Marlin 336, 1911, and an 870. good all-around combo?


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Erik Jensen
July 31, 2007, 06:52 PM
I've been thinking. I've had plenty of guns in the past, and I'm sure I'll have more in the future, but is there anything I really couldn't take care of with a .30-30 with a detachable scope and maybe ghost rings, a 1911, and an 870 with a short barrel and a long barrel? realistically, as fun as EBRs are, those three would take care of just about anything, wouldn't they? even as far as SHTF? only drawback I can see is ammo capacity and perhaps extreme long-range ability, though you'd be lucky to get a shot over about 150 yds here in Michigan.


what say you guys and gals?

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tubeshooter
July 31, 2007, 06:56 PM
It lacks a true "long range" (say, > 200 yds.) component, but it looks fine to me. That is not a knock against you, I don't have anything long-range myself.

If you are happy, that's what matters.

RDavidP
July 31, 2007, 06:59 PM
A gun that is in your hand is worth more than the high capacity super long range rifle in the display case at the gun store.

TallPine
July 31, 2007, 07:05 PM
Seems like a revolver would fit in better with the 336 and 870.

And everybody needs at least one .22 rifle.

FXR
July 31, 2007, 08:08 PM
I'd say you're covered just great. Nice selection of traditional firearms that have stood the test of time. I don't see mag capacity as an overwhelming issue in most SHTF-type scenarios anyway -- the capacity of the ones you listed will be fine. Now all that's left is training and practice!

B36
July 31, 2007, 08:32 PM
I also would sub a revolver for the 1911, not because i have a dislike for the 1911. I just like tha ammo versatility of a revolver, and would choose a S&W 44 of some sort.

mustanger98
July 31, 2007, 08:33 PM
.30-30 with a detachable scope and maybe ghost rings, a 1911, and an 870 with a short barrel and a long barrel?

On the .30-30, lose the scope and stick with a Lyman or Williams aperture rear sight. The .30-30 round, according to Jim Carmicheal in Outdoor Life... some of those loads have a point blank to around 250yds. Hornady's new offering stretches that some.

The 1911... if that's what you like (me too) run with it. Somebody else mentioned a revolver as fitting it better, but one's as good as the other.

870 with interchangeable barrels... good idea; you can select your barrel depending on where you're going and what you'll be doing when you get there.

MikePGS
July 31, 2007, 08:44 PM
Sounds like a great example of each category:)

obxned
July 31, 2007, 09:15 PM
Add a .22 and you are set for most anything!

Dave Workman
July 31, 2007, 09:22 PM
It lacks a true "long range" (say, > 200 yds.) component, but it looks fine to me. That is not a knock against you, I don't have anything long-range myself.

Not necessarily so anymore. Hornady LeverEvolution cartridges put the .30-30 on the long range map.

Cosmoline
July 31, 2007, 09:24 PM
Excellent choices, though I've gone with a '92 levergun in .44 and a matching revolver. It's nice to have them eat the same food, so to speak.

tubeshooter
July 31, 2007, 09:31 PM
Not necessarily so anymore. Hornady LeverEvolution cartridges put the .30-30 on the long range map.


Well... it does get it "in the game" at least. :)

It's still no '06 or anything, but I know what you mean, and it's good to have the offering and the option! I am glad that Hornady decided to do it. My .30-30 has always been an old favorite.

Sistema1927
July 31, 2007, 09:52 PM
While the new Hornady rounds allow you to kill deer cleanly out to 200 rounds, just about any .30-30 load will suffice to keep a man's head down out to at least double that. I think that he has all his bases covered.

LoadedDrum
July 31, 2007, 11:45 PM
It is a lot more coin, but I would change the 336 for a AR with 5.56, 6.8, and 22lr uppers and get a 22lr upper to go with your 1911. Those three guns could take care of any thing you would likely encounter in Michigan barring an dangerous game escape from the zoo.

mustanger98
July 31, 2007, 11:50 PM
Post #14 would have to include a .22 upper.:uhoh:

sm
August 1, 2007, 12:05 AM
Yep.

