[Black Adder LXX]

Hello to all-

I have a question for the 357 snubby owners out there.

Last weekend, I had the occasion to shoot a buddy's Rossi 357 snubby, and WOW! The closest approximation to how it felt would be like grabbing a tire iron as hard as you could and then slamming it as hard as you can into a solid concrete wall. Needless to say the grips were uncomfortable, but I can't imagine ANY grips making that feel any better (of better enough to be "ENJOYABLE").

That was my first time shooting a 357 snubby. Is that generally what 357 snubs feel like? If that's the case I'll stick with the 38 spl...

Also, I already know I'm a wuss, so we can skip past that part, thanks.

[telomerase]

Is that generally what 357 snubs feel like?

Not if you use lighter bullets, wide rubber grips, and go to the gym :D

They are :cuss: loud though, and the lighter bullets make that even worse.

[Mikeo]

When I shot my Taurus 605, for the first time a while back, (about 1-1/2 weeks ago), I shot about 20/25 158 gr JHP Blazer Brass .357s. The bone at the base of my thumb is still tender. I do have arthritis at the base of both thumbs, so that might be a contributor, but this is quite a bit more than I expected. In the past, I have owned and shot several different .44 mags, SA, DA and Contender, a number of .357s, including a snubby Security-six, and several .45s, including a Star PD, which weighed ~24 oz loaded. None of these felt as harsh as the 605. I have the gun loaded with 135 gr Gold Dot SB +Ps.

[Geronimo45]

Real men carry .454 Casull snubbies. :cool:

Seriously: snubbies are notorious for punishing recoil. The .357 models even more so. Airweights... same thing.
I have heard, however, that firing from a one-handed grip is much less painful... coulda been hearsay, though.

[Creature]

Well at the risk of being labeled a pansy, I prefer my 38spl.

I recall at the local indoor range the time a fella that stepped up to the lane next to me...and promptly launched a 357 Magnum round down range with his snubby.

KA-BLAMMY!!

I saw a muzzle blast the size of a bowling ball erupt from behind the barricade that divided our respective lanes...and what sounded like a howitzer going off right next me.

I leaned over to see what the heck made all that commotion...and the fella's eyes were wide as saucers. The snubby was brand new to him & it was his first time ever to shoot a 357 Magnum out of a snub. Judging by his expression as he slowly put that snubby down, I suggested he try shooting 38's through it for a while before trying magnums again.

He never said a word...he just packed up that gun and prettty much called it quits for the day. It can be quite a surprise shooting a Magum round from a snub for the first time.

[roguejestyr]

i saw a .454 Casull snubby today...i think it can double as a flare gun.

[DaleCooper51]

The mild magnums aren't bad if the gun has some heft to it. I used to shoot and carry Remington Golden Sabres in a 3" sp101. It was alot more pleasant than shooting +p .38's out of my 442.

[Mike Kerr]

"That was my first time shooting a 357 snubby. Is that generally what 357 snubs feel like? If that's the case I'll stick with the 38 spl... "


Yup!

Rubber grips and a heavy frame help a lot but snubbies are still a beast on blast alone. They are designed for concealment not "a comfortable shooter" .

Regards,

:):):)

[kgriggs8@yahoo.com]

I'm not bragging but handgun recoil doesn't seem to bother me. I can shoot +P out of my Airweights all day. I can shoot enough .357mag to feel comfortable with them but I would want to shoot them for hours on end. One box is all I would be able to handle and still maintain any level of accuracy and control.

That being said, I hate rifle or shotgun kick. I don't like getting kicked in the shoulder I guess but handguns are not a problem.

What I am saying is, if the recoil bothers you, try an auto or a less powerful/heavier revolver. There is no use in trying to get used to something that you find painful. If it is painful, your accuracy will be nill.

