What ever happened to the .32 auto?


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TonyB
July 31, 2007, 01:08 PM
It seems like in the "olden days" .32 was all over the place for self defense guns.My grandfather had 2....so how come it's not popular now?Are people just more robust now, and need shootin' w/ a .45 in order to stop doing bad things?Were people back then just whimps?Or is the .32 still a viable round that is under-mis-estimated?

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zinj
July 31, 2007, 01:22 PM
Gun technology has improved, so larger calibers can be built smaller. Essentially you can get a .380 in a gun the size of a .32. There also is the fact that .32 ACP is semi-rimmed, and thus vulnerable to rimlock.

the naked prophet
July 31, 2007, 01:47 PM
Medical technology has also improved. While once getting winged with a .32 might cause an infection that would kill you, nowadays you can get a dose of antibiotics and be fine. Of course, that's not to say that it's not lethal, just that it's not as lethal as it was before antibiotics were available. And since the bad guys don't have the fear of a deadly infection, they may not be stopped by a .32 since incapacitation may be primarily through psychological factors if nothing vital is hit. So we use larger calibers nowadays because we know what it takes to stop someone.

I wouldn't hesitate to carry a .32 H&R magnum revolver though!

GRIZ22
July 31, 2007, 01:54 PM
In addition to what zinj said, in the 70s the PPK/S became a popular off duty gun for LEOs. Many department policies said nothing smaller than a 38/9mm.

While once getting winged with a .32 might cause an infection that would kill you, nowadays you can get a dose of antibiotics and be fine.

While you might have some rational, I don't think bad guys think about infections. They think about getting shot.

sm
July 31, 2007, 01:55 PM
.32ACP is still around and still a great choice.

Gun stuff is cyclic, like anything else.
Best example is wearing pearls. Ladies never stopped wearing pearls, but when Barbara Bush was seen wearing them, the wearing of pearls increased.

TV, Movies, Video Games, Gun Magazines, and Internet all influence buyers on what they buy. Called Marketing.

One can have a case of Coca-Cola at home and the Sensory Input of Pespi (who paid to have their product in the movie) will have folks go buy a six pack of Pepsi on the way home from the movies.

.32ACP increased in popularity again with the Beretta Tomcat with the tip-up barrel.
Then it waned, only to be revived by the Keltec P-32.
NAA 32 is again reviving interest.

1. Have a gun.
2. Shot placement.

The Reality is, not everyone toted a hogleg in a caliber starting with a "4".
Too expensive , heavy, hard to conceal...
Lots of 32 and 36 calibers carried instead if one checks history.

Physically Limited folks find the tip up feature of a Beretta .380 and .32 great!
Fact is, the 32 conceals easier.

Slide does not lock back on the P3AT, which again does not bother most folks, even at a range where they use Chamber Indicators to show "clear" for range rules...
..but...

Watch a UC LEO, demonstrate being able to run a P-32, and Tomcat one handed.
Replicate being shot, and racking the slide back on a P-32, inserting mag, letting fly the slide and back in the fight.

Replicate getting a Tomcat loaded, dry gun, remove one ctg, insert mag, insert ctg into tip up barrel and back in the fight

Replicate dry gun, getting one ctg into tip up barrel and getting one shot off in a hurry.

There are folks with special needs and have special situations.
Physically Limited folks, some with birth defects, amputees, injury, recovering from surgery, arthritis...

Hence the person is wise to NOT rule out options, including certain platforms and calibers, including a 32.

All the folks Marketing, all the folks posting on Internet, will NOT be at YOUR gunfight.

;)

usp9
July 31, 2007, 01:58 PM
What happened is that the .32s are still very popular as seen in the unquenchable demand for Seecamp, Keltec, NAA. Other guns such as the CZ 83, PPK, P232 are also hard to find. Alive and well my friend.

Technosavant
July 31, 2007, 02:01 PM
1) Like zinj said, you can get a more powerful chambering in a gun nearly as small. .32ACP nowadays is pretty much just tiny automatics- anything larger will be eating .380.
2) Although it isn't considered a "manstopper" round, it was plenty lethal. With modern medical technology, it is more effective against people who just don't want to be shot than it is against people who need to be stopped posthaste. Hence the migration to more powerful rounds.
3) While the debate of lethality of smaller rounds will continue until the sun goes nova, until then, if you can carry and handle a more powerful round, why settle for anything less? You balance power vs. controllability vs. "carry ability," and for most folks, the .32ACP falls too far short on the first to overcome the second two, especially with what else is available.

ozwyn
July 31, 2007, 02:42 PM
I woudl also suspect a lot of the .32 demand may have been impacted by the end of the cold war and influx of cheap 9mm markarov pistols that perform well for the same kind of demands one might have for a .32

JERRY
July 31, 2007, 03:03 PM
i have for trade a S&W 649(.38) for a Seecamp .32

sm
July 31, 2007, 03:05 PM
Physically Limited Persons are getting effective hits , and effective hits quicker with 32 caliber gun, semi, or revolver.
This is real important to them, and means a lot to me, and those of us that assist these folks.

Big Factor in OUR situations.

Gets back to payload to weight of gun ratio much like Rule of 96 for shotguns.

benEzra
July 31, 2007, 03:12 PM
The Gun Control Act of 1968 pretty much put an end to the importation of .32 ACP pistols, AFAIK. That probably has a lot to do with it.

