Semi-Auto, mag fed 30-30 or 30.06?


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spartan20
April 23, 2007, 02:10 PM
Hey, I am looking for a SHTF/bug out type rifle with very common ammo usage. Not milsurp. I have a WASR for that.
Does such a thing exist that isnt in the price range of a Garand and items like that?
Even a 10 round mag would be good, just anything that uses a common hunting round, and is semit and uses a mag.
Any help would be great.

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ArmedBear
April 23, 2007, 02:16 PM
Remington 750 Woodsmaster
Now they have the nice walnut one and the truck-gun version in synthetic and matte. Balances and points like a 20 Gauge shotgun. Nice. 10-round magazines readily available. Available in various medium- and big-game calibers.

Used predecessors are 7400, 742, 740. The 750 is relatively new.

Browning BAR
Beautiful, expensive, but never heard a bad word about them. Winchester sells them too, rebadged as SXR. Available in a wide range of calibers including magnum hunting rounds.

M1A
There's always the M1A from Springfield (.308)

Check their websites.

Titan6
April 23, 2007, 02:37 PM
The Remington's are okay. However the .30-06 will not stand up to high volume fire with factory barrels. I bought a 742 the other day with scope and rings for less than $300. It shoots just fine. The .30-06 ammo is very cheap surplus from CMP.

Also would not recommend the .30-30. For the money you may as well get an SKS or AK as the 7.62X39 have almost the same ballistics. The commie round is not as popular as the old .30-30 but it is fast getting that way. I am willing to bet in ten years it overtakes the .30-30 in popularity for hunting.

ArmedBear
April 23, 2007, 02:47 PM
However the .30-06 will not stand up to high volume fire with factory barrels.

I think this is true for any sporter-weight barrel, including the BAR, as well as bolt actions. Carry weight and balance are favored over heat tolerance, in any sporter.

SSN Vet
April 23, 2007, 02:56 PM
overtakes the .30-30 in popularity for hunting.

I frequently hear that the 7.62x39 balistics are similar to .30-30....

but I did some comparisons the other day and (though I don't have a re-loading manual in the office here with me) if I recall correctly....

Your not going to get a 7.62x39 that will lob a 170 gr. bullet (the 170 gr Rem. Core Loct is one of the most popular deer hunting bullets).

Your not going to get a 7.62x39 that will chuck a 150 gr. 2,400 fps.

I'm certainly not the world expert on this, but I don't see the equivalence.

I'm wanting a 7.62 Saiga very much....but it will not be for deer hunting.

The .30-30 is a rimmed cartridge and I've only heard of it being used in lever and bolt action rifles.

Nomad, 2nd
April 23, 2007, 03:14 PM
Saiga?

strat81
April 23, 2007, 03:17 PM
Saiga: http://www.raacfirearms.com/

Basically, they're sporterized rifles and shotguns built on an AK action. Low price, but very good quality for what you pay. Many AK clones are Saiga conversions.

JesseL
April 23, 2007, 03:21 PM
Your not going to get a 7.62x39 that will chuck a 150 gr. 2,400 fps.

You can get a 7.62x39 that will chuck a 150 gr. 2,300 fps (https://dakotaammo.net/shop/product_info.php?cPath=22_64&products_id=126); and it will be a spitzer, rather than a round nose bullet so it shouldn't have to go too far before it's outpacing the 30-30.

atomd
April 23, 2007, 03:35 PM
Just out of curiosity, why not .308? Seems like it would open up a lot more options and ammo would still be readily available.

spartan20
April 23, 2007, 03:38 PM
.308 is expensive as hell as right now, and it is milsurp.
I already have a WASR in 7.62 so I dont really need a .308.
Im just looking for something that uses a popular round you could go into Wal-Mart, or some little shop in a little town and get, most likely something popular with hunters and the like.

JesseL
April 23, 2007, 04:04 PM
308 is expensive as hell as right now, and it is milsurp.
I already have a WASR in 7.62 so I dont really need a .308.

.308 is no more 'milsurp' than 30-06. Both were originally developed as US military cartridges and rapidly adopted by the civilian world.

Also, I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say you have a WASR in 7.62(x39) so you don't really need a .308? If you don't need a .308 why do you need a 30-06? .308 and 30-06 are very similar ballisticly and should both be widely available. Are you thinking that 7.62x39 and .308 Wincheser (7.62x51 NATO) are equivalent?:confused:

Titan6
April 23, 2007, 04:25 PM
Lately .30-06 has been much cheaper than .308. And there is still a good supply of surplus from CMP. Ballistics? Yep, the .308 is a little better.

I do not know of any semi-auto that uses the 30-30. Just because it is rimmed does not mean it could not be used in a properly designed semi-auto rifle however.

Ballisitics? Can you spot the 7.62X39 and the .30-30s below? The KE is right in there at range also.

http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/ballistics/comparative_ballistics_results.aspx?data=RL30301*R30301*R30302*R30303*L762391*R762391

ArmedBear
April 23, 2007, 04:28 PM
Ballistics? Yep, the .308 is a little better.

In what world?

Or perhaps, what do you mean by "ballistics"?

I do not know of any semi-auto that uses the 30-30. Just because it is rimmed does not mean it could not be used in a properly designed semi-auto rifle however.


True on both counts.

There have been rimmed semiautos, e.g. in .44 Magnum. I'm not sure anyone makes one at present, though.

All of that said, for a SHTF gun, a lever-action is still a viable option.

You can get a 7.62x39 that will chuck a 150 gr. 2,300 fps; and it will be a spitzer, rather than a round nose bullet so it shouldn't have to go too far before it's outpacing the 30-30.

Hornady's new bullets change that equasion. For hunting, I'd take the .30-30, just for the 170 grain bullets.

Titan6
April 23, 2007, 04:58 PM
In what world?

Or perhaps, what do you mean by "ballistics"?

Depends upon your use. For what the OP has in mind under 300 meters (certainly it must be under 300 as he was considering the .30-30) the .30-06 is better. For way, way, way out there I like .308 a little better. He is also talking factory loads not hand loadings.

Old Time Hunter
April 23, 2007, 05:09 PM
Heck, just go for the .30-30. Every country corner store and gas station has a few boxes laying around for sale. If you want to get enterprising, buy the Hornady Leverevolutions. Pretty expensive at $14.00 a box but right around the $ for a box of .30-06's. You can even get a real American rifle chambered for the .30-30 like a Marlin or something!

Essex County
April 24, 2007, 01:57 PM
I have never had a BAR but I have tried a couple of 742s in "06 and had problems with both. Granted, they were purchased used in excellent condition and I cleaned the extremely well. I have friends that have them in .308 and they seem to work well. Just my two cents. Essex

spartan20
April 24, 2007, 02:15 PM
Actually, does anyone have any experiance with the Remington 7400/7600 series? They have models in 30-06 and Eagle has 10 round mags for them. That could be something Im looking for.
Any thoughts or experiance?
Thanks again for the help.

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