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Detachment Charlie
July 1, 2003, 10:53 AM
I don’t know if anyone has ever been evicted from this board, but this may do it. I am about to insult a lot of board members.
What is the matter with some of you people? Have you been abducted by aliens and had your common sense removed?
So far I think I have seen two posts asking the question, “Can I carry into the airport?” This is like asking, “Can I stick my finger in the fan, or can I kick the skunk?”
Sure you can.
It really wasn’t that the question was asked that got my skivvies in a wad (I understand that there will always be that certain “10% factor.” I also know that, yes, there are such things as stupid questions.)
What was disappointing was that nobody ever noted that although you may, in certain areas, you probably shouldn’t. Why ask for trouble? Big trouble.
Before you reach for that keyboard to give me the 2nd Amendment and “I’ve got my CCW” and “there ain’t no law against it,” bushwah, step on your clutch and put your brain in gear.
Now, where are my meds?

:fire:

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dude
July 1, 2003, 11:09 AM
What about the ones who want CCW on airliners!! ....................yet they will talk about all the other unsafe morons at the range or at their CCW class

Ol' Badger
July 1, 2003, 11:10 AM
can I kick the skunk?”

What did he ever do to you!

Except maybe being to Tactical looking for his own good.

:D

Darrin
July 1, 2003, 11:14 AM
d00d, I waz just wAnTinG to kNOw if I c00d cArrY mY M60 to 'da PaRk.

bAcK oFf!

:scrutiny:




;)

PCRCCW
July 1, 2003, 11:17 AM
I have to be very careful.......Im stubborn, opionated, intelligent (but know Im not always right...sometimes too late though) and not afraid to stand my ground......but I approach forums/boards with a bit of caution. Ive posted stuff/replied to stuff in the 'heat of the moment" only to go back and realize how much Ive just stuck my foot in my mouth......................

At times I feel like saying' What have you been smoking and why do you smoke that S**T and play with guns.........dont you know its not a good thing to do? :what:

Love it.......Shoot well

willyjixx
July 1, 2003, 11:20 AM
its illegal in Nevada so dont do it! an heres to put my money where my mouth is


NRS 202.3673 Permittee authorized to carry concealed firearm while on premises of public building; exceptions; penalty.

1. Except as otherwise provided in subsections 2 and 3, a permittee may carry a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of any public building.

2. A permittee shall not carry a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of a public building that is located on the property of a public airport.

3. A permittee shall not carry a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of:

(a) A public building that is located on the property of a public school or the property of the University and Community College System of Nevada, unless the permittee has obtained written permission to carry a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of the public building pursuant to paragraph (c) of subsection 3 of NRS 202.265.

(b) A public building that has a metal detector at each public entrance or a sign posted at each public entrance indicating that no firearms are allowed in the building, unless the permittee is not prohibited from carrying a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of the public building pursuant to subsection 4.

4. The provisions of paragraph (b) of subsection 3 do not prohibit:

(a) A permittee who is a judge from carrying a concealed firearm in the courthouse or courtroom in which he presides or from authorizing a permittee to carry a concealed firearm while in the courtroom of the judge and while traveling to and from the courtroom of the judge.

(b) A permittee who is a prosecuting attorney of an agency or political subdivision of the United States or of this state from carrying a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of a public building.

(c) A permittee who is employed in the public building from carrying a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of the public building.

(d) A permittee from carrying a concealed firearm while he is on the premises of the public building if the permittee has received written permission from the person in control of the public building to carry a concealed firearm while the permittee is on the premises of the public building.

5. A person who violates subsection 2 or 3 is guilty of a misdemeanor.

6. As used in this section, “public building” means any building or office space occupied by:

(a) Any component of the University and Community College System of Nevada and used for any purpose related to the system; or

(b) The Federal Government, the State of Nevada or any county, city, school district or other political subdivision of the State of Nevada and used for any public purpose.

