Ammo Hoarding...


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Afy
April 25, 2007, 04:56 PM
I see a lot of posts about people buying 7-10K rounds of .308/.223/30-06/etc....

So my limited experience has me confused.... would really appreciate it if you could educate me on this...

1. Given that a barrell will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isnt it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo?
2. Why not reload? Its cheaper, and more accurate ammo...
3. The occasional hoard of 100K+ rounds in various calibers... are we preparing for the Zombie war or EOTWAWKI?
4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?

I have bought a couple of hundred rounds at a time because the price was right... but not 4-5K. (Dont have the money, and dont envisage shooting that much in a single caliber). Now if you are a pro... I can understand it. But most are not...hence the confusion....

Then again I do have respect for the guy who hoarded 1000K+ rounds at home... though I wouldnt do it.

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strat81
April 25, 2007, 05:04 PM
Reloading is not always cheaper, especially in "commie" calibers. Buying in bulk can yield great savings - that's why I like to buy by the case. If I could save 15%-20% by buying multiple cases, I probably would. Ammo isn't getting any cheaper.

TexasP226
April 25, 2007, 05:17 PM
On what gun does the barrel wear out after 5k rounds?

Plink
April 25, 2007, 05:17 PM
Afy, it's pretty hard to wear a barrel out. The finicky target guns may start to loose some of their fine accuracy at 5k rounds, but the barrel is hardly worn out at that point. Most guns can go tens of thousands of rounds and still shoot fine. I've got handguns and rifles both with 25-30k rounds through them that still shoot great, and a rimfire that has over 100k rounds through it and still has target grade accuracy. Changing out a barrel on most guns isn't too difficult and is actually quite a common service offered at most shops also.

I tend to buy in bulk and reload in bulk for the savings. I have several guns in the same caliber (AKs, SKSes) so 10k rounds may work out to only 1k or less per gun in reality. I'm also a relatively high volume shooter and go through as many as 75-80k rounds in a good year (much of that is rimfire). To me it's mostly savings related to buy/reload in bulk, but I also make an effort to have a long term supply on hand, just in case.

Car Knocker
April 25, 2007, 05:19 PM
Given that a barrell will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isnt it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo? How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?
Do you think that people just throw the firearm away when the barrel wears out and never buy another in that caliber? Guns can be rebarreled, you know. Sometimes people (gasp) have more than one gun in a caliber. Ammo doesn't go bad in a short period of time, like a carton of milk, so it will shoot just as well 10 years down the road and the price per shot will likely be cheaper than fresh ammo in 2017. Given the trend in ammo and component prices lately, it may well be a smart financial move for a shooter to invest in ammunition.

MMcfpd
April 25, 2007, 05:20 PM
I've probably shot +/-8000 rounds in the last year, and a lot was in the calibers whose prices are skyrocketing right now (7.62 x 39 and .223/5.56), so snatching a case when I see a deal is something I'll continue for the present.

HGUNHNTR
April 25, 2007, 05:24 PM
I guess I'm guilty of loving to buy ammo..It just gives me a warm fuzzy feeling. When I find a good deal, I buy as much as possible.

Afy
April 25, 2007, 05:25 PM
Gentlemen... like I mentioned I have limited experience...

I am currently gravitating towards more accurate weapons... hence the number. I dont know enough... to begin with. Hence the education :)

Also secretly I would love to have a few 100K of ammo but it isnt going to happen. Ammo on an average (other than .22lr) is well above $1 a round here.... so there is some jealousy as well. :):)

Nomad, 2nd
April 25, 2007, 05:27 PM
I just bought ~66K of 5.45x39 It cost me right at $0.10 per round... delivered in crates for long term storage. (Till I shoot it all up)

As for how much I shoot, I shot about 700 rounds of it this past saturday...
+ some 9mm and .22's, and the 3 weeks I was in Tn I shot over 12,000 rounds.

1. Your barrel life is low -in Chrome line barrels anyway.
-Who says I have only one gun?
2. Doubt it'll be cheaper to reload... and not much for the lack of fuss (I have a reloading set up... this is easier)
3. No, I'm 24... and plan on shooting for a LONG time at this year's prices.
-My .308 hord has 3X in price in ONE year... there's no investment I can put it into that will let me buy ammo later and not loose $... I'll shoot it all... one day.
4. No idea... alot.
(If you can keep track it's not enough;^)

A couple things you are missing:
One I already outlined... buying while it's cheap, before it goes up I already pointed out... and naturally if you do that you can buy more.

The other thing is... when you call up and order a pallet load... you get a price break... I found out a few years ago. Ever since I try to buy ammo 2X per year... and I get alot more ammo for my money.

