[Gunmeister]

I'm having a rough time convincing myself that I should buy this new S&W Model 60 in .357Magnum.
I'm no nuby to guns, 30 years in the military and I've carried a piece everyday for the past 20 years. My normal carry has been one of Mr Gaston's perfect pieces.
Other from time "In Country", I have never had to use a gun for self defence. I have grown weary of the brick like feel of the Glock but have always felt good about having 12 rounds onboard. I'm left to wonder if five rounds in a "J" Frame .357Magnum is enough to feel comfortable with, God Forbid I'll ever have to use it.
I've always heard that handguns are not always comfortable but are comforting which fits Glocks and the like to a "T". I've also read about the rule of threes, that being: On average, a gunfight is fought at a distance of 3 feet with 3 shots fired and is over in 3 seconds. I don't know how true that is but it does give some credance to five rounds being enough.
I'd like to hear from folks who carry their five round J-Frames as their primary CCW piece.

[gtmtnbiker98]

Where my G27 doesn't fit, my 642 does. I feel well-armed with 5-rounds. Hard to justify self-defense if 5-rounds won't suffice. With proper shot placement and proficiency, you should feel just fine.

[timothy75]

Against one assaliant maybe.

[billhilly66]

My 36 fits in my pocket. My N-frames and 1911 don't. I end up carrying the 36 more especially in the summer.

I figure if I need more than 5 rounds, I'm going to be wishing I had a rifle.

[1BLINDREF]

I carry a S&W 642 every weekday to work. While I'd rather carry one of my Sigs, the 642 conceals much easier with my work clothes. I can't take a chance on being "made" at work as we are not allowed to defend ourselves at work :rolleyes:. I'd rather have 5 .38spl +P than nothing.

[sm]

Mental Game, Not Physical Stuff.

Accept the fact no handgun is enough, no caliber is enough, and one will never have enough ammo.

One has to be brutally honest about this acceptance - or they will forever be in Denial and therefore always be Dependent on Physical Stuff, such as handgun, caliber and round count.

Yes 5 is enough if one has the mental game, and practiced training to deal with not going where trouble is, evading if trouble shows up and what to do to get out of trouble.

No 10 rounds is not enough.
Topping off the mag to make 11 is not enough if the person is in denial, by putting Physical ahead of Mental .

You have the Mental, and have had the training, just get back to that Mental you were trained in, and continue to use correct basic fundamentals of the Mental with the correct basic fundamentals of using a 5 shot.


Just my take...

[JesseL]

Considering that a person armed with a two-shot derringer in 22 short would be better armed than the vast majority of the public, I certainly wouldn't sneer at 5 rounds of .357.

[DawgFvr]

Same ol' question pops up on here every couple of months...eh? Final answer is usually, "depends on the situation." I guess that is why they made moon clips and speed loaders. The next question is, "how many reloads is enough?" Final answer: It depends on the situation. I remember copying down this quote...I forget where I got it from, but is seems like a good observation:

You and the suspect together are not likely to fire more than 3 shots, whether the situation is an ambush, armed robbery, or family fight. In the majority of cases, the initial exchange of fire will determine the outcome. The speed in which you can react to danger, therefore, is likely to be a more critical commodity than the amount of ammunition you have at your disposal. You probably carry more ammunition than you will ever need, but time is almost always in short supply.

[wheelgunslinger]

More people than you would think carry a 5 shot 38 or 357 because of the weight, portability, and firepower. And they do it in lieu of other larger and higher capacity weapons they own.

[Euclidean]

5 > 0

In an ideal world there'd be no bias against arming one's self and no other factors to consider and we'd all carry service pistols at our whim. In the real world, you gotta make do sometimes.

[dasmi]

A 5 round snubby is better than an empty hand.

[ArmedBear]

In the unlikely event that you are faced with 25 armed assailants, you can always run. That's what you'd do if you DIDN'T have the 5-shot revolver.