Shipwreck
July 31, 2007, 03:31 PM
.32ACP increased in popularity again with the Beretta Tomcat with the tip-up barrel.
Then it waned, only to be revived by the Keltec P-32.
NAA 32 is again reviving interest.

Not to nitpick, but I think the first generatiopn Keltec 32s were out prior to the Beretta Tomcat. I might be wrong, but I think this is true.

Anyway - I have a Keltec 32. I like it - but ammo prices are high!

Carl N. Brown
July 31, 2007, 04:50 PM
I have heard that Martin Fackler has accumulated data
on actual shootings that shows that the .32 Winchester
Silvertip hollowpoint is surprisingly effective.

CWL
July 31, 2007, 04:57 PM
Not to nitpick, but I think the first generatiopn Keltec 32s were out prior to the Beretta Tomcat. I might be wrong, but I think this is true.

Sorry dude, Beretta Tomcats came out in 1979. Kel-Tec didn't even exist as a company until 20 years later.

Quiet
July 31, 2007, 06:28 PM
Sorry dude, Beretta Tomcats came out in 1979. Kel-Tec didn't even exist as a company until 20 years later.
But, the .32ACP Beretta Model 3032 Tomcat didn't come out until after the Kel-Tec P-32 was released.

Deanimator
July 31, 2007, 06:36 PM
What's the point when you can have a 9x19mm almost as small?

Richard Simmons
July 31, 2007, 10:12 PM
Almost only counts in horsehoes and hand grenades :D

"What's the point when you can have a 9x19mm almost as small?" Guess you could say the same about some .40S&W or .45ACP so why a 9x19?

If you don't own or have at least a modicum of experience with a .32 there's no way anyone can explain it to you.

Geronimo45
August 1, 2007, 02:27 AM
Some idiot/sage/whatnot decided that .380 was the minimum caliber to stop evildoers.
"Cops use .38s. Therefore, .38 caliber is the absolute minimum." Was the thought behind it, as best I can figure.

The .45 fans/groupies/whatnots heckled those as would choose, say, a PPK in .32 when they could get the same gun in .380.

I find that I can shoot the .32 as long as I can afford ammunition for it. I can't shoot more than a box or two of .45 ACP before my hand gets sore. Sure, I could build up hand strength - but the fact is, at this time, it's more comfortable to shoot .32.

Were people back then just whimps?
That's what I wonder. Back then, you had Al Capone, Dillinger, Baby-Face, Bonnie and Clyde, and their ilk.

Wonder the same thing about bears. People constantly saying that only an elephant gun or the latest and greatest super ultra-belted magnum with hydra-shok plutonium-plated-gold dots will stop 'em... when Davy Crockett and a lot of other folks used lead balls and black powder.

ArchAngelCD
August 1, 2007, 02:59 AM
Anyway - I have a Keltec 32. I like it - but ammo prices are high!
Shipwreck,
You can buy a 50 round box of Fiocchi 73 gr FMJ ammo for practice for ~ $10 and their 60 gr SJHP ammo will run you ~ $12 a box of 50. That ammo is very hot and rated @ 1200 FPS w/205 ft/lbs of energy. That is at or above the numbers for the .380 Auto. http://www.fiocchiusa.com/cat_centerfire.html

Cosmoline
August 1, 2007, 03:26 AM
I used to have a Walther PP that was about the most accurate and rapid of all my short guns. With silvertips you could fire them off with amazing speed. More than fast enough to land the whole magazine in a foe. Put 9x19 in that same package, or a smaller one, and you'll be lucky to get half as many shots off, and to land any of them.

glassman
August 1, 2007, 09:16 AM
Here we go again! :banghead: I am so tired of hearing that phrase. I have a tomcat and like it a lot. It pockets well and is very accurate. I have no problem putting a 3" group together at 7yds and don't feel under armed with it. I don't know which gun guru decided that .380 is the minimum SD round but don't want someone who knows how to use the .32 pointing it at me.
No doubt, that there are other more powerful small pistols out there(I admit to carrying a 642 at times) and it's a matter of personal choice as to what to carry. The tomcat works well for me. (puts on nomex and kevlar)

Ala Dan
August 1, 2007, 10:46 AM
Better advanced technology has led to bigger (larger) caliber's for self 'D;
nearly phasing out the .32 ACP. Kel-Tec and Seecamp still offer NIB 32
ACP's; but the .380 ACP's have over taken the "small pocket gun caliber
war"~! The Seecamp LWS-32 is a fine little pistol; and one that I own. ;)

Deanimator
August 1, 2007, 11:32 AM
If you don't own or have at least a modicum of experience with a .32 there's no way anyone can explain it to you.
What's to "explain"?

It's a weak round used [mostly] in small pocket pistols which aren't all that much smaller than small pocket pistols chambered for 9x19mm, .40S&W and .45acp.

I've never shot anyone, but I've come close a time or two. I've never said to myself, "Boy, I wish I had a .32 instead of this .45."

fletcher
August 1, 2007, 11:35 AM
The only true pocket pistol in the calibers listed (9mm, .40, .45) I know of is the Rohrbaugh. Anything common and inexpensive is .380 and smaller.

Joe Demko
August 1, 2007, 11:50 AM
How's this sound, gentlefolk? Those who wish to carry a .32 (myself included) for various reasons will go ahead and do so. Those who do not may carry the caliber and platform of their choice. Nobody need publicly scorn or mock the other person's choice, though you are perfectly free to think what like.

the naked prophet
August 1, 2007, 12:05 PM
Just like sm said, there's lots of people who can't shoot or won't practice with the larger caliber in the same size gun.

