SWAT has fully auto weapons stolen from their van


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Beachmaster
April 24, 2007, 04:10 PM
When I was in the military, if we transported any weapons, we were required to leave at least one person with the vehicle to guard them. You would think SWAT would take the same care, especially when they had fully automatic weapons in their van.


http://www.commercialappeal.com/mca/local/article/0,2845,MCA_25340_5501442,00.html


Memphis police were looking Monday night for the thieves who stole seven weapons from a North Carolina SWAT team van parked in South Memphis.

Members of the SWAT team based in Raleigh, N.C., were eating at Interstate Bar-B-Que, 2265 S. Third, about 3:30 p.m. Monday when they realized their van had been broken into, said Lt. Jerry Gwyn of Memphis felony response.


Taken were three machine guns, two semi-automatic handguns, and two 12-gauge shot guns, Gwyn said.

The officers, who were traveling from Raleigh to Little Rock for training, noticed two thieves driving away in a burgundy Ford Expedition, Gwyn said. A video surveillance camera also caught the thieves in action.

"We’re concerned with getting these guns off the street," Gwyn said. "We have a lot of folks working on it right now."

The theft was reminiscent of a heist in 1997, when thieves stole a Little Rock FBI team’s Suburban. Inside the SUV were grenade launchers, M-16 rifles, submachine guns and other potent weapons, which were found after an intense three-day search.

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NM234
April 24, 2007, 04:20 PM
Just one of the reasons I turned against gun control some 7 years or so now (when I was 14 or 15). Criminals will always find ways to get their hands on guns. I heard somewhere a couple months ago someone in England snuck up on a cop on the street and assualted him, either seriously injuring or killing him and taking his gun.

This is just another example of criminals stealing cops guns. Also there are cops that are involved in crime and could be bribed to steal guns for criminals.

offthepaper
April 24, 2007, 04:22 PM
Is it just me........................or are an awful lot of LEO's having a hard time holding onto their weapons? Were ANY precautions taken,like (as stated) leaving someone to guard the weapons, like parking where the van could be seen while eating, perhaps an alarm system would be helpful considering the cargo (:rolleyes: ), how well were they secured inside of the van (locked cases maybe) or were they simply piled in the van?
If the anti's want to sue the gunshops that sell guns that end up being used in a crime, where would the responsibility fall if these FA's are involved in a crime?
There just does'nt seem to be a lot of accountability from these type situations. I have never once heard of a LEO being fired for such incidents, but I've heard of others being held responsible for similar acts.
OK, I've vented. :fire: :cuss:

El Tejon
April 24, 2007, 04:22 PM
I certainly hope those thieves submitted to the necessary background checks before taking possession of these weapons. Of course, with concurrent registration it will be an easy matter to get those guns back.:D

Glad to know that the police are so responsible with firearms while we mere serfs are not to be trusted.

pharmer
April 24, 2007, 04:25 PM
They'll catch 'em. Gov't is mighty pissed they got 3 ClassIII's without the $200 stamp/each. Joe

Blakenzy
April 24, 2007, 04:30 PM
(Sarcasm on)

You see!! The anti's are right. Only highly trained police officers should bear arms... if you are a common citizen, criminals will just take away your "gun" and use it against you!

Hmm, wait a minute, these were highly trained SWAT guys. What's up with that, huh??

BobMcG
April 24, 2007, 05:06 PM
At least for this team, they give a new meaning to S.W.A.T...

Squad Without Auto Toys

NickHTK
April 24, 2007, 05:15 PM
Up here in Canada a police department managed to lose about 50 Glocks. Never made the news....

JamisJockey
April 24, 2007, 05:58 PM
When I still lived in Utah some yahoo (can't remember if he was local or Fed) poleece had his "Sniper" rifle stolen. The media made it sound so bad as if the rifle would go on a killing spree all by itself.....thing was it was nothing more than an accurized Remington.....

walking arsenal
April 24, 2007, 06:02 PM
Our sheriffs dept here certainly doesn't fool around with it. Their trucks have safe drawers built into the backs of them. Nothing out without the keys.

Popov
April 24, 2007, 06:08 PM
Thanks, I needed that one!

ilbob
April 24, 2007, 06:13 PM
Is it just me........................or are an awful lot of LEO's having a hard time holding onto their weapons?
I suspect this kind of thing has been happening as long as cops have had guns (which is not all that long). I think we hear about these things because it is much harder to cover up things like this these days.

If the anti's want to sue the gunships that sell guns that end up being used in a crime, where would the responsibility fall if these FA's are involved in a crime?
The criminals that commit the crimes are the ones responsible. Don't let the rhetoric about safe storage of firearms fool you any.