One can dream up a lot of highly unlikely scenarios where you'd want a shotgun slung on one shoulder and a carbine in your hand, with a big belt of ammo for both. But in reality, a 5-shot revolver that's easy to carry is infinitely better than nothing, which is what dasmi and I can legally carry here, and will be useful in 99% of real situations where your life is threatened.

[ATW525]

I carry a five shot j frame (or it's Taurus equivalent) as a primary on a rare occassion. Usually it's only around the house and immediate vicinity, though. Most other times I go for overkill.

The way I see it, is five may do it or it may not. However, I'm pretty sure that 60+ will get me through anything short of open warfare with plenty of rounds to spare when the shooting stops.

[ronto]

I carry the DAO Ruger 357 SP101 daily...That's enough for me...If I didn't feel that way, I would consider an M60 mounted on my truck, 12 rounds of 9 MM would not be enough if a run in with a small army was reasonably anticipated.

[stormspotter]

you can always run....

I'm too old to run and bad knees wouldn't allow it anyway.:neener:

I'm sure that 99% of the time 5 would be enough, but I still feel better with my Glock 19 and a spare mag. I don't mind the little extra discomfort and really feel undressed without it.

[MCgunner]

I can run, but my wife can't. I have a motorized wheel chair for her, she's semi disabled. Well, the gov'ment says she's totally disabled. Can't work cause she can't stand up too long and can't do much at all physically. So, if I'm defending her, I've got no other choice, but stand my ground. I still think five is enough. I'd prefer five .357 magnums to .38s, but it's enough. I carry .38 a lot. I also carry reloads in the form of speedloader and speedstrip. I really don't think it's enough for law enforcement anymore, but for civilian defensive carry, sure.

[Golddog]

J's are easier to carry than most autos. But the knock against them for me isn't capacity; it's their relatively crappy DA triggers. You'll shoot your Glock a lot better than any J frame.

[jad0110]

But the knock against them for me isn't capacity; it's their relatively crappy DA triggers. You'll shoot your Glock a lot better than any J frame.

For some yes, for others no. I am one of those that prefers the smooth, firm pull of my 642 to mushy Glock and XD triggers. As a result, I shoot my J Frame 642 as well or better than Glocks and XDs. I am most certainly in the minority on that one.

I definitely agree that there isn't a lot out there that is easier to carry than a J Frame, especially pocket-carried hammerless or shrouded hammer varieties. For me, the biggest advantages a hammerless snub in my pocket offers is:

1) I can keep my hand on the grip while looking as if I just have my hand in my pocket to everyone else, and

2) the rounded backstrap allows for an extremely easy and super fast draw - I have never had a hang up in practice

Give it a try, and if you don't feel comfortable with carrying a 5-shooter you'll at least have a cool snubbie in your colletion - everyone needs at least one :evil: .

[ewayte]

Visit Down Range TV (http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid452320104/bclid595234649/bctid595226654) and see what Walt Rauch has to say about a snubby for CCW.

[Jim K]

Many years ago when I worked in a gun shop, I was repeatedly lectured by a customer about carrying an S&W J frame when he carried a Colt DS. His motto was that five was not enough and "what if there are six of them?" was his repeated taunt. Finally, ticked off enough to insult a customer, I replied, "What if there are seven of them?" He didn't come back for weeks, and when he did wouldn't talk to me.

IMHO, the ultra light J-frames in .357 are just too much. A poster on another forum reported that gun shops in his area were full of used S&W snubbies along with boxes of 47 rounds of .357 ammo. They are just brutal on both ends.

Jim

[ArmedBear]

People didn't know they could shoot .38 Specials in them?

Those light J-frames are not practice guns, they're not target guns (although they're very accurate), they're not plinkers. But man they're nice carry guns, especially for someone who can already shoot and gets practice with similar, heavier guns already. They're fine for a few cylinders at a time, which is all they're meant for.:)

[Schwebel]

The greatest thing about the little 5 shot J-frames,Taurii,Rossi's...etc. Is that it is a gun you WILL carry everyday. Glocks are nice and offer great firepower, but I find them thick, uncomfortable, and heavy to wear everyday. You do not have to alter your style of dress to carry a 5-shooter.

