Folding Stock Rifles?


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.45&TKD
August 14, 2007, 09:13 PM
Anyone else not have a folding/collapsible stock rifle and not sure if you want one?

I try to be practical in my gun pruchases, but the only reasons I can come up with to get a folding stock is to keep an AK under my trench coat or to PO a Liberal.

Any thoughts? Am I missing anything?

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everallm
August 14, 2007, 09:22 PM
For folding
For compact storage
To take to the range in a less threatening looking EBB (Evil Black Bag)

For collapsable
Adjustable LOP

Thats really it.

PTK
August 14, 2007, 09:34 PM
I have a folding stock 10/22. I find it handier overall than a regular stocked rifle.

JamesM
August 14, 2007, 09:41 PM
Easier to transport and I like to think the Brady Bunch cringes each time I buy one.

Joe Demko
August 14, 2007, 09:45 PM
I have a Yugo underfolder because I got a good deal on it. Otherwise, I've never been much on folding stocks.

cat_IT_guy
August 14, 2007, 09:47 PM
I have a side folder on my WASR-10. If I could do it over again, I would buy a normal stocked AK. The folder just feels too flimsy and requires you to shoulder the rifle at a slightly akward angle.

Tully M. Pick
August 14, 2007, 09:49 PM
I don't have any folding stocks on my rifles. I've never really cared for them. I do have a couple that are collapsible, just because I like the adjustable length.

.45&TKD
August 14, 2007, 09:54 PM
Actually, it is the Yugo underfolder that got me to thinking about this. I just got the Yugo AK47 with the full wood stock and I really like it.

The Yugo underfolder seems pretty solid, too. But I hate to spend that much money on another rifle, that I essentially already have.

I have an nice Romanian SAR1 that I could put a folding wire stock on just to have folding stock, but I keep coming back to the question, what for?

No offense to those that have them. Just looking to be sold on the idea so I can buy one.

Joe Demko
August 14, 2007, 10:17 PM
It's darned compact when folded. The AK pistols I see for exhorbitant sums are only a little shorter and don't have a stock at all.

Dave Markowitz
August 14, 2007, 10:37 PM
I have one folding stock rifle:

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c340/davemarkowitz/M1_Carbines/M1_Carbines.jpg

It's a USGI Underwood M1 Carbine made in 1943. The M1A1 folder is a replica. It is very short when folded, fits perfectly in an M60 barrel bag, making for a very compact setup. If I ever need to bugout, it's getting tossed in the truck within easy reach, along with several mags full of Remington 110 grain JSPs.

Navy87Guy
August 14, 2007, 10:40 PM
I have a side-folding collapsible stock on my Saiga -- it's the best of both worlds. Very easy to store - makes it convenient in the back of the truck. The stock is very solid and very comfortable. It also allows me to adjust the length of pull for my sons or my wife. I don't think I'd be very happy with a "traditional" side folder, though.

Here it is:
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-11/889657/Saiga_practical.jpg

I wouldn't do it any differently.

Jim

nalioth
August 14, 2007, 11:11 PM
I have a side folder on my WASR-10. If I could do it over again, I would buy a normal stocked AK. The folder just feels too flimsy and requires you to shoulder the rifle at a slightly akward angle.

My side folder is rock solid when open. It is functionally identical to a fixed stock.
http://www.novarata.net/abrams/mf_forum/aks-74_640_468.JPG

Locking mechanism. Can't beat the mortis and tenon approach.

http://www.novarata.net/abrams/mf_forum/aks-74_640_475.JPG

alucard0822
August 14, 2007, 11:18 PM
IMO folders are nice if you intend to carry it, and shoot at short distances, but if it is to be a range queen for target work, then a solid stock is hard to beat. There is little reason to fire a rifle with the stock folded, so it basically is for compact storage, compact carrying, or for looks, I prefer to whip the rifle around on the sling and have it ready to go, instead of pushing buttons and flippy flopping some flimsy contraption around that is near impossible to get a decent cheek-weld on.
but that being said both AK examples above are probably the most practical type of folders with the fewest drawbacks.

Regolith
August 14, 2007, 11:53 PM
Dave: I really like that folding stock M1 Carbine. Who makes em?

