[jato]

I just got back from tent trailer camping at Meeks Bay, Lake Tahoe with my family. Brown Bears were a fairly common sight. Two out of five nights the wife and I saw a Brown Bear inside my campsite perimeter. One bear even pawed at my trailer door. :uhoh:

I had the 3 & 4 inch Ruger GP100s loaded with Federal 180 grain solids ready to go. I should have packed at least one of my 44 mags or a long gun. I took the GPs because I have several holsters for them. (I need holsters for my N-frames.) A .357 feels small when up against a 400(?) pound bear.

No one got hurt. However, other campers' food storage containers were raided!

Campers beware! :cool:

[Trisha]

Here, the elk are going through their "pillow-art" antlers and getting frisky - and before you know it they'll all have headaches and be in really bad moods. . .

Fresh mountain lion tracks outside our home this morning, too!

jato - I just have to ask: why 'the wife,' instead of 'my wife,' my love,' etc? I've always found that a curious phrase - and it seems to be commonly used.

BOT: It sounds like the moral of your story is to get as far away as possible from campsites and get into the back country!

:D

Trisha

[RANash]

Food storage is definitely something to think about when camping! Rascally bears, especially around Lake Tahoe, have no fear and consider human's food to be their right!

Trisha makes a good point: in the backcountry the bears have more fear of humans, and don't get so nosy. Still, food storage in the tent is iffy.

I would want at least a .45 with ball ammo if it came to having to shoot Smokey. I'm told that the place to aim is right straight into the nose because the brain sits lower than we would expect, and a forehead shot would pass above the brain. Another option: right into the mouth, especially if it's open!

[Gordy Wesen]

Ah yes the nose shot. Don't believe everything you hear. You might have better luck with the "root of the tail" shot.
If you draw a line from the left ear to the right eye and from the right ear to the left eye you will find the brain pan to be where the lines intersect.

[CGofMP]

Speaking Of bears......

There is a good chance that sometime in the next year a close friend will be camping for a short time in grizzley country... Yellowstone to be exact.

My understanding is that they allow ZERO firearms there.

If this is true has anyone had any real experience with the anti-bear sprays and whatnot? Are there any real solutions to the potential for danger?

Most appreciate any insight.

Charles

[RANash]

Speaking from experience, Gordy?

[powerstrk]

CG try this thread on bear sprayhttp://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26044&highlight=Bear+spray

[nemesis]

jato said......
Brown Bears were a fairly common sight.
Are you certain that they were BROWN bears? Or where they BLACK BEARS that just happened to be brown?

I have had a lot of encounters with black bears of all colors and don't worry about them all to much but it's an entirely different story if it's brown bears.

What was it?

[CB900F]

RANash et al;

Food storage in the tent is iffy?!!!! In a National Forest or National Park, it isn't iffy, it's illegal. The reason it's illegal is although it's extremely stupid, the government takes the position that it must protect the sheeple from themselves. Those that aren't willing to do the research to protect themselves from inadvertently feeding the bears, get to feed government funded bear researchers.

Your research is simple, go to a ranger station, National Forest headquarters, your congresscritter's office, govt web site, and others & ask about bear/food regulations. Or pay $75.00 per violation to learn. Your choice.

GGofMP; You are correct that the National Parks are not firearms friendly. However, the operative word is not zero. You can have them, but they must be disassembled & ammunition stored elsewhere. Again, get the 'true word' from the research sites listed above.

This last weekend several dolts from Oregon, camping in Glacier National Park, stored their 2 coolers in their boat. Boat's right side up, no tarp. $150.00 fine. If you think the ranger ripped a strip for that, I'd hate to be on the recieving end of the lecture if he'da found the cooler(s) in the tent. Darwinism is a living AND DYING process. Which end of the equation do you want to examine?
900F

[Gordy Wesen]

Hey RA, never had the experience of shooting a bear in the nose or the ???, or the head for that matter. The "root of the tail" shot was found in some old Elmer Keith material and though he may have had success shooting deer in the ??? for a spine shot I'll pass on that one too. I'm not that good.
As for pepper spray, I'd happily put my money on a couple huge cans of Counter Assault and go have a good time. Yellowstone is a wonderful place.


___________________


"I liked being an intellectual - I was faithfully learning to make simple things complicated." Mahesh Chavda

[jato]

Are you certain that they were BROWN bears? Or where they BLACK BEARS that just happened to be brown?

All I can say is they were brown colored bears. The light was low and the adrenaline was high. Their fur appeared brown and shaggy.

Other people in the camp were calling them "Brown Bears". Maybe they could tell the difference.

[SteelyDan]

CB900F, I may well be wrong about this, but I thought that disassembled firearms were allowed in National Parks only if you were just passing through, but that if you stopped to camp it was illegal to have even a disassembled firearm.

