California: How To: Purchase a firearm not on the Certified Roster.


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Pietro Beretta
April 21, 2007, 08:17 PM
Hello, I have heard this myth several years ago, I am still unsure if it can technically be done since I have never heard of someone actually doing it.

There are a lot of nice firearms not on the Roster Certified for Sale, this is a way that you can supposedly obtain one.


The myth goes:

California still permits the transfer of firearms between father and son without going through an FFL dealer. You have to submit the Intra-Family transfer form to the CADOJ, submit a fee and your done. Supposedly it doesn't say what kind of firearms you cant transfer. (But any Assult weapon,.50 rifle, and magazine over 10rnds is illegal no matter what of course)

If you have a father that lives out of state, have him purchase the hand gun you desire and "gift" it to you, filling out the intra-family transfer form.

Its been said that the CADOJ will accept this form, and you are a proud owner of a handgun not on the Roster Certified for Sale.

I'm not sure if laws have changed since I have heard this, or this was a bag of lies from the begening, if anyone knows, let me know!

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RobG5538
April 21, 2007, 08:22 PM
While no expert, I believe your father must bring and register the gun himself into CA then he can gift it to you.

Retro
April 21, 2007, 08:23 PM
Just out of curiosity. If I own handguns legally purchased from other states, say a 1911 with 7 rd mag, and I move to CA due to work, do I have to register it with California before I can legally own it? If so, that is so screwed up!

Frog48
April 21, 2007, 08:23 PM
Sounds like a good way to win a vacation in the steel-bar motel. :neener:

Check with an attorney before you try it.

Pietro Beretta
April 21, 2007, 08:34 PM
Yes If you come into California you must give a list of them all to the DOJ.

Any non approved gun most be sold before entering California or given to a local police station to get destoryed.




I have actually contated the CADOJ about this question 4 times over the last couple of months with out an answer. I really would like to know if this is a legal loop-hole, from someone with knowlege.

AJAX22
April 21, 2007, 08:51 PM
It costs 19$ and is a simple piece of paper.

you can't bring in magazines over 10 rounds unless you dissasemble them while in state.

If you ARE moving into CA and being a 'personel importer of firearms' you are exempt from the 'doj approved list' there are a LOT of guys who'll pay you good money to bring in an extra handgun or two to register and then transfer to a CA resident.

If you happen to buy an extra AR lower receiver that has the proper paperwork to be registered as a pistol (manufacturers statement or whatever)

I'll buy two of them off of you for double what they cost you, if once you move you decide that you don't want them anymore. ;)

totally legal, and really the only way to get them in this state.

SoCalShooter
April 21, 2007, 08:57 PM
The only way I know of is to be a LEO. Otherwise us criminals are not allowed to have off the list hand guns.

AJAX22
April 21, 2007, 09:26 PM
SoCalShooter, that is not the case,

ANYONE can buy ANY handgun that is not an AW through the person to person transfer.

only DEALER sales are restricted to the 'safe' list handguns.

Retro
April 21, 2007, 09:54 PM
But isn't any handguns with threaded barrels also classified as an assult weapon? What about handguns with integral rail attached to it? Are they illegal also? And I was reading the CA gun laws just now, and apparently night-vision equipped "sniperscopes" are also illegal, and I guess pretty soon tritium night sights will be illegal also...! Also no "knife-in-a-pen", and no "sword-in-a-umbrella".

glockman19
April 21, 2007, 10:05 PM
I'm looking for a Kimber Pro Raptor II. It's no longer on the DOJ list. It's tyo complete my Raptor II collection I have the 5" and 3" is still on the list but the 4" fell off. I called Kimber last week to ask if they would pay to have it listed again before the law changes on Dec 31 2007 when all NEW handguns will require the mag release and chamber load indicator.

Please let me know If anyone wants to do a Private Party transfer in state. Thanks

SoCalShooter
April 21, 2007, 10:09 PM
SoCalShooter, that is not the case,

ANYONE can buy ANY handgun that is not an AW through the person to person transfer.

only DEALER sales are restricted to the 'safe' list handguns.


I was pretty sure that even for person to person, weapons that are not on the roster are not allowed to be transferred.Just like AW registered in state already are not allowed to be transferred in state to another person.

Black Majik
April 21, 2007, 10:17 PM
Us non-LEOs can purchase firearms not on the list via PPT in CA only. Just not brand new and/or assault weapons.

Retro
April 21, 2007, 10:29 PM
Is a Springfield Armory M1A with no-bayonet lug muzzle brake (instead of flash suppressor) GI wooden stock (no pistol grip) and fake selector switch and bipod and high-powered scope and a 10 rd detachable magazine considered an assualt weapon in California? If not, can one legally bring this rifle into CA and for personal use without registration?

SoCalShooter
April 21, 2007, 10:42 PM
Is a Springfield Armory M1A with no-bayonet lug muzzle brake (instead of flash suppressor) GI wooden stock (no pistol grip) and fake selector switch and bipod and high-powered scope and a 10 rd detachable magazine considered an assualt weapon in California? If not, can one legally bring this rifle into CA and for personal use without registration?

Does it have a pistol grip?

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/

That is the AG's site. Has the answers on it. I could not however find the info on the personal transfer lists. I did find the roster for handguns and i assumed that meant personal or dealer sales.

Retro
April 21, 2007, 10:49 PM
mine has no pistol grip... it should be Ca legal, right? I didn't see any M1A/M14 mentioned anywhere as an assualt weapon...

although I think the new M1A SOCOM 16'' barrel .308 rifle is a lot more deadlier than AK and AR and UZI... the laws just don't make sense.