There just does'nt seem to be a lot of accountability from these type situations. I have never once heard of a LEO being fired for such incidents, but I've heard of others being held responsible for similar acts.
I would bet they get some kind of slap on the wrist when they get back home. Beyond that, unless they were blatantly irresponsible or in violation of some department policy, they are just the victims of a crime. Its not fair to blame the victims of a crime for what the criminals did.

whitetiger7654
April 24, 2007, 06:35 PM
"Our sheriffs dept here certainly doesn't fool around with it. Their trucks have safe drawers built into the backs of them. Nothing out without the keys."

Hopefully, they keep the keys with them. Or do they do like my school and lock up the microscopes then with a big note next to them write "MICROSCOPE KEYS IN HERE." I kid you not.

DoubleTapDrew
April 24, 2007, 07:29 PM
"Alright, who forgot to lock their door?" :p

They are the only ones professional enough, that I know of, to handle FA weapons.
Maybe getting a $1000 gun given to you makes you more complacent about security than a gun you shelled out $15,000 of your own money for. "If ya lose this one, we won't give ya another"

joesolo
April 24, 2007, 07:58 PM
yep, from my fair city. I'm in the same county (Shelby). Nothing is safe in Memphis.

Man With A Gun
April 24, 2007, 08:38 PM
The FBI lost a vehicle, the guns in the trunk, tactical radios, flak vests, badges, jackets, cuffs, and some of their new pistols.

Beat that!

Around Atlanta we have some seedy looking FBI agents doing raids etc. If it were not so serious it would be a scream!

BUSH and his crew make me feel so safe and warm.

offthepaper
April 24, 2007, 09:03 PM
BUSH and his crew make me feel so safe and warm.
--------------------------------------------
Huh?
That's out there.

Wire
April 24, 2007, 09:10 PM
It's a pleasant evening, my windows are open to catch the breeze, the air is soft.

I'm safe in Memphis.

Frog48
April 24, 2007, 09:10 PM
Lets not forget that only cops can be trusted with guns. :rolleyes:

Steve in PA
April 24, 2007, 09:12 PM
Having a vehicle, locker or even a house broken into isn't "loosing the weapons".

Seminole
April 24, 2007, 09:26 PM
The officers, who were traveling from Raleigh to Little Rock for training,

Hopefully their training will now include a unit on securing their weapons. :evil:

fletcher
April 24, 2007, 09:39 PM
Good old Raleigh :uhoh:


These are the individuals we should "trust" more than civilians with automatic weapons?

Seminole
April 24, 2007, 09:39 PM
Local news is now reporting that police have recovered one of the weapons in an apartment in North Memphis. If they have one, my guess is they'll soon have the others.

KMKeller
April 25, 2007, 09:42 AM
Dang!! I know the guys on Raleigh's SWAT team. There's gonna be a lot of ribbing at the PPC match on May 19th!

foghornl
April 25, 2007, 11:10 AM
Been a long time since I was in that part of Memphis, but (IIRC) that is well...a fairly rough area. "Orange Mound" is the name of that area, unless I am mistaken.

Orange Mound is approximately equal to Harlem, Watts, South Chicago, Houston, TX "5th Ward", Hough area of Cleveland.

Gordon
April 25, 2007, 11:34 AM
Wolverines!:neener:

SamTuckerMTNMAN
April 25, 2007, 12:03 PM
Taken were three machine guns, two semi-automatic handguns, and two 12-gauge shot guns, Gwyn said.

I am not so careless with a .22 pistol revolver. Just the other night I was eating with my wife and asked her if she locked her side door (you can get into the trunk through car). She wasn't sure. I went back out to the well lit area right in front of the restaraunt and locked her door. No ones getting my .308 if I can help it.

If I was responsible for that van, holy cow, and they think we commoners are unable to protect our weapons.

Listen everyone is human. Government employees are just, well, working for the government.
:evil:

st

SamTuckerMTNMAN
April 25, 2007, 12:19 PM
what made me write that in the first place was the knowledge that I have done plenty of stupid things.....but we must be alert that there ARE people who are willing and able to take advantage of that. In combat, or todays America, this could be someone's life, or your own. I'll NEVER EVER forget letting a drill instructor steal my weapon in basic training, Ft. Leonard Wood, damn, I've never put a rifle out of arms length that I was responsible for since. Even, no , especially in my back yard!:what:

st

ps - I have worked for the government.....still do..sometimes....

Seminole
April 25, 2007, 03:20 PM
Been a long time since I was in that part of Memphis, but (IIRC) that is well...a fairly rough area. "Orange Mound" is the name of that area, unless I am mistaken.

Orange Mound is approximately equal to Harlem, Watts, South Chicago, Houston, TX "5th Ward", Hough area of Cleveland.