My wife has a Colt Officer's 1911 in .45 ACP, which when laid on top of my Glock 19, is exactly the same size (but a tad thinner). She likes it, but I can't shoot it more than a mag or two before my hand starts to hurt. But I've put over 1000 rounds through my Glock 19 in a single day, with no problems.

I can shoot a Glock 26 all day, but the 27 (same size baby Glock, but in .40) hurts my hand after 50 rounds. I wouldn't look forward to practicing with that gun. And they make the Kahr .40 even smaller than that - I wouldn't even want to fire that at all. In such a small gun, I could probably handle the 9mm, but I'm a young man and there's plenty of people out there who aren't young men, and who would definitely not be able to handle the Kahr 9mm subcompact. For them, a .380 or .32 in the same size gun would be more pleasant. If they can shoot it, and practice with it, it's better than a 9mm "almost the same size" that they won't practice with and would be afraid to fire.

I think that's what sm was saying, and I agree with him. As long as the laws of physics apply, the .32 will never go out of style. Maybe a more modern version, rimless or something, but something like it will always be around.

sm
August 1, 2007, 12:59 PM
I was born in the mid 50's.

32 caliber guns were very popular for a variety of uses.

Trail or Kit guns were Advertised in Field & Stream and other Outdoor magazines. Various Gun writers wrote articles about these Revolvers made by S&W, and other Gun Mfgs.

Now at the time, the big deal was was having a Revolver and ammunition that weighed total a certain weight ( I forget this suggested weight) to have out on the "trail" or outdoors.

32 cal had more punch than a .22 rimfire, and .22 magnum. These were used for filling the game pot with Rabbits for instance. Some Swamp rabbits get pretty big. Grouse, squirrels, and other game for the pot, also any snakes could be easily handled.

This was to compliment the Long Gun. Shotgun or Rifle, while out hunting, camping, or whatever reason to be outdoors.

I forget the exact Make Names and Model numbers, still S&W, Colt, and even Iver-Johnson, H&R had these [break top] and some other folks.

--

Again I forget the model number, still S&W made a J frame .32 cal revolver.
This was r-e-a-l nice!
This was the Nice gun folks that (a) could afford (b) Police used.

Around where I grew up S&W were the Police Guns. City carried Model 10s, State/Sheriffs Model 19s.

Back up guns were most often J frame .38spls -still- lots and lots of Cops had the .32 as a backup, or back-up/backup gun.
LOTs of Police Wives and Teengagers had these .22 revolvers in J frame too.

Bill Jordan was quoted a lot, and his take was a .22 magnum in a J frame was a really good choice for a back-up gun.
Well, .22 mag sorta pricy, so folks that used and knew how well the 32 revolvers worked, taking game, filling game pots, and the like preferred the centerfire ignition of a 32 for being reliable, and they reloaded these, thus less expensive affording more quality practice.

One boss as a kid, bought 5 of these J frame 32 guns for all the employees to carry.
Everybody carried when I was growing up, no "permits" just folks did.
These employees carried concealed while at work, to and from work, running to the bank and anything to do with or not with the job.

Bankers, Lawyers, Judges, Nurses, Doctors, Mom&Pop grocery, bait shop, fillin' stations....had these J frame 32s

Less monies got one a H&R, or Iver Johnson. Now saw what you will, these were nice guns!

Some actually preferred the break top of H&R/Iver Johnson over the S&W/Colt cylinder release, and the empties ejected easier and faster.

--

I grew up with Veterans , Men and Women who had been in Conflicts.
Army, Navy, Marines, Air Force, SeeBees, Doctors and Nurses and other Men and Women - with legs missing, arms gone from the shoulder on down.
Blind in one eye, burns, and all sorts of things from the Hell of Conflicts.

Big stropping fellas that in Conflicts had used all sorts of Guns, from being a gunner on a Airplane, to the grunt with a rifle, to Trench Guns to 1911s, .38spl M&P ...you name it.

One hand missing on weak side, a finger and most of a thumb on strong hand and this Vet could work, and shoot his "hardware store" Iver-Johnson/ H&R 32 cal revolver. Always on his person.

Now we had BGs, and they knew when Vets got their checks.
It may be the Vet, his/her spouse walking to the bus stop, taking a bus to go to the bank, in town, then returning home with money from a cashed check.

WE kids would do this errand and others for these Vets, and other Folks. Might be the widow women, or the young wife of a Service Man, pregnant and having a hard time. Maybe this young wife had a sick kid and ...

Oh yes, I am not the only kid that dropped a .32 revolver in a pocket to run these errands.

Cops, and Judges were known to tell folks to "get a gun and carry it".
It was not uncommon for Cops, a Judge, Clergy, to take up a collection, and get a gun for someone in need. Often times a .32 revolver.

One lady was a nurse. Her house burned and her husband died, and all the guns were burned up. The one car was in a carport, and it too caught fire.

Hospital took up a collection, got her a .32 cal gun. She worked 3-11 and this meant at night, she had a long walk home. Buses did not run after a certain time. Many times a cop would run these nurses "near home", or another co-worker that had a car, or the husband would run other employees home.
One car to a household, so folks did not have the luxury of a car.

