Muzzle Loader vs Beowulf: Which is stronger


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wacki
August 15, 2007, 11:32 PM
FEDERAL 209A PRIMER
SMI BLACK SABOT
300 GRAIN BARNES XS BULLET .458
POWDER XMR 2015
67 GRAIN = 2300 FEET PER SECOND
MUZZLE ENERGY 3550 FOOT POUNDS

http://www.smokelessmuzzleloading.com/loadingchart.html

vs

http://www.50beowulf.com/PDF/beowulf_ballistics.pdf
Beowulf - 16" Barrel - 100 yard zero
325 HP BC.149 - 2743 foot pounds
334 HP BC.210 - 2676 foot pounds
334 FP FMJ BC.210 - 2676 foot pounds
400 FP BC.202 - 2877 foot pounds

Does the "100 yard zero" mean that 0 = 100 yards? 100 = 200 yards? The energy crown depends on the meaning of that phrase. I'd like to see some stats on the .75 calibre Brown Bess. Googled for a little bit and came up with nothing.

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Kindrox
August 15, 2007, 11:47 PM
I don't know which has more energy, but I do know that the 50 Beowulf is downloaded because the AR15 bolt face cannot withstand more stress. Using another, stronger platform, it could have better numbers.

General Geoff
August 16, 2007, 02:54 AM
Strange loads to be comparing..

wacki
August 17, 2007, 10:13 PM
I don't know which has more energy, but I do know that the 50 Beowulf is downloaded because the AR15 bolt face cannot withstand more stress.

You serious? The bolt face? I'm sure you know a lot more than I do but that's pretty hard for me to believe. What happens when a bolt face fails?

browningguy
August 17, 2007, 10:51 PM
100 yard zero means the gun is sighted so that the round impacts at point of aim at 100 yards, only usefull for a ballistics curve and has nothing to do with energy.

According to the two charts you show the muzzleloader has more energy, assuming they are measuring velocity the same distance from the barrel.

R.W.Dale
August 18, 2007, 12:40 AM
You serious? The bolt face? I'm sure you know a lot more than I do but that's pretty hard for me to believe. What happens when a bolt face fails?

Why is that hard to believe? The Beowulf round has a rather large inside diameter resulting in a lot more rearward force on the bolt head than the diminutive .223 generates, Even when loaded to the same pressures. What happens when the bolt face fails? NOTHING NICE!

Bullet
August 18, 2007, 04:45 AM
Beowulf round has a rather large inside diameter resulting in a lot more rearward force on the bolt head than the diminutive .223 generates, Even when loaded to the same pressures.

Can you load a 223 to the Beowulf's low pressure?

R.W.Dale
August 18, 2007, 05:00 AM
Can you load a 223 to the Beowulf's low pressure?

You could if you wanted to, But I doubt the action would cycle

wacki
August 18, 2007, 10:06 AM
Why is that hard to believe?

Well with all the springs, rods, etc in the AR platform the last thing I would expect to fail is a near solid block of steel that can move backward to relieve the pressure.

Mat, not doormat
August 18, 2007, 11:44 PM
Holy mackerel, what kind of muzzleloader are you gonna use with 2015? That's not a muzzloader load, that's a marlin level .45-70 load! :what: :what: :what:

Maybe I've been out of the muzzleloading loop for a while, but you say muzzleloader, and I think .50 cal patched round ball, 75 grns of FFFg, and a No. 11 cap.

~~~Mat

groundedclk
August 19, 2007, 12:17 PM
So for example, what kind of a larger platform would you need to provide the .50beowulf with to perform at maximum performance?

Gator
August 19, 2007, 03:46 PM
Holy mackerel, what kind of muzzleloader are you gonna use with 2015? That's not a muzzloader load, that's a marlin level .45-70 load!

No kidding! (Good catch Mat) That's not your Granddaddys smokepole :eek:

As far as the Beowulf; that cartridge was specifically designed to work in the AR. ARs were designed to function with a specific amount of force on the bolt. Both rounds exert about the same pressure on the bolt (the Beowulf has a bit more, but not enough to require any changes in the AR design.)

LeibstandarteAdH
August 19, 2007, 06:42 PM
So for example, what kind of a larger platform would you need to provide the .50beowulf with to perform at maximum performance?

a mauser action, a mosin action, a break open ect...

and no it can not simply "move back to relieve the pressure" unless your talking about moving back past the locking lugs themselves through the thin aluminum recievor and drilled into your head.

benEzra
August 19, 2007, 09:27 PM
You serious? The bolt face? I'm sure you know a lot more than I do but that's pretty hard for me to believe. What happens when a bolt face fails?
The usual failure mode is for the bolt locking lugs to shear off, I would imagine; they're pretty thin on an AR. I have seen pics of catastrophic AR bolt failures; not pretty. AFAIK, AR's are a lot more prone to fatigue cracking of the bolt lugs than most designs, because the lugs are so narrow, and are stressed asymmetrically.

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