Zak Smith
August 14, 2007, 11:56 PM
Few would call this rifle less than solid
http://demigodllc.com/photo/BSR-2007.03/smaller/D101_3609_img.jpg (http://demigodllc.com/photo/BSR-2007.03/?small=D101_3609_img.jpg)
............... Larger version of above photo. (http://demigodllc.com/photo/BSR-2007.03/?small=D101_3609_img.jpg)

Andrewsky
August 15, 2007, 12:34 AM
Zak, would that be because the stock does not have anything to do with the functioning of the gun?:)

dstorm1911
August 15, 2007, 01:32 AM
If ya ever need to carry the AK while riding a dirt bike or a quad ya will discover very quikly that a fixed stock or even a collapsable stock don't work well at all and actually become a safty hazard, a side folder is a lil better (provided ya don't mind the trunion digging into the seat behind ya) but it still limits how ya can carry the rifle because ya won't want the folded stock against your spine.... An Underfolder however the stock completally gets outa your way folded up against the bottom of the rifle the flat rear trunion won't effect your seat upholstery etc.. ya can carry it right or left side muzzle direction as there is no folded stock digging into your back it also has a thinner profile than a side folder allowing it to fit under most vehicle seats easily.........

I never liked underfolders myself until I built my first Yugo M70AB2, it was far more solid than my Chinese or Polish UFs the angle when extended is more in line with the bore putting your head in perfect alignment with the iron sights, I braided black and grey para cord around the left stock beam as out here in the AZ desert that metal was a tad hot against the cheek...... added plus I use one of the knots the same way ya use a button on a hunting bow for consistant head positioning everytime I shoulder it...... makes for a super accurate AK.........

Well those are my reasons for a folder while I have collapsable, side folding wire and Plastic the YUGO UF is the one that gets used the most......

Father Knows Best
August 15, 2007, 01:38 AM
There are good folding/collapsing stocks, and there are bad folding/collapsing stocks. Good ones lock up solidly, and bad ones will wobble. The folder on a FAL paratrooper is rock solid. Some other side folders can also be rock solid. Many are not.

The other thing to consider is what a folding or collapsing stock does to your ability to get a good cheek weld. I tried a collapsible stock on my G3, and while it looked cool and made it easier to transport, it also made it almost impossible to shoot well, especially with a scope. As a result, I went back to a fixed stock. The folder on my Para FAL, on the other hand, accepts a nice padded neoprene cheekrest that makes it comfortable to use.

Bottom line -- I'm happy with the fixed stocks on my AK and G3, and the folder on my FAL:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c187/mosmoke/guns%20110505/Blackrifles3.jpg

ssr
August 15, 2007, 01:51 AM
Why buy them?

Because they're EVIL!:evil: Good enough for me.

Coronach
August 15, 2007, 01:59 AM
I try to be practical in my gun pruchases, but the only reasons I can come up with to get a folding stock is to keep an AK under my trench coat or to PO a Liberal.99% of the time a fixed stock gun will be fine. You really only need a folding stock for compact storage or for deploying (mounting/dismounting) from a motor vehicle. They're handier, for sure, but most of the time a fixed stock is sufficient, especially for the non-combat gunowner.

Mike

Dave Markowitz
August 15, 2007, 05:16 PM
Dave: I really like that folding stock M1 Carbine. Who makes em?

It's an Italian made replica which I got last year from Cheaper Than Dirt. I believe Sarco, among others also carries it.

The wood came stained but apparently devoid of finish. I applied around 4 or 5 coats of tung oil to it.

Nameless_Hobo
August 15, 2007, 05:53 PM
Navyguy, what's the brand of stock you've got on your Saiga? I'd like to have one.

Insayn
August 15, 2007, 06:24 PM
I've seen some folding stocks in the sniper schools I've attended. None are really a necessity, just storage and deployment practicle (sometimes). Some make it easier to clean because you don't have to remove the cheek rest to pull the bolt and get a rod in the barrel.
We just finished a .50 cal school and one agency had the A.I. .50 bolt guns. Very impressive and I noticed it was necessary to be a folder to remove the bolt and gain access to clean it.
http://www.texasoffroad.net/albums/members/album179/08_14_07_1250.sized.jpg

GunTech
August 15, 2007, 07:43 PM
I don't see the point of a folder unless you really need compact storage. The have a tendency to get loose and rarely fit as well as the fixed stock. Of all the folding stocks out there, the FAL folder is about the best. The new AK with a folder that looks like a fixed are also nice.

