CCW in action


PDA






The Unknown User
May 2, 2007, 12:49 AM
I should warn you, this does show the shooting. It's nothing too graphic, but still.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=NZrdbSJVSVM

Thoughts?

I question whether it was safe to draw a weapon and shoot so close to the female clerk and the baby on the other side of the counter.

If you enjoyed reading about "CCW in action" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
rkh
May 2, 2007, 12:54 AM
maybe it was just the camera angle, but it seems like he came dangerously close to shooting the woman and/or her kid.

The Unknown User
May 2, 2007, 01:08 AM
I just read more about that, and apparently the shooter said he had at least five feet, but the camera angle makes it look like less. Either that's true or he was just confident with his ability to control his weapon.

ArchAngelCD
May 2, 2007, 01:25 AM
IMO, he was careless and shouldn't have shot. In the video it seems the robber wasn't looking to shoot anyone and only wanted the money. Again, IMO, they should have given him the money and not endangered the woman and her child. Not only does it look like the clerk was dangerously close to that baby but if the robber decided to shoot it out with the clerk, that woman and child would have been in the grave danger. He also shot at the robbers back, that's a no-no.

You use your weapon to protect life, not the money in the drawer.

Mumwaldee
May 2, 2007, 01:59 AM
Did a search for this guy...the robber...Antoine Stephens, looks like he got a whopping 6 year sentence for a felony with a firearm(If I got the right guy). It's too bad the clerk didn't [insert non-THR content].

http://www.drc.state.oh.us/OffenderSearch/Details.aspx?id=A509446&pg=x

Mumwaldee
May 2, 2007, 02:02 AM
If you watch it closely Arch you'll see the robber actually fired first...one or two times when he saw the clerk produce his own firearm.(It's hard to tell in that low res vid) I have no doubt he acted correctly. Who is to say the robber would have taken the money and danced on down the street without harming them. Why leave the decision to him. What is certain is that because of the clerk they did survive.

Robber could have taken a few steps outside then turned around and decided to shoot some more. The felon brought the gun. It was loaded and chambered...he was obviously prepared to do some shooting. It's not a kids game of "haha I turned my back! you can't shoot me!" The clerk didn't continue to fire after the robber fell.

If he'd done nothing, kept his hands in the air and been shot and killed along with the others...would that have been better for the police to find? The headlines could read "CCW killed in robbery, never drew his weapon and let 4 year old so and so be kidnapped, raped and murdered."

Have no doubt this clerk is a hero. I applaud him for stepping up when the situation demanded it.

xpun8
May 2, 2007, 03:23 AM
another forum (http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/showthread.php?t=274058&page=1&pp=30)
That's a long thread, the CCW's sn is RooftopVoter with a bushmaster icon.

The BG didn't shoot, when the CCW yelled and drew the BG raised his weapon and jumped back. The CCW didn't face any charges, the BG got 7 years, all 3 shots hit, 2 over penetrated.

It sounds like there is a bunch more info on that forum if you register to search and stuff.

BigStick
May 2, 2007, 05:41 AM
In the video it seems the robber wasn't looking to shoot anyone and only wanted the money. Again, IMO, they should have given him the money and not endangered the woman and her child.

You mean like this clerk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pH3z7H4S-XI&NR=1) did?

Why should the victim have to play Russian roulette and hope that they aren't being robbed by a criminal who would actually shoot their victim?

jeepmor
May 2, 2007, 06:43 AM
I particularly like how the clerk concealed his draw behind the other clerk. I won't make any judgements, but the BGs should know, you bring a gun out, you could get shot by another. It's one of the inherent risks of being a bad guy. Another sociopath in the klink, good work in my book.

You try and tell the people saved by this guy that he should not have shot at the man and I think you won't be hearing any anti song and dance. I personally would be giving him praise.....after my ears quit ringing.

1911 guy
May 2, 2007, 07:36 AM
You've been watching too many John Wayne movies. The BG brought a gun and was threatening folks with it. The threat was neutralized with no innocents getting plugged. Good outcome. I think it was Clint Smith who said "If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck."

eric.cartman
May 2, 2007, 09:54 AM
IMO, he was careless and shouldn't have shot. In the video it seems the robber wasn't looking to shoot anyone and only wanted the money. Again, IMO, they should have given him the money and not endangered the woman and her child.

Yes, give them what they want, cooperate, you'll be safer :barf:

He** no, the guy did good! Who knows, maybe the BG wanted to get rid of witnesses. And your silly liberal-like thinking of cooperating with the bandits WILL get you killed :fire:

Tim L
May 2, 2007, 12:59 PM
thought it sounded familiar, it was discussed last year in this thread.
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=187561&highlight=baby

Tim

SWModel19
May 2, 2007, 01:31 PM
My only problem with it is how somebody "stylized" it and set it to music. POOR TASTE. :barf:

Other than that, it looked like a good defensive shoot to me (IMHO). If you were the clerk, would you take the chance that the BG would just walk out with the $? That woman with the baby could have been my wife and daughter. I'd have thanked the guy if it were.

High Planes Drifter
May 2, 2007, 02:27 PM
In the video it seems the robber wasn't looking to shoot anyone and only wanted the money. Again, IMO, they should have given him the money and not endangered the woman and her child.

So you know for certain that the BG, in the midst of commiting a felony with a firearm wasnt going to hurt anyone then? We have a mindreader in our midst folks. Quick, tell me what Im thinking about your reasoning. ;)

30 cal slob
May 2, 2007, 02:48 PM
i asked a few LEO's on this one.

if a person approaches you brandishing a gun and a reasonable person would infer that the person was a bad guy, you are within your rights to SHOOT the guy.

a bad guy with a gun presents an immediate and otherwise unavoidable danger of death or grave bodily harm to the innocent.

bad guy clearly had the ability to kill or cripple innocents with his gun.

being clearly within shooting distance, the bad guy had an opportunity to use his gun.

innocents were clearly in jeopardy when the muzzle of the gun was pointed towards them.

Justin
May 2, 2007, 02:54 PM
Closed.

As pointed out, this has been discussed before.

If you enjoyed reading about "CCW in action" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!