The years may have gone by, times may have changed on some things, still Evil is Evil.
Kids, teenagers, men and women , some healthy and whole, and some physically limited still exist today.

It is too easy to get caught up with the flow of what everyone says and suggests.
Then one gets down, or has someone close go through something like surgery, injury, disease or amputation.
Reality sets in, and it does not matter so much what everyone says, the gun magazines print, or Internet posts.

NAA was coming out with a 32 cal revolver. Last I heard, it was on hold.
Best I recall, it was going to be a break top design.

History is a great teacher, if one pays attention to it.
I feel NAA was listening to history on this gun design and caliber choice for Conceal Carry .

Joe Demko
August 1, 2007, 01:32 PM
NAA was coming out with a 32 cal revolver. Last I heard, it was on hold.
Best I recall, it was going to be a break top design.

It's DOA. It was a bizarre design that resulted from, I think, trying to put the .32 magnum in a tiny top-break design. If they had just gone with the .32acp they could have used one of the classic S&W or Iver-Johnson designs updated with modern materials. They would have sold a metric ***load of them, IMO. I personally would have bought at least three.

philbo
August 1, 2007, 02:05 PM
Love the 32 in all it's variations. The 32 S&W Long and the 32mag may be two of the most overlooked revolver cartridges for small game in my opinion. Reload frequently for the 32acp for use in both my Keltec and Walther PP.

Gator
August 1, 2007, 02:13 PM
The .32 is a good little round. General George S. Patton carried a Remington 51 in .32 ACP as his backup gun during WWII; and no one called him a wimp. And even though .380 pistols have gotten very small these days, .32s are still a bit smaller.

Ala Dan
August 1, 2007, 05:10 PM
Att: sm my friend-

Those S&W model numbers were 30 and 31 respectively~! The target sighted
6" (and hard too find) S&W model 16 was also chambered in .32 S&W Long. I
have my deceased fathers 2" round butt S&W model 30-1; and still look'in for
that elusive model 16~! :uhoh:;)

Sistema1927
August 1, 2007, 06:00 PM
The Kel-Tec P32 is a nice compact package. I have a neck holster for mine, and there are times when it is the weapon of choice.

sm
August 1, 2007, 06:22 PM
Joe,
Sorry to hear NAA gave up.
It would have been a great seller! Phooey! That is what happens when one gets "goopy" and all.

Ala Dan,

Thank you for the Model Numbers sir.
Yes - great guns indeed.

Maybe High Standard now in Tx will consider a simple 32 revolver?
If memory serves me correctly, when they were up North, they made 32 revolver guns.

Richard Simmons
August 1, 2007, 06:27 PM
"What's to "explain"?

Sorry but this

"What's the point when you can have a 9x19mm almost as small?"

sure looked like a question to me? As far as "coming close a time or two" again, we know what almost counts for. As Joe states above if you have a different opinon regarding calibers that's great, more power to you but don't belittle someone else's choice. By your logic, if you can get a .44 mag, "almost as small" you should be carrying it, right? Anything else is just silly. I mean how many folks with a .44 mag ever said I wish I had 45? In the same vein do you carry two guns? I do and you know I've never said I sure wich I had just one.

sm
August 1, 2007, 06:54 PM
We have an increasing percentage of Society being Older Folks.
This will continue.

So while your 70 year old mom/ grandma can shoot a big bore with no problem, someone else's is frustrated, and feeling not able to do for themselves, getting the new jar of jelly opened.
-

Folks speak "worst case scenarios" OK, I'll play, but I will cheat and use History.
What if, the gubmint said regular JQPublic could not have Guns and Calibers that the Police and Military have?

There goes MY preferences of 1911, BHP, K frames, 870, ..etc, and...hopefully NOT the .22 rim-fire such as a Ruger MKII, as the Military uses these.

Narrows down the Firearms and Ammo choices right fast does it not?

Ireland already restricts barrels to no shorter than 24"...
Be a heck of note if Gubmint said no 12 bores and no barrels shorter than 24" in the States now wouldn't it?
I mean Police and Military do use 12 bores and short barrels...where does that leave JQ Public?

See, in "worst case matters" history shares how folks needed small guns, easy to conceal, and be able to "travel" with.
Some pretty "harsh" things going on at these historical times.
Folks used what they had, learned how to use, kept mouths shut, trusted very few folks and survived.

25ACP, 32ACP well...check history.
32 calibers in revolvers too.

Times change...
When I was a kid, one just sent in the Ad from say Field & Stream and ordered a gun , and the Postman brought it to your door COD.

I also recall a time Milk was short, so babies and kids got 'real milk' and bigger kids and up drank Powdered Milk.


One would be advised to visit with Grandma and Grandpa about some "Life Stuff" - being as they have BTDT.

ugaarguy
August 2, 2007, 04:41 AM
What's to "explain"?

It's a weak round used [mostly] in small pocket pistols which aren't all that much smaller than small pocket pistols chambered for 9x19mm, .40S&W and .45acp.
Let me follow your logic here. S&W should quit making the .38 special +P rated 642 (their top selling gun by the way). Why? Because it's a weak round. You can get a 340PD which is the same size - slightly longer cylinder, but actually lighter than a 642 - chambered in .357 Magnum, which is a quantitatively more powerful round by a long shot. Ohh it only cost nearly twice as much. But what's money? It's only the smallest & lighest .357 Magnum revolver in the world.

