posting my 100% worthless opinions and statements on a rabid gun-nut forum.

God bless america.

TexasP226
April 18, 2007, 03:20 PM
Who cares...

Perhaps people like me that think society has dumbed itslef down enough as it is. The more we let go, the closer to Idiocracy we get.

My biggest pet peeve is people that write "then" rather than "than."

My rifle's magazine holds more rounds than my pistol's magazine is correct.

My rifle's clip holds more rounds then my pistol's clip is incorrect.

yhtomit
April 18, 2007, 03:28 PM
Hawk wrote: "The magazine v. clip thing has been dissected sufficiently I would think. I give anyone and everyone a "pass" on the terms with the exception of those that would legislate against the things. Helmke doesn't get a pass, Marlin does."

I think this is a useful double standard. The people who are using a term innocently (my mom, who is not comfortable with guns, I feel certain is not ever going to care much about the distinction) should be corrected if the circumstances allow this to be done politely, but as someone else pointed out, "correction" is often just best done by example.

But the people who are slobbering to ban 'em! ban 'em! ban 'em! and attempt to display holier-than-thou superior knowledge? They deserve no such grace. Instead, they should be deftly shown up as blowhards ignorant and misguided not only on ultimate questions but even on the easy, trivial aspects of nomenclature.

One of my favorite mottos of all time (which I know from the Baltimore radio host Les Kinsolving) is "Humble to the Humble, Unyielding to the Arrogant," and I think that's a good fit here. (If I've googled the Latin correctly, it's "Humilis humilibus/ Inflectens Arrogantibus")

And GEM's right, too -- clip v. magazine isn't nearly as destructive (or, I think, as intentional) a distortion of meaning as is automatic v. semi-automatic.

Note: the word "automatic" *is* ambiguous; there's nothing inherent about the way it applies to firearms, but there is a useful history and convention which as anyone here reading surely knows is often ignored by the no-guns crowd. In a nearby parallel universe, it could be that "automatic" when it comes to guns means that the next round is "automatically" loaded after each shot by the gun's mechanism, and trigger / firing mechanism just isn't implicated at all. But in English, on this Earth, it has come to mean something else, just like the metal at the back end of a softtail motorcycle doesn't actually have a squishy surface.

Given that convention and widely known, accepted, useful, unambiguous difference, *that* is one word that ought to be questioned firmly but not peevishly when gun banners mis-use it.

However, in conversations with gunless friends -- for me, that's most of them ;) -- and in thinking back to before I was interested in guns, I've come to realize that most people don't see the distinction as all-consuming anyhow. That is, even if they know that an "automatic" weapon can fire continuously until empty when the trigger's held down, and a "semi-automatic" requires a new trigger pull for each shot, most Dentists expressing an opinion don't give a fig. "So? You can still fire pretty quickly!" That is, this legally vital distinction doesn't mean nearly as much to people who aren't a) the BATFE or b) wish they could afford one.

Just stuff running through my head ...

timothy

Geronimo45
April 18, 2007, 03:31 PM
I think all this 'clip' business was started by the WWI/WWII folks. The 1903A3 and Garand were clip-fed. Sure they used the word 'clips'. You ended up with a lot of folks calling magazines 'clips', 'cuz that's what they remember from the army. You argue with them? Uncle Sugar taught them what they knew about guns. You think you know better? You go storm the beaches of Normandy! That's the attitude of some folks, anyhow.

So a lot of folks called magazines clips. A word's meaning expanded... similar to the word 'gay' - though it took on a different meaning altogether. "Don we now our gay apparel" wasn't talking about dressing to Queer Eye standards.

The English language changes a lot.

JesseL
April 18, 2007, 03:31 PM
Magazine and clip are more akin to pronouns, like "guy" or "dude". There are Glock Magazines, Springfield Clips, and so forth.

Magazine and clip are both nouns and they are not synonymous, no matter how badly you want them to be.

The only clips I'm aware of for Springfields are stripper clips for 1903s or en-bloc clips for M1s.

No matter how many times you repeat a flasehood, it will never become true.

How do you feel about those that argue that the word 'people' in the second amendment means 'states', 'arms' means '16th century muskets', or 'well regulated militia' means 'National Guard'?

3fgburner
April 18, 2007, 03:33 PM
You owe me 3 ounces of beer and 3 KLEENEXs for those two posts

That's "Kleenices".

Index ==> Indices
Codex (meaning book) ==> Codices

:evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:

Joe Demko
April 18, 2007, 03:35 PM
How do you feel about those that argue that the word 'people' in the second amendment means 'states', 'arms' means '16th century muskets', or 'well regulated militia' means 'National Guard'?

Well, as long as we're going down this road...do you really want his emotional reaction to that use of the word "people" or do you want his opinion? If the latter, why didn't you ask him what he THOUGHT instead of what he FELT?

TexasP226
April 18, 2007, 03:37 PM
We need to ban all of these automatic assault rifles and the high capactiy clips that go with them!!!!!11!!!!!1:scrutiny:

Bazooka Joe71
April 18, 2007, 03:38 PM
LOL this thread is awesome...It never ceases to amaze me, how long we can sit around and talk about clips/magazines and bullets/rds.