If only part of the building is occupied by an entity described in this subsection, the term means only that portion of the building which is so occupied.

(Added to NRS by 1995, 2725; A 1997, 63; 1999, 2767)

updated 2001

Chuck Perry
July 1, 2003, 11:22 AM
So, uh, can you? :)

Oleg Volk
July 1, 2003, 11:29 AM
Some people are uncomfortable with open spaces. Others, with doing something to which they are unaccustomed. Lack of comfort with such things shouldn't be extended to trying to prevent others from doing as they please.

Carrying to airports should be as legal as carrying to schools, churches and other public places. That we might disagree on the desired legality or feasibility that is no cause to insult anyone, on either side of the debate.

Betty
July 1, 2003, 11:33 AM
Stop and breathe for a minute. Inhale. exhale. Inhale. exhale. Inhale. exhale.

There are people here with different ranges of experiences with firearms. We have newbies to experts who have been there and done that. If you want to say "hey, you're stupid" to someone who has an honest question and run them off the boards with that attitude, than you have succeeded in making Sarah Brady jump up and down with glee. If you think the question is stupid, then don't answer it. Go find another thread. We don't need gun owners treating other gun owners like idiots.

Glamdring
July 1, 2003, 11:45 AM
Detachment Charlie:
What was disappointing was that nobody ever noted that although you may, in certain areas, you probably shouldn’t. Why ask for trouble? Big trouble.


If you CAN legally? Why not?

I have to agree with Oleg that people should be allowed to carry when flying and IMO everywhere else.

Henry Bowman
July 1, 2003, 11:49 AM
I had a smart @$$ comment to add, but Runt made me think twice about it.

Sometimes thinking twice is enough; sometimes even more thought is required.

willyjixx
July 1, 2003, 11:51 AM
Oleg:.............?

around here its illegal to have a firearm next to a school. the buffer is either a 100 or 50 ft cant remember.

so you can carry armed around schools in your state?
i know our laws (Nevada) specify any state or govt building is forbidden to have a CCW carried in.

our statutes our up the page some. or if you want a link ill send one

themic
July 1, 2003, 11:53 AM
story: knew a guy that was in the army way way back when... flying home to the midwest, he had a 4 hour layover in texas, during which he walked out of the airport, to a local gunshop, saw a beautiful revolver at a great price, bought it, and walked back into the airport and onto the plane.

oh, and Detachment Charlie, sometimes its good to know what the law is in differnet areas, because we're smart inquisitive people, even if it may or may not mean we will actually go running up to an el al counter waving a glock.

i know i can open carry in virginia, and i like to know that i can't open carry in one county, falls church, even though i will never open carry myself. just not for me. but do NOT insult my quest for knowledge and wisdom, even if it doesn't agree with your limited world.

Oleg Volk
July 1, 2003, 12:01 PM
Laws differ. In some states, carry in schools is legal. In some countries, sound suppressors are almost mandatory. So basing your view on what's right and wrong on existing laws is tricky.

But that's curent law. How it ought to be is different...and the differences of opinion over that turn into ethics discussions.

JohnBT
July 1, 2003, 12:03 PM
"Now, where are my meds?"

No meds for you if you didn't bring enough to share with everyone.

This rule is far more important than some old gun rule. ;)

John

Steve Smith
July 1, 2003, 12:05 PM
Everytime I go to the airport to drop someone off or pick them up, I'm carrying.

I never asked anyone here if I could. Don't plan to, either.

scottgun
July 1, 2003, 12:22 PM
Sometimes ya have to ask very basic questions, how else do you learn. People here are patient and give helpful responses, not insults or ad hominen attacks (usually) Maybe that's why people ask questions that others might find to be mundane or stupid. My theory is ask away, I'd rather spend time explaining, being safe and sure that everyone is well informed.

That's an anti argument to say "theres just some places you shouldn't carry". Why not? "Big trouble", "No one needs a gun at ..., its not safe, think of the children" I've heard all that before and it doesn't float.