Edited to add: Buying when it's scarse is called Hording. When you are buying it when it's plentiful and put it back it's called stockpiling. FYI

jthuang
April 25, 2007, 05:29 PM
I used to be "that guy". You know, the guy with several guns ... but he never had any ammo. :p Then I started shooting competitions and other organized events ... and realized how little 1k of ammo can be.

So I stocked up (fortunately prior to today's insane pricing). And I'm glad I did ... no way I'm paying 35-40 cents per round for XM193 or up to 50 cents per round for SA .308 ....

Justin

PS I have a Dillon 550B and (up until recently) it was not cheaper to reload surplus military rifle calibers.

Plus, you have to figure your sweat equity in reloading ammo. It's not free ... it's time you could be spending doing something else. Reloading rifle rounds takes more time because you need to lube the cases prior to resizing (which is something you don't have to do with carbide pistol dies).

Afy
April 25, 2007, 05:30 PM
Nomad...

You're the exception to the average person. Plus I did enjoy the pictures ....

And I have no chrome barrels :(

SoCalShooter
April 25, 2007, 05:34 PM
. Given that a barrell will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isnt it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo?
2. Why not reload? Its cheaper, and more accurate ammo...
3. The occasional hoard of 100K+ rounds in various calibers... are we preparing for the Zombie war or EOTWAWKI?
4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?


1. Reloading is time consuming and meticulous and it does not always mean more accurate ammo, you have to find a load that is right for each one of your guns. And that can definetly be time consuming.

2. Some people shoot a lot. I know I do as of late I have been shooting about 1000 rounds per month in 45 and .22 (matches, practice, practice) also, some shooters when they find a particular lot of ammo that shoots well in their gun they buy as much of it as possible because they know how it will act in their weapon.

3. I shoot a large amount of ammo, probably 2+ per year. I reload and buy factory ammo, matches I shoot about 250 rounds of just .45, this month I have already shot 500 rounds and will be shooting another 500 before the month is out.

4. If there ever comes a ban or background check on ammo, I want to have a lot stored up so when I have to go accross state lines to buy ammo, its absolutely critical to do so.

taliv
April 25, 2007, 05:44 PM
afy, i stockpile components instead and I do reload. when you shoot 300-500+ rounds in a trip to the range, 1000 rounds isn't as impressive as it sounds. believe me, it goes quick.

TexasP226
April 25, 2007, 05:51 PM
Yikes, I'm sorry you have to pay $1 per round! What caliber(s) are you shooting?

Nomad, 2nd
April 25, 2007, 05:52 PM
Afy: Get some.;)

And people who 'outdo' me are not as uncommon as you think.

BigSoundRacing
April 25, 2007, 05:53 PM
I was one of those guys "guns but no ammo" - sold off everything and now I have three guns.

Components to build 5k .308 and a Dillon 650.
5k of .223
3k of 5.7x28

Everything but the Dillon fit into my smaller safe.

It is a comfortable feeling knowing that if SHFT tomorrow, I have stocks that can be used, sold or traded. Prices continue to go higher and I'll continue to buy as I consume components for my hobbie.

Be safe, BSR

Afy
April 25, 2007, 06:04 PM
Texas

Primarily .22 LR, .222 Remington Magnum, 8x64S and 300 Winchester Magnum

We are llimited to some very wierd calibers in France. .223 or .308 (milsurp in general) is a pain of paper work to buy and 1 year of running around... versus leaving with the rifle and ammo the same day.

Roadwild17
April 25, 2007, 06:13 PM
I was definitely one of those guys that had a gun or 3 and 50-200 rounds per gun. I went to the range one day and didn't have a single round to my name. Now I'm in the position of not getting a gun in a new caliber until I have what I feel enough ammo to cover me for a while. The only rounds I'm stocked to a comfortable level is 9mm (2K rounds ball and 500+ a few mags of hp) and about 3k rounds of 7.62X39, and I'm still stacking it up.

DMK
April 25, 2007, 06:41 PM
1. Given that a barrell will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isnt it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo?
2. Why not reload? Its cheaper, and more accurate ammo...
3. The occasional hoard of 100K+ rounds in various calibers... are we preparing for the Zombie war or EOTWAWKI?
4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?

1) Who has just one rifle per caliber? I have multiples for almost every caliber I have except 30-06 and M1 carbine. I have about 10k of surplus 7.62x51 to share between two FALs, an M1 Garand (converted), and two No.2 Enfields. That's only 2k per rifle assuming I don't buy any more rifles. I think I'm down to about 7k of 5.56 to share among five 5.56 calibered AR15s.