YOU GUYS NEED TO WORK HARDER!!!!! Does your boss know what you are doing right now???? :neener:



:D

redactor
April 18, 2007, 03:44 PM
Just for laughs, I keep a Mosin Nagant clip in my pocket at all times to throw at people who make the mistake of calling a magazine a clip. :D

Hoppy590
April 18, 2007, 03:47 PM
I think all this 'clip' business was started by the WWI/WWII folks. The 1903A3 and Garand were clip-fed. Sure they used the word 'clips'. You ended up with a lot of folks calling magazines 'clips', 'cuz that's what they remember from the army. You argue with them? Uncle Sugar taught them what they knew about guns. You think you know better? You go storm the beaches of Normandy! That's the attitude of some folks, anyhow.

you as an M1 rifleman if he used clips or magazines, he will say clips
you ask a BAR man if he used clips or magazines, he will say magazines.
because those are the correct terms

the soldiers were trained correctly, and know the differance. its popular culture and recreational shooters that make the clip V magazine error

Two Cold Soakers
April 18, 2007, 04:07 PM
Those 5.56 stripper clips I got laying around all have a bent piece of thin metal running the length of it to keep the cartridge bases pushed up tight to keep them from sliding out.

It's a flat spring!!!

I gotta go downstairs and press out a couple hundred bullets for the skeet league tonight

:neener:

Bygottago.

Sassy soakers

03Shadowbob
April 18, 2007, 04:09 PM
3fgburner,
You are correct. I have been out of school for far too long to remember all this stuff. BTW go to gun broker dot com and you'll see clips as a section and not magazines. I plan on sending them an email to let them know that I am banning them until they use the correct terminology. OK, who's with me?!:evil:

lurkersince03
April 18, 2007, 04:16 PM
Just let the damn thing go already.

Carl N. Brown
April 18, 2007, 04:27 PM
You order a M1 carbine magazine, you get the detachable box magazine.
You order a M1 carbine clip, you get the stripper used to load the magazine.

Clarity comes from knowing and using accurate terminology.

But we are dealing with news media that blur the difference
between self-defense and vigilantism. They are ignorant and they
have a pre-set agenda, especial NYC based media.

Plink
April 18, 2007, 05:06 PM
I know these threads tend to get annoying to some, but I see some usefullness to them. Non gun owners don't know proper terminology and that's understandable. I doubt we'll ever educate them for the same reason that I don't know the proper terminology of jet engine internal parts. It's just not something I'm into.

The useful aspect of these threads is to educate the gun owners who don't know the difference. In the last clip/mag thread that just went through here a couple days ago, we have a gun owner insisting that magazines are indeed correctly called clips. Many of our own are ignorant of the terminology, and there's nothing wrong with trying to explain it, at least to the ones who WANT to learn. There will always be the ones who don't want to know, or don't care, and that's fine too. To each their own.

Knowledgeable gun owners pass on a lot of this knowledge to new shooters, which in turn helps reduce their confusion as they grow in the sport. It might seem nitpicky, but words do have meaning afterall. It's a lot like the difference between a tire and a wheel.

texas bulldog
April 18, 2007, 05:22 PM
Whenever I'm having a conversation with someone who is using incorrect terminology, I simply continue using the correct terminology. Usually they catch on or ask me about the different terms, allowing me an opportunity to educate them.

+1 on this. i find it to be the best balance of maintaining my sanity, not coming across as a jerk, and slowly educating them by repetition of the correct terminology.

good call. and it works for more than just "clip" versus "magazine".



...this coming from the guy who refuses to capitalize on the internet...

nemoaz
April 18, 2007, 06:18 PM
Any time I here a clip nazi spouting off, as if their useless firearm vocabulary trivia is some profound bit of knowledge, I imagine a guy who marches around in his underwear late at night singing,

This is my weapon;
This is my gun. (Grabs crotch)

Similar useless trivia abounds regarding "gun" vs. firearm, pistol vs. revolver etc.

We know that some drill instructor drilled that into your hard head. (Me too!) But nobody cares, really.

Do you still call the bathroom a head or latrine? :scrutiny:

Hawk
April 18, 2007, 07:59 PM
Well Hawk, my main carry gun is a Taurus 450 which just happens to hold 5 rounds of 45 LONG COLT!
Got a problem with that!!??

I'd be uncomfortable claiming .45 Long Colt is a misnomer starting from the time that these people (http://www.coltsmfg.com/cmci/revolvers.asp) started using the term.

It seems most firms that market both the .45ACP and .45 Colt adopt the .45LC convention. Those that do not market a .45ACP call a .45 Colt a .45 Colt. An exception is USFA which has maintained proper terminology even after marketing a .45ACP.

But since COLT uses ".45 Long Colt" on their SAA, I'd find the argument that Colt defines the term compelling. It is, after all, their intellectual property as it were.