Hard to beat what is proven, and has a history of being so.

Radagast
August 1, 2007, 12:12 AM
Needs a good sub calibre rifle in 22, 22 magnum or .17hmr; and a decent revolver, probably a 66 or 686.

martinc64
August 1, 2007, 12:20 AM
Excellent choices, every one of'em.

The Constitution of the United States of America, The Holy Bible and the code of the Boy Scouts of America direct and require that you must own each of the following:

.22 lr
12 gauge
30-30
30-06

Proof of ownership of a 1911 may be used to waive the requirement of either of the centerfire rifles (.22 and 12 gauge are non negotiable).

You only lack the .22 and if I may be so bold I would recommend the Marlin model 60 or ruger 10/22 because either of them fill the role and are remarkably affordable.

Old Dog
August 1, 2007, 12:29 AM
I could easily live with that combo, if I absolutely had to go down to 3 firearms.

My first four firearms were an old Win. 94 in .30-30, a '50s-vintage S&W Model 10, an old Colt's Gov't Model and an 870 ... BTW, I grew up in Michigan, and never took a shot at a whitetail over 75 yards ...

ArfinGreebly
August 1, 2007, 01:46 AM
I see no problem with your selection.

As others have pointed out, it's good to have a .22 in the mix.

The .30-30 with Hornady's 160 gr pointy stuff is good to go pretty much out to 300 yds. Almost justifies a scope. With my eyes the scope would be required past 100 yds.

You could quibble about the .357 vs .45 ACP, but you're fine. Myself, I have both a carbine and 586-7 in .357 mag, so that might be a thought.

Your selection is just fine, though. They're all classics. You're gonna find ammo everywhere.

You may, however, want to add the affordable plinker.

happy old sailor
August 1, 2007, 04:30 AM
there is much much more to surviving in the wilderness than guns and ammo.

i consider guns to be for self defense for you can harvest more food with a fishing rig and a few snares than you ever could with firearns, and, silently. very important.

put on your go to hell clothing, shoulder your pack, look at those guns and wonder how and where you are going to carry them plus the ammo. guns and ammo are heavy. a pound of snares and fishing line and hooks is a bunch and a much more effective way of feeding yourself. and far less expensive to procure. don't get me wrong here, i love my guns, but where survival is considered, facts is facts. pounds is pounds and food is at the top on your list.

if you are interested in this method, see Buckshot.com. he is in Michigan and a very knowledgeable person and a great guy to boot. his website is a pleasure to browse and has more info than a dummy like me can comprehend. he also offers how to videos that have no hype, just the facts with moving pictures.

and, yes, i have a 336 in 30/30, a 12 guage pump, Win, and a few good handguns in various calibers. plan to take a lightweight .357. i feel naked without a gun.

all for now.

.

Mannlicher
August 1, 2007, 09:44 AM
There is nothing wrong with any of those three, Erik. Other than the 1911, they are not really "combat" arms, but they will do in a pinch.

Red Tornado
August 1, 2007, 10:13 AM
I think it's a great all-around combo. Trade that scope on the 30-30 for a .22 rifle and I think you can handle any situation, including plinking. Most people underestimate the importance of plinking, just for general peace of mind if not the practice. ;)
RT

MinScout
August 1, 2007, 10:14 AM
Your combo looks pretty good to me. I'd add a .22lr, though. Maybe a Marlin 39 to match your 336. Just a thought.

unrealtrip
August 1, 2007, 02:37 PM
Proven weapons, a most excellent selection.

I also personally stick to tried and true items. An M1A, 1911, 870 and a Marlin 925 round out my collection so far. I also consider the ammo as far as being a proven round. .308, .45, 12 guage and .22LR

Why I have each:

The 925 .22LR -
Honestly, if I had to head for the hills and I could only take one gun. It'd be the .22. Because in my 2 front pockets I can carry 1000rnds with no problem, it is light weight and reliable. I can take small game to live off of and it is still powerful enough with enough range to provide defense against 2 legged animals.

