What happened to Max Cleland?


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DaveB
July 3, 2003, 01:42 PM
You guys can predice where I come down on this. What do you think.

(Dismissive shots at the Washington Post and The Nation are beside the point.)

From http://www.thenation.com/outrage/index.mhtml?bid=6

This 4th of July weekend, spare a thought for decorated Vietnam veteran Max Cleland, a man who sacrificed both legs and one arm in his country's service. Then spare a shudder for how casually the Bush Republicans -- utterly indifferent to this man's honorable record at war and at peace -- smeared him as some sort of Osama bin Laden-loving traitor. The Bush Republicans are all about such vague smears. Democrats are indistinguishable from Chemical Ali, Qusay Hussein and the other Iraqi villain face cards. Bipartisanship is just another word for date rape.

Cleland -- who is profiled in today's Washington Post -- lost his Senate seat in November to challenger Saxby Chambliss, a Republican who first made the scene via Newt Gingrich's "Contract With America". Control of the Senate was riding on the Cleland-Chambliss contest, so money had poured into Georgia, and George Bush visited five times to campaign. Then came the TV spots, which opened with pictures of bin Laden and Saddam Hussein, then moved to attacking Cleland as an opponent of the President's Homeland Security bill (Never mind that Cleland was a key supporter of the similar Democratic version of the bill).

"That was the biggest lie in America -- to put me up there with Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein and say I voted against homeland security!" Cleland angrily tells The Post. "I volunteered 35 years ago to go to Vietnam and the guy I was running against got out of going to Vietnam with a trick knee! I was an author of the homeland security bill, for goodness' sake! But I wasn't a rubber stamp for the White House. That right there is the epitome of what's wrong with American politics today!"

Republican senators John McCain and Chuck Hagel -- both, like Cleland, Vietnam veterans -- immediately denounced the ads. "Putting pictures of Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden next to a picture of a man who left three limbs on the battlefield -- it's worse than disgraceful, it's reprehensible," says McCain. For Hagel it was "beyond offensive," especially applied to a man who'd given so much to his country. "It made me recoil, quite honestly," Hagel said. (Senator Chambliss, sticking to the low road that's served him so well, had someone tell The Post he would have no comment).

The Post says Cleland also now feels he was "bamboozled" into supporting a wrongheaded war in Iraq. "I voted for it because I was told by the secretary of defense and by the CIA that there were weapons of mass destruction there," Cleland says. "The president said it, Colin Powell said it, they all said it. And now they can't find them! Our general over there, who has no dog in this fight, he said he sent troops all over the place and they found two trailers and not much of anything else. So we went to war for two trailers?

"Now wait a minute," Cleland continues. "Let me run this back: We have a war. A bunch of Americans die. After the war, we try to figure out why we were there. There's a commitment of 240,000 ground troops with no exit strategy. You know what that's called? Vietnam! Hey, I've been there, done that, got a few holes in my T-shirt."

db

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treeprof
July 3, 2003, 01:49 PM
A similarly whiney piece was in the Atlanta paper a few weeks back. Boo hoo, Max.

MAKOwner
July 3, 2003, 06:23 PM
He turned too liberal for the "southern Democrats" of Georgia and got booted, end of story. People who win down here with Conservative messages and then go to the liberal left party line at the Federal level are in a real danger of getting the boot nowadays, as Cleland found out the hard way. Finally people are waking up...

BigG
July 3, 2003, 08:33 PM
I don't know anything about Max Cleland's military record but as a politician he parlayed his handicap as shamelessly as Bob Dole or that turncoat McCain ever did. Good riddance to all three of them, I say. :fire:

Lone_Gunman
July 3, 2003, 10:39 PM
Not to belittle Max's war injuries, but weren't they caused by his own hand grenade?

That's not really an important point, he lost 3 appendages, but it certainly needs to at least be brought to everyone's attention when Max starts using his service record for political gain.

As everyone else has pointed out, Max is just too damn liberal for his own good.

His Senate record disgraces any contribution he may have made in Viet Nam.

The State of Georgia, US, and the world are all better places now that he is out of office.

WAGCEVP
July 3, 2003, 11:07 PM
sacrificed both legs and an arm, BULLCHIT!
His stupidity lost him both legs and an arm.......... he's no hero!

WAGCEVP
July 3, 2003, 11:09 PM
who cares what happened to him, I say good riddance!:barf: :fire:

Blackhawk
July 3, 2003, 11:25 PM
Not to belittle Max's war injuries, but weren't they caused by his own hand grenade?I don't know, and what I heard about him being a bit drunk screwing around with a grenade that caused his injuries wasn't verifiable.

I saw a sanitized 2002 campaign account alleging that he was exiting a slick under attack and attempted to throw a grenade at the attackers, but that wasn't plausible. The account had him right next to the slick with its rotor spun up, and the whole bit.

Hint: anybody who even thinks about trying to throw a grenade while under the rotor should be shot -- by his buddies --before he gets the pin out....

Drunk, and an AD (Accidental Detonation) is far more plausible to me, but like I said, I don't know.

Does anybody have a credible account of how he was injured?

Mark Tyson
July 4, 2003, 10:26 PM
I believe that the grenade belonged to another soldier who had secured it improperly.

Anyone who loses 3 limbs and keeps on thriving is OK in my book. That takes guts.

Lone_Gunman
July 4, 2003, 10:48 PM
Mark Tyson,

Unless you are a flaming liberal, Max should not be ok in your book.

His loss of limb does not justify his terrible Senate record.

WR Olsen
July 4, 2003, 11:00 PM
Just for the record:
I worked in the Vetetrans Administration when Max was the Administrator of Veterans Affairs (back before it became a cabinet office). It made political points for him to be in a wheelchair rather than walking around on prothetics. So he took off his legs and arm and rode a wheel chair.

Within 6 months his weight balloned and he was confined to his political mode of transportation! As with many politicians he was in the job for what it could do for him, noit what he could do for the veteran.

I can't find it in my heart to feel sad for him, he made the decisions that got him where he is.......but he was a talented guy who sold his soul and is now paying the bill.

Mike Irwin
July 5, 2003, 12:22 AM
Don't really care as long as he's out of office, thank you...

Byron Quick
July 5, 2003, 12:59 AM
I honor his military service.

I regret his wounds.

However, scoundrels get caught by explosives, too.

Judging by his voting record, he could have the best military record for heroism and I would no longer wish for him to be a senator for Georgia.


I would much rather he had not been wounded at all in Vietnam...and nver gone into politics.

HBK
July 5, 2003, 01:07 AM
I say good riddance.

Mark Tyson
July 5, 2003, 10:48 PM
Lone Gunman:

Liberal? Compared to most of you guys, definitely!

Flaming? No.

And as far as RKBA goes, I think you should own a mortar if you want one.

Blackhawk
July 5, 2003, 11:40 PM
It made political points for him to be in a wheelchair rather than walking around on prothetics.Stinkin' phony!

Way too reminiscent of Clinton's fake tear wiping when he spotted the cameras when coming out of Ron Brown's funeral while he was yukking it up.

99% of politicians give the others a bad name....

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