SKS legality question


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yesit'sloaded
August 18, 2007, 12:44 AM
I happen to have one of the rare SKS carbines that will shoot 1 inch groups at 100 yards with good ammo and a good rest. As the barrel is good but the stock is so short and crummy feeling I have been wanting to replace some parts without destroying any of the originals. In mind is the Choate machine and tool Dragunuv style stock and a removable bipod. A friend of mine said that if I do that, the stock counts as a pistol grip and if I later decide to use detachable magazines (although I never have heard of one that works reliably) that the rifle would be an illegal imported assault rifle. ? I thought the Assault Weapons Bann was over. I would call BS but he knows alot about that kind of stuff and never has ben wrong before

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GRIZ22
August 18, 2007, 12:57 AM
You have to remember that changing the stock and other parts may also make your 1" SKS a 4" SKS. If I had one that was that accurate and wanted to keep it that way I'd look into getting a slip on recoil pad that would lengthen the stock a bit.

I also might do nothing. I'd curse at the short stock and it would still shoot accurately. One can screw things up in search of aesthetics.

yesit'sloaded
August 18, 2007, 01:08 AM
That was why I was looking something that requires no modification so I can go right back to all original if I want to. I was just concerned with the possiblility of making it illegal to own. If you were wondering past 150 yards it starts to do the famous 7.62x39 rainbow curve.

Mojo-jo-jo
August 18, 2007, 01:13 AM
You can get an extended recoil pad (adds about 1 inch to the stock) that attaches to the existing stock using the existing butt plate screws. I put one of these on mine and it is amazing how much that added 1 inch helps.

I can't remember where I bought it, it was somewhere online.

That might help solve your stock length problem without changing the stock, and seems to be more solid (and longer) than most of the slip-on recoil pads.

yesit'sloaded
August 18, 2007, 01:19 AM
Is that the same as the pad on the yugos? I almost bought one but the night sights, bayonet, and grenade launcher seemed a little silly and the thing felt so much heavier than any other SKS.

cuervo
August 18, 2007, 02:28 AM
You're running into the 1989 ban on importing assault weapons which is still alive and possibly the 1994 ban on Chinese assault weapons, not the 1994-2004 ban on US-made assault weapons.

Basically, it is difficult to modify an SKS and remain 922(r) legal. Replacing a straight-stock with a pistol-grip is the first step in manufacturing your own assault weapon, so you have to keep an eye on the number of US vs. original foreign parts. Again, it is very difficult to modify an SKS and remain legal. This is one of those areas that is going to come back and bite a lot of people when they say they want the existing laws enforced more, because many people don't know they're illegal.

Best advice is to replace the straight stock with a straight stock, or leave it completely alone.

Here are some links:
http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=27678
http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html

musher
August 18, 2007, 02:47 AM
Cuervo's right. The problem is that it is not legal to assemble a foreign made firearm that is not importable.

Being semi-auto and having a bayonet would prevent SKS rifles from being importable EXCEPT that they are C&R's--which makes them importable.

Problem is, if you change the configuration "significantly" (whatever ATF decides that means) then the rifle no longer qualifies as C&R. If the rifle isn't C&R eligible anymore, then it isn't importable.

Does adding an aftermarket synthetic sporter stock make the rifle no longer eligible as a C&R gun? Who knows. Importers have been neutering the grenade launcher on yugo 59/66's and selling them, so it appears that "some" modification (even permanent) might be all right, but how much...well, you've gotta get prosecuted and go to court to find out.

Thing is, that even with an ATF letter saying you're good to go, they could always change their mind later and come after you.

Of course, if you can round up enough US made parts, you can turn the gun into a "US MADE" sks (legally speaking) and the whole issue goes out the window. Then you can do anything you want to the thing.

yesit'sloaded
August 18, 2007, 11:46 AM
I did some research and found out that to make it legal with the stock I want I need to replace the

stock-$80
magazine (counts as 3 parts)-$20
gas tube-$50
gas piston-$25
hand guard-included with stock
operating rod-$9

thats almost $200 worth of parts on a $130 rifle just so I can have the stock I want if I read the ten or less right. If done that leaves the
trigger group including sear
receiver
bolt
barrel
receiver cover
recoil spring
and bolt follower as the only parts that are original.
guess I'm going with the butt pad.:(

buck00
August 18, 2007, 11:53 AM
Just to add perspective. Lets say you modify your SKS or AK cosmetically- add a different grip, stock, etc, and you are in technical violation.