My 442 is my primary weapon for several reasons

1. I can shoot it better than most compact semi's.
2. It is realiable, it always goes BANG.
3. It is lightweight.
4. It conceals better than most autos
5. It has no external saftey, just point and pull
6. .38+P's offer decent stopping power, a .357 snub is even better
7. Drawing the weapon is lightning fast

If only 5 shots makes you feel underarmed, do what I do, I carry a P3AT on the ankle or in the pocket as a BUG, plus one speed strip in the pocket. All together this weighs less than a 1911 and a spare mag. Plus you can spread the weight around instead of just carrying one heavy firearm. This all being said, it seems a snub takes more practice than a semi, to reload quickly, and to become proficient with. Some people complain about the heavy triggers, but in a SD situation with adrenaline flowing, you could probally have a 50lb trigger and still put a shot where it needs to be. But if you do buy a 60 S&W and hate it, you won't have a problem selling it. As said before, they are not the greatest range guns (they can put a hurt on you), but they are dsome of the finest carry guns made.

[wcwhitey]

Can you hit what you shoot at Master Chief? If you can five should be fine. Seriously it's all about practice. If you can hit with the first one from the holster your odds are very good you will win the fight. I have been wearing the same S&W Model 640 (.38) for 17 years now, 24/7 as an Off Duty of BUG. Cannot tell you how many times I have caught the badguys eyeing my Sig 226 on the duty belt while I had my hand in a pocket clutching the little J frame. I am very confident in it but I shoot it everytime I go to the range, it's the last thing I shoot before I pack up. I do understand your situation especially coming down in size from a full size service weapon. Personally, I take comfort in the fact that I am always armed, many times where the bigger gun would not be practicle. The J frames are a good solid, reliable revolvers with decent power in .38 and excellent power in .357 if you can master it.

Good Luck and Thank You for your service!

[markallen]

Go back into history, and look. six shooters were always carried with five loads, and an empty under the hammer. history is a good teacher.

[Gunmeister]

My sincere thanks to all who replied, I really appreciate it.
I was proud to serve this great country and except for father time and gravity I would still be there.
OBTW I bought the Model 60.
God Bless our young Men and Women in uniform, wherever they serve. JW

[highfive]

Like they already said, it will depend in the situation. Not all of us can carry a M-249 probably will like to, but we can't, lol JK

I usually carry a revolver as my primary gun and for me is all about practice i rather spend some money in ammo and practice than go and buy an expensive sight or something. if you can shoot with it you are fine.

[sm]

Gunmeister,

Congratulations on the Model 60 purchase.
Again, Thank you for your Service.


That out of the way, new gun purchase means you get to make the coffee.
Well...don't just sit there, get with it! I take mine black. :D




Steve

[crankshop1000]

One in the left eye, one in the right eye, one in the forehead and two in the heart. Yup 5 should do it. Chuck.

[marley]

It might be enough I have an sp101 that i use for that role. Practice the reload. There maybe 8 of them lol. Or you could miss. Twice. patrick

[MCgunner]

For some yes, for others no. I am one of those that prefers the smooth, firm pull of my 642 to mushy Glock and XD triggers. As a result, I shoot my J Frame 642 as well or better than Glocks and XDs. I am most certainly in the minority on that one.

Maybe a minority anymore, but 30 years ago when revolvers were king, it was a majority. Personally, I agree with ya 100 percent! I don't like "safe action", feels like a mushy single action with a lot of creep. It's unpredictable, too. I am more accurate with a DA revolver that has a good SMOOTH trigger. It don't have to be a light trigger, just a smooth trigger.

[sm]

Never felt having two 5 shot snubbies was a bad thing myself. ;)

Oh I don't know, maybe the BG is expecting a strong hand draw watching strong side...

Lady in little black dress attending a function with you can access one, as you practiced.

I mean the gangbanger often has his "Nine" in the purse of the GF, so a good street tip is watch for the "3+1" and the gal(s) in a gathering of folks. ;)

Physically Limited Folks, well a LOT can be learned from assisting them.