2) I've priced it out a number of ways. Not even including equipment costs, I can't reload for what I've paid for any of my rifle ammo. Almost all of my rifle ammo was purchased for less that 14 cents a round, some less than 10 cents a round. Although with todays prices the gap is closer.

3) I've hoarded for two reasons: I predicted ammo will get harder to find and it will get much more expensive. Both of these have come true for almost every caliber I have except 7.62x54R (and even with that some of my favorite types are now gone). I was buying Barnual 7.62x39 for $39 per 500. I have about 4k of that and wish I bought more. You can't even find Barnual anymore and Wolf is nowhere near that price.

4) I used to shoot about 500 rounds a year per caliber (and I have a lot of different calibers), but now I'm probably down to around 200-300 on average. Some more. I've been on a 5.56 kick lately.

So now I sit back and shoot what I have while most others ask where can one get this or that, and complain about how expensive ammo has gotten.

gaweidert
April 25, 2007, 06:41 PM
Many of these people buy cheap milsurp ammo in bulk simply becasue it is so cheap. Often about 10Cents per round or cheaper in the good old days a a couple of years ago. I have stocked up but I also have a small collection of milsurp rifles and enjoy shooting them when I get the chance. I figure that when I retire, I will shoot off all my ammo then sell most of the guns.

BTW, my ammo is looking more and more like a good investment. The value some of mine is up over 50% in the 8 months or so.

kcmarine
April 25, 2007, 06:50 PM
Here's how it's gonna work:


1. Surplus supply dries up or becomes wildly expensive

2. Ammo makers realize the profit potential

3. Makers buy up manufacturing equipment

4. Makers turn out surplus grade ammo at around eh, 25- 30 cents a round.

glockman19
April 25, 2007, 07:02 PM
I try to keep on hand 1-2k per caliber.
.308
.22LR
.223
.38
.357
.45
9mm
.30-06

Matt Dillon
April 25, 2007, 07:31 PM
It is far better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.... and who thinks the price of ammo will go down any time in the future?

DoubleTapDrew
April 25, 2007, 07:43 PM
It is far better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.... and who thinks the price of ammo will go down any time in the future?

Oh it will...about the same time that gas gets back down to $1 a gallon :banghead:
I wish I would have stockpiled back when ammo cost half of what it does now...you know, last year :( Oh well, time to fire up the dillon.

ZeSpectre
April 25, 2007, 07:59 PM
1. Given that a barrel will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isn't it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo?
As others have pointed out, this is misinformation. I can see guns getting a good once-over by a gunsmith at 5k rounds but that doesn't mean it's shot-out.

2. Why not reload? Its cheaper, and more accurate ammo...
I shoot a lot of 7.62x39 and 7.62x25. Definitely still cheaper to buy than reload (also reloading in the apartment is the one thing the wife has absolutely forbidden)

3. The occasional hoard of 100K+ rounds in various calibers... are we preparing for the Zombie war or EOTWAWKI?
100-200 rounds per practice session, Practicing 1-2 times a month, comes out to around 1200-2400 rounds per year.
Divide that up amongst my 3 favorite guns and that is still 400-800 rounds per year.

4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?
See above. Some a lot less (12GA shotgun) some a lot more (.38 Special used in cowboy action shooting).

I have bought a couple of hundred rounds at a time because the price was right... but not 4-5K. (Dont have the money, and dont envisage shooting that much in a single caliber). Now if you are a pro... I can understand it. But most are not...hence the confusion....
If I have the $$$ and I find a good price then I buy. I like to keep around 1k rounds of each caliber (except for 12ga, I keep a LOT less of that :D )

JNewell
April 25, 2007, 08:09 PM
1. Given that a barrell will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isnt it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo?

To add to the responses above, a rifleman with a rifle worth having +10k rounds for might very well also have additional barrels and the skills to change them. Specialization is for insects, that kind of thing... ;)

I also want to point out that several times in the past 10-15 years there have been temporary ammo droughts. Even if you're not worried about TEOTWAWKI, you might want to have some stored.

ctdonath
April 25, 2007, 08:11 PM
It's a consumable that will only go up in price, never goes bad (abuse aside), always has buyers, value skyrockets in tough financial times, has practically no sentimental value, is basically untraceable, and is easily handled in values from trivial (one round) to major (case).

Sounds like a good reason to have a LOT of it ASAP.

Only problem is that a single round can relieve you of the rest of it rather easily.

Gustav
April 25, 2007, 08:22 PM
Better to have too much that not enough after all when does ammo ever go down in price?:
The days of buying it cheap seem to be dwindling but at least its still available even if more expensive. :fire:
Ask any of the old timers about their time during WW II when only a few calibers were available at the local country store if any ammunition was to be had at all.
After covering basics its a good thing to keep a little extra on hand even a few calibers you may not use but a friend family member or neighbor may one day need.;)
Get whatever you can afford while you can because who knows what the future holds as fuel and goods increase in price?
I still am shooting some ammunition my dad has from 50 to 60 years ago properly stored it can last a long time unlike many of the things people seem to buy today.