And if I don't fly and have no need to get information on carrying at the airport, I'd probably just skip that thread. :)

ZekeLuvs1911
July 1, 2003, 12:29 PM
Hey Detachment Charlie,
What is the problem? Can't people ask questions anymore? Whatever happened to the Freedom of Speech? Remember, there are never ever dumb questions!!! In someplaces, it is legal to carry into the airport as long as you don't cross into the secure area. So dude, chill out and think before you post.

willyjixx
July 1, 2003, 12:43 PM
hmmm maybe i misinterpretted the post? i saw charlie goin off about carrying in an airport. i know my state laws. i have too, its part of being a responsible gun owner/carrier. my post was not my opinion on carrying in a airport but a fact of the written laws i must follow.

my state laws say i can not carry in a public airport, or a school, or a federal or state govt building. some of these i understand some are a pain. but after working the airport security detail as a Natl Guard soldier for the time that i did. i couldnt really justify having people carry inside an airport.
thats my opinions. we worked hand in hand with the local law enforcement an we saw a lot............ it was shocking to see the social irresponibility of a lot of people! (i know i know you cant rule all buy the actions of a few)

one of the biggest was pathetic excuses we heard. a woman comes throught the screening an has a handgun in her bag. red alert red alert. after all is said an done she states " i was so busy getting ready i FORGOT that i had my gun" no CCW either.

i know i can. Can anyone else tell me where everysingle firearm they own is an if its loaded? the fact that this happened a few times opened my eyes an made me realize that this is a place where a firearm is not necessary or needed due to the high traffic an potential for problems of this sort. in the car at the ready no problem but i dont believe there is a need to have one while seeing someone off.

on a long winded side note i can see the justification for a CW at a baggage carousel pick up as most are far away from the gates an ticket booths an there is more crimes commited there

Kimber45
July 1, 2003, 12:47 PM
You can in Virginia as long as you dont try to enter the secure area. I always carry when I go to pick up/drop off friends/family.

pax
July 1, 2003, 01:17 PM
First, around here we don't insult other members. Keep it in mind.

Second, about carrying at the airport: If there's no law against it, why not go ahead and do it? Because someone might hassle you? -- If that's the reasoning, all the standard "concealed is concealed' remarks apply. Plus one more, on the political side: rights that are not used always fade away over time.

To illustrate what I mean, consider whether or not you would open carry in a state where open carry is perfectly legal. Chances are you wouldn't do it. Why? Because nobody else does it, so you are setting yourself up for some big hassles if you do. Chances are the local cops even think it is illegal and would need to be told otherwise, while you are in cuffs and they are calling their bosses. Bad juju, that. So even though it is legal and you have the legal right, you no longer have the practical right. It's gone. And it's gone because so few people use that right any more.

That's a bad thing to allow to happen, if you value your freedom. If you have the right to do something, you should use it from time to time so that it will not go away.

Not only so, but keep in mind that it is still legal to fly with guns. Friends of mine do it all the time, to get to various competitions and workshops around the country. It is perfectly legal to walk into the airport with a gun, which should be unloaded and will be put in a locked, hard-sided case for the flight. In states where doing so is legal, and with a carry permit, the gun may be unloaded and placed in the case while the people behind the counter observe. (I don't recommend doing it that way, but if it were my only gun, that's the way I'd do it rather than being defenseless on the way through the parking garage). There's no way to fly with a gun that doesn't involve the gun coming into the airport at some point. ;)

Which brings us to the practical issue of "Why in the world do you think you need a gun in the airport???? There's security all over the place ..."

My little sister was robbed at gun point in a airport parking garage, as she was getting out of her car to pick up a friend. She was not raped only because some kids came along and the guy lost his nerve. Parking garages are dangerous places for women alone.

