whats the better pocket gun, na .22 mag revolver or a kel-tec 380?


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cajun47
July 21, 2007, 09:47 PM
are the kel tec 380s reliable?

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Babalouie
July 21, 2007, 09:50 PM
I don't own a KelTec...yet...but if you are interested check out the Kel tec Owners Group at KTOG.org and learn everything you could ever want to know about KelTec firearms. Its a great group over there.

fflincher
July 21, 2007, 10:08 PM
I believe the KelTec is far superior to the NAA mini-revolvers.

I find the mini-revolvers difficult to shoot accurately, slow to fire, slower still to load, and fumble-prone throughout the shooting experience. I have carried them when nothing else was appropriate, like when I couldn't carry a gun.

I'd call it a toss-up between the KelTec .32 and the NAA .32. I've carried both, finally trading off the NAA.

I've carried the P32 for some time, like it best with the belt clip for athletic clothing. When I got my P3AT from KelTec, it pretty much took the place of my other pocket guns, haven't put a belt clip on it. Yet. I carry it in a pocket holster, spare magazine in another pocket.

I tried a Seecamp, gave up on it because there were no sights. With the NAA or KT .32s I can bounce beverage containers pretty easily from 10-15 yards. Couldn't do that with the Seecamp.

I like Kel-Tec products, and have a fair number of 'em. I don't know of any other firearms manufacturer that encourages users of its guns to work on
em, modify 'em, and then backs up the product with a 100% guarantee.

You ask if the P3AT is reliable. Mine is. Any you find may be made reliable, if it is not already. You're asking a question of the entire class and wanting an answer which will pertain to a single example from that class. There is no honest way to answer that question affirmatively, no matter which firearm of which you ask it.

Double Naught Spy
July 21, 2007, 10:31 PM
The Kel Tecs have poor sights, but they are a lot better than what you find on a NAA Mini revolver.

Reload on the Mini Revolver is a long process. On the Kel Tec, just slap in a new magazine.

Bigger hole with the .380.

I have a NAA Mini in .22 lr and have shot the Kel Tec. The Kel Tec I shot did very well. It was surprisingly pleasant to shoot.

LightningJoe
July 21, 2007, 10:55 PM
As a gun, the Kel-Tec is way out ahead of the NAA mini-revolver. It's as small as a gun could ever need to be, presuming you've got a pocket on you somewhere.


The mini-revolver is sort of a kludgey gimmick for shooting off bullets--hardly a gun at all. It's like holding a cartridge with pliers and hitting it with a nail.

kgriggs8@yahoo.com
July 22, 2007, 06:16 AM
"are the kel tec 380s reliable?"

NO! Put it simply, I don't think you could call the Kel-Tecs reliable in general. You may get a reliable one but they have a HUGE percentage of problems compared to say a S&W j-frame which I would consider reliable.

The problem with KTs goes deep. They have some basic design flaws due to their poor quality. They are made a little better than a Jennings or a Bryco but probably won't be as reliable. Parts have a habit of breaking for no good reason. Look up trigger axis and Kel-Tec to see what I mean. Without this part, the gun won't work. It just so happens this part tends to break.

PzGren
July 22, 2007, 06:29 AM
I agree with kgriggs, many Keltecs are problematic. I had embraced the P11 as a small 9x19 and had never gotten the gun to work reliably, even after a trip back to Keltec. A P32 that I had tried did not work with 100% reliability, either. A Sub2k I owned finally worked flawlessly.

From my experience, based on three Keltecs that I owned, and three more that good friends owned, Keltecs quality is hit or miss.

The NAA .22 revolvers are way too small for me to shoot and with that short of a barrel, you better not expect the .22 l.r., or .22 Magnum to be a man stopper.

fletcher
July 22, 2007, 06:31 AM
The Kel-tec. The two P3ATs I've seen in action perform completely reliably, and I would trust .380 over .22 magnum from a pocket gun. The mini revolvers are also SA, which IMO is a big disadvantage at the range it is supposed to be used.

ranger58
July 22, 2007, 09:01 AM
look at the s+w 642, good price very reliable. a friend that has a ffl told me a story of a guy taking his ccw class and had the trigger break right off his kal tec.