Deanimator
August 2, 2007, 10:18 AM
S&W should quit making the .38 special +P rated 642 (their top selling gun by the way). Why? Because it's a weak round.
If you think a 158gr. LSWC-HP .38 Special +P is a "weak round", well I don't know what to tell you...

Onmilo
August 2, 2007, 10:22 AM
I love .32 auto pistols.
I collect and shoot .32 auto pistols.
What happened to .32 auto pistols is they never went away as a deep cover back-up gun.

As a primary carry gun what happened to the .32 auto pistol is the Glock 26 and pistols of the like.

Armed citizens who insist on carrying a .32 auto as a primary carry gun in todays world are in the same realm of reality as law enforcement officers who insist on carrying a single action army revolver as their primary belt gun.

scubie02
August 2, 2007, 11:03 AM
small pistols definitely have their place. I can remember when an old guy neighbor of mine moved UP to a Colt 38 revolver for a bit more power--he'd carried various 32's for years. I still have a 32 H&R mag j frame, and have owned 32 acp's before (got rid of the last one because of the gun, not the round). Something is often better than nothing, and there are times when clothing or circumstance just means to can't wear a belt holster with something bigger. I like pocket guns for their ability, well, to drop one in a pocket on the way out the door ;). That having been said, it IS also true that nowadays you can get more powerful cartridges in guns of larger caliber. A kahr PM9 is still pretty small, and not all that unpleasant to shoot. Actually, I don't know that I find it any more unpleasant to shoot than the keltec p32 I used to own--the slightly larger grip and heavier weight probably making the difference.


Each argument has it's merits. Get the one you like and shoot well.

halvey
August 2, 2007, 11:04 AM
They are killed off by better, lighter guns chambering a .380 or 9mm.

ugaarguy
August 2, 2007, 11:06 PM
If you think a 158gr. LSWC-HP .38 Special +P is a "weak round", well I don't know what to tell you...
It is quite weak relative to .357 magnum power levels. Again, as others have explained, some folks (for a myriad of reasons) can't handle 9x19, 9x18, or 9x17 recoil in the same guns they can handle .32 ACP recoil in. Larger/higher pressure calibers are all good and well as long as you can handle them. Writing off smaller or lower pressure calibers because something larger or higher pressure exists in the same package is what you advocate. I took your logic and applied it to J frame revolvers.

Heck, by your logic I shouldn't be using .45 ACP. How silly of me - I should be running .45 Super, .460 Rowland, 10mm Auto, .38 Casull, or 9x25 Dillon in my 1911s. The .45 ACP really is a weak round compared to those you know.

chemist308
August 2, 2007, 11:53 PM
Medical technology has also improved. While once getting winged with a .32 might cause an infection that would kill you, nowadays you can get a dose of antibiotics and be fine. Of course, that's not to say that it's not lethal, just that it's not as lethal as it was before antibiotics were available. And since the bad guys don't have the fear of a deadly infection, they may not be stopped by a .32 since incapacitation may be primarily through psychological factors if nothing vital is hit. So we use larger calibers nowadays because we know what it takes to stop someone.

***?! Are you telling me that a center of mass shot from a 32 won't crack through the sternum and punch the heart or collapse a lung?! You mean it won't cause death from bleeding to death through your liver?! What about getting 'winged'? The bullet won't break an arm, smash a shoulder, shatter a kneecap or break a shin-bone?!

usp9
August 3, 2007, 07:49 AM
Halvey said;
They are killed off by better, lighter guns chambering a .380 or 9mm.


Tell that to Seecamp, NAA, Keltec, Beretta, CZ, Walther, etc. There's a waiting list for some of these you know.

Tomac
August 3, 2007, 09:49 AM
I've carried the 3032 Tomcat for deep CCW ever since they came out (currently carrying the Inox, best of the breed IMHO). Never experienced a malfunction of any kind, it's surprisingly accurate and I prefer the SA/DA trigger & manual safety to the DAO trigger on other small pistols. As soon as someone makes something more powerful that will slip into my back pocket like the Tomcat then I'll buy it (the Tomcat is the largest small pistol I've found that will fit).
Tomac
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/Tomac/ResizeofTomcat002.jpg

Richard
August 3, 2007, 10:16 AM
What ever happened to the .32 auto? We read too many gun magazines telling us that we needed bigger and better. The .32 auto performs better than it should in shootings and only a little worse than the .380, I do not feel unarmed with my Kel-Tec 32. Lastly, reloading the .32 auto is a breeze and it makes a great camp/plinking pistol. Regards, Richard:D

As far as I know there 10 or less Taurus PT57 32acp pistols in the USA, this is mine:
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid90/p4291f640b4cb6acc44b39bd7ed46a56d/fa742b55.jpg

Checkman
August 3, 2007, 11:12 AM
I'm actually very fond of the older 32 caliber pocket pistols. I especially like the Mauser HSc, the FN Model 1910, CZ 27 and the Colt Models 1903 and 1908. I wish I could find a Sig 38H, but I'm not real hopeful that will happen.

On a side note I'm very impressed with the 7.63mm Mauser. The famed 30 Mauser shot by the legendary C96 Mauser Broomhandle.That is sort of a 32 caliber round, more or less.;) Now that was a real zinger of a round. An 86 grain round with a muzzle velocity in excess of 1,300 feet per second, WOW! :what:

The 32 acp is still alive and well. All the major ammo makers produce self defense rounds ( i.e. hollow points) in 32 acp.

