Do cops normally take your gun when the pull you over?


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TheOtherOne
January 8, 2003, 12:19 AM
I got pulled over on the Freeway today for speeding. It's the first time I've actually had a gun with me when I was stopped by a cop. The first thing I told the officer is that I had a CCW, like you're suppose to and he asked where the gun was and I told him the glovebox. Then he just asked for my license, registration, insurance. I told him the insurance was in the glovebox and then opened it and he then told me to give him the gun out of it so I did. He sat the gun on the roof of my car, I then handed him all my papers and he walked back to his car with my gun. It took him forever to finally come back, and he just gave me my gun back (with the magazine removed and the slide locked back) and said "slow down a little" and then sent me on my way. So no ticket! :) But then again, I was only doing 72 in a 65 and it was basically with the flow of traffic so I don't why he pulled me over in the first place.

Anyways... I just didn't think they would actually take your gun?

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Jesse H
January 8, 2003, 12:22 AM
Been in one situation where my friend was disarmed, but the gun was returned with no magazine, one in the pipe. Other times I've been pulled over officers didn't mind.

Boy I'd be upset if anybody put something on the roof of my car, which might possibly scratch the paint.

Pointman
January 8, 2003, 12:30 AM
When I was in my late teens through mid-20's LEO's always took my weapon, unloaded it and gave it back to me and asked that I not load it until they'd left.

But from mid 20's up it's been "just leave it where it is" attitude. Though I've not been in a situation in the last 7-10 years where an LEO would ask for it, either.

It's going to vary from state to state, department to department... Some agencies may have a set policy while others will leave it to the officers discretion.

rock jock
January 8, 2003, 12:51 AM
I guess I'm getting old because I generally stick with the speed limit. It just isn't worth the hassle of going through defensive driving or paying a ticket.

Robert inOregon
January 8, 2003, 12:56 AM
Only reason to take the gun back to the squad car is to perform a instant background check and see if the gun has been reported stolen. He was fishing!

BamBam
January 8, 2003, 12:59 AM
I don't have a CCW permit yet, so I don't disclose that I'm armed unless asked.

Also, I find that carrying causes me to pay more attention to traffic laws. It also makes me more relaxed while driving; ie: not let other people's bad driving get me agitated.

Mike Irwin
January 8, 2003, 01:02 AM
I've been pulled over a couple of times while carrying. None of the officers ever asked if I was carrying.

MPFreeman
January 8, 2003, 01:04 AM
I've never told a POLEESSSE ossiffer about a single firearm I own. None of there business. I carry mine concealed so i don't have to show it to them unless they want to frisk me.

Pull me over, I don't even roll down windows anymore. I'll put the Driver's license and Registration against window. I have lost all respect for the traffiK popo since they are willing to enforce seat belt laws in Indiana.

So no, I will not talk to a traffiK popo or make his job easy. :scrutiny:

Mike
January 8, 2003, 01:07 AM
I've only been pulled over while carrying once and I did not declare my weapon or my carry permit. None of their business, really.

TheOtherOne
January 8, 2003, 01:14 AM
Robert inOregon:
Only reason to take the gun back to the squad car is to perform a instant background check and see if the gun has been reported stolen. He was fishing!I suspected that. I was watching him in my rearview, he was talking into his CB often and it took him about five minutes to finally come back... that's why I thought for sure he must be writing me a ticket, but he didn't.

The cops around here say they don't profile, but trust me they do! I get pulled over all the time and I think it's mostly just because of the kind car I drive. I'm very careful at driving as to not give them any real excuses... and yes, I was speeding but doing anything less than 70 on the freeways here and you're going to get tailgated and passed by everyone.


Jesse H:
Boy I'd be upset if anybody put something on the roof of my car, which might possibly scratch the paint.My first thought when he did that was, "Dang, I'm glad I've got a vinyl top". I'm glad I wasn't driving my other car. Maybe he wouldn't of put it up there on a normal painted roof, probably not though :D

labgrade
January 8, 2003, 01:30 AM
Not all the guns ....

Coming back from RMGO's (Co's GOA affiliate) .50 cal shoot, I wuz absolutely bushed - a volunteer for the fun weekend.

Got pulled over "crossing the yellow line" (sigh) way out in the boonies while pulling the event signs - closing shop.

When contacted at my window, informed the polite enough statie revenuer that I'm CCWing/licensed/yada, hand over all pertinent papers.

He asked where's the shooter.