Jim K
April 21, 2007, 11:17 PM
I don't quite understand that system. How does a gun become "unapproved" and if it does, do the police confiscate it? Does the law apply to all guns or all handguns regardless of age? Someone asked about an original S&W Schofield that the police were threatening to seize as not approved. Does that happen with all antiques?

In MD, we have a handgun roster board that has to approve handguns made after 1990(?) before they can be sold, but once approved guns can't be taken off the list, only added.

Jim

SoCalShooter
April 21, 2007, 11:46 PM
The gun stays on the list for 2 years. It falls off the list if the gun manufacturer does not pay tribute to the DPRK. This is why many different models of handguns dont make it in this state they only make one or two models that they will sell here. It costs money for the DOJ make sure that the new prospective weapon is tested and is a safe firearm. Second if a gun falls off the list that was previously on the list they have to pay again to have the same firearm with NO CHANGES tested again. That is my understanding of the system as I was told it.

coxhw
April 22, 2007, 12:01 AM
God Love TEXAS

Pilgrim
April 22, 2007, 12:04 AM
Any non approved gun most be sold before entering California or given to a local police station to get destoryed.

Please explain. We're talking about the SB-15 list here, right?

Pilgrim

railroader
April 22, 2007, 12:09 AM
I maybe wrong but I think the problem with the intra family transfer is the father and son live in 2 different states. Being that the gun isn't an inheritence but a gift technically the gun needs to be shipped to an FFL in california to be transfered per federal law. Once it FFL gets involved now it has to be on the safe handgun list because it isn't a private party transfer. Now if the transfer is instate the intra family form can be used like a private party transfe, just fill out the form and send in the check. Mark

SoCalShooter
April 22, 2007, 12:15 AM
Private party transfers here (LEGAL) to my understanding have to go through an FFL.

Librarian
April 22, 2007, 12:44 AM
Quote:
Any non approved gun most be sold before entering California or given to a local police station to get destoryed.

Please explain. We're talking about the SB-15 list here, right?

PilgrimRoberti-Roos 'named' California 'assault weapons' and SB23 'features' 'assault weapons'.

So long as a weapon is not a CA 'assault weapon', someone moving here may bring his gun into CA. If it's a handgun, it must be registered after moving here. If the owner chooses, he can continue to own 'assault weapons', but cannot bring them into the state, so they need to be stored out in Free America. (Also need a "Machinegun permit" for full auto; possible, not common.)

It is legal to bring in what California calls 'assault weapons' for competitions - there are rules. CA has a 10-round magazine limit; people moving here may not bring their standard-capacity magazines (10 rounds+); I'm not sure whether competitors may bring theirs in (but I think not).

CA pistols sold through dealers - from inventory to non-dealers - must be on the CA Roster; C&R is exempt. Any firearm owned and in CA before the law is legal to own and use and sell via a California PPT, which must go through a dealer for background check and waiting period and other purposes, but since the transfer is from person to person, not person to dealer inventory to person, PPT weapons need not be on the Roster.

If a firearm 'falls off' the roster, it means only that dealers can no longer sell it. Still legal to own and use and PPT.

Guns from out of state, again excepting C&R, must go into a CA FFL's inventory and then be sold to the CA resident.

glockman19, the law about mag disconnect and loaded chamber indicator went into effect 1 Jan 2007, not 2008. It was either/or for 2006, both for 2007 and after. PC 12130(d)(2) (2) Commencing January 1, 2007, no center-fire semiautomatic
pistol may be submitted for testing pursuant to this chapter if it
does not have both a chamber load indicator as defined in subdivision
(c) of Section 12126 and a magazine disconnect mechanism as defined in subdivision (d) of Section 12126.PPT looks like your remaining avenue for the Kimber.

Scanr
April 22, 2007, 01:08 AM
What a load of bunk! Thank the good Lord I'm in Nevada. You can keep your cotton picking gun laws. We have enough californicators here, the rest of you stay there and live with the mess you created or fix it, just quit exporting it to everyone around you.

gbran
April 22, 2007, 01:34 AM
I'm in CA and my father lives lives in NV. He has given several guns to me over the years. None were new and none were bought by him as a straw purchaser for me. Each time I filed the intra-family transfer form with $19. I've als given guns to my kids using this form. There is no waiting period or background checks. All recipients must not be prohibited from purchasing guns.

Practically, my dad could buy new handgun not on CA's approved list and then give it to me. BTW, you can currently buy used guns not on the list as private party transfers. A gun dealer can take these guns on consignment.

torpid
April 22, 2007, 02:48 AM
You can keep your cotton picking gun laws. We have enough californicators here, the rest of you stay there and live with the mess you created or fix it, just quit exporting it to everyone around you.

Yeah, I love exporting the messed up gun laws I created to you.
It's my hobby.

:rolleyes:

(I do know what you probably intended to say though) :)

EOD Guy
April 22, 2007, 11:47 AM
Yes If you come into California you must give a list of them all to the DOJ.

Any non approved gun most be sold before entering California or given to a local police station to get destoryed.

The statement in red is absolutely untrue. Except for assault weapons and handguns chambered for shotgun ammunition, there is no restriction as to what handguns can be brought into California.

RobG5538
April 22, 2007, 11:57 AM
We have enough californicators here, the rest of you stay there and live with the mess you created or fix it, just quit exporting it to everyone around you.

I assume you mean anti-gun Californians :scrutiny:

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