Nope--Orange Mound isn't that close to the part of South Memphis where the SWAT team was eating at Interstate Barbecue. Orange Mound does, however, lie almost immediately adjacent to Chickasaw Gardens, where real estate prices are comparable to those on the Upper East Side of Manhattan, and both Orange Mound and Chickasaw Gardens are about a 2-minute drive from my house in a relatively modest upper-middle-class neighborhood. This is symptomatic of the crazy demographic quilt that resulted from the peculiar notions regarding urban planning held by "Boss" Crump in the first half of the 20th century.

Once you get the lay of the land in the city you can stay out of the bad parts pretty easily. I've lived here for 5 years and don't consider myself to be in any more danger than any of the other 4 or 5 cities I lived in during the 15 previous years. I stay aware of your surroundings, try not to do stupid things, and don't assume people I don't know are my friends--but these are good safety rules anywhere.

foghornl
April 25, 2007, 03:42 PM
I had forgotten exactly where the "Orange Mound" area is, since I haven't lived in the Memphis area for over 25 years. But I do remember my long deceased parents .....ahhhhhh "discussing-n-cussing" old city 'Boss' E.H. Crump.

IIRC, he was sort of like Emperor DICK Daley I of Chicago, although with a distinct Southern Style all his own.

Just like any major city, know the areas to stay far away from, and you'll be relatively OK.

Here is a tip, though, for any LEO's 'on the road'...when you stop for food, park where you can see the car, and sit close to the windows/main door. Set the alarm 'on' if the car has it.

I park as close to the door as I can no matter where I am, and try to get a window table.

bowfin
April 25, 2007, 04:26 PM
I'm not going to pin this on the SWAT guys, thieves are responsible for stealing stuff, not their victims.

But, I don't want to hear any more about "LEOS hav lots of training, they can be trusted more" from the anti crowd, especially after this, combined with the two wounded Secret Service guys and the FBI fatality.

Oohrah
April 25, 2007, 05:26 PM
You know it wasn't too many years ago, that a boatload
of Full Auto AKs was impounded in the SF, Calif. Not sure it
was because of, but believe Chinese Ammo banned, and
anything firearms that came from China. Those guns were slated
to be in the hands of Gangs! Back to "When guns are outlawed,
Outlaws will have guns." Note worthy is this week, a mayor in
Japan was killed by organized crime. In the land of no guns,
a stricter gun law to be passed. A solution? Go figure!!!!

obxned
April 25, 2007, 05:51 PM
Did they call 911? Well then - problem solved!

nra-life-member
April 25, 2007, 08:22 PM
Taken were three machine guns, two semi-automatic handguns, and two 12-gauge shot guns,


Ahh.. so this is how the bad guys get their guns.. I guess the bad guys didn't realize there is a law against stealing machine guns of all types. I also heard that unless you have a $ 200 tax stamp and a certain date of manufacture you can't have a MG in your possession.. So I guess this is 2 gun laws that were broken. Maybe we need more laws!!:barf:

Sounds like a news flash for the media and alike..

Seminole
April 25, 2007, 11:12 PM
Just heard on TV news: "If you know where the rest of the guns are, please call Crimestoppers"

Seriously!

foghornl
April 26, 2007, 10:55 AM
Any update on recovering the rest of the guns?

Seminole
April 26, 2007, 11:28 AM
All three autos and the shotguns have been recovered. They're still looking for the handguns, though.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/mca/local/article/0,2845,MCA_25340_5505080,00.html

2 held in theft of guns from lunching SWAT team
By Chris Conley
April 26, 2007

Memphis Police Wednesday charged one man and were holding at least one more in connection with the theft of tactical weapons, including three automatic assault weapons, from a out of state SWAT van.
Six of the eight stolen weapons had been recovered by Wednesday night, police said.

Brian Bowles, 21, was charged with the theft of a 2006 Ford Expedition that was used by thieves as a "work car" to break into the Wake County, North Carolina, SWAT team van Monday afternoon outside the Interstate Bar-B-Que.
Taken from the team's unmarked Chevrolet van were three assault rifles, three shotguns, two handguns and hundreds of rounds of ammunition.

An assault rifle was recovered Tuesday. The two other assault rifles and all three shotguns were back in police hands Wednesday night. The two handguns had yet to be found.

"We're still working on those last two," Memphis police spokesman Vince Higgins said.

Shelby County Sheriff's deputies early Tuesday recovered the Expedition in Millington, and crime scene investigators lifted Bowles' prints from inside the Expedition.

The van, which was owned by an elderly Florida man, was stolen from the lot of Bally's Casino in Tunica on April 19.

The plates on the Expedition were switched by the thieves and the van was used to carry off the weapons from the SWAT van, police said.

Bowles turned himself in to the Sheriff's Office fugitive squad late Tuesday. He gave a written statement to members of the Memphis Police Project Safe Neighborhoods squad in which he admitted he knew the Expedition was stolen, according to the charges. He said he was going to sell some stolen speakers.

"The case broke fast when we recovered the Ford Expedition," Higgins said.