Tell him one on my hip, another in "that bag on the seat," "oh, another under the seat," "musn't forget that one in the bag on the floor .... "

He wants 'em & I deliver 'em up.


"Ah. You're coming from The Shoot. (smile) Anymore?" he asked & really, I'm kinda blank - it's been a long fruitful weekend & I spaced some.

He starts to walk away with my horde & I remember & then "Oh yeah, I've got two rifles "there 'n there," a shotgun .....

He smiles & just walks away skaing his head.

Doesn't appear that he's had time to check NICS (whatever) for S/Ns, etc. - I got a ticket anyway.

Prolly do another thread on this - I've asked it enough times on TFL without a suitable answer .....

How can it possibly be in the officer's safety when you hand them a loaded handgun? Unless you're already at gunpoint (& even if) reaction time isn't likely to overcome your being "pre-positioned." (& this implies no ill intent - just reaction time & positioning)

& as far as "my safety" .... ? I don't think so. Frankly, I was quite oaky-doaky before I was pulled over.

Any takers in case I don't get to it?

Lennyjoe
January 8, 2003, 02:21 AM
Umm, Im pretty sure its the law in Arizona that you have to identify that your carrying when you get pulled over by the law.

May be the same in other states as well.

Who says you have to hand it to them loaded? Why not unload it yourself? Would the officer think thats an agressive move?

Hkmp5sd
January 8, 2003, 03:16 AM
One has taken my Glock during the stop and returned it as I left. The others didn't bother.

tomkatz
January 8, 2003, 03:17 AM
In my state(washintgton)I have never heard of anything that says you have to tell them anything at all. If I was asked to hand over my gun I would feel like I need to clear it the same as you would handing it to anyone, but I guess the thing to do is ask the officer if you can clear the weapon. I always keep it concealed on my person so like some others have said it is really none of their business anyway.....tom

Kamicosmos
January 8, 2003, 08:55 AM
MO doesn't have CCW, so I am just thinking off the cuff here...

A) if a cop pulled me over, I would hand him my CCW with my driver's licence. (That is, if it's a piece of paper.) Either way, I would let him know.

B) If he/she wanted the weapon, I'd automatically unload it. Basic gun handling safety. Just because he's a cop, doesn't mean he's familier with my handgun. Hell, I could be carring a desert eagle or something... ;) In fact, I would insist that the gun is unloaded, and slide locked back or cylinder left open, for both our safety.

I don't hand anyone, including best friends, a loaded weapon at the range. Why would I hand a stranger one, even if he's a cop?

Kamicosmos

Kalindras
January 8, 2003, 09:08 AM
Just ripping this one off the cuff, as well, but here's what *I'd* imagine:

Depending just how fast you moved, and what the actual actions involved in clearing your weapon were, your 'Basic Gun Safety' might just get you shot.

I know a fairly large number of officers who are exceptionally touchy about weapons during traffic stops--with very good reason. Don't get me wrong--more than enough cops get plugged during traffic stops to merit the paranoia. I'm just trying to illustrate that it might not be in your best interests to take more than the absolute minimum action with your CCW weapon. Something like handing it to them by the trigger guard or the barrel...very slowly and carefully . Or, if it's against your religion to hand over a loaded weapon, I'd make a very LARGE point of stating in a firm voice, "Sir, I'm going to remove the ammunition from this weapon--is that alright?" And proceed as he tells me. (I almost said, "Sir, I'm going to *unload* this weapon," and then thought better of it... :o )

Just my two coppers... ;)

Kal

Snowdog
January 8, 2003, 09:26 AM
Became a bit tiffed myself a couple years ago during a traffic stop (license/DUI checkpoint). Likewise, I pointed out I had a CCW with a handgun and the location. Officer #2 circles around to the passenger side and asked me to unlock the door, which I did.

Next, officer #2 reaches in, opens the console and takes the handgun, mentioning something about "checking to see if it's stolen"! :fire:
Taking this as an insult, I promptly asked for the name of this officer from officer #1, who repeatedly told me it was merely being "secured" during the stop. A few minutes later, I received my unloaded .38snub and a handful of shells while being thanked for my cooperation.

Cooperation? What choice did I have?
Should I have sped off? Wrested my handguns from his grip?
Thrown punches?
What cooperation?

Even though I had the name and badge number, I never did contact the Sheriffs department concerning the actions of officer #2 as I cooled down considerably the next morning (stoically, I am generally quite difficult to rile).

Checking to see if the handgun of a CCW recipient is stolen... I still often wonder if that's standard practice with some departments.
Two later checkpoints with the H'ville Police department only yielded such comments as "Well, just don't go twirling with it" once the CCW/carry gun was mentioned.