I hate to sound blunt, but who cares? :confused:

The reason I ask- does the ATF do random audits of gun ranges where they examine the grips on rifles?

Neo-Luddite
August 18, 2007, 11:57 AM
What kind of sks? When did it enter the US?

Domino
August 18, 2007, 12:44 PM
Opps, mispost.

zoom6zoom
August 18, 2007, 02:24 PM
I've never heard of anyone prosecuted for a 922(r) violation - but I wouldn't want to be the first, either.

ndolson
August 18, 2007, 03:05 PM
You should be able to add a dragunov style stock without having to worry about 922r. I may be mistaken though.

Also, the Choate stock is way above and beyond in quality than the ATI. Please, don't get the ATI. My brother did, and I was very disappointed with it.

If you want to be sure, I believe tapco sells a US compliance kit for ~$60 that will give you the part count you need.

jpwilly
August 18, 2007, 03:11 PM
Keep the SKS the way it is and get an AK to be it's companion!

ndolson
August 18, 2007, 03:14 PM
I agree. And quite honestly, I've never shot my SKS's (SKSii?) again since buying an AK. I'm weird like that. If you're planning to trick it out with a new stock, hi cap mags that may or may not work, tacticool scopes, bipods, etc...you might as well have just taken that $300 + $200 for the rifle and bought what it is you're trying to make anyway.

railroader
August 18, 2007, 03:28 PM
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=78292450 Here's what the stock extensions look like. I have one on my norinco. Mark

http://san1.atlanta.gbhinc.com/GB/078292000/78292450/pix1884216250.jpg

Elmer
August 18, 2007, 03:56 PM
I hate to sound blunt, but who cares?

The reason I ask- does the ATF do random audits of gun ranges where they examine the grips on rifles?

I understand the attitude, but putting yourself in the position of going to prison, or spending a fortune to keep from going, isn't worth making some mods on a rifle, imho.....

The odds of having a problem might be small, but you could also drive around for years with a pound of cocaine in your trunk and not have a problem. But most of us would be awful worried if we were........

yesit'sloaded
August 18, 2007, 05:58 PM
guess I'm going with the pad....keep saving up for the HK 93

Ian Sean
August 18, 2007, 09:44 PM
railroader nailed it....I have the same pad on my AK's and SKS's...it adds an inch and really helped me...I have long arms and made shooting much more comfortable.

riddleofsteel
August 19, 2007, 12:28 AM
I too have an exceptional SKS. After some minor adjustments it was able to keep 1.5" groups at 100 yards. That's 5 to 10 round groups! I don't know what it will do beyond that because I never shoot it beyond that.

I have installed a two piece quick disconnect scope mount that is drilled and tapped into the side of the receiver. I also smoothed and angled the ejector and opened up the ejection port for fewer jams shooting with the 4x Simmons rubber armored scope on board. I also installed a smoothed and cleaned up trigger group.
The most important addition was a Bell & Carlson stock. These are the Cadillacs of SKS stocks. The bedding of the rear part of the action is not nearly so important as the forward section near where the barrel joins the action. I have found this to be true of most rifles with pinned barrels. Bed and support the forward section of the action and the first two inches of the barrel. DO NOT FREE FLOAT THE BARREL. The sheet metal support at the front of the stock will act as a pivot and actually force movement in the barrel/action assembly.

http://yerfrockethellhound.com/bcskscammo.JPG

Travis McGee
August 19, 2007, 12:43 AM
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

If it shoots that good, don't change it! Put on a nice padded stock extender, and enjoy!

dfaugh
August 19, 2007, 08:32 AM
FYI---I believe the "Dragunov" style stocks are considered "thumbhole" stock (with a REALLY big thumbhole), not a pistol grip...FWIW

Domino
August 19, 2007, 11:24 AM
I have been informed the dragunov style stocks are not going to make a rifle non-922r compiant. It counts as a thumbhole stock and not a true pistol grip. Check out SKS.boards to find out what you need to know...

http://www.sksboards.com/smf/

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