38 S&W Special CTG - anyone know this gun?


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sammonger
May 7, 2007, 03:24 PM
Hi,

My first post... I recently acquired a few guns and was wondering if anyone could give me some info on them.

1) 38 S&W Special CTG (6" barrel) Wood Grips, Serial #, found behind the cylinder, is B 1553690, and

2) Colt Lawman Mk III 357 Magnum CTG (2" barrel), SN 94025L, and

3) Colt 1911 National Match Semi-Automatic 38 Special Mid Range, SN 5283-MR.

Any input on any of these would be greatly appreciated.

Wonderful forum, btw.

Thanks,

Sam

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Sistema1927
May 7, 2007, 03:43 PM
Well...

1) Not enough info. to tell for sure. Does it have a S&W logo on it? Does it have a model number inside the crane, i.e. MOD 19 or MOD 10, etc.?

2) The Colt is a good revolver, not as common as S&W. What kind of shape is it in?

3) The National Match .38 1911 is sought after by bullseye shooters. Hazve you shot it yet? What kind of shape is it in?

BTW, welcome to the forum. More will chime in soon.

sammonger
May 7, 2007, 04:39 PM
1) 1) Not enough info. to tell for sure. Does it have a S&W logo on it? Does it have a model number inside the crane, i.e. MOD 19 or MOD 10, etc.?

It has a S&W logo on it, on the handle.

Above the trigger, it has this:
MADE IN USA
Margas Registradas
Smith & Wesson
Springfield, Mass

On one side of the barrel, it says "38 S&W Special CTG".

On the other side of the barrel, it says "Smith & Wesson"

Other stuff I found on what I believe you refer to as the "crane" are:
"90K6453" and "MOD 14-4"

2) The Colt is a good revolver, not as common as S&W. What kind of shape is it in?

I would have to say that it is in excellent condition. No scratches of any sort. Extremely clean. I can't even find any wear marks.

3) The National Match .38 1911 is sought after by bullseye shooters. Hazve you shot it yet? What kind of shape is it in?

Yes, I have shot it. It is dead accurate. It is in excellent shape. A couple of very minor blemishes on the metal but other than that, it is pristine. Very beautiful gun.

Thanks for the input!

XavierBreath
May 7, 2007, 06:04 PM
Gun # 1: Sounds like a Smith & Wesson Model 14-4. The serial number is on the butt of the grip frame. Depending on your grips, you may have to remove them to see it. The Model 14-4 run was from 1977 to 1991. Your's sounds like a 1980 gun if the serial is 90K6453. Value depends on condition, $175 in fair condition, up to $450 NIB (you gotta have the box for NIB!). It was also known as the Target Masterpiece, and is a K frame gun. An excellent revolver.

Gun #2: I believe your Colt revolver may have been made in 1978. Hang on to it. The values of DA Colt revolvers is hard to pinpoint right now. Colt just stopped making DA revolvers, and the prices are all over the board. They will almost certainly go up.

Gun #3: I'd like to see a pic of this gun. Is it .38 special .38 AMU (Army Match Unit) or .38 super? A few gunsmiths way back when converted 1911s to .38 special for Bullseye. Jim Clark was one, and Armand Swenson was likely another. There is a fair chance this pistol has an interesting history. The work of many of the old gunsmiths is recognizable to a discerning eye. Post a pic or two if you can, particularly of the sights, the frontstrap and small parts. Value will depend on who did the work, and the quality and amount of the work.

sammonger
May 7, 2007, 07:59 PM
How do I post pictures?

Old Fuff
May 7, 2007, 09:28 PM
X Breath:

3) Colt 1911 National Match Semi-Automatic 38 Special Mid Range, SN 5283-MR.

The serial number (5283 MR) indicates that it is A Colt .38 National Match. Between 1960 and 1973 they made 3 models with the following barrel markings:

1st. Model COLT .38 SPEC. N.M.

2nd. Model COLT .38 SPEC. N.M.
* * MK. II * *

3RD. Model COLT .38 SPEC. N.M.
* * MK III * *

Serial numbers ran from 100 MR to 9409 MR

Some may be chambered in .38 AMU rather then .38 Special, but I presume the one in question is a .38 Special because the owner has been shooting it.

XavierBreath
May 7, 2007, 11:39 PM
Shows what I know..............:uhoh:

Old Fuff
May 8, 2007, 12:00 AM
These were sometimes called "Gold Cup .38's" although they were not so marked. The design was interesting, because it wasn't a modified .38 Super. It used a straight-blowback action, where the whole barrel recoiled a short distance - somewhat like the floating chamber in a .22 Conversion Kit. They were match-grade accurate as a rule. The big problem nowdays is finding magazines. Most of the custom 'smiths used these magazines when they could get them.

Note that total production was only about 8,400 + guns. Sales were a bit slow because many, if not most, bullseye shooters were going to 2 guns, a .22 and a .45, and shooting the .45 in the center fire match. On a civilian's budget it was better to buy two of the best, rather then three of lesser quality.

sammonger
May 8, 2007, 12:37 AM
I looked on the barrel and it is indeed a Mk III. Can you estimate closer as to when it was manufactured?

sammonger
May 8, 2007, 12:49 AM
Please go to

http://dataweb-design.com/1911.htm

to see pics of this 1911.

Sam

Old Fuff
May 8, 2007, 01:07 AM
The records on this model are not well researched, but I am going to say 1965. Anything more precise will have to come from Colt's, and I'm not sure they can get much closer. Over 13 years they made less then 9,000 pistols. On average that's less then 700 per year. I'll stick my neck out a bit further and say that the Mk. III is probably the least common. While this was an excellent pistol, competitors were moving away from .38's toward .45's.

If you should shoot it, use nothing except 148 grain mid-range ammunition. It is not made, or intended to be used, with anything hotter.

Old Fuff
May 8, 2007, 01:12 AM
That's what it should look like, except someone has modified the front sight, and changed the rear blade to a white outline.

sammonger
May 8, 2007, 01:24 AM
... for all the responses. You guys really know your stuff!

Where's the best place to sell guns like this, and how does one go about establishing their value?

M92FS
May 8, 2007, 01:56 AM
quote by sammonger : ... for all the responses. You guys really know your stuff!

Where's the best place to sell guns like this, and how does one go about establishing their value?

If I own these handguns , I don't think I would be selling them. Colt Lawman can be use as a ccw and Colt NM 1911 in .38 Special is sort of a rare gun. Never knew Colt had a .38 Special in the M1911A1 platform. :)

sammonger
May 8, 2007, 04:50 PM
If I own these handguns , I don't think I would be selling them. Colt Lawman can be use as a ccw and Colt NM 1911 in .38 Special is sort of a rare gun. Never knew Colt had a .38 Special in the M1911A1 platform.

What's a ccw?

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