:confused: What ever happened to universal standard practice?

bogie
January 8, 2003, 09:31 AM
Yeah, Misery ain't a good place to be...

After we get CCW (and it'll happen eventually...), if they require us to inform cops on traffic stops, I don't have a problem with that. I think it's a good PR tool for "gun folks," in that cops will rapidly figure out that the folks carrying are generally okay. Should one wish to relieve me of the piece, fine. I plan to take charge of the situation, however, and insist that it be unloaded prior to transfer...

Double Naught Spy
January 8, 2003, 09:31 AM
Fishing? I don't think so, no more than when he ran your license and registration.

Would he have run your gun had you not had to handle it to get your paperwork? Probably not. But since you had to expose the gun to the officer in order to get your paperwork, he followed his duties.

Profiling? Sure. You met the first profile definition by breaking traffic laws. You also probably behaved enough in some manner to hold his attention such that he felt he needed to take your gun from you. People often confuse the differences profiling and individual assessment. Cops would have to be idiots not to assess every person they stop for acting in manners that maybe don't coincide with the traffic stop. Is that profiling? Yes and no. It is not profiling in the traditional sense where skin color, age, sex, socioeconomic status, etc. gets used. It is profiling in the sense that his assessment of you led him to feel the need to disarm you and verify your gun as well as license and registration. You know, he is just doing his job and you never would have been in that situation had you not been breaking the law. You get pulled over all the time, not because of the vehicle you drive, but because you are breaking the law.

As for the idea that he was fishing, that sort of implies that he was trying to catch you for something. Had he been fishing, you would have gotten your speeding ticket. Instead, the running of all your numbers simply provided a verification that you were one of the good guys and he sent you toodling down the road with no ticket.

Preacherman
January 8, 2003, 09:41 AM
I don't know about other states, but in Louisiana you're required to inform any police officer who stops you for anything that you have a CCW permit and are armed. The permit is also computer-linked to one's drivers licence and vehicle tag, so that as soon as you're pulled over and the LEO runs your tag, he is warned that the vehicle belongs to a registered CCW permit holder. On two occasions at random road-blocks, I've not been carrying, but was asked by officers whether I was carrying, because my vehicle was "tagged" as belonging to a CCW permit-holder. However, when I have been carrying, I just tell the officer that I'm armed, show him my CCW permit, and so far have never been asked to hand over the weapon.

TheOtherOne
January 8, 2003, 10:07 AM
Double Naught Spy:
Would he have run your gun had you not had to handle it to get your paperwork? Probably not. But since you had to expose the gun to the officer in order to get your paperwork, he followed his duties.Yeah, I've decided the glove box probably isn't the best place to keep it. I'll never know if he would of still asked for the gun had it been on me or under my seat or someplace else. I'm a really passive guy and I wasn't being rude or beligerent or anything. I tried to keep my hands in a safe place where he could see them and everything. I even made sure to tell him again that the gun was in the glovebox when he asked me for the registration and insurance. The cop wasn't being a jerk or anything, and since he didn't give me a ticket, I don't have a problem with it! :) The only time he ever seemed perturbed was when he asked me to hand him the gun and I asked him if I should take the magazine out and then he kind of snapped at me "Just hand it to me!".

As far as the profiling, you are right... I was breaking the law and speeding and so was everyone else driving on the freeway with me. I know that just because everyone else is doing it, it still doesn't make it okay, but I guess I could say it seems like I get singled out an awful lot. I've been pulled over before because the cop thought my "rear bumper was too high" and another time just because they wanted to check why I was out so late and make sure I hadn't been drinking. The list goes on.

TheOtherOne
January 8, 2003, 10:29 AM
Commenting on what labgrade mentioned about why a cop would want to disarm you... I don't really understand either. I guess he just wants to cover all the bases. It's the bad guy that doesn't mention has a gun that he really needs to worry about though and not the good guy with the permit.