TonyB
August 3, 2007, 11:16 AM
OK,OK...I'll get a kel-tec 32 already.....I've seen a used one for $149 locally....I'm in..I guess it will be my "other pocket"gun......;)

villaconn
August 3, 2007, 03:11 PM
Greetings:

New guy here. I used to do a lot of shooting back in the early/mid eighties. I got rid of everything excep a Beretta 32 auto. I can't figure out what model it is but its the one that "looks like" a PPK and not the T-cat. Does anyone know what model that is? Many thanks in advance.

Cheers,
Ricky

Richard Simmons
August 3, 2007, 06:19 PM
Welcome to the forum

Is your pistol perhaps a 70 Series?

http://www.berettaweb.com/mod_70/mod_70_P1.htm

villaconn
August 3, 2007, 07:20 PM
Richard:

Dug it out and looked at it because the 70 didn't look quite right. The gun has been put away for quite some years. Its a 90. Thanks for the link, though. I'll keep lurking the forum for a little bit now.

Cheers,
Ricky

Mortech
August 3, 2007, 07:45 PM
Wheres the 32 ACP ? still around , along with the demands for new NAA , Seecamps , etc ; just try and get a decent Colt M1903 for less than one of those . I waited 5 years to find one and shooting its a blast , it'll never replace my favorite caliber (10MM ) but you won't find me lookin down my nose at someone who carries it .

P.S. I'm with those people wishing someone would bring back the COlt Hammerless Pocket pistols again

Hypnogator
August 4, 2007, 01:33 AM
Where's the .32 ACP?

Well, there's one in my back pocket right now! :D

It's there whenever I have my pants on, sometimes accompanied by it's big brother .45 ACP on my hip for "serious social occasions.";)

Rexster
August 4, 2007, 10:06 AM
Here in the USA, we like to hot-rod things, and get the most out of a given design. IMHO, that is why the .380 has become more popular than the .32, as most guns available in .32 are available in larger calibers on the same frame size. It also seems to me, at least, that the rimfire mini-revolvers had largely taken over the role of the tiny hideout gun for quite a while. So, the .32 was caught in the middle, not small enough for the micro-gun crowd, and too small for the hot-rod crowd. But, the "thinking men" never gave up on the .32, therefore the Seecamp LWS-32, followed by the other small .32 autos that capitalized on the rarity of the Seecamp. I recently purchased an SP101 in .32 H&R, and have an S&W M631 in .32 H&R on layaway. I am not sure I will ever want to carry less than a .357 or larger bore for primary defensive armament, but a do like the .32, and as I get older, it looks better all the time.

nero45acp
August 7, 2007, 10:35 AM
I carry a S&W 432PD .32H&R Magnum and don't feel undergunned. Before that I carried a walther PPK .32acp, and a Seecamp LWS .32acp.

I think I remember reading somewhere that JMB invented the .32acp and was quite fond of the cartridge. It was also enough bullet to start a world war.

Good enough for JMB, James Bond, and a world war initiator, good enough for nero32acp....;)



nero

billybob44
August 7, 2007, 06:20 PM
For me, it's like this:today it was 96F, my TomCat rides well in my back pocket, stoked with Federal HydraShocks. My Govt. Model sits in my gun vault, my Model 60, same place, my Super Redhawk (9.5bbl.) same place. I DO have the .32 in my pocket, without additional sweat HA!! A gun in your pocket beats the heck out of a big bore at home!!

KBintheSLC
November 9, 2007, 06:12 PM
I have noticed several folks in this thread who have brutally scorned the .32. They were obviously exclusive fans of the .45acp.

Well, my thoughts are that handgun effectiveness... in all calibers and configurations... are based on shot placement first and foremost. To put it plainly, there is just not enough velocity in handguns to create a large temporary wound cavity (rifles are a different story) regardless of bullet size.

It seems like many .45 fans refuse to accept the validity of anything smaller (I can't tell you how many times I have heard mockery of the 9X19... which happens to be the most common round at any local morgue). I still don't know what anatomical entities these folks are lacking to require such overcompensation.??

So, for whatever reason you choose to carry a .32, just remember that the round has killed a lot of people. I believe that the low recoil per size of gun makes it a viable alternative for a tiny gun. I doubt I would want to be anywhere near the firing of a .45 out of something the size of a P32. Granted, I would not count on a one-shot-drop with a .32... but who only shoots one shot in a gunfight anyway?

For me, my biggest problem with .32's is that it is hard to shoot accurately with such a tiny gun. Thats why I picked a G26. However, if it is size that matters (aka, conceal ability), then I see no problem with the .32 as far as caliber is concerned.

For all of you .45 lovers. I would have nothing less than a .45 out of a full sized 1911. But out of a pocket gun, I might be more scared to shoot one than to be shot at by one (exaggeration).

SilentArmy
November 9, 2007, 06:20 PM
I carry a .32 Beretta Tomcat as a Bug occasionally as something is better than nothing but you will not find me with ONLY the .32 Someone once said..... Bring Enough GUN!

PX15
November 9, 2007, 06:57 PM
FWIW:

I don't know what happened to ALL the 32cal pistols.. But I have a very good clue where 4 of them are..

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a73/Laserlips/100_5268.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a73/Laserlips/100_6909.jpg

The first photo shows my older KelTec P32, NAA Guardian (32cal.) and a 22cal S&W Escort. (Just hanging around for protection?)
The second photo shows my LWS32, and JoAnn's LWS32.