Canes, walkers, Amigos, Wheelchairs "advertise" easier Prey.
An especially vulnerable time is the use of "lifts" getting into a vehicle with Amigo, or Wheelchair.

Still, getting down on the ground, and not being able to access a gun, means having more than one is a good idea.
Grappling for a gun, is harder if that gun is a 5 shot J frame or Snubby like a Colt Detective, Ruger SP 101 , or even 3" RB K frame.

Even getting into the vehicle, with the lift, the BG has time to access vehicle.
I know, I have done this as being one physically limited and being the BG.

Slides can get out of battery, which can be good, or bad depending if you are the one the gun is pointed at, or you need to fire the gun.

5 shot also includes the NAA mini revolver. I highly recommend the lanyard that NAA does a great job on.

Now guys use the lanyard, still the ladies might want to pay attention, or those with ladies they are concerned about.

Lady is down, fighting, and hands are going where they should not be, bad breath distance and that NAA .22 lr with solids to a eyeball, in a mouth, Adam's Apple...the gun is around the neck, where can be accessed.

One lady carries a BUG, a 32 cal snub nosed revolver this way, and has for a long long time.

Forget the tack-tickle expensive knives. Get a good screwdriver , more than one is better.
Wheelchairs and Amigos need adjusting, and one will not get cut in using one as they will with a knife.
BGs taught me and others about screwdrivers a long long time ago.

This is why I stay in trouble with some and most often with some that have attended "schools".

Tell you what, just for fun, you and your lady, or ladies with your guy, take the USB Thumbdrive and get on the bed and play act.
Pretend the flashdrive is a NAA.

Now go get a drinking straw and pretend it is a screwdriver and play act with it.

Real deal stuff from the streets, and folks that have BTDT, and those that have survived.
Not everything is learned from a textbook or a building with "school" on the door.

;)

[Troutman]

<<I'm left to wonder if five rounds in a "J" Frame .357Magnum is enough to feel comfortable with, God Forbid I'll ever have to use it.>>

It’s fine, if you’re an average Joe.
If you’re a V.I.P. that something different.
If one is on the “witness protection program”, it’s something different as well.
Being in the latter category. It does not really matter that much, what you have. If “they” really want to get to you, “they” know how. How much fire-power (beyond handguns), would be the least concern. This does not mean that it does not help though.

[Rexster]

I like more heft, so I have SP101 snubbies. I appreciate the extra destructiveness of .357 ammo. I LIKE to have more than just five rounds available, but if it's just the one fivegun, I know I can handle most events that could conceivably occur. Five is enough, until it isn't. So, I USUALLY carry another gun! Whether the second is another SP101 snubby, a Ruger Speed Six or GP100, or sometimes my fat little duty SIG P229R or a 1911. FWIW, I tried the Glunck G27 "Baby Glock" for a while; just not for me; I found two SP101 snubbies to be handier than one G27. I also have an Airweight J-frame, but about the only time I need to go that light is when I injure my back, and every ounce is a pain.

[Creature]

I carry a j-frame (Model 36) and feel very comfortable with my five shots!

[Gator]

Yes. Chances are very slight that you will ever need to even draw, and even slighter that you would have to fire even one round. I feel adequately armed with my five shot .38 Spl, and it is light enough not to be noticeable.

[MikeJ]

I am very comfortable with either my S&W 442 in .38 or 640 in .357 when I am out and about. My reasoning, for what it's worth, is that I just can't imagine becoming involved in an ongoing gun battle while at the supermarket. I'm not saying it couldn't happen but the likely scenario is someone intent on robbing a helpless victim in the parking lot and discovering their victim is really not so helpless should stop the aggression. I have been in this situation and believe me it worked once they knew I was armed. I also would not engage in some kind of spray and pray shooting while in a public area. Now when it comes to home defense that is a different story, I want more firepower for the home invasion assailants. BTW, I highly recommend the Speer Gold Dot 135 grain short barrel .357 for your model 60, very little muzzle flash and lots of ooomph.

