Mini shells


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Dithsoer
June 30, 2007, 03:00 AM
Anyone familiar with those new mini shotgun shells being put out by a (I believe) Mexican firm? They're like 1-1/2 inches long, available with buckshot, slugs and bird shot. If these things had decent loads they'd be great for home defense situations, lower-powered shotshells for in-home use, i.e. less chance of over-penetration or ricochets. In addition, they'd turn a standard five-shot sporting gun into a high-capacity model without an extended magazine, (which would probably make them illegal in some areas).

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inf100
June 30, 2007, 03:25 AM
http://www.aguilaammo.com/minishells.htm

I believe those are what you are talking about. I havent tried them myself so I cannot comment on thier effectiveness/performance.

Titan6
June 30, 2007, 08:27 AM
They are Brazilian. They will not cycle semi-autos and have feeding issues in some pumps. They give you the advantage of being able to load more rounds in your magazine than you normally have at a reduced capability. I am not real crazy about them myself.

trueblue1776
June 30, 2007, 09:01 AM
They are made by Aguila from Mexico. Very fun to play with, but unless you plan on modifying your gun they are not reliable enough for home defense.
The only pump gun that didn't jam like mad with them was my ancient 2-3/4" 870 wingmaster. Mossbergs didn't like them in general and anything with a magnum feeder would flip them around during feeding. I think the 870 feed design is more supportive on the shell than the Mossbergs. I had to pump fast, even in the 870 to keep them from flipping sideways.
They are fun though, I like the mini-slug rounds, those things are so slow you can see the trajectory. Take them to a rock quarry and shoot some big rocks for a good time.

sm
June 30, 2007, 09:39 AM
Serious Situation use of any firearm means the gun has to run , the loading being able to feed and extract : Reliable
Next up is being able to shoot POA/POI - Shot Placment

If the gun does not run, it cannot put the projectile(s) where they need to go.
Period.
Makes no difference what the load is, it has to "get there" ...now what it does comes into play.

MiniShells in My testing and the testing of others, are not consistent in pattern, pattern density, and depth of penetration.

So I do not want these shells as for ME these are not efficient on this one point alone.

Win 1300s are the pump guns that "most times" will feed and extract these as far as a repeating shotgun is concerned.

Well , not everyone owns a 1300, so what about other Repeating shotguns?

So I am not going to stake my life on a shell that does not feed and extract.
Another "X" as to why I won't use these.

What good is having a lot more of "The Ammo" in any gun, if if won't feed or extract, and it does not go where it is supposed to, and then is a bad pattern?


Mini shells are great for Older Guns with short chambers, that once in a while get fired to remember someone in Remembrance.

Double Barrel, and Single Shot shotguns using these for showing a kid, new shooter what these are, and getting to shoot one and having the hull for 'Neat Factor".

Yeah, they are cute, neat, and all.
Heck some left over and being used in a Single Shot for pest duty is fine.

2 3/4" shells are all anyone needs for serious use.

These have a proven history of doing so, and no need to re-invent the wheel.

Striker
June 30, 2007, 09:49 AM
Aguila minis are my load of choice for "lil loudmouf" (NEF single shot 12 ga cut back to 18") that I use as a walking about gun when out in the woods with dogs.

loudmouf only weighs about 4 lbs, and will get your attention with standard loads, even AA featherlights. Aguilas, though are just the ticket. I carry 10 of them in a butt cuff (2 per elastic band) and usually have a mix of slugs, 00 buck, and birdshot in the cuff.

Don't underestimate these shells. Out to 15 yards or so, they pattern/group nicely even with no choke in my gun and are effective. I've potted the odd rabbit or two, and put down a rabid racoon, all a with single shot.

The birdshot was extremly effective on the multitude of snakes around my brothers house down in Louisiana after Katrina. (I normally don't kill snakes, but there where dozens around the house, since he was on a bit of high ground).

Only downside is that they are a bit pricey, but I like em.

joab
June 30, 2007, 09:56 AM
I have a very old Warner SxS that I use their birdshot in simply because I don't think the gun can take a full powered load, or not many of them, due to it's age. I don't think I could take many ful powered rounds due to the 18"
I have tried the shells in all of my shotguns
Savage 6A, Winchester, Remington and Norinco's Winchester clone

None have had any issues with loading but I have deliberately chambered each round

trueblue1776
June 30, 2007, 10:29 AM
Mini shells are great for Older Guns with short chambers, that once in a while get fired to remember someone in Remembrance.


Or to deliver someone in deliverance.

sm
June 30, 2007, 11:03 AM
Striker,

You are using these for what I call "property loads".
You have enough experience with patterning to know each gun is different, and one must pattern the gun to know what works out to what yardage.
You also know another gun, just like yours, might not pattern the same.

You and I are NOT talking of Serious Situation Loadings, as so many folks are prone to thinking with these Mini-shells.

You have other shotguns and loadings for Serious Use.

Before Mini-Shells, we used to shorten hulls to make shorter shells for shorter than 2 3/4" chambered guns.
Again, often times these loads were for pest control , "property use", and firing off a shot in Salute to someone passed on.