Colt can change ".45 Colt" to ".45 Long Colt" with impunity, but even if Mec-Gar, McCormick, Metalform, Tripp and Wilson suddenly started calling "magazines" "clips" it wouldn't redefine the terms.

On a tangential note, when historical references are made to Wyatt Earp "pistol whipping" somebody, what type of semi-auto was he using?

...just my humble effort at thread veer...

Jim Watson
April 18, 2007, 08:08 PM
And I just love those old advertisements for the "Colt Automatic Pistol", don't you?

"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean -- neither more nor less."

Biker
April 18, 2007, 08:08 PM
Good Lord... didn't ask for a damn book...a simple yes or no would've done! BTW, I've never "pistol whipped" anyone, but I have "pistol whupped" a man or two. Heh heh...:)

Biker

Hawk
April 18, 2007, 08:11 PM
Good Lord... didn't ask for a damn book...a simple yes or no would've done! BTW, I've never "pistol whipped" anyone, but I have "pistol whupped" a man or two. Heh heh..

No prob - I had it memorized from the six page beating I took on another forum.
Rather educational but almost made me miss the old "mag" v "clip" days.
:)

DoubleTapDrew
April 18, 2007, 08:13 PM
Revolver whipping just doesn't have the same ring to it :D

Hawk
April 18, 2007, 08:16 PM
And I just love those old advertisements for the "Colt Automatic Pistol", don't you?

Possibly related, but I have a clear memory of at least one print media "back when" defining ".45ACP" as ".45 Automatic Centerfire Pistol". One assumes they had issues with Colt.

With no way of checking it out, and my dealer believing it as well, I went about a dozen years believing "C" meant "Centerfire".

How low-rent is that?
:o

Geronimo45
April 18, 2007, 08:17 PM
"when historical references are made to Wyatt Earp "pistol whipping" somebody, what type of semi-auto was he using?"
A Glock 7 - haven't you ever read your history books? Gaston Glock distributed some two hundred of them to top-notch LEO folks. Wyatt got number 83. I got number 40. The others... there's a list, somewhere. I'll check my records.

CountGlockula
April 18, 2007, 08:32 PM
Here you go:
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/8999/clipmagazine0491xo5.jpg

Hawk
April 18, 2007, 08:38 PM
Actually, Count, I rather liked your picture with the stripper clips as well. Good work and an easily understood explanation.

The "spring" thing didn't work as well for me personally as I have several hundred Garand clips and they're pretty "springy". It's the springy part that keeps the boo-litz from falling out. :D

Euclidean
April 18, 2007, 08:49 PM
A clip is not a magazine
Nor is a mag a clip
And a grip is not a stock
Nor is a stock a grip

I don't mean to nitpick
But improvement could be seen
If we could ever bring ourselves
To say exactly what we mean!

default
April 18, 2007, 10:34 PM
I never, under any circumstances, use the terms interchangeably. However, there are plenty of people who have forgotten more about guns and shooting than I'll ever know who call magazines "clips". They're still wrong, at least technically, but I'm not going to correct them. Nor would I ever correct a fellow THR member on this topic. I'll gently correct non-shooters if the situation is appropriate. In the heat of an impassioned argument is not an appropriate situation.

If the only only argument that you can bring to bear in discussion with an anti critical of large-capacity magazines is that they're not called "clips", it's time to develop some better debate skills. On the other hand, if a friend refers to a magazine as a clip, I might mention that technically it's called a magazine, but that the distinction between the definitions of the two terms might seem somewhat obscure, and then return to the subject at hand. If they are interested in knowing the difference, great. If not, no big deal. It's a real technical distinction but it lacks much political or legal significance, and isn't worth pursuing too far in many cases.

On the other hand, the distinctions between, say, semi and fully automatic, or between assault weapons (an obtuse and largely meaningless legal fiction that disappeared, at least at the federal level, in 2004) and assault rifles are quite important, and I'll politely but firmly correct anyone who thinks they are synonymous.

No_Brakes23
April 19, 2007, 06:58 AM
Language becomes useless when nobody cares about using it correctly.You have a fundamentally incorrect understanding of linguistics if you think this is true. Language evolves. Why are you not speaking in King James English?

Working Man
April 19, 2007, 07:50 AM
Language becomes useless when nobody cares about using it correctly.

Not quite, but misconceptions do abound.

I can't believe I'm posting in this.... IIRC, I think I skipped the other 200 or so
Clip vs. Mag threads.

If you know the correct term, then use it.
If you are training someone, then use it.

If a person uses the incorrect term when speaking to you then politely correct
them if the sprit moves you. Do not be rude or elitist about it, we're supposed to
be helping one another.

Two Cold Soakers
April 19, 2007, 10:12 AM
I only use improper terms around people who know I know better but who don't know that I know they want me to know how much they know.

Always be correct and direct around new shooters.
e.g. I don't call going poop "heaving a havana" etc. around my 5 year old.
I'll do it around deer camp.