[samtechlan]

I think a lot of the problems that folks have with shooting J frames are greatly lessened when you put CT grips on them. CT grips plus 5 Gold Dot 135 grain plus p's take the J frame airweight to a whole different level.

[deputy tom]

Depending on the situation and shooter's ability five should suffice.I know the old time Colts ad of "six for sure" but I cut my teeth on a five shot J-frame.Always carry a reload and a sharp knife just in case.YMMV.tom.

[gtmtnbiker98]

Crimson Trace grips are a nice novelty but isn't the snubby really designed as a "get off of me gun?" I mean, in a self-defense situation, who's going to aim, anyway? It's all going bo boil down to instinct and point shooting.

[JesseL]

There's no reason why a snubby can't be as inherently accurate a a full-sized gun. It's really only hampered by a short sight radius so I'd say putting CT grips on a snubby does in fact make a lot of sense for eliminating their primary shortcoming.

[SwampWolf]

If a lightweight, compact revolver carrying more than five shots is desired there are still plenty of Colt Cobras/Agents on the used gun market. Slightly heavier and slightly larger than Smith "J" frames but carrying one more round, the Cobra/Agent series make nice carry revolvers, especially when equipped with the detachable hammer cover (though these can be difficult to find).

[tubeshooter]

Depending on the situation and shooter's ability five should suffice.I know the old time Colts ad of "six for sure" but I cut my teeth on a five shot J-frame.Always carry a reload and a sharp knife just in case.YMMV.tom.


This is what I subscribe to.


And nice post, sm.

[M2 Carbine]

gtmtnbiker98
Crimson Trace grips are a nice novelty but isn't the snubby really designed as a "get off of me gun?" I mean, in a self-defense situation, who's going to aim, anyway? It's all going bo boil down to instinct and point shooting.

"Is Five Really Enough???"
Probably, if you can hit what you aim at.
Twenty rounds isn't enough if you're just punching holes in air.


Novelty??

Do this "instinct and point shooting" without a Crimson Trace laser on your snubby.;)
I know I'm lucky to hit the paper when shooting from the hip without the laser.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/CTlefthand15shots.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/CTrighthand10shots.jpg

There are some shooters that can hit with a snubby without aiming, but not many, and I ain't one.:)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/5yardsrapidfire.jpg

[crebralfix]

Though we've clashed in the past, at least you're carrying a gun! Five shots may not be enough, but at least you'll give the goblin(s) a little surprise. Get it if you like it...do you really need an excuse to buy another gun? I'll write your wife a note if it helps.

[357-8-times]

I don't think it is enough => I bought a Taurus 608 (check out my username)

[M2 Carbine]

Like the old man, that lives in Houston, said when asked by the Policeman, How did you shoot him ten times with that five shot revolver?

Well he kept trying to get up, so I reloaded and shot him five more times.




The old man was "No Billed" (good shooting).
The DOA had been robbing the old man of his SS check.

[vanilla_gorilla]

I feel that a five shot revolver serves as the absolute minimum - for a BUG. I do not walk out of the house with less than a 6 shot .357 and a reload, usualy 2 reloads. Often, then with a 5 shot .38 BUG as well.

Usually, though, I carry a 9 shot 1911 and 2 8 round mags spare. I consider 5 shots enough to handle no more than 2 bad guys, and maybe not even then. Just because you can hit a guy doesn't mean that he knows he's supposed to fall down and quit.

[aaronrkelly]

5 MAY not be enough......thats why they make speedloaders.

[antediluvianist]

5 is enough until you have to reload. And that will happen pretty soon. Best if your fight involves just one other opponent, or a dog.

[Shawn Michael]

I have this conversation with LEOs and they say that the hit rate for police officers is like 30%. I wonder if having hi cap has gotten into the heads of police and they just do not place shots as accurately as they used to when they had revolvers.

[vanilla_gorilla]

Mr Michaels, I think that's less of it than many think. Way back when every officer carried a wheelgun, many officers had been shooting long before they ever slipped on a Sam Browne.