On Tuesday afternoon, Memphis police began looking for a second man, Clent Green, 23. They arrested him early Wednesday on outstanding warrants for vehicle thefts. He was being questioned Wednesday, but had not been charged in the weapons theft.

Zoogster
April 26, 2007, 03:13 PM
I seem to recall within the last few months multiple cases of full auto weaponry stolen from federal and local LEOs. The MP5 stuck out in my mind as being involved in the most cases of stolen full autos. Most were stolen from either federal or local LEO vehicles while they were parked someplace.

This just goes to show that if firearms were not a protected right in this country then the criminals would have a serious advantage. They would always have LEO and the military to steal from or have corrupt "homies" within these institutions to smuggle to them.

In fact one thing that will not be particularly popular on a gun board but is true and happening nonetheless is that because the market is legaly controlled yet allowed to exist, the types of firearms present are limited to what is within the law (for the most part). If firearms were outlawed (or so severely restricted that they might as well be) the market would be satisfied by people not within the scope of the law and regulations, and the firearms available would be those deemed most desired. For example the AK-47 is one of the most widespread firearms in the world, and they are a full auto weapon that is relatively cheap. These full auto weapons would likely be sold in massive quantities just like they are in much of the world.

So more gun control laws can actualy lead to less control over guns. In a nation where we cannot even stop human beings that need to eat, drink, and breathe from crossing borders in the millions there is absolutely no hope for stopping inanimate objects that are far easier to smuggle from entering out nation.

DoubleTapDrew
April 26, 2007, 04:47 PM
Ok, so 3 full autos, and 2 shotguns. Aren't the SWAT shotguns usually 14" barreled guns? So that's 50 years and $500,000 on top of whatever they get for the other crimes right (for posession of illegal NFA items)?

DomMega
April 26, 2007, 05:02 PM
Just one of the reasons I turned against gun control some 7 years or so now (when I was 14 or 15). Criminals will always find ways to get their hands on guns. I heard somewhere a couple months ago someone in England snuck up on a cop on the street and assualted him, either seriously injuring or killing him and taking his gun.

This is just another example of criminals stealing cops guns. Also there are cops that are involved in crime and could be bribed to steal guns for criminals.

The country of England is a complete joke. They have disarmed each and every citizen on that island and crime has gone up 3 to 4 times what it was. You're not even allowed to have a weapon to protect your home. If I was a criminal, I would move there. It's like a free for all, take whatever from whoever and nobody can do anything about it.

TrybalRage
April 26, 2007, 08:39 PM
Well, my first thought was:

Ha!

teCh0010
April 26, 2007, 09:02 PM
Been a long time since I was in that part of Memphis, but (IIRC) that is well...a fairly rough area. "Orange Mound" is the name of that area, unless I am mistaken.

Orange Mound is approximately equal to Harlem, Watts, South Chicago, Houston, TX "5th Ward", Hough area of Cleveland.


The mound is east of there.

The area where they were can be rough, but the resturant where they were eating is very popular and busy. I take work visitors there for lunch all the time, but I don't know if I would come back after dark.

atomd
April 26, 2007, 09:29 PM
Funny story about something like that. A while back at a Dunkin Donuts shop, an acquaintance of mine was in the shop when someone went into the men's bathroom and right there on the sink was a pistol. He told the girl behind the counter and she called the police. They showed up and there was a big to-do about it until they realized it belonged to another officer who left it there while using the facilities. That one didn't make the paper and I almost thought it was a tall tale at first.

It gets better when a year or so later in a neighboring town ANOTHER officer left his sidearm ON THE SINK IN ANOTHER DUNKIN DONUTS BATHROOM. Fortunately someone picked it up and called the police. This department suspended him and it was all over the papers. In the article it mentioned a "similar situation in a nearby town". He was eventually fired after his suspension due to other things he had done in the past apparently (nothing crazy like that, I think it was just being late or not showing up for work or something). I found it sort of humorous that it just happened to be a donut shop both times. Doh! :uhoh:

Glockfan.45
April 29, 2007, 05:48 PM
I'll NEVER EVER forget letting a drill instructor steal my weapon in basic training, Ft. Leonard Wood, damn, I've never put a rifle out of arms length that I was responsible for since. Even, no , especially in my back yard!



Reminds me of a time we were out training, and an ROTC cadet playing opfor left an M16A2 with an M203 launcher behind in the woods. He didnt even realize it till we got back to the armory. They had us out there all night looking for the damn thing, and it never was found. I am not sure what happened to that cadet afterwards, but somebody ended up with quite the piece of hardware. Sadly it was not the last time such an incident would happen. A buddy of mine from another unit told me a SAW was left behind at the local State Police Range where they held live fire drills. When they went back for it.........:uhoh: . It just goes to show if you want full auto just hang around where Army Reserve is drilling, and wait for them to leave.

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