George Hill
April 25, 2007, 08:27 PM
Next Liberal Anti Gun move is to limit ammo...

Stock up while you can... they might not be able to take away our guns, but they can starve them to death.

gak
April 25, 2007, 11:34 PM
Ammo went up 30-35% in my area just in the last year, I woulda' been stupid -not- to horde. In fact, I'm sorry I didn't buy more.

It will be interesting to see the prices when I need more, probably $50/cartridge.

MMcfpd
April 25, 2007, 11:51 PM
Yesterday I was at Academy and saw their Monarch green box .223 priced at $7.68/20. I have some I bought in January and it's marked $3.86. Wow.

So, since this thread began this afternoon I found two decent deals and have another 2K rounds inbound. I might pick up some ammo cans tomorrow.

TexasP226
April 25, 2007, 11:58 PM
I too just bought 1k of 9mm anf .45 each. I just received a shipment of 1k of 7.62 and 1200 .223. I think that will be my primary stock and I will pick up a few boxes here and there over time.

byf43
April 26, 2007, 07:16 AM
George Hill wrote:
Next Liberal Anti Gun move is to limit ammo...

Stock up while you can... they might not be able to take away our guns, but they can starve them to death.


Absolutely correct!

Daniel Patrick Moynihan (sp???) said many years ago (paraphrasing, here) that Americans have the right to keep and bear arms, guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment, but, there is nothing in the 2A about being allowed to have ammunition.

I really dislike quoting the libs, or even putting thoughts into their little heads, but, we should all be aware of what MIGHT come down the pike, towards us.


As for the amount of ammo that is 'reasonable'. . .
A good friend has several K98k Mauser(s) and a semi-auto MG 42.
He (not too long ago) stumbled upon a really good deal on 8mm Mauser ammo.
He bought two PALLETS of the stuff. (How much ammo and how much did it cost. . . that ain't my business, but, he can afford it. I can't!)

silentmajority
April 26, 2007, 09:24 AM
I have been finding Wolf .223 for $3.99 - $4.25/box of 20, or about 20/round at a sporting goods store in the next county, and at a recent gun show. Each time I bought 100 rounds. Based on this thread, that sounds like a reasonable price for someone that doesn't reload. I suppose I might find lower prices if I spent some time on the internet, but with the weight, I'm not sure if any lower proces would get eaten up by the shipping costs?

If some of you found 20/round .223 Wolf, would you be buying it up in quantity (1000 rounds), or do you think I could fairly easily do better?

MMcfpd
April 26, 2007, 09:54 AM
If some of you found 20/round .223 Wolf, would you be buying it up in quantity (1000 rounds), or do you think I could fairly easily do better?

Today at Classic Arms (http://www.classicarms.us/htm/ammunition.htm):

WOLF .223 55GR...1000 RDS PER CASE...............................$159.95

MMcfpd
April 26, 2007, 10:05 AM
Well, that didn't last long. It worked for me yesterday, but apparently they're out now.

silentmajority
April 26, 2007, 10:12 AM
Well, that didn't last long. It worked for me yesterday, but apparently they're out now.

Was that price with or before shipping? If shipping was extra, how much? Thanks.

MMcfpd, nevermind - I realized my dialing finger actually still does work [duh]. Shipping to me would have been about $20, so still a good deal. She said to check back Monday. They had 1/2 pallet yesterday and sold it all from 4:30 PM yesterday to this morning.

DMK
April 26, 2007, 10:13 AM
Well, that didn't last long. It worked for me yesterday, but apparently they're out now.Guess that pretty well answered the question didn't it? ;)

silentmajority
April 26, 2007, 10:40 AM
Another question on the same basic topic:

I use MilSurp ammo boxes, and toss-in several of those those little silica packets that you find in the box with most new shoes, luggage, and lots of other products that ship here by ocean containers, to absorb moisture. I try to be careful about choosing ammo boxes with good seals, but it gets pretty humid here in the summer, so I thought it would be a good idea.

With growing kids, I'm buying new shoes all the flippin' time, so I've accumulated dozens of the silica packs over the years. :banghead:

Just wondered if anyone else does this?

Also, I've asked every store where I've bought guns and supplies, and none of them seem to sell these packets. If any retailers or e-tailers are reading this, maybe you would consider offering the silica packs for sale. They must be ultra-low cost, since they're thrown in with so many products as packing material, so even if you charged 25 each, you'd probably make a profit. Not something you coud retire on, but....