Not only so, but if I were a car thief looking for an environment rich in good stuff, the airport seems a pretty good place to look -- lots of travellers with cash, cameras, and other goodies in the trunks of their cars. I'd want my gun on the ride to the airport (since I wouldn't want to be broken down on the side of the freeway without it) -- and I've always considered that the one place I know my gun won't get stolen from, is on my right hip. Certainly leaving it in the car seems risky to me.

I doubt any of this has convinced you that carrying a CCW into the airport is a good idea. That's fine; you don't have to live my life and I don't have to live yours.

pax

There are only two emotions in a plane: boredom and terror. -- Orson Welles

Tamara
July 1, 2003, 01:27 PM
i know i can. Can anyone else tell me where everysingle firearm they own is an if its loaded?

Must be nice; I can't even tell you off the top of my head how many I own... ;)

spacemanspiff
July 1, 2003, 01:29 PM
but feel free to insult yourself, as i do! okelee-doakalee, i'm an idiot!

spacemanspiff
July 1, 2003, 01:30 PM
I can't even tell you off the top of my head how many I own
you know we dont believe that, right? we KNOW that you are such a gun-geek you have mapped forwards and backwards paths to each and every one of your boomsticks and their appropiate reloads.
:neener:

Skunkabilly
July 1, 2003, 01:41 PM
or can I kick the skunk?”

You can try :p
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=349966

Well, some things that people are raised to think are illegal (carrying at airport, carrying at school, needing a license to rent a gun) aren't.

Best case is to ask befure assuming, maybe someone has BTDT and/or knows the specific law prohibiting or permitting said act.

Carlos Cabeza
July 1, 2003, 01:52 PM
The most recent event I can think of that would warrant carrying inside an airport is the LAX incident at the Israeli Air ticket counter. I don't recall if any innocents were killed, maybe a ticket counter attendant, but the security detail finally killed the perp after he waved a handgun around in a threatening manner.

willyjixx
July 1, 2003, 02:07 PM
Tamara:Must be nice; I can't even tell you off the top of my head how many I own...


LOL you are blessed young lady! i wish i had that problem!

Pax:

was the insult part directed towards me? feel bad for your kin! an your right in a parking area or baggage area perfectly fine! up on the course an ticket counter..NO GO. i too have travelled withmy pistol an the first thing i do is call ahead for instructions. the only problem i ever had was with seattle.


Skunk!:

Nice.........is that Uber tactical though with the contrasting web gear an chinos:D

pax
July 1, 2003, 02:15 PM
Willyjixx,

Heavens no. :o

I was answering the first post in the thread.

pax

As a child, a library card takes you to exotic, faraway places. When you're grown up, a credit card does it. -- Sam Ewing

GhostShooter
July 1, 2003, 02:25 PM
What was disappointing was that nobody ever noted that although you may, in certain areas, you probably shouldn’t. Why ask for trouble? Big trouble.

If it's concealed how is it asking for trouble?:scrutiny:

http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/2M16.gif

RTFM
July 1, 2003, 02:44 PM
runt_of_the_litter
There are people here with different ranges of experiences with firearms. We have newbies to experts who have been there and done that. If you want to say "hey, you're stupid" to someone who has an honest question and run them off the boards with that attitude, than you have succeeded in making Sarah Brady jump up and down with glee. If you think the question is stupid, then don't answer it. Go find another thread. We don't need gun owners treating other gun owners like idiots.

Well put!, and that is the exact reason I joined this board in the first place, and also why I return.

We don't beat up on each other (unless in good fun) and 98.999% of the replys to any question are flame retardant.

I am always presented with new "angles" or differing viewpoints here, which help shed light in the dark spaces to some of my own questions. And no one has ever said "my way is the right way, you don't know what your talking about"
My .02Cents.

cool45auto
July 1, 2003, 06:48 PM
Let them ask whatever they want. It's better they get the info here with the good sources on this board than out there from people that may not have any idea what they're talking about. If you think the post is unnecessary then go to another one, it's up to the moderators to decide what stays and what doesn't. I've asked plenty of stupid questions and I know I will continue to do so in the future.