**********************************************************

In otherwords, I use the terms "clip, bullets, gun" around those who I feel are uptight, self aggrandizing, blowhards. Brings 'em down a peg or two. Lets me laugh to myself while using a little self-depricating humor.

Picture a cartoon with two little gnomes with big hammers pounding each other into the ground. Sometimes I'm one of those gnomes.

Your sole purpose in life is my entertainment.
Soakers

Now, if I could just get and keep a shooting buddy...............

Joe the Redneck
April 19, 2007, 01:06 PM
I love this stuff. It reminds me how easy and carefree my life truly is.

This is what I found in the OED. (The OED is the decriptive dictonary. Webster is the proscriptive dictionary. If you don't know the difference, you had a girlfriend in highschool.) Have fun with it.

clip1

• noun 1 a flexible or spring-loaded device for holding an object or objects together or in place. 2 a piece of jewellery that can be fastened on to a garment with a clip. 3 a metal holder containing cartridges for an automatic firearm.
• verb (clipped, clipping) fasten or be fastened with a clip or clips.

magazine

• noun 1 a periodical publication containing articles and illustrations. 2 a regular television or radio programme comprising a variety of items. 3 a chamber holding a supply of cartridges to be fed automatically to the breech of a gun. 4 a store for arms, ammunition, and explosives.
— ORIGIN French magasin, from an Arabic word meaning ‘storehouse’.

— ORIGIN Old English.

pedant /pedd’nt/

• noun a person excessively concerned with minor detail or with displaying technical knowledge.
— DERIVATIVES pedantic adjective pedantically adverb pedantry noun.
— ORIGIN French pédant, probably related to PEDAGOGUE


Joe

No_Brakes23
April 20, 2007, 05:54 AM
lol, nice one joe.

The magazine definition reminds me that a magazine can be something that you store ordnance in. And a rifle is not technically a gun.

.cheese.
April 20, 2007, 07:39 AM
The misuse has come from both sides.

The day of the shooting, I turned on AM radio to the conservative talk radio channel. Sean Hannity was on and I remember him saying, "Ok, so the latest word is that up to 50 shots were fired from what appears to handguns..... now, as somebody well schooled in the usage of firearms, I know that he must have brought a number of clips with him to enable this."

(or something around those lines). I smacked myself in the forehead, but decided it was not the right time to call in to correct him. Too much bad news for one day to worry about little details..

.cheese.
April 20, 2007, 07:42 AM
OH, and while I'm usually a fan of Hannity, comments like that have me feeling like, "AND uhhhhh WaHt cOLor is de SkY Otday......... I like chocolate milk.... AHHHHHHHH." (cartoon reference)

Dr. Dickie
April 20, 2007, 08:06 AM
Any time I here a clip nazi spouting off, as if their useless firearm vocabulary trivia is some profound bit of knowledge, I imagine a guy who marches around in his underwear late at night singing,...

In the end, you may call them what they want to call them. You may call a lion a tiger, it only makes you look ignorant (not stupid! Ignorant is another word that most folks don't seem to understand the meaning. Another is Nazi.).
As others have said, the best course is to continue to use the correct term and eventually the other person will catch on.
Or go singing into the night...:neener:

NM234
April 20, 2007, 09:08 AM
All I wanted to say was, being somewhat of a newbie (have done safety research and gun model researc, don't own any yet, and only fired a few times), as I said before I was calling the magazine on a glock (for example) a clip and am now happy to know the correct terminology. I never gave thought to the spring enclosed and thought it was a clip.

Had I used the term I would have hoped to be politely corrected, I like to learn things instead of remaining ignorant.

Thank you for starting this thread, I learned something new.

CajunBass
April 20, 2007, 11:44 AM
Yea. I know what you mean. The first thing I thought about when I heard about the VT shooting, was "Gee, I sure hope they don't call the magazine a clip."

:rolleyes:

CountGlockula
April 20, 2007, 02:37 PM
Affirmative. It may seem a big deal to some and also, not a huge deal to others...but knowledge is power right?

Joe Demko
April 20, 2007, 02:41 PM
but knowledge is power right?

It can be, but isn't necessarily always. Is an in-depth knowledge of Hummel figurines a source of power? What about being able to quote Monty Python at length from memory? Does knowing all the secrets and cheats for the Final Fantasy videogames empower you? How many of these will cause hot chicks to throw themselves at you? Will insistently differentiating between clips and magazines cause that to happen?

whistler
April 20, 2007, 02:57 PM
ok I just loaded the magazine well of my 1911 with a clip:neener:

Tinmancr
April 22, 2007, 10:51 AM
the definition of clip is incomplete and can be understood as a synonym of removable or box magazine however the manufacturers call them mags so ok.
but what about the difference between cartridges, shells, bullets and rounds.
I have heard a random redneck to a master gunsmith use them as synonyms, and the manufacturers listen to him by the by on any problems with new guns "the gunsmith"
thank god for freedom of speech.. and typing

No_Brakes23
April 23, 2007, 05:20 AM
"however the manufacturers call them mags so ok."

Remington and Marlin call them clips.