The 1911 .45ACP -
Talk about a proven design, it is nearly unchanged for 100 years. The .45ACP cartridge has a solid track record and the gun is extremely reliable. Oh and it is all metal. For a concealable firearm, it is hard to beat the 1911. Powerful, proven and it will stop a man. You can even hunt with it. I have it for home defense as well as CCW and open carry in the backcountry.

The M1A .308 NATO -
Yet another proven firearm. Though the Discovery channel special ranked it at #10, I found it amusing that all of the benefits that made the AK47 #1 were the same that the M14 had. Their issue was that it had the "shortest deployment life" of any battle rifle at ~4years? Of course, this is not accurate, because it never left service and is still in use today in Iraq. It provides accurate long range shots, it fires under almost any conditions, it is semi-auto with a detachable mag and is a battle rifle that will hold its own if we are ever have an alien invasion.

The 870 12 gauge -
In my opinion the 12 gauge shotgun is probably one of the most versatile weapons ever developed. Pump action allowing it to have an extremely reliable cycling action. It can fire buckshot, birdshot, bean bags, incidiary devices, sabots and slugs. You can use it for close quarters engagements like a home or building and you can take 50yard shots with just as much ease. Taking a target out to 100 yards with a smooth bore barrel is no problem with a modern rifled slug. The 12 guage proved its worth in the trench warfare of WWII and is still in use today in Iraq. I chose the 870 because of build quality and a proven record. I have mine loaded with buckshot and slugs nearby.

You have selected a fine assortment of firearms. :)

Sulaco
August 1, 2007, 03:09 PM
It's funny you bring this up. I've been contemplating the same thing for some time now. I own a 336 in 30-30, an 870 12 gauge with a field barrel and a short barrel and a Ruger SP101 in .357 Magnum. I also own a Marlin 39A in 22LR so I feel I am covered for just about anything.

The next gun on my list is a CZ 550 American in 30-06.

After that, it's whatever fits, but I think these 5 are the perfect setup for me.

doubleg
August 1, 2007, 03:58 PM
At the moment I have,

Springfield (Savage) 840 30-30
New Haven (Mossberg) 610AT 12 Gauge
Kimber Custom II 1911 .45 ACP
Remington 597 .22LR

Which is a decent collection for someone my age. Sure I like to obsess about my next gun purchase but I realize this is all I will ever really need. Aside from a CCW (S&W 25 .45 ACP) revolver when I get around to it and a new .22 that can actually hit what I aim at. All a man really needs is a Shotgun, Rifle, Pistol and a 22.

Houston Tom
August 1, 2007, 05:42 PM
I think it is a good combo, I like the lever action adn the pump for a SHTF situation. They are hardy, proven weapons, because depending if something happens to the gun a gun smith may not be around

Nameless_Hobo
August 1, 2007, 06:33 PM
I'd change the .30-30 to a heavy barreled bolt action .308, with a sporter style stock. You can push this out to 1000 yards with practice, and it won't be to heavy to use for self defense like a dedicated target rifle.

You need to either get a conversion kit for the 1911 or add a .22Lr rifle to that list, merely because .22 is so damn common and cheap. You can stack enough to keep your great-great grandkids fed and protected in a EOTW situation.

RoadkingLarry
August 1, 2007, 07:35 PM
As an alternative mix keeping with the OP...Substitute a Marlin 1894 carbine for the 336 in a pistol caliber to match a good DA revolver and stick with the 870(or mossberg 500).

Houston Tom
August 1, 2007, 07:48 PM
If you have a spouse/girlfriend that you are taking with you or staying with you, you can get her a 357 revolver. That is how we have handled the sitution, I carry a XD45 and the wife's bug out/hd gun is a Ruger 357. SO with the 357 you can use 38's small game or rat/snake shot. IF no female to take then it is way cheaper to just buy a second pistol

mustanger98
August 1, 2007, 07:59 PM
...change the .30-30 to a heavy barreled bolt action .308, with a sporter style stock. You can push this out to 1000 yards with practice, and it won't be to heavy to use for self defense like a dedicated target rifle.

