(WA) ATF Agents Raid Local Business


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Drizzt
June 18, 2003, 07:56 PM
ATF Agents Raid Local Business

POSTED: 3:38 p.m. PDT June 17, 2003
UPDATED: 5:37 p.m. PDT June 17, 2003

REDMOND, Wash. -- ATF agents stormed into an Eastside business early this morning -- and they were tight lipped about what they're hunting for.

They're still there tonight -- packing up many boxes of evidence.

ATF agents say this is just routine enforcement -- but it looks like much more.


It's all happening in Redmond, Redmond Police are on the scene helping with traffic and security.

Sources tell us that it's the makings of serious weapons that spurred this raid."

"Next thing I know there was ATF people all over the place," said eyewitness Gary Wilson.

Those agents zeroed in on this place -- in a Redmond industrial park.

We've learned it belongs to a business called P-W Arms Incorporated -- that deals in ammunition.

A man who doesn't want to be identified says he's seen piles of old ammo inside.

"Enough to fill a couple of 48 foot trailers -- maybe two or three," he said.

ATF agents, most of them undercover, came prepared for a big haul.

"There was probably a hundred of those officers here - and they swarmed in and evidently there was 6 of these trucks lined up in the street waiting," said John Bovee.

All day they've been hauling crates out of the business. Sources tell us what they found here is guns -- imported in separate pieces so they're legal -- but the parts can be put together to create illegal assault rifles.

Officially -- ATF won't say much at all.

"Only thing I can say right now is that we have an ongoing investigation," said Matt Horace, ATF agent.

The number of agents is large -- the stacks of evidence keep growing -- and the work doesn't seem to be slowing down. Still, ATF insists this is a routine enforcement action-- and people shouldn't worry.

"There's no imminent threat to public safety and we'll be here as long as it takes to conduct our investigation," Horace said.

So far agents have been on the scene about 8 hours. Again, ATF officials won't confirm what this is all about.

But a source tells us this raid is not in connection with a large crime ring or terrorism.

http://www.kirotv.com/news/2276557/detail.html

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hammer4nc
June 18, 2003, 08:10 PM
Just doing a quick search; FYI...

Seems this outfit is connected in some way with Barnaul Ammunition (Russia). Here's a link, with a Redmond contact address, if I'm not mistaken:

http://www.barnaulammunition.com/index.htm

Maybe other high roaders have had first hand exp with this vendor?

powerstrk
June 18, 2003, 09:54 PM
I read this in firearmnews.com (www.firearmnew.com) and it said the same thing except a quote from the fire dept about 490,000 rounds of 50 cal.

Henry Bowman
June 18, 2003, 10:58 PM
We were warned that this would start happening soon.

AR-10
June 18, 2003, 11:23 PM
We were warned that this would start happening soon.

The sky is falling. :rolleyes:

What are you implying? That crates of ammo is now reason enough to interest the Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms(and hobby rocket engines/fireworks/anything that may catch on fire/make you walk funny/sound like Homeland Security) in ruining the life of the common Citizen?

Well.............you may be right.

But then, that's why they get the big bucks.

WonderNine
June 19, 2003, 02:57 AM
The number of agents is large -- the stacks of evidence keep growing -- and the work doesn't seem to be slowing down. Still, ATF insists this is a routine enforcement action-- and people shouldn't worry.

Keep moving....nothing to see here folks....keep moving....nothing to see here....

Tamara
June 19, 2003, 06:06 AM
So, uh... what the heck? Did the guy forget to say "Mother may I" or genuflect properly when he took delivery on his last load of ammo?

:confused:

Hkmp5sd
June 19, 2003, 06:10 AM
What, no cattle truck loaded with news cameras?

tyme
June 19, 2003, 06:13 AM
It sounds like the ammunition business was a front for importing parts and putting to gether illeeguhl and ultra-evil assault weapons
Hush little baby, don't say a word,
Momma's going to buy you a mockingbird.
If that mockingbird don't sing
Momma's gonna buy you a diamond ring

If that diamond ring turns brass
Momma's gonna buy you a looking glass
If that looking glass gets broke
Momma's gonna buy you a billy goat

If that billy goat runs away
Momma's gonna buy you a better day

See that baby running in the sun
See the baby just having fun

Hush little baby close your eyes
Hush little baby hear the lullaby
What on earth is the BATFE thinking? We're going to fall asleep?

Meowhead
June 19, 2003, 10:09 AM
It sounds like the ammunition business was a front for importing parts and putting to gether illeeguhl and ultra-evil assault weapons
Where're you getting this information?

Judging just by what posted in this thread, it's too early to tell anything.
Could be that employees of the place were importing AK-47 parts, putting them together and handing them out to mental patients in exchange for their medication. Could be that the owner of the place decided to use his profits to buy himself some weaponry, and forgot that a loose pile of stamped metal and springs is, according to his betters in the ATFE, actually an evil babykilling 747downing terrorist machine gun.

AJ Dual
June 19, 2003, 10:40 AM
My reading on other boards is that this is due to "improperly" de-milled FAL parts kits, just like the FAL's and PPSh kits Interordinance had recalled recently.

These were allready legally imported on approved Form 6's and had ATF supervised de-milling by cutting the recievers. The ATF has since decided that most recievers merely cut in half are now "readibly restorable" and must be missing a significant chunk of the middle. This is what got Interordinance in hot water, and had thier customers being tracked down individually on the sales recipts and being visited to turn in the entire parts kit, or just reciever chunks depending on the amiability and knowledge of the agent making the call.

My best guess is that the owners of PW arms saw what happened to Interordinance (still in business BTW, just had the kits seized) and decided to proactively contact the ATF, I heard a quote saying one of the owners invited them over, either to have the kits re-de-milled, or voluntarily surrendered to avoid trouble.

Then the ATF showed up in full raid gear with semi trailers. :rolleyes: And I think that's because the ATF, now under Ashcroft (who's made challenging statments to the ATF in the past) and the DOJ (and the FBI do not like the ATF either and see them as "troublemakers" and "cowboys") instead of the Treasury dept. is undergoing bugetary and procedural review, and the word is that the firearms division of the ATF is going nuts with "makework" to look good and retain their headcount and budget.

It still sucks, but the "blip" is bigger than it needs to be, partly on the ATF who is puffing up thier operations, and the media who is speculating wildly because they're operating in a vacuum of facts, and are ignorant of firearms laws, and can't concieve of something this magnitude really just being bureaucratic nitpicking and a procedural SNAFU. My best guess for right now is that PW will stay in business and just lose a bunch of parts kits.

robear
June 19, 2003, 01:16 PM
a little off topic, but has anyone ever seen those full-length steel shotgun shells before??

http://www.barnaulammunition.com/shotgun.htm

UnknownSailor
June 19, 2003, 01:55 PM
The CAWS project from 20 years ago used an all brass 12ga shell.

Kharn
June 19, 2003, 01:58 PM
Robear:
The HK CAWS uses 12 gauge shells made entirely from brass, to prevent them from being crushed in a magazine or all the other problems associated with a box magazine fed semi/fullauto shotgun.

Kharn

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