R58

tjhjunk
July 22, 2007, 09:46 AM
The chances of getting a reliable 2ond. generation P3AT NIB are very good. If you are the type who does not like to tinker with your guns than a P3AT might not be the one for you. But I can tell you this, if for some reason it is not reliable than Kel-Tec's customer service is second to none and the people in the KTOG will be more than happy to assist in anyway that they can.

Why would you buy a gun that has the reputation of having a few problems? It has been my experience that everything that is man made will at some point give you a few problems.

If you are looking for a carry all the time anytime pistol than you can't go wrong with the Kel-Tec. Price, light weight, small size combined with the added power of .380. Just my 2cents.

jad0110
July 22, 2007, 09:46 AM
The NAA mini revolvers are typically very reliable, though I would not personally carry one as my primary CCW. They would however make a great BUG to an already small primary pocket gun like a Kel-Tec or J Frame.

Double Naught Spy
July 22, 2007, 01:56 PM
Neither the Kel Tec or the NAA should be your primary carry gun, IMHO.

wally
July 22, 2007, 02:32 PM
Any gun that is very small for its caliber can be problematic, check out the complaints about high dollar Kimber Ultra Carry models for example. If you really need the small size, Kel-Tec stands behind their product and will make it run eventually. If you can carry something bigger, then do it!

--wally.

The Lone Haranguer
July 22, 2007, 02:40 PM
With such a tiny grip and having to cock the hammer manually for each shot, I don't see how any mini-revolver can be shot accurately.

Noxx
July 22, 2007, 05:00 PM
I went looking for Kel-tecs recently for a pocket gun, only to find out they are LEO only here in the PRK. Grumble.

JERRY
July 22, 2007, 07:28 PM
if you want true quality like that of the NAA mini, and better ease of use like the K.T. p32,...............get a Seecamp.

k.t. has not made quality a standard yet with any of their guns, and NAA mini wheelys just lack the ease of use when you loose fine motor skills in the real world....

tinygnat219
July 22, 2007, 07:38 PM
P3AT: It's a centerfire cartridge, more ammo choices are available, it's a bigger bullet which makes a bigger hole, and the P3AT is actually concealable and is DAO, instead of a tiny SA revolver that uses a .22 rimfire.

No contest. P3AT

Tully M. Pick
July 22, 2007, 07:43 PM
Every Kel-Tec I own has been reliable right out of the box, no tinkering required. I only own 3, though. I plan on buying more.

The P3AT is the better pocket gun for defense. It's not a piece for a gun snob, though. Kel-Tecs are generally ugly, ill-finished little pistols. You may be disappointed if you value form over function.

MCgunner
July 22, 2007, 07:45 PM
Kel Tecs are reliable and backed by one of the best no-nonsense warranties and customer support departments in the industry and a .380 is FAR better than .22. I own a KT P11 and a NAA mini. I don't consider the NAA serious as a carry for defense.

LightningJoe
July 22, 2007, 11:28 PM
The Seecamp/NAA Guardian type pistol went into the curio/collectible category with the advent of the Kel-Tec P-3. If you want a finely-made steel nugget, get the Seecamp or the Guardian, or better yet an old Baby Browning. But for a deep-cover pistol, you can't do better at the moment than the Kel-Tec P-3.


Many will suggest the P-3AT over the P-32. I think that might be a mistake. The .380 has more power, but I suspect that's going to matter a lot more to the shooter than to the shootee. For a little gun like the P-3, .32 Auto is probably more suitable. As for the Rohrbaugh, that's probably a bridge too far, also. It weighs twice as much, true, but standard pressure 9mm out of such a tiny gun may be asking too much.

obxned
July 23, 2007, 12:14 AM
I have owned and shot both quite a lot. Both functioned 100%. Both are plenty accurate enough. I've shot jack rabbits with the Mini-revolver, and could easily do the same with the P3AT.

The P3AT fires a much more powerful cartridge, and you have more of them, particularly with a spare mag available. Reloading the Mini is not something you will ever be able to do in an SD situation. So with the P3AT you have 13 rounds at about 200 foot pounds of energy each, while with the .22 you have 5 with about 50 or so foot pounds.