I wish our CCW didn't require us to inform the officer. That kind of goes against the "concealed means concealed" philosophy doesn't it? Of course, in my case, I guess I didn't do too good of a job at keeping it concealed.
http://jabberwoq.com/images/emoticons/bangin.gif No more storing my car registration/insurance in the same place as my gun!

tomkatz
January 8, 2003, 01:01 PM
Had dinner at thanksgiving with a guy we know who is wa. state patrol, he said the car that stands out is the one that is not keeping up with traffic on the freeway. I've always thought that too. He said if a line of cars is passing him at 10 over he does nothing, but maybe other LEO think differently.....tom

Wil Terry
January 8, 2003, 01:49 PM
KEEP MY REGISTRATION. I HAD ALREADY GIVEN HIM MY DRIVERS LICENSE.
" I NEED YOUR REGISTRATION, SIR "
' IT'S IN THAT GLOVE BOX BUT I'M NOT REACHING IN THERE FOR NOTHING RIGHT NOW '
"WHY NOT?"
'THERE'S A PISTOL IN THERE TOO'
" DO YOU HAVE A CARRY PERMIT?"
YES SIR. I ALSO HAVE ONE ON MY LEFT HIP.
" ANOTHER PISTOL?"
YES SIR, A 10MM.
" WHAT KIND OF PISTOL, SIR"?
A GLOCK MODEL 20'
" I LIKE MY GLOCK 45 A LOT"
YES SIR'
" GET OUT OF THE TRUCK, SIR, AND WALK BACK BETWEEN THE VEHICLES" [ OH OH...]
YES SIR'
" NOW LET ME SEE THAT GLOCK 10MM PISTOL"
I'M NOT PULLIN MY G..D... GUN OUT HERE, SIR! ALL THOSE PEOPLE GOING BY WILL CALL IN AND THERE'LL BE HELL TO PAY!
[ WE WALK AROUND TO THE RIGHT SIDE OF HIS CRUISER ]
" HERE, YOU LOOK AT MINE AND LET ME SEE YOUR PISTOL "[ HE PULLS OUT HIS SERVICE GUN AND HANDS IT TO ME, NO SHI! ]
WE TALKED GUNS FOR HALF AN HOUR. THIS AFTER HE CLOCKED ME AT 90 IN A 75 ZONE ON I90.
" YOU BETTER SLOW DOWN SIR "
YES SIR'
MY REGISTRATION IS NOW IN AN ENVELOPE IN MY DRIVER'S SIDE DOOR AND MY LICENSE IS IN A BRASS CARD CASE IN MY LEFT SHIRT POCKET ALONG WITH MY CCW AND OTHER I.D.

MoonMan
January 8, 2003, 04:35 PM
What if you just said, "No, you may not have my weapon. You have no reason to disarm me. Please issue me my ticket and allow me to proceed with my travels"?

sturmruger
January 8, 2003, 05:35 PM
I work at a Ford dealership we see allot of State Patrol officers in and out of here. There is allot of down time here so I have had allot of good opurtunities to talk to the troopers when they are here getting something fixed. I have asked 4 differant troopers and they all said the same thing here in IA. They told me not to volunteer my carry status unless I am asked to exit the vehicle. They said that 90% of the time I will not be asked to exit the vehicle. On the rare occasion when I am asked to exit the vehicle they said that alerting the officer to my carry status would be the safest alternative.

I have been pulled over twice in the last 18 months that I have been carrying. At first I thought I would be nervous expecting the officer to feel my gun with some sort of Psychic power. They never noticed a thing. Before I travel through any other states I always visit Packing.org (www.packing.org) to check and see what the law is in that state. Better safe then sorry.

motorep
January 8, 2003, 06:09 PM
Just common courtesy- I hand over my license and etc., then the carry permit with "I don't want you to be alarmed when this comes up on my license check". I've always received a "thanks, I appreciate that". Only once have I been asked where my weapon is, in that instance I was standing on the side of the road with a State Patrol officer- an inattentive jerk had run into me- I told him right hip, he said thanks again, and that was it. I have an acquaintance that was asked to hand it over, he said "no way am I going to touch it, it's in the glove compartment, you can get it out if you want". It stayed in the glove compartment.

HadEmAll
January 8, 2003, 07:01 PM
4 occasions in San Antonio. Presented CHL as required. 2 officers asked where it was, 2 didn't ask at all. None asked me to surrender it.

Zander
January 8, 2003, 07:17 PM
Have been stopped just once since being licensed and that was by a Tennessee State Highway patrolman. He never mentioned my handgun carry permit nor asked for it; nor did he inquire about anything that I may have had on my person or on-board.

No requirement to notify the officer, but since driving and carry licenses are linked [both carry the same number], he knew when he checked the database.