1911Tuner
April 23, 2007, 06:44 AM
Lordy...This one can be a hot topic button for some.

Technically, if it has a spring that moves ammunition into the feeding position, it's a magazine. If it holds ammunition together and is discarded after the ammunition is manually fed into the weapon's magazine...it's a clip.

Now for the "Devil's Advocate" part...

Why is it such an issue for some? Is it worth all the energy and time...and often confrontation...just to make a point? When someone says: "I've got a few 7-round clips for it" we all know what he means. If a member of the 101st Airborne relates that he jumped into Normandy on D-Day armed with a
Thompson and as many clips as he could carry...Do we chide him for his mistake...do we dishonor his bravery and his service by literally calling him an idiot for failing to use the correct terms...or do we let it go and listen to his story? When a veteran of "Frozen Chosin" tells us that he fought an M2 Carbine and "30-shot Bananna Clips" do we likewise listen with reverence...or do we launch into a mini-tirade over terminology in order to educate him? For that matter...can you say "Bananna Magazine" 5 times in a row and keep a straight face?

I spoke with a veteran of Iwo Jima a few years back. He was part of an honor guard at a funeral. He said bullet instead of cartridge and round...and clip instead of magazine more than once. Guess I was too much in awe of the Navy Cross on his Class A's to interrupt him.

ProficientRifleman
April 23, 2007, 08:06 AM
the definition of clip is incomplete and can be understood as a synonym of removable or box magazine however the manufacturers call them mags so ok.

You are incorrect, Sir.

A clip is a binder, as in paper clip, or a cartridge stripper clip. Or even an en-block clip as feeds the Garand rifle.

A magazine is a container. It fully encloses the loaded cartridges. Examples are, the BAR magazine, the M14 magazine, the 1911 magazine and the Glock-17 magazine. If the terms were synonymous, a bunker on an ASP might be called a "clip", instead, it is called a magazine.

jeff-10
April 23, 2007, 08:48 AM
Who cares...

+1

I know lots of people who are regular shooters and even some who carry a firearm for a living that call magazines clips. Some people call cartridges bullets or shells. Those are legitimate names and people understand what you are talkinge about when using them. Deal with it.

Eleven Mike
April 23, 2007, 09:24 AM
Magazine and clip are more akin to pronouns, like "guy" or "dude". There are Glock Magazines, Springfield Clips, and so forth.

I just wanted to highlight this great bit of scholarship. It seems that, to those who think a mag can be called a clip, nouns (guy and dude) are actually pronouns. :confused: Noun? Pronoun? Who cares, what's the difference? :rolleyes:


Toss me a magazine for my K98.

Joe Demko
April 23, 2007, 10:15 AM
Unless it is missing some parts, your k98 should already have an internal magazine, sometimes referred to as a "blind" magazine. During WWI, a few 20 round "assault" magazines were manufactured for the Mauser, but they weren't widely used. You can find modern reproductions for sale in Shotgun News.

Jim Watson
April 23, 2007, 10:20 AM
Sorry, Joe, a K98 does not have a blind magazine, it has a detachable floorplate. A blind magazine is one with no bottom opening in the magazine well or stock at all. Like a Remington 700 ADL and some of the cheap plastic Savages.

Joe Demko
April 23, 2007, 10:22 AM
My bad. You're right about the Mauser. It does have an internal magazine, though. With the somewhat rare "assault" magazine, it has an external (non-removable?) magazine.

Eleven Mike
April 23, 2007, 10:40 AM
Yes, Joe, my Mauser also has a fixed magazine. But since it doesn't matter, I will now refer to the clips as magazines. Now, can you toss me one of those stripper magazines? I need to reload.

obxned
April 23, 2007, 12:38 PM
Yes, a magazine is not a 'clip', but I bet you regularly use slang in your everyday conversations.

steveracer
April 23, 2007, 12:53 PM
YOU KNOW THE DIFFERENCE!!
Many of you are making an argument supporting and defending ignorance. When an anti calls your AR-15 an "assault weapon" you correct them. When they call your Mini-14 a "machine gun", you come back with how stupid they are, but you are continuously advocating the deliberate use of term YOU KNOW TO BE INCORRECT.
You, me, all of us, we know better, and we have an obligation to the new guys to teach them the difference. No, don't be rude, but there's no excuse for getting it wrong when you know better.
This may not seem like a big deal, but every time we call a magazine a "clip" we are contributing to the ignorance of firearms, which as gun enthusiasts should be our mission to stamp out.
Get it right, people, it really does matter.
Steve

GLOOB
October 20, 2008, 10:23 PM
For everyone who thinks the terms are interchangeable, try reading this without cringing:

"Well, first ya got yer M16. You stick the clip in the bottom. Then ya got yer M1 Garand, where you stick the magazine in from the top. For a Colt .45 SA revolver, ya got these nifty little "moon" magazines that you drop into the cylinder. For your Browning machine gun, you got this nifty box clip that holds 200 belted rounds. For your pump action shotgun, you load dem bullets into the clip through this here hole."