[Rexster]

I carry magnums in my SP101 snubbies; there is a learning curve involved. Premium self-defense ammo has flash retardant in the powder, and flashes MUCH less than training-grade or other cheaper ammo. Golden Sabers in the 125-grain .357 load are mild, about 200 fps slower than the hot stuff. I like the 145-grain Silvertip, another medium load, which tends to shoot nearer to point of aim than the lighter-bullet, and has very little flash. Fit of the grips to the hand is very important, plus holding it right. Nearly everyone that wants to test-fire my snubbies seems to want to hold it low on the grip, which will increase muzzle flip; simple leverage at work there. The web of my shooting hand is at the very top of the rubber portion when I shoot. The little gun then kicks much more straight back. FWIW, becuase I load the hot 125-grain stuff in my bigger .357 sixguns, I am just as likely to have that load in my snubbies, and have even shot some 180-grain Federal "Hunting" Castcore loads in the snubbies. Exhilarating, but not painful. :)

[Baron357]

The recoil out of my .357 model 60 is not bad at all, it is all steel and heavier then the airweights and it makes a big difference.

[The_Shootist]

Try Buffalo Bore 158 gr .357 rounds from an SP 101.

That will put the fear of God into ya :evil:

[PaladinX13]

.357 out of the 340PD is rough but not as brutal as many proclaim, IMHO. Maybe it depends on your hands....

[rdaines]

For summer, I load 38 Spl, 125 grain Golden Sabre (handloads, 950 fps), thinking being less fabric to go through. Winter, .357 mags commercial loads. Either way I don't think I can go wrong.

[Gary A]

Years ago I found a Model 640 Centennial in the case and to my shock and pleasant surprise it was marked .357. I managed to get a very low serial number just after they had been released. I was so taken that I called Smith and Wesson and during our discussion it was mentioned that the recoil could be, ah, er, surprising with full-house 125s. I took it to a local indoor range and loaded up some Remington full velocity 125 grain SJHPs and, yes, I was...surprised. Loved the gun but backed off a bit on the loads, moving to 110 Winchesters and 125 Remington Golden Sabers, also 158 plus P .38s (all roughly equally easy to shoot, IMO). I love small-framed .357 snubbies but to this day have a difficult time doing well with full-power loads. I'm getting better with 158s but have foresworn the 125s. Too much of a good thing in my book. These days I stick with Speer 135s, both .38+P and .357 or the aforementioned 158 LSWCHP+P .38s. Personally, I don't think I could well handle .357s from a lightweight scandium model. I mean, I could shoot them, but don't think I could practically hit well with them.

[twenty711]

The recoil out of my .357 model 60 is not bad at all, it is all steel and heavier then the airweights and it makes a big difference.

I just bought my model 60 and couldn't believe how little recoil there was. - There is definante recoil, but it was not painful at all and did not make me feel out of control.

[envonge]

I have an S&W 240PD airlite and I shoot alot of doubletap .357 200gr. hardcasts in it and they don't have that much recoil.

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_27&products_id=152

[Old Fuff]

For some reason not fully understood, these little guns are usually sighted to use 158 grain bullets in both the .38 Special and .357 Magnum.

The Old Fuff is not even slightly interested in a J-frame snubby using .357 Magnum cartridges. If he can't do what needs to be done with a .38 he'll get a Magnum, but a bigger, heavier one. ;)

[Gary A]

This reminds me of a story I came across years ago in Taiwan. There was a Taoist master who was a butcher by trade and the story was he had never in his life ever had to sharpen his knives. The local warlord asked him how that could be so since all knives dulled with use and threatened to kill him if he did not supply the answer. The master replied and demonstrated that when he plied his trade, he passed the knife betweenthe joints and did not hack his way through. Consequently, his knives did not dull. Placement is everything. (Note: I am most definitely NOT a Taoist master :).)

[ronto]

With Trausch Grips on my Ruger DAO SP101 I don't have any problems...With the right grips and a heavy platform, 357's from a snubbie are not that bad.

[rich642z]

Sounds like you people are afaid of a .357 mag. I have 8 of them from Ruger and Smith&Wesson. I just picked up a centennial 340 mp with a steel cylinder and shot 125 grain .357 Hornadys thru it. I had fun!!!!!!! People standing next to me asked me if I shot reloads thru it. I said OF COURSE I CAN,so I shot some hot loaded handloads thru it and yes flame came out of the barrel like my S&W 500 mag did also. My 500 Smith is a 4 inch barrel by the way. I am disabled and retired and even let my transplant surgeon fire my 500 Smith and he said OUCH!!!!!!! and I said WHAT A WIMP!!!!! Rich642z,Omaha,Ne.:cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:

[Vonderek]

Lots of nearly new (less than a cylinder-full shot) lightweight .357 snubnoses in the used gun counter.