[dude]

They were Black bears..................the last 'brown' bear in California was killed well over 100 years ago!!

[HBK]

I thought bears that came into a campsite were extreme bad news. Am I wrong? Bear spray is supposed to work well, but a persistent bear will keep coming back. I read in "Bear Attacks" by Gary Shelton of a bear that was sprayed three times, but each time rubbed his face on moss to get the spray off and kept hunting the guy. His pickup was near, but he barely made it back.

[goalie]

I had a bear come at me in Alaska. I had my .375 H&H, Mr. Bear had teeth. Mr. Holland won.

Oh, and I did not pee myself, it was sweat!!!! :what:

[CZ-100]

Food storage is definitely something to think about when camping! Rascally bears, especially around Lake Tahoe, have no fear and consider human's food to be their right!

And if I were a Bear... I would Too! :D I you leave it out .. It's MINE!:D

[J. Parker]

They were black bears. There's all different shades and colors of blackies. You're story brings back memories. I did alot of camping in the Sierra Nevada mountains. Had a cabin in Pollock Pines just off hwy 50.
I would carry a 4" Smith 629 and "the wifey" (it's a guy thing) :D would carry a 357 magnum snubbie.
That's all I did back then was tent camp. Never, never, and never store food in a tent.
These days in Washington State I'm into fancy semi-auto's but always have a snubbie 12 gauge with me on short walks. Best regards, John

[Russ]

Jato,

Best thing to do with Bears is stay out of their way. Even a Black Bear that appear quite small as bears go are extremely dangerous.

I lived in the PRK for a long time and I don't recall ever seeing a Black Bear. Brown yes. I don't know that Black Bears range that far west. They are here in Kentuky and there's a bunch of them in Tennessee but I think you probably saw a Brown Bear.

Good thing you had a trailer to get into. I wouldn't want to be in a tent with a Bear outside, at least not without a .308. I would only go up against one with a .357 if it was a last resort thing. After I emptied the gun, I would run like the wind!

[BenW]

You saw a brown colored black bear. There are no other species of bear in California. You can generally chase a black bear away by yelling at it. If that doesn't work, you can bean it in the head with a rock. These methods have always worked for me. That of course doesn't mean that they will work on a bear who has become overly accustomed to getting food from campsites or that I don't sleep with a .45 under my pillow just in case. :)

Really though, unless you're hunting one, shooting a black bear is a last resort. They aren't anywhere near as aggressive as a grizzly or brown bear.

[Keith]

There are no brown bears in California. Those are black bears with the brown or "cinnamon" coloring.

Brown bears weigh 1500 pounds. Black bears weigh 200 to 300 pounds. Brown bears eat black bears.

[bogie]

I think I heard somewhere that "soft sided" trailers (and tents in general...) aren't allowed in some camping areas. Better check first.

[J. Parker]

I've become a wuss in my old age so I don't tent camp anymore but it's real hard to beat a camper on a 4-wheel drive truck to get somewhere remote. I want more than just a piece of cloth between me and 'ol snaggle-tooth. :D

[Test1968]

Montana grizzly bear notice:

----------------------------



In light of the rising frequency of human/grizzly bear conflicts, the Montana Department of Fish and Game is advising hikers, hunters, and fishermen to take extra precautions and keep alert for bears while in the field.



We advise that outdoorsmen wear noisy little bells on their clothing so as not to startle bears that aren't expecting them. We also advise outdoorsmen to carry pepper spray with them in case of an encounter with a bear.



It is also a good idea to watch out for fresh signs of bear activity.

Outdoorsmen should recognize the difference between black bear and grizzly bear droppings.



Black bear droppings are smaller and contain lots of berries and squirrel fur.



Grizzly bear droppings are larger, have little bells in them and smell like pepper.

--

[ElToro]

J. Parker - whats a "12 guage snubbie " ?
you got a picture of that ?
unless your shooting slugs from a flare gun!

most California Blackies will run if you make loud noise. allthougha few years ago when there was a bad drought for a few years running, they were coming out of the hills and getting aggressive into campsites becuase there was a lack of food and water.. at least thats what the rangers said.

when i took my fiance camping for the first time, it was an easy low impact affair at PineCrest, north of Sonora in the Sierras. i work for a bank so i get a lot of Monday holidays and i believe this was either Columbus or Veterans day, early fall either way and not many people there on a Sunday nite.
In fact, we had pretty much the run of the place to ourselves, but when i brought out my S&W M-19 as we were getting into our sleeping bags, she freaked out. (she long knew i was into guns and had taken her target shooting before this and she was cool with that) i explaind that even though our food was in a locked foot locker, i was more concerned with 2 legged varmints. in the middle of the nite a bunch of hooligans came running through the camps in their trucks screaming and shouting. later the next day, she told me she felt so much better knowing i had the piece. I'm trying to convince her that an extended "real" backpacking trip through the sierras or trinitys would be much more funand we could not only take guns we could target shoot along the way... sorry for the threadjacking

[Kinsman]

You can not tell a brown or a black bear by its color!!!