I don't care about looks, just what shoots best. You don't see match rifles with folding stocks for a reason.

YMMV

Deer Hunter
August 15, 2007, 07:54 PM
I don't care about looks, just what shoots best. You don't see match rifles with folding stocks for a reason.

...Because all your match rifle sees the inside of your gun safe and a bench-rest maybe?

Zak Smith
August 15, 2007, 07:58 PM
You don't see match rifles with folding stocks for a reason.
I shoot the AI-AW 2.0 folder, and a lot of other people use the AICS folder stock on Remington and Surgeon actions. In matches.

-z

BigSoundRacing
August 15, 2007, 08:12 PM
I like the folder on the FAL, the SPR Stock gives me extension for my shoulders and set the rifle up for a cheek rest and scope.



folder version 1

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i15/BigSoundRacing/DSC05615_75.jpg

folder version 2

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i15/BigSoundRacing/DSC05747_50.jpg

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i15/BigSoundRacing/DSC05744_50.jpg

GunTech
August 15, 2007, 08:51 PM
Zak, the AI is hardly what I think of as a folder (though it is). The number of folders that are decent is miniscule. And I wasn't really thinking of tac matches

Navy87Guy
August 15, 2007, 10:47 PM
Navyguy, what's the brand of stock you've got on your Saiga? I'd like to have one.

Unfortunately, it's a Command Arms Accessory stock. I say "unfortunately" because I didn't find out until after the fact that they are made in Israel (despite the big "CAA" logo stamped on it). So ity doesn't count as a compliance part for 922R. I like it so much, though, that I'm not willing to give it up -- so I got a US-made gas piston and some mag parts to reach the magic number for compliance (I had the same problem with the pistol grip!)

Jim

MyRoad
August 16, 2007, 02:17 AM
I have a Butler Creek folder on my Mini-14, which makes it compact enough to fit inside a backpack when camping.

I ordered one for my SKS, but canceled the order when I found out I'd have to switch out 10 parts or be committing a felony.

nalioth
August 16, 2007, 10:57 AM
I ordered one for my SKS, but canceled the order when I found out I'd have to switch out 10 parts or be committing a felony.

It's not switching out 10 parts, but only having 10 foreign parts (or less) in the weapon.

Here are the relevant parts in an SKS Carbine:

1. Receiver

2. Barrel

3. Bolt

4. Bolt carrier

5. Gas piston

6. Trigger housing

7. Trigger

8. Hammer

9. Sear

10. Disconnector

11. Stock

12. Handguard

13. Magazine body

14. Follower So by using buying your stock, you'd only need a US made 10 round mag assembly to bring your countable foreign parts down to 10. If you have a Yugo M59/66 you have an extra countable part:

15. muzzle attachment

MyRoad
August 16, 2007, 11:12 AM
So by using buying your stock, you'd only need a US made 10 round mag assembly to bring your countable foreign parts down to 10. If you have a Yugo M59/66 you have an extra countable part:

Well, that's a different take. I wouldn't want to put detachable magazines on this gun, so I'd have to figure something else out. Since I've read more than one interpretation of this law (or I've been consistently misinterpreting it), I'm still not sure its worth it to mess with it. But thanks for clarifying.

accomplice
August 16, 2007, 11:49 AM
I have an Ace folder on my Sig 556 and love it. It locks up solid and makes it pretty compact when folded.

nalioth
August 16, 2007, 11:55 AM
Well, that's a different take. I wouldn't want to put detachable magazines on this gun They make US made duplicates of the 10 round magazine. They're not any more detachable than the originals.

and I was just using the mag as an easy way to compliance, you could use a gas piston and fire control part or any other US made parts from the list, so you had a total of 4 US parts on the gun (the stock counts for 2 parts).

Zak Smith
August 16, 2007, 12:52 PM
I actually shot that gun in an F-class match a few months ago.

GunTech
August 16, 2007, 12:54 PM
Well, you can get a decent folder on a $4,000 rifle. There are a handful of decent folders, and a huge number of worthless ones.