Whatever, I love you guys!;)

Drjones
July 1, 2003, 08:14 PM
1. I am impressed (but of course not surprised) at the complete civility everyone has displayed in response to this rant.

2. Charlie: You get all tied up in a knot because someone asks a question that you consider stupid? Were you ever young? Did you ever try to learn about anything before? Ever heard the phrase "the only stupid question is the one you don't ask"?

In the future, it would be quite helpful if you;

a) Take a deep breath before you post. Think twice, post once or you will very likely end up saying something you regret.

b) Identify precisely what you believe is the "stupid question" in question and be a bit more civil about it.

Welcome to THR. :)

Let's keep it that way.

Standing Wolf
July 1, 2003, 09:45 PM
“Can I stick my finger in the fan, or can I kick the skunk?”

Sure. Why not? Just make sure you use your finger and/or your skunk.

Alan Smithiee
July 1, 2003, 10:12 PM
I know an air traffic controler who carries to work every single day, when I inquired, (just out of curiosity mind you) I was informed that you may carry into any area considered not a secure area at an airport, at least in Idaho.

I also had a possible near encounter with a suspicious person in a parkade at an airport once. he was heading for us with a aggressive body language, I just happened to be wearing my NRA cap, I VERY obviously faced him and adjusted the cap. at that point he 180'd and headed away at speed.

so yes, I carry to airports and just be very carefull about where I go.

brookstexas
July 1, 2003, 10:19 PM
"What about the ones who want CCW on airliners!! ....................yet they will talk about all the other unsafe morons at the range or at their CCW class"

Specifically-
"All the other unsafe morons"?

So I'm a moron?
You think planes explode when they get bullet holes in them like in the movies?
Better to not have armed and trained folks on board because one may be a cowboy? Tell that to any of the passengers on 9-11 and their families.
Some people know what the Second Amendment is about, understand the gun culture and some are just people who own guns and probably don't even vote...
BT

:rolleyes:

BlkHawk73
July 1, 2003, 10:21 PM
No flame but how about a "nice post" instead Detachment Charlie. I browse a few different boards and read alot of the threads. I very seldom post unless, I can actually offer information that pertains to the original question/topic. However, this thread got my attention.

To borrow anothers lines but not in a malicious/spiteful manner...

11. I am impressed (but of course not surprised) at the complete civility everyone has displayed in response to this rant.

Although impressed, I'm also surprised at the semi-civility displayed.

2. Charlie: You get all tied up in a knot because someone asks a question that you consider stupid? Were you ever young? Did you ever try to learn about anything before? Ever heard the phrase "the only stupid question is the one you don't ask"?

Well put! But I still don't understand why some people ask some of the things they do. Myself, I wouldn't rely on anything other than a local/state published document informing me of the laws. laws for my area may not be rhe same as another, thus giving the broad generalities of laws could result in a problem for a fellow member. If you need to know the laws in your area, go to the local police or courts. Personally, if you've got the maturity to carry, you should have the common sence to know where to obtain the legal info pertaining to your city/town/state rather than asking people from totally differnt areas about your local laws. As far as the it's legal so do it people...do you do everything that's legal to do?

In the future, it would be quite helpful if you;

a) Take a deep breath before you post. Think twice, post once or you will very likely end up saying something you regret.
b) Identify precisely what you believe is the "stupid question" in question and be a bit more civil about it.

I'll often rewrite a post a time or two before committing it to the forum. And while I agree with the second point here (b), If everyone is so so quick to quote the the 2nd amendment, perhaps they should remember the 1st as well.

Once again, I used these quotes as a base, and not in any way as anything negative or disrespectful at all towards drjones.

Glamdring
July 2, 2003, 05:02 AM
Tamara:
I can't even tell you off the top of my head how many I own

Alltimers? :rolleyes:

Glamdring
July 2, 2003, 05:39 AM
Eight or so years ago here in MN a guy got on a MTC bus with a com bloc rifle (AK/SKS) slung over his shoulder.