I found a Hogue grip to be much more manageable than the stock panels on my SP101. Use a high firm grip...if you hold the gun loosely you will be punished for it. Also look for moderate loads. The worst I ever shot was some cheap Phillippino Armscor ammo I bought years ago and forgot about until recently. It was about the hottest stuff I ever shot.

[Cannonball888]

I have a S&W 340PD but have yet to shoot .357. Also, I could not tell any difference between shooting .38 Spl and .38 Spl +P from it. The recoil seemed less than my P3AT maybe because the CTC LG-405 grips have nice cushioning like Hogues.

[W.E.G.]

it felt would be like grabbing a tire iron as hard as you could and then slamming it as hard as you can into a solid concrete

The alloy/aluminum frame .38 spl. models feel that way too when firing "duty" ammo.

I found the best solution to this problem to be the Glock 26.

ymmv

[Nomad, 2nd]

The recoil out of my .357 model 60 is not bad at all, it is all steel and heavier then the airweights and it makes a big difference.

+1 My .357 Bodyguard with Factory rubber grips is not bothersome with Corbon .357's.

[Black Adder LXX]

I found the best solution to this problem to be the Glock 26.

Um, thanks but I'm one of those guys with a condition that doesn't allow me to like Glocks... I've really tried, but it seems incurable. ;)

[MCgunner]

My SP101 sorta hurt my middle finger with 140 grain full power hot handloads, but I added a rubber Hogue Monogrip. That made a HUGE difference. It's not bad now other than the flash/bang. Yeah, I'm into steel when it comes to .357 magnums. The SP101 isn't as light, but about as compact as the J frames. It carries a little more weight at 27 ounces which helps more than you'd think 3 or 4 ounces would and isn't hard to carry at all. But, I have a ultrailite .38 (alloy frame) 17 ounce 38 for pocket carry. The SP101 isn't a pocket gun. I won't say it's pleasant to shoot, but it's not unpleasant to shoot with full power loads. Heavier the bullet, the harder it kicks, though. I've fired hot 180s out of it, was an experience with the standard grips it came with.

I found the best solution to this problem to be the Glock 26.

I've got a Kel Tec P11 I prefer, but I like the .357 for the horsepower. :D If it hurts you when you fire it, imagine how it feels to get hit with it. Yeah, I know, gross over-simplification, but I had to say it. LOL

[Logos]

The 9mm out of the 26 will hurt just as much, be equally effective.....and is much easier to deliver with precision.

Of course, you won't get the immense pyrotechnics of that power-wasting flash/boom, but you could learn to do without it.

:)

I know, revolvers have a mystique. I love my two and a half inch 686......but I'm also a realist as well.

For serious work, I'd definitely go with the 26.

[Ala Dan]

I have and occassionally shoot a Smith & Wesson 2.5" model 66-4* with the
round butt walnut grips. Its not painfull at all, if you let the felt recoil roll
the weapon back in your the webbing of your hand. :);)

*FootNote: .357 magnum

[41magsnub]

I can relate to being suprised by a snub. I fired a .41 mag with a 3" barrel I inherited using full power remington shells. Good lord I did not know what I was getting into. The first round was in the black. The rest the best I can say is they were down range, none hit the paper even I was flinching so badly. I put the gun away and picked up my security six and threw some wadcutters downrange to unlearn the bad habits I probably just picked up. If I ever shoot the .41 again I will need to find some lower power rounds.

[The Lone Haranguer]

The one snubbie I find tolerable to shoot with full-power .357s is the Ruger SP101. I still have several boxes of Remington 125-gr. SJHPs (R357M1), unused. The blast/concussion blows the target around fifteen feet away, and other shooters turn to look at me with "*** is that?" looks on their faces. With milder .357s like the Winchester "white box" 110-gr. JHPs or "medium velocity" 125s, and all .38 Special loads, it is OK. However, the existence of subcompact 9mm autoloaders that are about the same size yet can hold up to over twice as many shots makes it pretty hard for me to justify keeping this gun. I felt the same way about a S&W 640-1 I used to have. Due to its smaller grip (Uncle Mike's Boot Grip) it painfully pounded my thumb joint with .357s. At least the Ruger's weight and larger grip spreads it out more.