He was polite, I was polite and he asked that I slow down a bit while on "his" interstate. <shrug>

That said, troopers and other LEOs who have not checked the statistics for permit holders are doing a disfavor to us and to their departments issuing badges. We are, overwhelmingly, the most law-abiding citizens they are likely to encounter in their day-to-day. In fact, much more law-abiding than their peers. :cool:

Betty
January 8, 2003, 07:23 PM
Zander,
The trooper was probably discreetly intimidated because you look like a sly lawyer. ;)

Jeff OTMG
January 9, 2003, 01:46 AM
In Texas notification is required, in fact your CHL info is tied to your DL so he is going to know that you have a CHL when you get stopped. It is the standard policy of the Austin PD to disarm a CHL holder and that is permitted under state law. In Indiana, although not required, it was greatly appreciated when the information was surrendered voluntarily. No ticket either.

Powderman
January 9, 2003, 07:46 AM
I have absolutely no problem with CCW. If a person tells me they are carrying and have a permit, I ask to see that along with the license, registration and proof of insurance.

That being said, here's a guide to a relatively painless traffic stop:

1. As soon as you behold the blue light special in your rearview, pull over and stop. Turn off the ignition.

2. Turn on ALL of your interior lights if it is at night, or during reduced visibility.

3. Keep your hands in plain sight--BOTH of them.

4. When the officer gets there, I recommend the following speech: "Officer, before we go any further, I want you to know that I have a CCW permit, and I am armed. What do you want me to do now?"

5. For your own safety, DO NOT HANDLE, TOUCH, OR REACH FOR YOUR WEAPON IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, FORM, OR FASHION.
This move, with whatever good intentions in mind, WILL be interpreted in a way you don't want. Trust me on this one.

6. Follow the instructions the officer gives you.

If the officer asks you to hand them the firearm, I would refuse. Tell them this: "The firearm is (say location), and I would prefer that you take it directly rather than hand it to you. What do you want me to do?"

If I take a weapon back to my patrol unit, it is NOT fishing--I do check for stolen on every firearm I encounter.

Preacherman
January 9, 2003, 09:33 AM
Powderman, can you help me understand this one? Not flaming you, you understand - I really do want to know. You said:If I take a weapon back to my patrol unit, it is NOT fishing--I do check for stolen on every firearm I encounter.Isn't this making an awfully big assumption? I would be highly insulted if any cop checked my weapon's serial number on the grounds that it "might be stolen" - I would expect that since I have no criminal record whatsoever (not even a traffic citation), it would be presumed that my weapon is OK. I know that many cops do what you do, but I really don't understand it. There is no "probable cause" to do the check, as far as I can see. Is there a reasonable explanation for this conduct on the part of so many policemen?

motorep
January 9, 2003, 09:52 AM
Preacherman- they're already checking your driver's license and your vehicle for wants/warrants, I don't see that there's a big stretch to run your gun, too. Already had probable cause to pull you over, no?

DeltaElite
January 9, 2003, 12:50 PM
I don't. I have heard all the safety arguments and I am not worried about the armed citizen on a traffic stop.
Heck, if they tell me they have one, odds are they are not someone to be worried about.

Zander
January 9, 2003, 01:02 PM
The trooper was probably discreetly intimidated because you look like a sly lawyer. -- ROTLLOL! I've had people guess that I'm a doctor or a college professor, but never a sly lawyer.

What the heck, as long as he didn't write me a citation, I wouldn't care if he wanted to believe that I was a space alien...

Powderman
January 9, 2003, 04:06 PM
Preacherman, thanks for the question. It's not taken as a slam at all.

The reason to do so is just in the name of good police work--dotting the I's and crossing the T's. It's checking each and every thing that is possible to ensure that the law is not broken--plus, believe it or not, there's a benefit to the citizen there, too!

It goes like this:

1. I approach the vehicle. If the driver informs me that he/she is carrying concealed, AND the gun is in a fanny pack or a seperate bag, I will politely ask for it, and tell them that once the stop is over it will be returned.

(If it is in the holster, then it's best where it is, of course. The only reason to remove it at that point would be if suspicions are raised WAY beyond the reason for the stop.)

2. I'll take it back to the car, and have it checked by dispatch.

Let's say that you are a mother or father, with kids in the car and/or spouse. You really don't (stretch of the imagination here, folks) look like a criminal, you didn't make any furtive movements, and you're not on my hot sheet. Your vehicle--and you--came back clear, all ways.

You decided that you wanted to purchase a gun, and that's the one that I have in the car checking. You just bought it used, from a pawn shop, or gun store.

The gun comes back stolen.

I'll check again, to make sure. Then, I'll talk to you, and ask you if you know the gun was hot. I'm willing to guess that you didn't, okay? (Benefit of the doubt here)

Then we'll talk and figure out your options from there. It would probably be to coordinate with our detectives, who will get the operation you bought the gun from checked. If they are knowingly selling stolen guns, they'll be caught.