I watched a series of trainees qualify two weeks ago that nearly made me cry. Out of 8 of them, 1 had ever fired a handgun for anything other than playing around before the basic recruit class. He was also the Marine. He was also the only one who managed to score worth anything. At least he kept them all on the center mass. One guy managed to completely miss the target 2 out of 6 shots at 7 yards, with 15 seconds on the clock.

[DrLaw]

It is, if you practice two things. 1) Drawing and 2) shooting.

Find the book NO SECOND PLACE WINNER by the late BILL JORDAN. It seems odd to think that you have to practice drawing a gun, but it will not do you any good unless you can get it out of where ever you keep it on you. His photos on drawing from concealed carry are very good. I practiced and practiced drawing.

Only three times did I ever have to point my gun at a person. But all three times, I was first, and I never had to shoot because of it. Something about seeing that hole looking at them stopped all three in their tracks. One had a shotgun at port arms, one was reaching for his glove box and I saw a 'pistol butt' under the seat - wasn't a gun, but that is another story, and the other was reaching for a set of brass knuckles saying it was his ID.

Yep, five will do it. So will 10, 20, 30 and whatever else you want to carry, but is it practical to do so?

The Doc is out now. :cool:

[XavierBreath]

I look at it like this. As a civilian gun toter, I carry a gun to save my life. I carry a gun to allow me to escape a deadly conflict, not to overcome it.

My goal in a lethal encounter is not to overcome, but to escape and eventually make it home and regain my life. A police officer requires the tools necessary to overcome criminals. As a civilian on the street, I require the tools to escape criminals. I figure five rounds of .357magnum is a pretty good guarantee I and mine will escape.

I do not say this to mean that civilians should not be allowed to carry high capacity firearms. Far from it. I say this because I feel that I have enough awareness, knowledge of tactics, maturity, ability and willingness to use my five shot firearm that I will escape my attacker(s) unless they are heavily armed, many in number, are willing to die, and are specifically targeting me. I don't think in my life, that's going to happen to me. Therefore, five rounds, or seven+1 makes me feel secure.

[crankshop1000]

+1 on the laser for a snubbie!!! Well worth the money. I added Lasermax to my 642 and it's a totally different experience.

[goalie]

5 may not be enough. If it isn't, will 10 be? 15??? 20???

Personally, I value my ability to run a 5 second 40 in flip-flops much higher than my ability to draw and hit center mass from my pocket at 7 yards in about a second and a half.

:p

My seatbelt and air-bag may not be enough to protect me in a car crash, but that doesn't mean I am going to outfit my personal vehicle like something in a NASCAR race. Carrying a 5-shot snubbie is a give-and-take, like anything in life. I'm aware of the potential, and personally feel that the risks are low enough, and can be controlled enough for me to be comfortable with them, through situational awareness, training, and physical fitness. My opinion may change when I can no longer run faster than I can shoot......

[Cannonball888]

It is enough if what statistics say are true about the average number of shots used in the average defensive situation.

[dispatch]

Five .38's in my pocket do give me comfort.

[sm]

Before I do, read XavierBreath's post above again.

Last time a gun was pointed at me, and trigger pulled, at the front of my truck, I was not fully pulled into parking spot.
I evaded.
I had two CCWs on person.

This person continued to pull trigger and rack slide, learned later his gun was loaded +1

-

Time Before,
I again evaded on foot.
Again, trigger was pulled as I moved off the line, and kept moving using cover.
Later revealed, this was a popular, polymer 9mm handgun, that was loaded +1
Gun did not run, pull trigger and racking slide .

Again, I never went for my CCW, instead too busy moving and scooting.
Now, I was "there" on business, no "trouble" going in, "trouble" showed up when I exited.

-Time before that-
NO CCW.
Regulations, Metal Detectors and Wands.
I had legit business to be in that building.
Situation happened as I made my way back to my parked vehicle


I had no CCW, only a SAK classic allowed, and Bic Pen, and almost empty 20oz plastic bottle of water when I started back to where I had to park.
Two punks appeared from parked cars
Third punk was in the driver's seat of a car.