Ok, I'll shut up now.

xd9fan
April 26, 2007, 10:43 AM
We all would not be this way if Congress didn't act so Anti-liberty.

Lonestar.45
April 26, 2007, 10:50 AM
I've seen Wolf 7.62x39 go from $80/1000 just three or four short years ago, to $209/1000. .223, .45, and 9mm all seem to have doubled in price as well in just a few short years. Guys that bought it cheap and stacked 'em deep are looking pretty good right now, wouldn't you say?

Every hoarder's got his reasons. Economic, future bans or taxes on ammo, TEOTWAWKI, SHTF, Katrina, Zombies, competition shooting, etc. Me, I keep what I can on hand, but it's never enough if you like to shoot.

M2 Carbine
April 26, 2007, 10:57 AM
Afy

3. The occasional hoard of 100K+ rounds in various calibers... are we preparing for the Zombie war or EOTWAWKI?
4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?


I have a couple ranges, so shoot a good bit.

Between reloading and buying cases of ammo on sale I hoard a lot.


Why stock up on ammo? Because it's the smart thing to do.
While you are paying outrageous prices on ammo and watching the price go higher every day, I'm shooting ammo that costs about 25 percent, or less, of what you are paying.

For instance my 7.62x39 cost $54 for a 1,000 round case and I'm shooting 9mm WWB that cost $4.39 a box.
I'm shooting 45ACP, 38 Special, 9mm, etc, that I reloaded a few years back for $2.50 a box, or less.

Buy in bulk and shoot cheap.:)

heron
April 26, 2007, 11:34 AM
Last spring, when I bought my .22 pistol, I hadn't discovered the bulk concept yet, and would sometimes find myself driving to three or four stores over three counties to find maybe two or three boxes -- one day's supply -- of what I liked. I spent more in gas than I did on the ammo, and spent more time on the road than I did on the range. No more. I look at all the web sites, find the best price (with increasing discount for volume) and let UPS do the driving. Bought a case last year and have about 1k left of it. For my other guns (which I use less) I get a minimum of a brick at a time, partly just to make the shipping cost worthwhile.
The thing that struck me, was that I used to think that a gun was expensive and the ammo was cheap. That holds fine as long as you hardly ever shoot.
Point: buy as much at a time as you can.

0007
April 26, 2007, 12:21 PM
Don't forget that most of the surplus ammo is NOT reloadable. So you have to keep replacing it. Me I'm sorry I was so late coming to the 7.62X39 table. I remember thinking that $45.00/500 was ridiculous. I would be happy to find it for less than $75.00/500 now. Don't even get me started on 7.62X51 or .223. I'm really thinking I need to buy maybe 10K of the 5.45X39 NOW, even though I don't have anything to shoot it in - yet.

Im283
April 26, 2007, 01:02 PM
Glad today is payday, time to go buy some more rounds.

As my stock in ammo increases so does the minimum amount of rounds I have to have on hand to even go shoot.

I used to be happy having 100 rounds of different ammo for what few guns I have, now I want to have 5 times that much on hand all the time. Probably in another few months it will be 1000 rounds on hand.

I am addicted to it.

Oohrah
April 26, 2007, 01:08 PM
Been doing this for a few years now, so here is my 2 cents. If it is
not a current used military caliber, be concerned. Surplus will raise
as the amounts dwindle. Not all this ammo is great, but most will
go click bang. I would seriously have the knowledge and equipment
to load your own. Most MilSurp cases is crap unless mgf. in the US.
In fact all the componets made in this country are the best including
prices. Other than GI Match, my loaded for any caliber rounds are
more accurate and function more reliable than any MilSurp that I have
used.
I suspect the future will perhaps point to controlling the ammo rather
than the firearms or a combination of both. A short time back our supply
of 223 ammo was so low that Federal could not produce the needed
amount working 7/24. Israel took up the slack. For many years Kailf.,
and some others are working on a tax ammo and in some towns not
allowing the sale of ammo. Don't know, but a firearm is not much of
a tool without ammo. It also may be what concearns those ugly
assult weapon with a BAYONET lug dangerous!:fire: :D :D

Risasi
April 26, 2007, 02:08 PM
You know I had given this exact thing some thought years ago. Of course I didn't really do much about, other than start collecting brass. And I have been doing that for almost a half a decade. Tons of calibers for which I don't even own firearm.

That's all fine and dandy, but I realized recently what about primers? What would be nice is to have a very (very, VERY) large supply of primers. How well to these keep? Also any chance of someone devising a way to "roll your own" primers?