The Seecamps are our daily carry choices simply because they seem easier to conceal, are extremely reliable, and "as up close and personal" last ditch mouseguns we consider them the cream of the crop..

My wife and I are senior citizens (I've been cc legally since 1966) and live in what we consider an extremely low threat environment (rural SE Ga). We don't visit bad neighborhoods (our drugs come via usps from Merck-Medco), we generally are tucked in and asleep at those times of the night predators are out and about, and if we need eggs or milk we buy them before sundown at a grocery store and not at the local "stop 'n rob"..

I don't advocate a mousegun for everyone. In fact when my wife and I are out in unknown territory and circumstances allow I carry my Walther P99c/AS, and JoAnn still carries her LWS32. (Actually I still have my LWS32 also in a rear wallet holster.)
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a73/Laserlips/100_6832.jpg

LEO's and the like have different threat levels so what works for us old farts might not for them.. Even for folks in law enforcement however I would think the LWS32 (or better yet, LWS380) would make a fantastic b/u. That's not for me to decide.

But I DO feel adequately armed with just my LWS32 under most circumstances...

All personal opinion of course/YMMV. :D

J. Pomeroy

coelacanth
November 10, 2007, 12:47 AM
Gene stood about 6'3" and weighed in the neighborhood of 250 pounds. He was a former star athlete in pretty good shape still for a man on the back side of forty. One night he ran into trouble with someone carrying a five shot .32 S&W revolver. Gene took 5 shots to the torso at close range and died on the spot. Any questions?

gtd
November 10, 2007, 12:51 AM
I have two .32 revolvers, and two .380 autos. I do not want anything bigger.

Please, I'm not trying to kill anyone, even a bad guy. Just stop him or turn him away. And I certainly do not want to kill someone by infection! :confused:

.32 will do the job. I can shoot a coyote if necessary (I'd rather not), or run away from a wounded robber, screaming like a little girl! :uhoh:

I personally want just enough firepower to get the job done, with minimal intrusion into my daily life. That means I need a small, reliable weapon that I can shoot effectively and with some reasonable accuracy at close range, nothing more.

gtd

Jerry Morris
November 10, 2007, 02:49 AM
The .32 ACP will still do what it always has done. The graveyards are full of people killed by them. There are better choices and yet still reasons for its selection.

Many people cannot hit as well with my .45 ACP, but can be spot on with a .32 ACP. It is not what you shoot the gremlin with, but where you shoot him. Put it into the boiler room, or on the tip of his nose, he is going to go away as a threat, by and large. Most thugs will vacate the area at the appearance of any gun. At least that has been my experience. Maybe I am just a Lucky Irishman?

I used to have a Walther PP in .32 ACP. It was reliable and accurate. It killed rabbits well. I had found the European FMJ loads were better performers. They were hotter and more accurate. Wish I had kept that gun.

Still, I do prefer the 1911 type .45 ACP. I just plain shoot it better. But, if you have a .32 and can shoot that puppy, I am not going to put you down for it. I might ask if you have tried the .45 and can afford one. That is as far as I will go.

This castigation of people and their picks is just another form of snobbery.

Jerry

ldp4570
November 12, 2007, 08:52 AM
I own several .32's, auto and revolver, and have never felt under-gunned with any of them. All are extreamly accurate, and along with mild recoil and report are very easy to shoot. I also have 1911's and 9mm platforms to include .38/.357 and .44 revolvers. My little PPK .32 still gets the nod for carry.

lbmii
November 13, 2007, 05:45 PM
I don't like the semi rim design of the 32 auto. What is the purpose of the semi-rim? Can it be fired in a 32 S&W Long revolver?

Ratshooter
November 13, 2007, 11:32 PM
Yes you can shoot .32 ACP from a revolver. At least my S&W model 31 will do it. These were the first rounds i shot out of it because i had no .32 S&W long.

The rim to me is the biggest drawback to the 32 auto. I bought a 10 round mag for my Kel-Tec and had a lot of rimlock problems. I got the bright idea to chuck up the rounds in a hand drill and reduce the rim diameter from .355 to about .343. This solved my rim lock. My Kel-Tec and PP work fine with this mod. Actually they work very well and feed noticeably slicker.

I had a CZ model 70 ( i think) that didn't like the change. But that gun didn't eject well with anything and got sold.

The new .25 NAA round based on a .32 case necked down has the reduced rim diameter.

351 WINCHESTER
November 13, 2007, 11:58 PM
Well a .32 in the pocket is much better than a .45 in the safe. Yes the .32 is an anemic round, but it's better than nothing.

FSCJedi
November 18, 2007, 11:39 PM
You know, I'm really glad to hear the support for the .32 round (in all its forms) and the importance of shot placement. I've had several people make fun of my choice of 9mm for my primary carry pistol, but I can accurately and repeatedly place shots in tight groups with quick recovery between shots.

I also regularly carry my Beretta Tomcat. It's pretty much always with me, even when I can't carry my full size. I've never felt under-gunned with just having it. As has already been mentioned, the Tomcat is an accurate little piece if you do your job. The weapon's weight also allows for quick recovery, but isn't so much as to be annoying in the pocket.