Time to dance.
Driver pulled a bit away.
Two youths doing the "street dance" and me scanning 360*
To far to run back, and not close enough to run to other structures.

Street Dance is on. You do what you gotta do. Adapt. Improvise. Overcome.

With cars parked as they were, and space we had to "dance" I did NOT want to get painted against anything.

"3+1" : Signals you about to go from Dance, to Rodeo.

Left rubbed his face, glanced , and before he could shift weight ["3] and do the Plus one hand movement
I busted off a antenna and went inside as fast and hard as could would antenna and soda bottle.

I "messed up their game plan".
Left run back, Right started to come and ...I can be the most ugly, cussing, "crazy old fool" when I want to be.

I was chasing them! They ran calling me names, and driver pulled up and they hauled butt away.

Got to my vehicle, got my CCW, and left a note and money for the busted Antenna.
Made another call.
Then went on to where once safe I could have my well deserved adrenaline dump.

Lady Luck is always welcome in my life.

Life is Life, just one is wise to not get fixated on "gun" and "knife" and "equipment" always.

Learn to read people, places and things.

"Left punk" was doing a textbook signal before he made his move.
I went in before he got to "3" and "+1".

Right "I think" had a knife.
Left "pretty sure" a gun.

Being honest, I was too busy watching hands and ALL the signals.
Hands are important, again, ALL the signals are important.

You will note I did not mention what kind of guns I had these days, round count, ammunition anything.

Not important.

[PTK]

Why, sm, you sound like you're trying to say that guns aren't magical talismans that protect the holder from harm! Say it ain't so!

[sm]

Not for Good Guys
Not for Bad Guys.

The Reality is, anything can and will break.
It does not matter how much money it costs, or how new and improved the design is, or how new and improved , and expensive any accessories are with Firearms.

I do not care what Internet says, what a gun magazine says, what anyone says.
Firearms and accessories can and will fail.

[Creature]

sm wrote:
The Reality is, anything can and will break.
It does not matter how much money it costs, or how new and improved the design is, or how new and improved , and expensive any accessories are with Firearms.

It's funny how from of all the guns in my collection that I always choose the oldest, most inexpensive and beat-up relic as my carry piece.

[Green Lantern]

What better place to say YMMV!

Since none of us can see the future, it's hard to say. You may be fine carryin NO gun the rest of your life. Or, 5 shots of .357 may be fine. OR, God forbid, you might one day find yourself in a situation that would call for a Para P-14 AND a spare mag!

Personally, I don't like going around with my round count in the single digits - but I DO it sometimes.

I have read an account of a SD shooting that was sobering and led to me liking high shot counts. The guy did everything "right" IIRC. Saw the threat, tried to avoid but could not, and hit what he aimed at. With a .45 auto.

Thing is, it took 3 hits EACH to stop 2 attackers. If the THIRD one had not fled, the good guy might have been hurting! :eek:

[The_Shootist]

Juts bought a used Taurus 85 on impulse because it was in excellent condition and I was looking for something a little beefier for "out the door" carry than my P-32. Besides, a man can't have too many subbies! I also own a SP 101 in 3" bbl.

Its rated for +P, I'll carry the FBI load in it. So if that and one S/L won't allow me to at least start running I'm probably finished anyways.


But boy is it a sweet pocket carry gun!

[welldoya]

Here's my thoughts on the situation. Not saying it's right, it's just my reasoning.
I just bought a 642. I'm going to pocket carry it in a Mika.
I own a Glock 19, a BHP, a couple of Colt .45s, an S&W 60 .357, a CZ75, well you get the idea. But I know I won't carry them all the time if much at all.
I figure the rate of actual use of a CCW is probably less than 2%. In other words, 98% of those carrying concealed will never draw their weapon.
I'm not going to buy my pants 2 sizes too big so I can carry IWB and I'm not going to wear a photographer's vest. The only way that I would carry on a consistent basis is in the pocket and a 642 in a Mika seems a comfortable way to do that. I figure I will always have it just in case. It might not be the ideal weapon but I will have it with me (as opposed to the others) and it could very well be enough to diffuse the situation.
In other words, a 642 in the pocket beats a Glock 19 at home in the safe.
Also, I looked at the Crimson Trace grips and thought they were very nice but the grips were a little longer which would take up more pocket space and I really don't need to have $620 in a pocket gun. $415 sounds a lot better.
Plus, I figure if I have to shoot it's going to be at very close range so I wouldn't really need the laser. Plus, I've been shooting a long time and plan to practice quite a bit with the 642.
Like I said, my reasoning may not be for everyone but it's how I arrived at the 642.