I've been consolidating all my firearms down to a few select calibers, and even all the same platform, that way I can stock up on rifles, parts, accessories, ammo and reloading equipment. I anticipate by the end of this year I will have over 10k rounds in each major caliber, will be reloading brass, and have a decent collection of parts to keep my firearms running indefinitely. I intend to have a rifle, shotgun, and handgun for each of my kids when they grow up.

johndoe1027
April 26, 2007, 02:51 PM
4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?

Well when I first got my new handgun (M&P 9c) I shot 600 rounds out of it in the first week...
Of course I slowed down after that but only because that's all I could afford.

I have been finding Wolf .223 for $3.99 - $4.25/box of 20, or about 20/round at a sporting goods store in the next county, and at a recent gun show.
I found some ADCOM for 4.99/20. That's the cheapest I can find anywhere (aside from the Amerc I found for $4/20 at the last gun show :barf: ). I stop by every payday and pick up 5 more boxes... Most stores around here don't even have any .223 or 5.56. If you could provide a link for $4 boxes of wolf, I'd be very appreciative. :cool:
Am I just not finding the websites that give deals for bulk ammo? I get Shooters and cheaper than dirt (and the others) in the mail and their prices ess-you-see-kay. I can get 5.56 cheaper at the pawn shop down the street.

And 22LR? Come on, that stuff is CHEAP. Let's see, for the price of a box of (50) 45LC's I could get approx 900 22LR's.... That's 1800% more expensive or something. Please forgive me if my math is out in left field, y'all get the idea.

El Tejon
April 26, 2007, 02:58 PM
I don't "hoard", I invest for the future.:D

1. I just don't have one weapon is a particular caliber, I have dozens.
2. I do not reload anymore because of time. I used to reload and it is great, but time utility dictates that I do not (for now, if copper goes any higher I just may get back into it).
3. 100K+ rounds is for whatever. As the Framers stated, we have guns for fighting. If you get in a fight, have lots of ammo. Ask our THR combat vets about the importance of having lots of ammo about.
4. Shoot all calibers in the 25K to 30K per year range.

George Hill
April 26, 2007, 03:14 PM
TIGER 7.62X39MM (Russian mil stuff just like Wolf) is 199.99 a case. I picked up 2.

busy_squirrel
April 26, 2007, 03:39 PM
4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?


200-500rds./month PER caliber.

That's just plinking, not actual target practice or hunting or "civil needs". You do the math.

LeafsFan
April 26, 2007, 04:38 PM
Currently I own two rifles:

Mosin 91/30. I buy an average of 1000 rds for it at a time & reorder when i get down to 200. I shoot approx 60 rounds once a week, all of it target practice, not plinking.

K-31. I have 120 rounds left out of the 500 I bought with it. Even surplus 7.5mm is too expensive to shoot much at the moment, so I'm keeping the 120 rounds on hand for now.

If I wasn't leavnig my job and going back to college in the fall I'd keep probably 5000 rounds on hand for each gun. Better to have it than not, since the prices for it aren't going back down anytime soon.

Gewehr98
April 27, 2007, 11:35 AM
I try to keep 1K rounds for each of the 24 different chamberings I reload. It's nice having a huge supply of brass from previous days as a range officer, so that's pretty much amortized. So I focus on buying big lots of primers, powder, and bullets. I find that cranking the handle on the big blue Dillon is therapeutic, and I take comfort in knowing that my worst 7.62x39 handload still shoots better than that steel-cased Wolf crap. :D

http://mauser98.com/safeammo2.jpg

silentmajority
April 27, 2007, 11:57 AM
~24k rounds on-hand most of the time? Hope you have a Halon system in that room! ;)

ctdonath
April 27, 2007, 08:30 PM
That photo is insightful. More people need to see that when asserting how bad "lots of ammo" is (demanding arsenal licenses, etc.). Twenty four THOUSAND rounds, and it all takes up about the space of two coolers.

"I don't fear the man who has ten nuclear weapons. I'm terrified of the man who only wants one."
- _The_Peacemaker_

gezzer
April 27, 2007, 11:06 PM
Hoard? I resent that. I buy what I feel I need for whatever. Why are you calling it hoarding?

cameron.personal
April 27, 2007, 11:43 PM
A Porsche
A property with horses
and a huge supply of ammunition...


It's a goal!

Durruti
April 28, 2007, 09:22 AM
TIGER 7.62X39MM (Russian mil stuff just like Wolf) is 199.99 a case.

AIM Surplus (http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/copy_of_7_62x39.html) has it for $149.95!

Bartholomew Roberts
April 28, 2007, 09:30 AM
Last year (a slow year for me), I shot about 3k rounds of 5.56, 6k rounds of 9mm and a few hundred of various and assorted other calibers. This year I'll be shooting 2k of 5.56 and 500 9mm in one weekend for a single class (in addition to what I've already shot).