Black bears are brown and brown bears are black or any other bear color.

Brown bears (Kodiak, Griz, Polar) have a hump on the back of their neck and smaller ears, WAY bigger claws, and are in general eighteen and a half feet tall. If you see a great big bear, it is a black....and not really that big or agressive. If you see a huge monster that could mess up your truck, it is Griz. .45 LC just make 'em mad. .44 Mag don't bother 'em much. .375 H&H or so wil kill 'em.....eventually.

[RANash]

most California Blackies will run if you make loud noise. allthougha few years ago when there was a bad drought for a few years running, they were coming out of the hills and getting aggressive into campsites becuase there was a lack of food and water.. at least thats what the rangers said. The last time I went camping at Lake Tahoe (3 years ago, at Camp Richardson, a private commercial campground) the bears were everywhere every night. The reason was 1) the camp didn't empty the trash cans often enough, so there was garbage spilling out of the "bear proof" cans, 2) almost everyone kept food in their tents or outside their tents in ice chests sitting on the picnic table.

When the bears would tear the ice chests open, people would come out and yell and scream, and even throw stones at the bears. The bears were so used to people, they wouldn't even look at the humans! They would just calmly eat everything and amble away. The only time I saw anyone scare one away was when one guy started lighting up "cherry bomb"-type firecrackers and throwing them at the bears.

One big dumb guy (human, I think) threw a very large rock (about softball size) at one of the larger bears, and hit it smack in the right eye. The bear waved his paw at his head like he was waving off a pesky fly and never even stopped foraging through the food!

Needless to say, I'll never go there again. It was an urban nightmare among the pine trees. The bears were a pleasure compared to the people!

I didn't know that it was actually illegal to store food inside your tent, but it makes sense. Camp Richardson is not NFS land, so no rangers. Years ago, I used to backpack into wilderness areas, and we'd do the "hang the food from the tree limb" thing. It worked well. I hear that in Yosemite, the bears have gotten wise to it, and now know to gnaw the ropes in two and a tasty treat will drop from the sky!

As far as shooting bears, I was only passing on some info I had been told. Spray sounds like it might be effective.

Oh, yes, as many have said, California only has black bears, not brown. The only brown bears left in CA are on the flag!

[mussi]

If I saw a bear eating away my food hun from a high tree limb, Mr Bear would quickly find out I don't store my guns in trees, and not unloaded neither....

But maybe I'll be brutal and feed them with a "original" US Navy SOS. Will teach them a lesson. :)

[dude]

............why would you shoot a bear for just eating your food??

[Horsesense]

Seen an article, last year, that said that the bears in Yellowstone would single out certain makes and models (mostly Toyota & Nissan) to raid. They would simply peal the window frame back and rip up everything (sometimes for a stick of gum). The article said that the bears would find; say a red Toyota Celica with lots of goodies in it and for the next several days break into every red Toyota Celica it ran across.

[SunBear]

Do not store food in your car unless you want it destroyed. They can easily break the window out of your car and can even rip the door open. Absolute truth!!!

[themic]

remember, although it's not ok to carry in a national park, it IS ok in a national forest, if the forest is in a state where you are legally allowed to carry. this does not include a national building, which is the visitors center or ticket booth or heck maybe even the occasional bathroom. cabins are ok.

that being said, one can't guaranteee that every ranger is fully aware of this regulation, even if you're in the right.

here's the mumbo jumbo:

Under Federal Code:
TITLE 36--PARKS, FORESTS, AND PUBLIC PROPERTY
CHAPTER II--FOREST SERVICE, DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
PART 261--PROHIBITIONS
36CFR261.8
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi
it states "... The following are prohibited to the extent Federal or State
law is violated:"

basically means it's up to the state you're in.

here in the commonwealth of virginia, they specifically mention how their law applies:

4VAC15-40-60
http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?000+reg+4VAC15-40-60
(see section G)
where it states "... nor shall it prohibit possession and transport of
loaded concealed handguns where the individual possesses a concealed
handgun permit as defined in §18.2-308 of the Code of Virginia."

heard that a few people have called the parks around here and teh rangers are starting to express the same opinion. they ask politely that you not open carry, however, even though it's technically legal, because it could startle some other people and be a hassle.

CAVEAT: I AM NOT A LAWYER.