Rode all the way to the airport. Walked into airport and eventually fired off several rounds.

Now this guy was a little messed up mentally IMHO. But what about ALL the people that saw him and never called LEO? The Twin Cities here in MN is an anti gun place in general, at the time St. Paul was working real hard on getting rid of all the gun stores in their city.

I still remember this incident because I had sold my car, and other things, to go back to college. I had to ride the MTC busses to get anywhere myself.

Lived in a dorm (in St. Paul) and worked security for campus and a nearby church (The church had better alarms than the college. Both had their own security people).

But I couldn't carry legally on campus. And didn't have good enough political connections to get a permit to carry at the church (well I could have carried at the church but no secure storage at the campus so my 357 lived with my parents while I was at school).

MN just recently became a Shall Issue state. But lots of people are really making a ruckus about people carrying. Saying things like shouldn't be able to at church, gov't buildings, bla, bla.

My family isn't anti by any definition. But they don't see the point of carrying concealed on a regular basis. Was just talking to my Mom on the phone couple days ago about carrying debate in the media. Mentioned churches and my mom asked why do you need to carry in a church?

I didn't mention that some churches are really not a safe place (because of location). I just said for the same reason I carry other places. I don't know when I might need it.

Not to mention I know of at least one Church in St. Paul that feels the need for an expensive security system with motion sensors, CCTV, and remote locked doors (ie I would buzz people in while watching them with the cameras), and their own security force. How much do you think that cost per year? They still have problems with people breaking in once in awhile. Security was there to protect people, only there during events. Didn't guard empty buildings.

I could talk about dorm rooms getting broken into at that campus, or the armed robberies and rape that occurred.

BTW if anyone has college kids FYI dorms are probably more dangerous than a decent apparment. I can promise you that dorms are NOT secure, every campus that I have been able to get honest answers from security or locksmith admit that they have LOTS of masterkeys that are "lost".

They don't rekey often because of the expense. And at least here in MN someone living in a Dorm doesn't have same legal rights as any other tennant.

***
I apologize if this was a rant. But a lot of people don't seem to understand actual threats in the real world.

Or the number of actual "bad things" that happen every day or every month at a lot of the places they think are "safe".

Drjones
July 2, 2003, 12:35 PM
If everyone is so so quick to quote the the 2nd amendment, perhaps they should remember the 1st as well. No offense to you sir, but :rolleyes: :rolleyes: .

The first amendment protects freedom of speech. It does NOT protect one from reactions to anything stupid, insulting, inflammatory, or otherwise distasteful thing one might say. The dixie chicks are a bright, shining example of this.

Detachment Charlie has every right to say whatever he wants, and we here on THR are free to say whatever we want in return.

This is, of course, provided that what we say are within the rules that have been set by those who run this place. Before anyone starts crying "1st Amendment" about the rules here, let me explain something to you in case you do not know; THR is not a public forum. It is a privately run internet web site.

Think of it as Oleg & Co's house. If they do not appreciate what you are saying or how you are saying it, they are well within their rights to ask you to leave.

Sarge
July 2, 2003, 12:48 PM
in, and by, a generation which didn'y "suffer fools gladly", I have to occasionally remind myself that the current one has been largely deprived of the daily exposure to firearms (and proper gunhandlig) that was a part of my upbringing. They are only fools if they are not asking questions, and the best way I have found to deal with the problem is to answer carefully and thoughtfully- or on those occasions when the question itself is a source of irritation- not at all.

GSB
July 2, 2003, 02:17 PM
'Scuse me, but the question about carry in an airport in Florida is a valid question. It's valid because CCW classes teach that it is allowed in non-secure areas, yet the wording was vague about what constituted sterile and terminal areas.

Just because someone doesn't think someone should carry somewhere is completely immaterial to whether a particular state law says you can or not.

Sheesh.

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