At those rates, an ammo stash that looks like an "arsenal" to your average joe with no interest in guns won't last three months - and with the way the war is driving up ammo prices, it is always a smart idea to buy while you can. I waited around for about two years and just lived off my existing stockpile and finally noticed that good ammo wasn't getting any cheaper or more plentiful.

xd9fan
June 14, 2007, 11:42 AM
How long does commercial ammo keep?

bender
June 14, 2007, 12:03 PM
I've never bought large quantities of ammo, even though I want to.

Ordering it over the internet, and with a CC, to me it seems like a flag that "hey, this guy's a weirdo...".

If "they" ever decide to look at ammo records from the large distributors that is...


No I'm not wearing a tin foil hat... :)

Car Knocker
June 14, 2007, 04:04 PM
How long does commercial ammo keep?

Kept in a cool and dry location, decades!

leadcounsel
June 14, 2007, 04:37 PM
What are the top websites people use to find the best/cheapest ammo?

Also, I've found that several, including Midwayusa, offer C&R discounts on ammo. Just fax them your license.

Tin Gizel
June 14, 2007, 04:43 PM
1. Given that a barrell will typically wear out at about 5K rounds... isnt it excessive to have 2x the life of the barrel in ammo?

Haven't had a barrel go bad on me yet.

2. Why not reload? Its cheaper, and more accurate ammo...

My time is worth more to me than the money i'm saving, plus when shooting 1,000's of rounds, there's no time to reload.

3. The occasional hoard of 100K+ rounds in various calibers... are we preparing for the Zombie war or EOTWAWKI?

Don't have 100k yet, but yes, I do have a seperate stash for SHTF and Zombies.

4. How much do you actually shoot per year in a given caliber?

Don't know about this, but last night alone I shot 500 rnds of 9mm and 220 rnds of 223.
In september I'm taking FP and FR so i'll be going through another 1,500rnd 9mm and 1k of 223.
Take those and all the range trips in between and i'd say I shoot my fair shair of ammo. I'd say I average 50k rnds of various calibers throughout a year.

Lastly, as Nomad said, there's some significant savings to be had buying in bulk.

TEDDY
June 14, 2007, 04:48 PM
JUST GOT BOX OF 45/70 ammo.$12.32 for 20 rds A-MERC brand wondered where this co was went on web and its in miami fla.web site says gov bought 426 million rds last yr.this year they bought 1.5 billion.this country contracted to buy 2 billion from romania of 7.62 X 39.you want to know where the surplus goes.have your head in the sand yes.I figured ammo would go up.and if you reload at least you wont be caught short.and of course if some one is shooting 400 a session it means lots more are.I wonder what the effect of planting more corn than cotton will have.:banghead::banghead:

Car Knocker
June 14, 2007, 05:00 PM
JUST GOT BOX OF 45/70 ammo.$12.32 for 20 rds A-MERC brand
Considering the reputation that AMERC has amongst shooters and reloaders, I believe you overpaid. Significantly. :D

kcmarine
June 14, 2007, 05:02 PM
Woooo WEEEE that's a lot of ammo. Never seen that many cases in one place in my life. Not even at the stores.

MAIL THAT TO BARBARA BOXER!!!!

xd9fan
June 14, 2007, 08:13 PM
Kept in a cool and dry location, decades!


sweet (In Darth Vader's voice:D)

Ordering it over the internet, and with a CC, to me it seems like a flag that "hey, this guy's a weirdo...".

If "they" ever decide to look at ammo records from the large distributors that is...

Pay cash my friend

Geno
June 14, 2007, 08:24 PM
I buy all I can reasonably afford when it goes on sale. I agree with those who have stated that 1K of ammo is not much. It is quite easy to fire that many rounds in 1 day, especially in pistols!

Nomad, 2nd
June 14, 2007, 08:43 PM
Woooo WEEEE that's a lot of ammo. Never seen that many cases in one place in my life. Not even at the stores.


How about ~60K of 5.45x39?

xd9fan
June 14, 2007, 08:44 PM
you are my hero

ctdonath
June 14, 2007, 08:59 PM
bender,
Ordering a thousand rounds occasionally is not "large quantities". Mail order is cheap acquisition of consumables. No biggie. If "they" did indeed go thru the records, the signal-to-noise ratio of wierdo-to-competitor purchases would be extremely low.

If it bothers you, drive a truck to the seller and do a cash-and-carry purchase. Note the picture above: 24K rounds ain't that much.

Frog48
June 14, 2007, 09:56 PM
I stock up on .223 Rem/5.56 NATO and 7.62x39 Soviet when I find good deals. I probably have 500 round of each, which isnt much compared to alot of yall, but to me thats alot.

