"original" guns


August 7, 2007, 02:24 PM
I've seen "original" used to describe certain mil-surps, but there seems to be no clear standard as to what it means. As I understand it, it means as-issued, but I may be wrong on that one.

What say you?


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Novus Collectus
August 7, 2007, 02:33 PM
Need an example of the term used in more context to see what you mean.

August 7, 2007, 02:37 PM

Second Mauser. Bought one thinking it was matching, based on "original", nothing matches at all. Guess I should have expected that for the price.

August 7, 2007, 02:43 PM
Example: An "original" WWII M-1 Carbine probably wouldn't have the bayonet lug and the adjustable peep rear sight. Most all WWII carbines without those features were arsenal "upgraded" after the war. One of those wouldn't have been altered by a purchaser, but wouldn't be considered "original."

AJ Dual
August 7, 2007, 02:44 PM
In this context it probably means "not Re-Arsenaled".

August 7, 2007, 02:46 PM
Pretend I'm stupid, and don't know what it means to be "re-arsenaled"

Car Knocker
August 7, 2007, 02:51 PM
It probably is "as-issued". The third or fourth time it was issued. After at least two or three arsenal rebuilds. If the ad copy doesn't state that the numbers match, they don't. "As-issued" means, to me, that it hasn't been modified from the original design for that model; barrel length is the same, the stock hasn't been cut down, been refit with a scope mount, etc.

August 7, 2007, 05:55 PM
iv alwasy taken original to mean similart to "USGI" its how it was, when ever the government sold it off. using standardized government made parts. this could be anywhere from Unisued to 4th rearsenal.

August 7, 2007, 09:18 PM
"Original" is too vague a term to have any specific meaning when discussing surplus firearms. I think you can see that just from the few posts already here where people mention a couple different possible meanings.

If someone describes a surplus firearm as original you should find out more. They might mean one of the following:

The firearm is EXACTLY the same as when it was manufactured by the factory with no individual parts replaced or repaired. This means that firearms with serial numbered parts should have all parts with matching numbers. Note that under this defination a surplus firearm could still be "original", but in poor shape.

The firearm is in the same *configuration* as when it was produced, but some parts may have been replaced. For example, a WWII M-1 Carbine should have a 2-position peep sight and should NOT have a bayonet lug. Since most M-1 Carbines were rebuilt after the war and the sights were changed and a bayonet lug was added, a M-1 Carbine still in WWII configuration might be desribed as "original" even though other parts have been replaced.

The firearm is in the same condition as when it was in military service. That means that no parts have been removed or replaced since the gun left the military. However, parts may have been replaced while the gun was in service. Therefore a firearm with serial numbered parts may have mis-matched numbers on some parts and/or other parts might have been "upgraded" to a different configuration.

August 7, 2007, 10:42 PM
What Trebor said :)

Original means different things to different people. You have to get more information to know for sure.

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