As far as your gun goes, don't worry if it happens in WA State.

Our court system imposes punishments for criminal convictions in three steps--fine, imprisonment, and restitution. You'll get your money back, plus any lost wages for appearing in court. :D

Hey, the system works--just kinda slowly at times.

Shootin' Buddy
January 9, 2003, 04:43 PM
I've only had one officer ask to take my weapon. Every other time it's been completely ignored. The one time I was asked, I got the distinct impression that the officer was uncertain about the validity of my permit. I am an Oregon resident. I have a valid Washington CCW and I was traveling in Washington. He seemed uncertain that a Washington permit would be valid for out of state residents. I got the gun back at the end of the stop no problem.

What struck us as funny and futile about the whole thing was that my passenger was also armed, but the officer didn't -- most likely couldn't -- ask. So if we were bad guys, we'd have still been armed. Shrug. By the same token, I guess if we were bad guys he'd have never known I had a gun either. Ah well, what can you say?

Powderman
January 9, 2003, 04:53 PM
That's where officer safety comes in.

A lot of the funny things we do are because of officer safety. I know that we live in a shall-issue state. I also know that, as a rule, crazies and whackos do not apply for CCW.

I also know that there is an exception to every rule.

That's why I am real careful about traffic stops and citizen contacts. You might say that I'm restrictive, and some above have hinted (at least that's what it sounds like) that I have little regard for citizen rights (hey, I'm a citizen too).

But consider this:

You are asking us--all of us who are cops--to knowingly TURN OUR BACKS ON A PERSON WITH A LOADED, OPERATIONAL FIREARM. A person we have never met, at that.

Is that right?

12-34hom
January 9, 2003, 05:07 PM
Powderman, Many have a hard time with being disarmed or having the serial # Checked on a firearm they might have in thier possession.

I've read these replies here and at TFL for years about JBT.

Many have respect for our laws - many don't.

As the saying goes - "There are no careless electricians - only dead ones." That applies to police officers as well.

Stay safe.

12-34hom.

PATH
January 9, 2003, 05:14 PM
Powderman,

What you say is fairly reasonable to me. I also think that you need to do what is necessary to get through the shift in one piece.

I think most LEO's are pretty decent folk and if you behave decently so will they. There are of course some jerks out there. Name one profession that does not have them!

In terms of taking the firearm from me I would rather the officer secure my firearm rather tham handle it myself. I can just see someone getting nervous because the holster slipped out of my hand.

I think most LEO's know we are the good guys and act accordingly!

Shootin' Buddy
January 9, 2003, 05:53 PM
You are asking us--all of us who are cops--to knowingly TURN OUR BACKS ON A PERSON WITH A LOADED, OPERATIONAL FIREARM. A person we have never met, at that.

Is that right?
Oh heavens no, Powderman!!! What I'm asking is that when you pull ME over you turn your back on a person with a loaded, operational firearm. ;) :D

benewton
January 9, 2003, 05:58 PM
"You are asking us--all of us who are cops--to knowingly TURN OUR BACKS ON A PERSON WITH A LOADED, OPERATIONAL FIREARM. A person we have never met, at that. "

And you are asking us--all of us who are citizens-- to?

rock jock
January 9, 2003, 06:44 PM
No, powderman, its not unreasonable at all. I think most folks on this board, me included, would say that our routine encounters with other armed folks we are unacquainted with don't make us uncomfortable in any way. BUT, that's probably because those encounters are typically at the shooting range or in the gun shop or in the the presence of mutual friends and there is no reason to remotely suspect strangers in these situations. However, if I were out shooting in the woods somewhere by myself and was approached by a couple of armed fellows wanting to shoot with me, I would of course be extremely cautious. Not too different in your situation.

I would also say that it is the natural inclination of honest people to expect others to view them as exactly that way - honest and law-abiding, and are slightly offended that someone would suspect them as being anything but. However, we should understand that you as a cop, while probably possessing of above average powers of observation, are not psychic and can't discern us friendly gun-nuts from the more malevolent types on the prowl by only a brief introduction.

rock jock
January 9, 2003, 06:47 PM
And you are asking us--all of us who are citizens-- to?
benewton,

I don't think that is fair. There is a reasonable assumption that the guy behind the badge, even in the remote chance that he is a bad cop, is not going to shoot you during a traffic stop just because he doesn't like your taste in cars.

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