The heavy barrel .308 crankbolt, even with the sporter stock, is gonna be heavier than the .30-30 levergun. While 1000yds may sound good, realistically, you'll probably not shoot deer beyond 250-300yds, if that far, and no human attackers past 600yds depending on the situation. For most self defense situations, it'll be up close and personal and that's handgun/carbine/shotgun territory and not as a general rule "sniper rifle" territory.

mustanger98
August 1, 2007, 08:01 PM
As an alternative mix keeping with the OP...Substitute a Marlin 1894 carbine for the 336 in a pistol caliber to match a good DA revolver and stick with the 870(or mossberg 500).

My opinion is that a set containing a Marlin 1894 and any good quality revolver, both in .357, is a good thing. A good DA revolver or even a good SA revolver... IMO, you can't go wrong. It's all in what you like.

Erik Jensen
August 2, 2007, 04:18 PM
well, I suppose this is a positive enough response to goose me to augment my collection. all my rifles are currently WWII or older vintage. I have an Enfield MK4 No.1 to take care of extreme range for now, though I'd like to eventually get some sort of heavy barrel .308 with an absurd scope for fun.

of the weapons I mentioned in the first post, the only one I currently have is the 1911. I sold my 870 a while ago, intending to get either an 870 Police or a Mossberg 590A1. I really need to pick up that 870 or Mossy 500 soon. be picking up a .30-30 within two weeks.

I've considered the .357 or .44 lever with matching revo idea, and it sounds nead to me, but I don't think I'm convinced that even .44 Magnum out of a lever would have superior or even equal ballistics to .30-30, though it would certainly be fun. probably end up with that combo later.

I like the idea of a lever .22. the Marlin may be the way to go, but didn't Ruger used to make what was, in essence, a lever action 10/22? I see they currently make something like that, but in .22Mag. not quite the cheapo plinker I would be looking for. did they used to make the same thing in .22LR, or am I losing my mind?

Houston Tom
August 2, 2007, 04:40 PM
Another thing to remember is what is the situation and the target. Example if you are holding up in your prepared house during a riot or natural disaster then you have the lurury of more weapons, if you have to flee then you need to consider weapon versatility, defense/food. And where you live is also a consideration, if you live some where that the hunting is close range 200 yrds give or take then the lever 30-30 will get the job done if you are on a mountain side in Montana and the shots will be 500 yrds then you have a different need.

My rule is can not have too many guns( lots of ammo for all).

Erik Jensen
August 2, 2007, 04:52 PM
absolutely. for a bug-out situation in MI, either the .30-30 or a .22lr seems to be a good bet. with our extensive tree cover, shots will be short. I don't think much meat will be left on, say, a rabbit after getting smacked with a thuddy thuddy, but it would be better for larger quarry and self defence than a .22. there's always giving the SO a .22 pistol. that would be fine for small game, too.


.22, 12ga, .30-30, and 45ACP seems to be the cheapest and easiest ammo to find around here, aside from 9mm, but I trust .45ACP to do its job more. .308 is common as well, but I think I'd prefer the handyness of a lever.

High Planes Drifter
August 2, 2007, 04:57 PM
I've considered the .357 or .44 lever with matching revo idea, and it sounds nead to me, but I don't think I'm convinced that even .44 Magnum out of a lever would have superior or even equal ballistics to .30-30, though it would certainly be fun. probably end up with that combo later.

Buffalo Bore makes .357 ammo that'll come darned close (if not beat) to .30-30 numbers at the bore. Plenty enough grunt to down a whitetail.

Nameless_Hobo
August 2, 2007, 05:36 PM
Mustanger, The ability to is what makes it worth it to me. The .308 is just more practical than .30-30, in my opinion at least. Your opinion may differ, but that's your right.

What's the point of a .357 rifle/pistol combination if you're going to shoot different ammunition? You loose the versatility of carrying one type of ammunition. I suppose a Ruger could take the rifle loads, but I'd imagine the recoil in a pistol would make it slow to fire.

mustanger98
August 2, 2007, 05:58 PM
What's the point of a .357 rifle/pistol combination if you're going to shoot different ammunition? You loose the versatility of carrying one type of ammunition. I suppose a Ruger could take the rifle loads, but I'd imagine the recoil in a pistol would make it slow to fire.