Zak Smith
August 16, 2007, 12:58 PM
Nah, I agree of course. I just don't like blanket statements when the problem isn't an inherent attribute of the class, but of most of the instances. The Masada folder also seemed pretty solid and didn't affect ergonomics.

cameron.personal
August 16, 2007, 01:15 PM
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m198/2007cam/DSA%20Para/DSASA58ParaL01.jpg

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m198/2007cam/DSA%20Para/DSASA58ParaFoldedR02.jpg

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m198/2007cam/DSA%20Para/DSASA58ParaFoldedL01.jpg

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m198/2007cam/DSA%20Para/TennisBag2.jpg

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m198/2007cam/DSA%20Para/TennisBag.jpg

I was at the dealership dropping off my car for service when the guy remarked "I didn't know you played tennis" when I got the Tennis Bag from my rear seat...

I said, "You should see my serve!"

DMK
August 16, 2007, 01:31 PM
I've got a DSA Para folder on my FAL, a Romanian Sidefolder on my SAR1 AK and a repro M1A1 folder on my CMP Inland Carbine. I'm happy with all of them. They all work well while shooting, fold tight and compact, and seem pretty sturdy.

The AK was the first folder and I bought it mosty because I wanted to stash the gun ready to go in my house. The particular spot I had in mind was too small for a full length rifle. I liked the utility of it so much, that I went with folders on my FAL and carbine too.

As soon as I can get some soft points tested through it, my carbine's going to find a quiet corner in my car's trunk for road trips.

http://mysite.verizon.net/dmk0210/myarms/ImblFAL4.jpg

col_tapiocca
August 16, 2007, 06:56 PM
Folding stocks are handy!

I only own two rifles with folding stock.

Upper is a Bulgarian made Arsenal AK-Klone with underfolder
Lower is a Ruger Mini 14 with factory side-folder

62448
open
62449
closed

In most EU-Countries folding stocks are Ugh! (Forbidden by law) But in Switzerland it's lawful. I guess Switzerland is an exception in this matter :)

DougW
August 16, 2007, 09:24 PM
How about a folding #4mk1?

http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p118/MDWINK/Enfield4004.jpg

coyote_jr
August 23, 2007, 05:47 PM
I have an nice Romanian SAR1 that I could put a folding wire stock on just to have folding stock, but I keep coming back to the question, what for?

Very simply, I only bought my underfolder because it can be hidden more effectively in my car should I ever need to.

W.E.G.
August 23, 2007, 06:24 PM
Hey, whatever it takes to keep the students happy.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/vucijak-usmc-1.jpg
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/vucijak-usmc-10.jpg
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/vucijak1smaller.jpg

PTK
August 23, 2007, 06:57 PM
I was at the dealership dropping off my car for service when the guy remarked "I didn't know you played tennis" when I got the Tennis Bag from my rear seat...

I said, "You should see my serve!"

You're my hero. :D

Dave R
August 23, 2007, 10:18 PM
I put a Romanian side folder on my AK to celebrate the expiration of the Assault Weapons Ban. It works better than I expected. Its rock-solid when extended (and folded, for that matter.) I can get a decent cheek weld.

Its cool, but I still think about putting the original stock back on, just because the gun feels more comfortable.

And, after a bit of fun experimenting, I'm convinced that it takes a different skill set than I have to be able to shoot it accurately from the hip or any other folded position.

FMJMIKE
August 23, 2007, 10:23 PM
I just got my first folder.......I love it........:D Rock-Ola M1 Carbine
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/mbmphoto/Rock1-1.jpg

esq_stu
August 23, 2007, 10:41 PM
For traveling - fits in a smaller case;
For trunk - fits in a case that looks like something besides a gun case (bat bag, fishing rod bag, etc.) to avoid theft;
For storage - takes up less space;
For carrying in something that looks like something besides a gun case to avoid panicking gun paranoids.

It has nothing to do with concealment. I'd settle for easy breakdown weapons such as a rapidly removable barrel and stock so I can fly with my clays shotgun packed in something that does not scream "GUN!" Same for my other guns. But I hear something insidious in the question.

Zumbo saw no point to the AR - they looked too much like evil terrorist guns to possibly have any legitimate use.
I guess there are some more Zumbos out there - if it looks evil, it cannot possibly have any legitimate use.

But whether it has legitimate use or not, there are rights and there are rights. Leave this one alone.

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