Saiga .223 Hi-cap questions.


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Northslope Nimrod
April 22, 2007, 12:30 AM
1. Must I convert a Saiga .223 to accept standard capacity mags? (edited to add: I mean hi-cap mags)
2. If so, can someone mechanically challenged do it?
3. If I have someone else do it, how much will the conversion cost?
4. If I don't have to convert it, where can I get standard cap mags that will fit it?
5. Does any of the above rase 922 issues? If so, what is the easiest, cheapest way to fix?
6. I still can't decide on .308 or .223. Will .308 and .223 ammo continue to stay same in cost, relative to the other? In other words, do we expect .223 to go down while .308 will not. Will .223 become more available but not so with .308? I'd like to go with .308 for versatility (hunting), but for a SHTF gun, I want plenty of ammo and the possibility to get more.

The ten rounders won't make be happy. I want standard capacity mags....just because the lib's don't want me to have them...and soon they could be successful (doubtful but possible).

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rbernie
April 22, 2007, 01:20 AM
1) There is no such thing as a 'standard' AK 223 mag. As I understand things, there are at least three variants (Israeli/Galil, EGerman/Weiger, China/Norinco). None of these will work in a Saiga without some minor work to the rifle (adding a bullet guide to the front trunnion) and/or mag. Surefire makes a $50 mag that will work in a Saiga without requiring that the rifle be modded to make the mag work, but that might (MIGHT) get you into 922(r) issues - nobody knows for sure.
2) You must have SOME mechanical aptitude, but you don't need a lot of special tools.
3) Tromix wants close to $400 to do the conversion, but those are first rate and you're paying for that. You might could find cheaper, but not likely less than $200. I just bought a converted 223 Saiga for $430; it was used, but still in reasonable shape. Maybe you can find a similar deal.
4) See #1. The Galil mags tend to be popular since they're cheap and plentiful. I have used the Surefire high-cap in a 223 converted to use Galil mags, and it worked.
5) US furniture and G2 trigger group, for starters.
6) 223 is currently cheaper than 308 and will stay that way. But don't choose the chambering based on ammo cost - choose it based on which will do what you need for the rifle. If you go 308, the FBMG mags are the only game in town, and they work without requiring a bullet guide be added to the rifle.

rangerruck
April 23, 2007, 12:09 PM
my head is spinning.... go here
http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?http://forum.saiga-12.com/

aubie515
April 23, 2007, 01:24 PM
There is a site that shows you step by step on how to do the conversion for the Saiga. There is a link on the Saiga forum.

MD_Willington
April 23, 2007, 04:43 PM
There are also magazine adaptors available for the S.223

They are for a Galil, and they will let you use an AR magazine. Only do this after changing the FCG and furniture. The adaptor is welded to the receiver.

Once you've done that, get some US made magazines and you'll have 3 more 922r Browney points for each US made AR magazine.

Nightcrawler
April 25, 2007, 08:17 AM
Well, you've got the following different .223 AK mags out there:

-East German: Also used in the Romanian .223. Imported in small quantities, hard to find.
-Norinco: Used only in Chinese rifles, no longer imported.
-Galil: Used only in Israeli rifles. Available, but not imported in any quantity. Stock up while you can if you want to use these.
-Bulgarian: Used in Bulgarian rifles, and is what Tromix converts the Saiga rifles too ususally. Currently imported and probably your best bet.
-AK-74: Robinson used to convert their .223 Vepr rifles to take AK-74 magazines. The 5.45mm mags won't feed .223 reliably, but will with a new follower. I *think* these might fit in the same magwell as the Bulgarian mags, but I'm not positive. The .223 followers are expensive and only available from one source, though.
-Russian: The Russians are currently exporting .223 AK variants, but the ones in military format are not imported to the US. I'm unsure if they use an AK-74 mag with a new follower or a different kind of magazine.
-Valmet: Finnish magazines for the Valmet .223 rifles. Hard to find and no longer imported.

MD_Willington
April 25, 2007, 04:16 PM
I emailed ROBARM, not sure if they got the email or not.. but I received no reply...

You can modify your own AK-74 follower, but it is nice to have a US made follower because it counts as 1 compliance part, then you can add a falcon arms floor plate and your mags will count for 2 compliance parts.

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