This isn't the same thing as "Kleenex" vs "tissue." Using "clip" and "magazine" interchangeably is roughly equivalent to wiping your ass with Kleenex and blowing your nose with Charmin. :neener:

230RN
October 21, 2008, 04:23 AM
Sometimes in the little snapshots of eternity we call our lifespans, we forget that many went before us who used different terms for the same things.

Language evolves, changes, grows, shrinks.

And it's the same thing with gonne terminology.

What disturbs me about this clip v magazine "debate" is the passion involved.

Fifty years and more ago, clip was right, or at least not wrong. Bullet was right or at least not wrong. And they still appear on some manufacturers' and suppliers' websites and literature.

It's changing, viz the remarks about the decorated veterans, whose clips for their 1911s served well in holding seven bullets. When they served, clip and bullet were OK. They're not intrinsically wrong, just dated.

I used to use clip all the time. Now, more to avoid controversy than anything else, I am more scrupulous about differentiating clip from magazine and using bullet for cartridge.

And I no longer use "riffling" for the little spiral riffles that are cut into the bore of a gonne. :)



Free Example (Exempli Gratia, E.g.):

Riffle

Rif"fle\, n. [CF. G. riffeln, riefeln, to groove. Cf. Rifle a gun.] (Mining) A trough or sluice having cleats, grooves, or steps across the bottom for holding quicksilver and catching particles of gold when auriferous earth is washed; also, one of the cleats, grooves, or steps in such a trough. Also called ripple.


Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc

Golden Hound
October 21, 2008, 04:59 AM
Just to throw some gasoline on the fire...

...CHAAAARRRGGGERRRRSSSSS!

:evil:

yeti
October 21, 2008, 05:28 AM
For a Colt .45 SA revolver, ya got these nifty little "moon" magazines that you drop into the cylinder.

I could never get those dang things through the loading gate.:what:


Now what is the difference between shrapnel and bomb splinters?:confused:

Griz44
October 21, 2008, 07:59 AM
Personally, I would rather see a rant or indignation over something that mattered, like the erosion of our gun rights or CCW issues. I have been around a lot of years, and the "trendy" things seem to be to make a big deal of un-important things. I grew up in a military household in the 50's. Clip worked just fine then. My Uncle was UDT (yea, way before "Seals") and he loaded his pistol with "clips" Grandpa, died in '86 at 101, and he hunted with an autoloader rifle that he too loaded with "clips". I think his WW I AND WW II service entitled him to call it anything he wanted to call it. Four pages of rants about "clip" and "mag". Geez, go watch the Oprah and find something more important to carry on about.

moxie
October 21, 2008, 08:32 AM
I've known guys who carried and used 1911s in WWII, Korea, and Vietnam who called their magazines clips. You tell them they are wrong. Not I.

moxie
October 21, 2008, 08:37 AM
I've known guys who carried and used 1911s in WWII, Korea, and Vietnam who called their magazines clips. You tell them they are wrong. Not I.

And yes, 5.56 stripper clips do have a spring in them.

GLOOB
October 21, 2008, 11:14 AM
Damn right. They earned the right to wipe their ass with all the facial tissue they want.

tostada
October 21, 2008, 01:32 PM
This isn't the same thing as "Kleenex" vs "tissue." Using "clip" and "magazine" interchangeably is roughly equivalent to wiping your ass with Kleenex and blowing your nose with Charmin.

And what's wrong with that? I wipe my ass with Puffs all the time when I run out of toilet paper. And in public restrooms I quite often blow my nose on toilet paper. They're functionally equivalent. They're totally interchangeable. It's not the same as trying to jam a moon clip up the butt of a semi-auto.

hso
October 21, 2008, 02:36 PM
I think it's easy to distinguish the two by what they do.

A "clip" clips the ammo together. Enblcoc, stripper, whatever, the ammunition is clipped together with the little metal thingy.

sniper5
October 21, 2008, 03:06 PM
OK, here's my strategy to get them to ask. Anyone who comes over (trusted friends, I'm not running a public museum) and wants to see some "living history" usually gets shown the Ishapore 2A first. Then while I'm talking about it I note that it can be reloaded with either clip or magazine. Then they look puzzled and ask "what's the difference?" The answer usually sets off a stream of other questions, then dialogue occurs, and learning begins along with them developing an interest in historical arms and battles. When my wife's anti friends are around and talk the blah blah about guns, I say "I'm a Federally Licensed Collector". Then I'm instantly not only OK, but an information source to a slew of questions. When they figure out the whole thing is about living history, they come away with a different outlook.