I regularly carry the P3AT is warm weather. I know its limitations, but feel quite comfortable with it for SD. I am also giving thought to buying a new NAA with .22LR and .22Mag cylinders. It does have its uses, particularly with heavy non-expanding .22 Mag rounds.

Fred Fuller
July 23, 2007, 12:18 AM
My wife and I each have 1st generation hardchrome P3ATs. Both have been flawless out of the box with no attention beyond normal cleaning, with a variety of ammunition.

I have a couple of NA minis, a .22LR and a .22Mag. IMO there's no comparison- the
KelTecs are much to be preferred.

lpl/nc

cajun47
July 23, 2007, 12:52 AM
thanks for all the input.

my brother in law and i went to the gun show today. he wanted a kel tec p-f9(slim 7 shot 9mm) but he thinks they are a little too big. so he bought the p-32(?), the 6 shot .380.

i bought a second used beretta 92fs for $300 and an old used browning a-5 auto 12 ga for $300 cash. i had a bit of money left so i picked up the pf-9 for $250.

i shot 100 rounds through my pf-9 with 0 malfunctions. it has a bit of a kick but i find it very accurate. so far so good.

my brother in law was cycling the .360 ammo through his p-32(?) on the way home and it would jam up every other round. o he was pissed! i told him to hold on and put 100 rounds through it, then judge it. later he shot 100 rounds through it with 0 malfunctions. quite accurately.

so far its 2 thumbs up for those 2 kel tecs.

yongxingfreesty
July 23, 2007, 07:15 PM
the p3at is a great carry gun IMO. a friend of mine has one that is 100% from the start. recoil is harsh, not a range gun but great for SD

M2 Carbine
July 23, 2007, 08:24 PM
If I'm going to carry a ultra small defense gun like a P3AT I want it to be reasonably accurate, fast to shoot and fast to reload.

are the kel tec 380s reliable?
My always carry gun is a 1st generation P3AT equipped with a ARMA laser.
If I didn't think it was reliable, I wouldn't be carrying it.


I don't believe I can do this with the NA .22 Mag.:)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/P3ATlaser2.jpg

Ala Dan
July 23, 2007, 09:17 PM
Another vote, for the KEL-TEC P3AT .380~! ;)

goings_51
July 23, 2007, 10:12 PM
My Kel Tec acts like it wants to jam when you load it, but it fires just fine. I have a freind thet weighs about 350 and has hands to match. He can put a full mag inside the nine ring every time at 7 yards, but I'm not that good.

As a note on the belt clip: Be careful if you carry in your back! I had been in the car for about an hour when I stepped out in a crowded grocery store parking lot. Since I was new to the beltclip, I roughtinely "checked" it. Before I had the chance, felt it fall into the back of my shorts. I just kind of froze and it worked its way down and fell on the ground just as a car drove by. I just kind of put my feet on either side of it and bent over like I was tieing my shoe. As soon as the car passed, I picked it up and put it in the glove box. I don't think anyone noticed, but I usually use a pocket holster now.

GunNut
July 23, 2007, 10:31 PM
.380acp is almost always better than .22mag in a self defense gun.

Great choice on the guns.

Steve

Mat, not doormat
July 24, 2007, 11:07 AM
P3AT. I've had direct experience of 4 KTs. One P32 (mine,) one P3AT, and two P11s, (all 3 owned by a friend, who was one of my best shooting buddies, GRHS.)

Anyhow, of those four, one of the P11s required a fluff and buff to get working well. The other three have all been winners.

Oh, I almost forgot. At one point he replaced the polymer guide rod with an a steel one from KT. The gun never worked right again, until he put the plastic one back in.

~~~Mat

Coyote3855
July 24, 2007, 01:23 PM
I carried a NAA .22 Mini as a backup before the KelTecs came out. We have lots of Keltecs in the family, two P-11s, a P40, two P32s and a P3AT. The P40 is retired, no fun to shoot. My wife carries one of the P32 24/7, and I carry the P3AT as a BUG all the time. The only reliability issue with any of these guns was the P40 and some questionable-spec reloads. I have not shot or carried the NAA since acquiring the Keltecs.

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