Light single shot shotguns, we did really light loads, not sure of current powders and components, still we had some 3/4 oz loads in 12 ga that were pretty light.

Serious Shotgun use : Stick with Serious, Proven Loads.

Forget Marketing , Gimmicks, Flashy Ads, Kewl Factor, and all that.

Dead is Dead and Forever is Forever.

Big Daddy K
June 30, 2007, 11:09 AM
Do they come in 20 or anything other than 12?

trueblue1776
June 30, 2007, 11:23 AM
I've only seen 12ga

Striker
June 30, 2007, 02:10 PM
sm,

No arguement here, guess I wasn't very clear.

I use mini's for a specific purpose in a specific shotty. The point being they are effective and lethal when utilized within those parameters.

:)

Dave McCracken
June 30, 2007, 02:33 PM
IMO, these minis are useful as a special purpose load as Striker uses them but have little GP utility.

For short chambered shotguns, the scarce but available 2 1/2" loads from Gamebore, BP, Polywad, etc, are a better choice.

And for most repeaters the minies are nigh useless.

Chuck Dye
June 30, 2007, 05:02 PM
I found a box of Minishells, 20 rounds for $11.50, loaded with 4 buck and 1 buck. They are worthless in my Ithaca Model 37, requiring a lot of manipulation to chamber. Don't think I'll foul the chambers of the Superposed playing with them.

When the Minishells were originally introduced, Aguila's web site showed some dedicated shotguns made by, or at least branded, Poseidon. As I understand it, Poseidon never actually sold a gun, not the mini 12s or their suppressed Ruger 77/22s.

Okiecruffler
June 30, 2007, 10:08 PM
I've played with alot of the mini shells, especially the dual load. They cycle my 311 just fine so I don't know why you guys are having such a problem.
Kinda fun to play with, but patterns in my gun are...strange. some real dense areas and then big holes of nothingness.

joab
July 1, 2007, 03:46 AM
They cycle my 311 just fine so I don't know why you guys are having such a problem. In case y'all didn't know it
That was funny

trueblue1776
July 1, 2007, 08:41 AM
Funny? I was trying to figure out what 311 "cycles". :D

kjeff50cal
July 1, 2007, 10:41 AM
Funny? I was trying to figure out what 311 "cycles".

Both barrels in turn:evil::p.

The Punisher
July 1, 2007, 10:50 AM
I've used these myself as more of a novelty item in my side by side short barreled shotguns. The recoil is way more manageable than standard loads and has a neat factor when shooting class 3 guns...which are also just cool anyhow.

thebigc
July 1, 2007, 06:00 PM
i picked some up just for the hell of it about 2 weeks ago 8.50 for a box of 20 slugs they feed fine in my winchester 1300 and are fun at the range but i wouldent trust them for self defense.

CWL
July 2, 2007, 02:44 PM
They may be fine for small game but do not deliver the energy load for reliable home defense. If you want light HD/SD go with reduced recoil ammo like Federal.

Creature
July 2, 2007, 02:56 PM
They cycle just fine in my 590A1 but are not suitable for SD/HD in my opinion. Fun though!

sm
July 2, 2007, 03:20 PM
Okiecruffler wrote:
They cycle my 311 just fine so I don't know why you guys are having such a problem.

Classic!!


:D

Okiecruffler
July 2, 2007, 03:28 PM
It certainly is a classic, just got back home from shooting it. But alas, no short shells, just my old reliable red dot #8 loads. First time I've had it out this year, not sure where my head has been at.

Carl N. Brown
July 2, 2007, 03:44 PM
The Mini-shells work just fine in my NEF and H&R shotguns.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=60187&stc=1&d=1183405313
The short H&R is my snakegun and the minishells are ideal.

MortalWombat
July 8, 2007, 09:45 PM
I got a hold of some of the Aguila mini birdshot shells and mini buckshot shells at a gun show a few weeks ago.

I took them to the range today to try them out.

Here are the results from a Baikal coach gun (20" barrel, cylinder choke) at only 10 yards:

Mini buck shot:
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y143/MortalWombat68/minishellbuck.jpg

Mini bird shot:
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y143/MortalWombat68/minishell7.jpg

As you can see, from this gun, both pattern very wide at 10 yards. The buckshot hardly hit anything anywhere close to the center of POA. The birdshot would be OK dispatching a snake or some other small pest at fairly close range I suppose.

I will try to get a hold of some of the mini slugs if I can and try those out too.

trueblue1776
July 8, 2007, 09:48 PM
With a 20" cylinder bore I'm not surprised. They patterned similar to normal bird shot in my 28" modified.

foghornl
July 9, 2007, 12:56 PM
One of my shooting buddies gave me a 1/2 box of the 'Minies'. Wouldn't feed worth a hoot-in-Hades in my Mossy500 or Maverick. Couple of times, they slid off of the 'shell elevator' and partly dropped out of the loading port...tying up the action in a real bad way.

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