Winning hearts and minds, one rifle at a time. Now excuse me, I have to order some more history.:D

CountGlockula
October 21, 2008, 03:25 PM
ENOUGH of the tissues scenario (no visuals needed). Please keep it within the magazine and clip topic.

yeti
October 22, 2008, 02:04 PM
And in public restrooms I quite often blow my nose on toilet paper.
:what::what::what:


:evil:

RockyMtnTactical
October 22, 2008, 03:00 PM
http://www.minutemanreview.com/2008/09/clip-vs-magazine-lesson-in-firearm.html

daorhgih
October 22, 2008, 03:00 PM
Why are those "bullet"-holding thingies I snap into the bottom of my AK called 30- or 40-round "banana-clips"? Cheeezo,, ain't this a fun thread? And which is the "pistol"? . . . . the S&W wheel-gun or the Glock?? A local establishment (Non-Governmental but big on tax-money income) has a big red sticker on the door prohibiting what looks like a revolver within the confines of the building. So I always make sure when I'm visiting, that I'm wearing an auto-. ("Auto-" is shorthand for "automatic-self-loading" fire-arm.) Cheaper Than Dirt lists Rifle, shot-gun, revolver, pistol ammo/cartridges. Ae we missing something? No, we are just enjoying jibes at each other. Keep it up.

ch1966
October 22, 2008, 04:34 PM
Here's your Banana magazine:
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.bananaboys.com/reviews/images/bananamag_issue02.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.bananaboys.com/reviews/banana.html&h=332&w=250&sz=20&hl=en&start=3&um=1&usg=__KIiK0ub26qcLsqMuxH9Q4Mk5kpg=&tbnid=QQN_iiZ_gbGYRM:&tbnh=119&tbnw=90&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbanana%2Bmagazine%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4TSHB_enUS209US209%26sa%3DN

Sniper X
October 22, 2008, 04:53 PM
Well count I have to agree on this one and anyone who doesn't I have a question.

Do you also call a car wheel a rim? Or call a revolver a pistol, or a carbine a rifle. Lets be knowledgeable about our passion here and show it with good articulation and correct vocabulary.

My 2 cents.

Griz44
October 23, 2008, 01:26 AM
Why doesn't gunclip depot sell gun clips?

moooose102
October 23, 2008, 09:16 AM
i am leaving this one alone. no sense in throwing gasoiline into a raging fire!

Hawk
October 23, 2008, 11:48 AM
I have little to add that wasn't already in the thread when it was new. However, just as a fun little challenge, how about the "revolver vs pistol" folks filling me in on exactly when revolvers stopped being pistols and by whose authority?



Online Etymology (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=pistol) gives us:

pistol
"small hand-held firearm," c.1570, from M.Fr. pistole "short firearm" (1566), of uncertain origin, sometimes said to be from Ger. Pistole, from Czech pis'tala "firearm," lit. "tube, pipe," from pisteti "to whistle," of imitative origin, related to Rus. pischal "shepherd's pipe." But earlier form pistolet (1550) is from M.Fr. pistolet "a small firearm," also "a small dagger," which may be the literal sense; though some connect this word with It. pistolese, in reference to Pistoia, town in Tuscany noted for gunsmithing. Pistol-whip is first recorded 1942.

NRA-ILA (http://www.nra-ila.org/Issues/FireArmsGlossary/Default.aspx) provides:

PISTOL
Synonymous with "handgun." A gun that is generally held in one hand. It may be of the single-shot, multi-barrel, repeating or semi-automatic variety and includes revolvers.

LearnAboutGuns.com (http://www.learnaboutguns.com/2008/04/07/glossary-of-gun-related-terms/) offers us:

Pistol - A semiautomatic hand gun which stores ammunition in a magazine. Not to be confused with a revolver.

Wkipedia jumps on board with:
In American usage, the term "pistol" refers to a handgun whose chamber is integral with the barrel, making pistols distinct from the other main type of handgun, the revolver, which has a revolving cylinder containing multiple chambers. However, Commonwealth usage makes no distinction at a technical level—"pistol" may refer to revolvers, semi-automatics, or muzzle-loading/cap-&-ball handguns. For example, the official designation of the Webley Mk VI was "Pistol, Revolver, Webley No. 1 Mk VI", and the designation "Pistol No. 2 Mk I" was used to refer to both the Enfield Revolver and the later Browning Hi-Power semi-automatic.

Well, that certainly clears it up doesn't it?

NRA says "pistol" includes "revolver", learnaboutguns says it doesn't and Wkipedia says the distinction is geographical.

So who's right?

I guess what puzzles me is that any number of folks have stated that it's incorrect to call a revolver a pistol although NRA and about half the online resources have the opposite view.

So are these people actually correcting those who confuse the terms or simply pushing their random internet viewpoint as the correct one? And, if it is actually a "correction" would a poster from Britain be exempt from such "correction" - this is, after all, an international forum?

I'm no expert but etymology can be fascinating in small doses and I'm curious when the "pistol v revolver" definitions diverged for us but not the Commonwealth.

daorhgih
October 24, 2008, 01:12 PM
One can generally count on the NRA to drop the ball in any punting situation.....so join JFPFOA. Their lives have always depended on being armed, no matter the government.

mljdeckard
October 24, 2008, 03:56 PM
I got a giggle out of my hunting party last weekend when I corrected out 18 y/o mall ninja by telling him, "Every time you call a magazine a clip; God Kills a kitten. Please; think of the kittens."