Other calibers I dont keep much on hand. At the moment I probably only have one box of .45 ACP, one box of 9mm Luger, and a half dozen boxes of 12 ga. shells and .30-06 Springfield combined.

eastwood44mag
June 14, 2007, 10:32 PM
Why I buy in bulk:

1.) Prices aren't going to go down EVER, and bulk is cheap
2.) You will (almost) never see odd-ball rounds in stock at the local shops (i.e. Tokarev, Nagant, etc.)
3.) It keeps the gun-banners awake at night.

Geno
June 15, 2007, 12:45 AM
Nomad, 2nd:

Care to adopt a brother? :D In all seriousness, your ammo-purchase mind-set reminds me of some of the former USTA instructors with which I instructed TKD in MS (Gulfport). These fellas were all 7th, 8th and 9th degree Black Belts, and had weapons and ammo like I couldn't believe! Dang I miss those days!

That's a pretty cool pics! Thanks for sharing it. Without a doubt, the last time I will ever see a "mother-load of ammo".

Doc2005

Tin Gizel
June 15, 2007, 09:13 AM
How about ~60K of 5.45x39?


For arguements sake, how much of that 60k have you burned up since you bought it?

taliv
June 15, 2007, 09:32 AM
i don't know that i buy the "prices won't ever go down" argument.

there are some wars going on and if they ever stop, that will put a lot of surplus on the market. (components, if nothing else)

i was under the impression that copper futures are already declining

dstorm1911
June 15, 2007, 09:44 AM
Taliv, the BATF has not been approving any form 6s for millitary surplus ammo imports........... the prices won't be going down and as Century just had a form6 canceled AFTER buying the ammo and getting it shipped etc... 65,000,000 rnds worth (most of that 5.45x39) uhhh pretty much whats in the USA is what your gonna have to choose from, especially if new restrictions get enacted in 08 etc...

OR ya can keep waiting for the price to go down............. as there are no US makers of 5.45x39 that will mean that in a couple years folks who don't stock up are gonna have some really cool lookin wall ornaments.......

I'm still using 7.62x39 and 7.62x51 Chinese ammo I bought up in the late 80s at less than .50 cents per box...... still waitin for the price to go down but till it does...... my .308 stuff is fed as well as all of my AKs and SKS etc...

good luck to those who want to wait on price drops, I'll be buyin the guns nobody can get cheap ammo for by the way but........... your gonna have to take a loss on the sale seein as how ammo for em is soooooo expensive but I will buy ;)

taliv
June 15, 2007, 10:16 AM
foreign military surplus isn't the only ammo around, you know. prices on wally world ammo have risen dramatically, and there's a good chance they'll go back down

ilbob
June 15, 2007, 10:16 AM
I don't hoard ammo. I buy what I reasonably plan to shoot in the near future, keeping in mind that buying in bulk often results in huge savings.

I usually buy 22LR by the case because the stuff I shoot the most is for a bullseye gun and it likes ammo I cannot easily acquire locally. By the time I pay all the shipping fees, I might as well get a whole case. I might not shoot it all up this year, but it stores well.

Same thing applies to other calibers, especially stuff that is not easy to come by at local stores.

I agree with the reloading suggestion too, at least in part. The reality is that for some stuff it is cheaper to buy wolf than try to reload, so if you only interest in reloading is saving money, you may not see much savings in some calibers.

Nomad, 2nd
June 15, 2007, 03:33 PM
For arguements sake, how much of that 60k have you burned up since you bought it?

Oh, that's about what I've got left. I bought more than that.
(I had originally only got about 66K for me, but some of the guys I went in with backed out so I bought theirs also.)

I'll shoot it up, but I've got a few other types of rifles/ammo stockpiles also.

leadcounsel
June 15, 2007, 04:25 PM
I believe that supply and demand will create a profitable market for US ammo makers to pump up the production of ammo. When the supply increases the demand, and hence price, will decrease.

I'm not overly worried about that part of the equation.

What I am worried about is the cost of production increasing, eg copper and oil (shipping costs). As these increase so to will the cost of ammo.

dstorm1911
June 15, 2007, 06:09 PM
teliv, sure if ya only shoot a few rounds a month, I go through bout 2,000 rnds a week so tell me either $2.00 per 20 or $20.00 per 20 which will allow ya to shoot more?

BTW, outa 4,000 guns I only own 1 non-military rifle and it hasn't been fired in over 9 years a Browning BAR .308, very accurate very pretty and totally usleless compared to the Military stuff....... not to mention my Select fire PSG-1 is ALOT more fun ;)

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