ArchAngelCD
November 19, 2007, 01:23 AM
I too am tired of hearing the .32 Auto is a mouse gun and inadequate for SD. I guess the .32 Auto isn't the style of gun the younger "spray-n-pray" generation likes. Since it doesn't carry 17 rounds I guess it's no good. BS! European Police Departments carried the 7.65mm Browning for over 100 years and it did the job.

I will admit I prefer to carry a .38 Special J frame in my front pocket but when the J frame is inappropriate I do carry a Kel-Tec P-32 and I'm comfortable doing so since I know I can hit what I aim at with it.

KBintheSLC
November 19, 2007, 05:47 PM
It is still alive and well. I am about to buy 2 of them (One for me and one for the wife), and I hear I'm not the only one. They won't replace the 9mm, but they will make it less likely that we go out in public unarmed on warm days when sporting the speedo.

Slugless
November 19, 2007, 10:26 PM
it less likely that we go out in public unarmed on warm days when sporting the speedo

Will you be using ball ammunition? :D

Mad Magyar
November 21, 2007, 08:06 AM
For me, my biggest problem with .32's is that it is hard to shoot accurately with such a tiny gun.
I took out my older Mauser yesterday and the sights being what they are really lends itself to unsighted fire....At short distances, I'm more prone to point shooting and the .32 not being a punishing round: rapid adjustments can be made after the 1st shot....
In my case, the ergonomics of this HSc are so good that it will shoot P.O.A.:)

Agouti
November 21, 2007, 09:21 AM
I fired a .32acp from my k31 with an auxiliary cartridge. Wouldn't even penetrate the gatorate bottle. Hell, at first I didn't even hear it (thought it misfired), had to take off the hearing protection to even hear it (fired again with hearing protection off, I'd swear my paintball gun makes more noise).

Of course, I love my little Ortgies, amazing safety design.

Slugless
November 21, 2007, 10:22 AM
Where's my .32 auto?

It's in the safe.

It's a Colt 1903 Pocket Pistol and at one time I thought seriously about using it as, well, a pocket pistol.

But the ergonomics suck and I had some problems with the pistol, one of which was a scary misfire/bullet stuck in the barrel.

A friend convinced me to treat the piece as an antique and if I wanted a pocket pistol to get something modern.

It's a neat design though. If the ergonomics were better I would have stuck with it.


I've got my grandad's .32 H&R revolver. It's beat up from daily carry but that's also a neat little piece.

tubeshooter
November 21, 2007, 11:21 AM
Isn't the .32 still fairly popular in Europe?


I'm not sure what happened to the caliber in the US. It is not wildly popular, but it is definitely still around. I am thinking that ammo cost and availability relative to other calibers in the ballpark does not help.

fletcher
November 21, 2007, 11:26 AM
Last I heard, it was in my pocket.

My take is that the smaller calibers (.25, .32, .380, etc.) have fallen by the wayside with respect to mainstream advertising/production in recent years as the 'big three' (.45, .40, 9mm) and runners up have become more popular with lighter and smaller firearms in those calibers. Not to say that the smaller ones don't have their place, they certainly do, and many people still carry them.

I carried .22 magnum for a while, and just upgraded to a P32 for pocket carry. It fit my budget, carries when nothing else will, and I'm sure will do the job (assuming I do my part by practicing) if need be.

lindermant
November 21, 2007, 02:57 PM
I have one .32acp pistol

http://mysite.verizon.net/tlinderman/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/1903_1.jpg

she's off getting a bit of a makeover with David Sams. I'll post pics when I get her back (should be soon).

GaryP
November 21, 2007, 04:42 PM
I have a Colt 1903 PM 145xxx (1913 vintage) and an Interarms manufactured SS Walther PPK/s in .32acp and from time to time carry one of them in CCW role. I plan on adding a NAA Guardian in .32acp fairly soon! :)

KBintheSLC says
I have noticed several folks in this thread who have brutally scorned the .32. They were obviously exclusive fans of the .45acp.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! :rolleyes:


.32acp is alive and well in the Good Ole USA! :D


:evil:

jonnyc
November 21, 2007, 07:49 PM
Still around...currently sitting in my pocket.

Bullet Bob
November 21, 2007, 10:09 PM
I only know where this one is:cool:

http://fototime.com/6FC73117E518809/standard.jpg

mjb
November 22, 2007, 01:27 AM
General Patton carried a Remington model 51 .380 and a Colt 1908 .380, not a .32. However, .32acp were issued to some other generals during WWII.
To me, I do not feel confident that a .32 will have any knockdown power needed to stop someone from attacking me. I would rather carry my Colt .380 Mustang Pocketlite than a .32. In my opinion, bigger is better.

cardman
November 22, 2007, 04:11 AM
I've had several 32 autos and revolvers, the bullet just
isn't powerful enough for defence. The bullets are also
very expensive, I paid $ 16.00 the last time I bought
some I can buy a box of 9mm for $ 8.00 .

Mike (cardman)

PTK
November 22, 2007, 04:26 AM
I have a few .32acp pocket pistols.

As for why it's not as popular now, maybe people are too fat for it to be effective? :D

Stevie-Ray
November 24, 2007, 12:21 AM
A P32 in my back pocket now, and a 1903 Colt Pocket Auto in the safe. .32 ACP is very much alive in my life.

skarpenz
November 24, 2007, 12:28 AM
The only place on the planet that a .32 auto is insufficient for man-stopping is the United States. Or thats what it seems sometimes anyway where bigger is always better. I'm just sayin'. :D

BTW, I love .32 auto.

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