Having said that, I was out of the army for 16 years, and then went back in. Went to a range with about 200 firers last summer, and in between zeroing and qualification, we had concurrent training, which was refreshingly good for a change. We got a refresher in tactical rifle from a SF SFC who was all too willing to make it real-world. He kept referring to "where your gun should be pointed right now", and one of the younger NCOs asked him, "Don't you mean rifle?" He paused in the training, and made a point to say that "there's a big difference between terminology the military clings to to force you into a particular mindframe, and what you are actually thinking when bullets are flying past you. Let the drill sergeants use the former. I'll use the latter. They can say magazine, rifle, round of ammunition, target, and watch your lane, I will say ....ing gun, ....ing bad guy, and kill that ............ You've already had the book version. Start thinking about the real-life version, because you'll need it sooner than you think."

I_AM_LEGEND
October 24, 2008, 04:14 PM
Rather the anti's call them clips or mags doesn't really matter, correcting them will only draw more anti-opinions on guns and gun owners. Calling magazines clips or vice versa isn't drawing people over to their side or changing people's opinions any more than using the correct terms. Essentially all this is good for is if you here someone talking about a clip when they mean magazine, you know instantly they're probably not all that knowledgeable about firearms. Being nit-picky about this is pointless as it doesn't really matter, the terms are pretty much used interchangeably to the majority of people out there and it's only the big gun gurus that get all in a tizzy about the terms being used incorrectly.

If you here someone make this mistake, just politely correct them and explain it to them and don't go off ranting and raving and making a big deal about it. I made this same mistake a few years ago on another board and got so much crap and made fun of so much I eventually just left the forum. Don't turn people off to guns and gun-ownership over vocabulary.

RockyMtnTactical
October 24, 2008, 04:42 PM
I have yet to meet an anti who became that way because they were chided for saying "clip". If you like firearms, you like them. No vocabulary Nazi is going to change that.

I agree that we don't get anywhere with people when we do things in a rude way. However, there's nothing wrong with helping people know what they are talking about.

mljdeckard
October 24, 2008, 05:10 PM
I have sometimes used the incorrect language to my advantage. When they say scary sounding things like 'high capacity' (standard capacity) High-powered (medium-powered) and point blank range, (usually 200 meters) I continue their theory using their incorrect terminology to make them look stupid. "You say the victim was killed with a 30-06 at 200 yards? No? That's curious, because that's what high-powered rifle at point blank range means."

But come to think about it, it's been a long time since I had time to argue with antis.

RPCVYemen
October 24, 2008, 06:54 PM
It's hard to imagine a thread this long on such an insignificant topic. Who'da thunk it? :)

Mike

jnyork
October 24, 2008, 07:15 PM
It's hard to imagine a thread this long on such an insignificant topic. Who'da thunk it?

Mike

I love this arguement, it's hilarious to see grown men come to blows over such small things. I saw one of these threads over at Rimfire get REALLY nasty and it went on for pages and pages. I guess boys will be boys! :D:D

yeti
October 24, 2008, 08:01 PM
'I rather eat an apple than be shot' 'I rather eat an apple then be shot'

Both are correct, both have completely different meanings. (I'm a big then/than abuser:rolleyes:)

If Joe Yokel, in all his tactikewl finery:uhoh:, wanted me to look at the new 177 round clip he just purchased for his Gecko45 Extreme Edition, I'd look, say 'kewl', and go back to my shooting. I would keep a wary eye on him:scrutiny:, but I probably would not get into a lesson on proper terminology.

If my 13yo Nephew asked to run a couple of clips thru my 1911:confused:, I would say yes, explain the difference between the 2, show him some clips and magazines, then take off and go shooting with him.:cool:

If Elmer Keith:eek: asked if that was the new 177 round clip for the Gecko45 Extreme Edition, I would say "Why yes Mr. Keith, it is. Would you like to give it a try?" And from that moment forward would always call magazines, clips.;)

If Sara Brady:what: came up to me and asked "is that one of those evil, hi cap, clips", I would launch into a detailed explanation:cuss: of the difference between mags, and clips until her eyes started to glaze ov... Oh hell, if Sara:what::what: showed up, I would probably run off screaming like a 5 year old girl, with a toad in my knickers.:neener::evil:

Tirod
October 24, 2008, 08:52 PM
I see it as an indicator of 1) real gun knowledge, but not necessarily functional skill. If Carlos Hathcock wants to call them clips, more power to him, 2) what kind of character the "corrector" has - go ahead, tell someone they don't really know all about it. You could be embarrassing yourself no end.

Kind of like the story about the young lieutenant describing to a senior officer what sexual acts he could commit with a beautiful young lady across the room, only to discover he was talking to the commander about his daughter.

Give respect, you get respect.

Having owned a HK91 sporter rifle and hearing it called a "machine gun" every time I brought it to a public range, I'm aware of the depth of ignorance out there. I agree with the SF SFC tho, who cares what it's called when you're downrange from it?

It's just an interweb discussion. But I'm glad to know some people care. I'll probably start calling them "clips" more often around the young and seriously sincere. It's always good for a laugh. :evil:

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