[Richard.Howe]

Just pretend you're carrying two and a half derringers... :)

[fastbolt]

I'm in general agreement with many of the folks who have responded that 5 rounds in a S&W J-frame is generally sufficient for my perceived and anticipated needs when it comes to off-duty usage.

I've gone to carrying one or another of them as my primary off-duty weapon in recent years. Upon occasion I'll sometimes even carry a couple of them ... and when I've done so it's still been more comfortable and practical for my needs than many instances when I've carried a larger, heavier higher capacity pistol.

The other weekend my daughter, visiting from out-of-state, wanted me to take her on a day-long motorcycle ride through the valleys and foothills of Santa Clara, Santa Cruz and Monterey counties. Due to the summer heat I wanted to be able to wear a T-shirt under my leather riding jacket, and be able to remove and carry my leather jacket when we stopped for lunch and to wander around any of the towns.

My chosen carry methods allowed me to comfortably carry 2 S&W J-frames that day, along with 5 speedloaders and a speedstrip, and remove my jacket when we stopped moving in the heat. I was not only able to remove and carry my jacket when we stopped and got off the bike, and remain cool wearing a T-shirt & jeans, but I was able to comfortably 'forget' I was armed.

Of course, I'm inclined to feel comfortable with revolvers of 5-6 round capacity because I spent the first several years of my LE career carrying them as issued weapons. Back then if I wanted a higher capacity semiauto off-duty weapon I carried my Commander with 7+1 capacity.

Whenever someone asks me if 5 rounds is 'enough', I point out that this sort of thinking can be carried to whatever extent someone desires. Are 6 rounds 'enough'? Are 7 rounds 'enough'? Are 46 rounds 'enough'? When is 'enough' going to be 'enough'?

Then, I'll change the line of questioning toward considering whether the person's knowledge, training, experience, strategic thinking, acquired & practiced skills, as well as mental & physical preparation is going to be 'enough' ... for whatever circumstances and anticipated situations are being considered.

Confidence in a tool is fine ... but misplaced confidence, or at least over emphasizing confidence on the tool rather than the abilities, skills and preparation on the part of the tool user may be a potential issue ...

When it comes to my daily LE duties I'm fine with a semiauto pistol with a capacity of anywhere from 7+1 to 15+1 ... and I wouldn't even mind returning to carrying a revolver, especially since the newer S&W models are available in 6, 7 & 8 rounds capacities ... but I'd probably not choose a 5-shot J-frame as an issued revolver. :neener: Just because.

Off-duty (and pending retirement) are a different matter, though. It will probably also help that I plan to leave the greater SF Bay Area (and most probably CA) once I retire. Matter of fact, I'd kind of like to live somewhere which reminds me of how southern CA used to be, especially in the rural, and even some semi-rural areas, when I was growing up in the 50's & early 60's. ;)

FWIW, even if 5 rounds were going to be considered to be 'enough' by some folks, that doesn't necessarily mean their skills with a J-frame are going to be 'sufficient', you know ... and that's a factor to be considered.

[fastbolt]

Besides, a man can't have too many subbies!

Couldn't agree more! :D

I presently have 4 J-frames and a SP-101 DAO 2.25" ... and I'm always on the lookout for another J-frame model which I might want to add to my working collection. ;)

I regret trading off at least a couple of them in the past, too ... (The impatience and boredom of youth is my excuse.)

[Haywood]

If I carry a 5 shooter, I IWB the 605 Taurus and pocket a mdl.37 S&W.