While a 180gr HP/XTP loaded to run 1600+fps from a levergun would probably be preferable to shoot deer to 100yds, a 158gr HP/XTP running 1300fps from a 4-6" revolver will gain another 300fps from the levergun's 16-20" barrel. It'll be just as deadly.

Sure the Ruger will take the 180grainers... so will a N-frame S&W for that matter... I agree that follow up shots would probably be slower. You have to match your ammo to your overall purpose.

The ability to is what makes it worth it to me. The .308 is just more practical than .30-30, in my opinion at least. Your opinion may differ, but that's your right.

I never said anybody shouldn't have a 1000yd rifle; I have some... M1 Garand, '03A3, No.4Mk2 Enfield, K98k. Just nothing in .308. I'm just saying the .30-30 would be lighter to pack, and more practical up close and personal, if such becomes necessary. I like my long range rifles too. The great thing about opinions is that we don't have to consider what works for one to be gospel for everybody.

1911 guy
August 3, 2007, 08:47 AM
You've got your bases covered. I'd add a .22 for plinking and cheap practice. Works on small game, too.

ieszu
August 3, 2007, 09:11 AM
With regard to what to bring with you, I guess it depends on why.... SHTF with someone chasing you, or just survivalist mode.

For SHTF I have:
1) custom .30-06 bolt action, heavy barreled
2) CZ-97B (.45 acp)
3) 870
4) Beretta Neos - .22lr semi
5) If I can justify it - .338 Lapua Mag, custom built, kicks like a .223 (19.5 lbs fully loaded) and accurate to about 1400 yards (I am only good to about 900 though).

for survival similar:

1) CZ-97B
2) 870
3) 10/22

frank23185
August 3, 2007, 10:17 AM
There is not much you can't realistically do with a 30-30 levergun.
In actuallity, you probably won't engage any target further than 200 yards.
I do recall in the past that someone made a chamber adapter to shoot 32acp. Might be good for small game.

Houston Tom
August 3, 2007, 10:30 AM
I agree, My Grandfather who raised me and from whom I got the majority of my guns loved this 30-30 lever, it was his favorite rifle. Easy to carry accurate and rugged. According to him every home needed a shotgun (12ga) a 22 for varmits and such, a good rifle and a 357 revolver. Having these items was not optional.

ArfinGreebly
August 3, 2007, 11:47 AM
I do recall in the past that someone made a chamber adapter to shoot 32acp. Might be good for small game.
Actually, Remington produces a line of ".30-30" cartridges (their Express line) that's a 55 grain .223 projectile in a sabot.

I've been told it's effective past 100 yards and does a real number on coyotes.

I have some boxes of this, though I haven't shot it. The guy I talked to goes varmint hunting regularly.

Leanwolf
August 3, 2007, 05:31 PM
ARFIN GREBLY - "Actually, Remington produces a line of ".30-30" cartridges (their Express line) that's a 55 grain .223 projectile in a sabot.

I've been told it's effective past 100 yards and does a real number on coyotes."

I'm not saying they are not accurate in other rifles, but I've shot them off the bench at 100 yards with both my Marlin 336 and my pre-'64 Winchester 94, and the groupings were very poor.

I was using a Williams 5D receiver sight on my Winchester 94 and a Lyman 66 receiver sight on my Marlin 336.

They didn't work for me.

FWIW.

L.W.

ArfinGreebly
August 3, 2007, 05:36 PM
Hmmm.

Wish I could say I was surprised.

I'll pick up another couple of boxes -- just to test.

Figure I'll start at 50 yards and see if I can hit a milk jug with it.

If you've got a long sight radius and still get crummy groups, then it's probably not a reliable small game round at anything past 30 or 40 yards.

If it turns out that they just plain suck, at least I'll have some fun finding out.

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