[DomMega]

Haha, a .357 in a little J frame revolver is going to hurt. It really doesn't matter how big you are or how much mass you have to attempt to control the gun with, its the mass of the gun itself that makes firing that round semi-painful. You're basically actuating an explosion in your hands. Due to the weight of the gun itself to absorb that explosion (which is minimal at best) shooting it is going to be a daunting task. Heck, to be able to get those bullets where you want them to go downrange is a challenge in itself.

I think the main function of a .357 snub is to scare the attacker away from the shear BANG! that gun will make when fired. It's great for close range (which is the primary function of a snub, as its certainly not longer range accuracy) firing in a dangerous situation with a would be bad guy but don't give them much more credit than that. I think they're great guns for the purpose they serve but thats really about it. Close range personal protection is its primary purpose and a purpose that it serves well.

[Nematocyst]

.38 spl is to snubbie
as .357 is to full grip.

IMO. YMMV.

Me? 642 + 65.

[Spiff_P239]

I had a Smith & Wesson M&P 340 that I foolishly sold (and am in the process of replacing) and I found it to be a great gun. .38 +P was very manageable and did not punish me or my hands at all. Even after putting a couple mild .357 Magnums through it, I was still ready to shoot some more. I've found that recoil is very subjective and varies from person to person. If a snubnose revolver doesn't work for you, maybe it's time to move on to something else.

[Black Adder LXX]

Yeah, I think I'm liking the Smith 642 anyways, so 38 spl is nice. If I get a snub 357, I'll definitely go with the SP101 for the extra mass. I love Rugers anyways.

Thanks for the input everyone...

[DawgFvr]

I have to chuckle when I hear the repeated comment, "recoil is very subjective and varies from person to person." Actually, recoil is not subjective...maybe "felt" recoil might be an point to argue...but the real point of concern is that the muzzle flip of a tiny (especially a scandie) J frame revolver, as the result of using the .357 mag bullet degrades the firer's ability to get back on target for subsequent shots. I think accuracy of that round in such a light weapon during the attempts of rapid fire would also be questionable. I rejcommend using the .38 special in J frames...use the .357 mag in larger combat/fighting revovlers.

[MCgunner]

The 9mm out of the 26 will hurt just as much, be equally effective.....and is much easier to deliver with precision.

Of course, you won't get the immense pyrotechnics of that power-wasting flash/boom, but you could learn to do without it.


I think you're about right, carry my 9 a lot because it's 14 ounces unloaded and carries 11 rounds of +P which is nice in a small package. It's quite accurate, too, and easy to shoot.

However, ballistically.

9mm carry load...6.5 grains Unique...115 grain Hornady XTP/HP...~1267 fps/410 ft lbs

.357 carry load...17 gr 2400...140 grain Speer JHP...1332 fps...551 ft lbs

Guess what, WE HAVE A WINNER! .357 Magnum. But, yeah I know, the 9 is plenty. Heck, today, I carried a .38 special +P load in my ultralite. It makes about 931 fps/270 ft lbs and felt well armed enough. I think ft lbs is less important than shot placement and I shoot all these guns well enough to make hits. I really do like the nine, but I ain't givin' up my revolvers. :D I've always liked the .357 magnum as a round for both self defense and outdoor uses. I've killed deer with it using 158 grain loads in a 6.5" barrel. I wouldn't take on a deer or hog with the 9, but my 180 grain load out of the 2.3" SP101 makes 1306 fps for 682 ft lbs! THAT one, I carry on my walk abouts just in case I spot a hog close enough, inside 30 or 40 yards. Usually, they bed down in the heavy thicket and sometimes you'll spot one or more in the thick stuff if you're observant and walking slow. I'd feel under-gunned with the 9 in this situation. But, for self defense, the 9 is a really good choice. It is a lot easier to shoot, grant you that.

[Grey54956]

Snubbies with full power ammunition aren't meant for pleasure shooting. They are meant for easy concealment and self-defense.