[twoblink]

Thus far,

I've got an M1Carbine savings spreadsheet, and a GP100 savings spreadsheet.

Do I need to start a savings spreadsheet for a .44?

A friend asked if I had a .44, I said no, I thought .357 will take care of most everything I need, but he asked if I've researched that thoroughly, I had to answer no..

So..

Do I need (I mean.. err.. should I add a .44 onto my want list)?

What can a .44 do that a 357 won't? Then I can see if it fulfills one of my needs, or fills a niche I don't yet have.

[RUT]

>>What can a .44 do that a 357 won't?<<

Cost you a fortune to shoot!

[Ala Dan]

Recoil a lot more than a .357 magnum!:uhoh: :D

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

[Boats]

Sit in the safe? The .357 Mag is a way better all arounder.

[Old Pa]

It took me nearly twenty years to realize the secret of .44Mag happiness: 95% lead, 5% jacketed! Check out Elmer Keith's 2400 powder loads for 240 gr. Keith type lead bullets. It's like plinking! And (relatively) cheap.

In answer to your question; everything. Better. And the recoil is more of a push than the sharp vicious twist of a hot .357Mag. Of course .44Mag is also the transition cartridge from handguns to long guns for me.

[Phil in Seattle]

Why it'll tear your head clean off (punk)

What will it do... hmmmmmmmm it will knock over the steel plate target that 9mms, 40s, and 45s only bounced off of.

It will put a bigger hole in whatever needs holes put in it.

[Edward429451]

The 44 is more versatile, more frontal area, more weight, bigger payload of shot cartridges, the same or less perceived recoil from comparable weight/loads. As far as potential double duty goes, you can download 44 loads to be more street effective with less problems than you can load up a 357 to mountain loads for bear defense etc., The 357's are just easier to carry, less weight.

The 44's seem to have a wider range of ballistic options and are extremly easy to load for. They're only more expensive to shoot if you do not handload. I can load up 50 bear stompers for about 4 bucks.

Straight lead, no gimmicks, hands down 44.:)

[Frohickey]

A 44Mag will have you getting the Dirty Harry DVD collectors set. :D
And you will see yourself practicing all of Clint Eastwood's lines. :D :D

Seriously, a 44Mag would be more versatile than a 357Mag, especially if you reload. And you can go for light-recoiling plinking loads, to heavy-hitting hunting loads, and everything in between.

For me though, a 45Colt would be better. It shares the same caliber bullets as my 45ACP, it can do what the 44Mag can do, with less pressure, and wear/tear on the gun. Its nostalgic. The only drawback I see is that I have to keep saying "Its 45Colt, there is no long in 45Colt!!!" :cuss: :p

[Gordon]

I think that the .357 is a better human defense weapon;loads have been developed and optimized for that purpose for last 30 years. It carries in smaller/lighter formats. Recovery time(shot to shot 'splits') is faster with .357 hands down. .44 is MUCH BETTER hunting round on deer on up. I'm sure it puts the definitive hurt on BGs IF bullet opens AND you hit them right THE FIRST TIME. Now guys I know somebody has a Jerry Miculek .44 pin gun out there but get real! Over all I'll take a good 629 4" over any thing else if I don't have to pack it for long. If I had to pack it a 3" mod 60 or a 2.5"-4" " mod 19 or 66 is hard to beat HP to weight ratio(I'm not up on the 7&8 shot Ti stuff). Plus you can plink with .38's that no light .44 loads approach in comfort.:cool:

[Shane]

If you reload (so you can afford to shoot a lot), a .44 magnum is more versatile. Its a good choice for larger game. The .44 magnum is better suited to Grizzleys, elk, and other larger animals than the .357 magnum is. A rifle is best of course, but if all you can pack around is a revolver the .44 magnum can do the job against large animals if shot placement is good.

The disadvantage of the .44 magnum IMO is recoil, factory ammo availabilty, and cost. If you don't reload, the factory ammo is pricey and relatively harder to find than a .357 magnum (our Big 5 store only has ONE load of factory .44 magnum for example and NO .44 special loads). . Recoil can be overcome with practice, but even so without good shooting gloves I find that my hand becomes bruised MUCH QUICKER using a .44 magnum than with a .357 magnum.

The .357 magnum is my favorite of the magnums, but for certain applications such as big game is not quite as versatile.

[Edward429451]

Plus you can plink with .38's that no light .44 loads approach in comfort

Hah! Try 10.0 grains of 2400 behind a 180 gr wadcutter...Zero muzzle rise!
Thats the good of 44, it loads down as good as it loads up.:D

Just don't use the load disclaimer.;) My pockets aint very deep.

[Mike Irwin]

Kick hard.

It's very likely that had the Dirty Harry movies never come out that the .44 Mag. would be a niche cartridge.

Prior to 1972, when the first DH movie came out, the .44s were selling, but not in any great numbers. Up until then it was a specialist's cartridge.

When DH hit the streets, though, S&W and other manufacturers couldn't keep the gun in stock it was selling so quickly.

The .44 Magnum is really no more and no less versatile than the .357 Magnum because it fits into a slightly different niche.

[Porter Rockwell]

What the heck does a spread sheet have to do with shooting?
The 44 Maggie is a legend, pretty much a Must Have in every mans handgun collection.
180gnHPs@1800fps+ are an experience to pass on to to the mere mortals who pretend gun expertise.
330gnLFNs@1300fps are capable for any thing that walks the planet.

[Blueduck]

Since I don't hunt with a handgun anymore, just as good if not better self defense ammo is available in 357 magnum, for me the only thing a .44 magnum would do better is make .074" larger holes in paper. That could come in handy I guess ;)

[Marko Kloos]

Things a .44Mag will do a .357Mag won't?

Throw a much heavier bullet.

Seriously, while I consider the .357 Magnum a much better and more flexible self-defense cartridge, the .44 Magnum can do things that a .357 cannot do, like throw a 240 grain hard cast bullet at 1000fps+.

While the .44 Magnum is a less than ideal self-defense round when loaded hot (too much recoil, noise and penetration), it really comes into its own as a hunting round.

[twoblink]

Porter..

If you don't have a savings spreadsheet, in which you contribute a small amount (or large amount) to the gun you want; what is going to happen is, you are going to go on a buying frinzy, and then you will owe on the credit card.... until 2012...

:banghead:

Hunting? Isn't that what a 308 is for?? :D

The ammo cost consideration means I'd have to handload..

Need to start a Lee Press savings spreadsheet.. ouch..

A must have huh? I'll consult with my logistics about that.. But it's tempting just to walk around and say a few dirty harry lines..

[Pappy John]

Some of the most disagreeable handgun loads I've ever shot have been through my old 686. My .44's might have more recoil energy, but it doesn't seem as harsh to me. And i've also got great plinking loads too. Bottom line for me is...over the years, what were once my .357's have all gone to someone elses collections and I've added .44's...and I'm still looking for more.

[YodaVader]

"It will put a bigger hole in whatever needs holes put in it."

Kind of what I had in mind as well! I have both - 357 in a 686 and 44 in 629. The 686 is a 6" and the 629 a 6.5". Have to totally disagree with those who state the 44 having milder recoil. That is , when both revolvers are shot with full house mag loads. I have accuracy tested both from the bench and there is a definite difference when the 44 is fired as compared to the 357! Although both are easily manageable in these longer barrled guns.

[kentucky bucky]

A .41 magnum is better than both!!!!! When in doubt split the difference!!!!;)

(gotta handload though)

[Frohickey]

Harry: "I know what you're thinking: "Did he fire six shots, or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth in all this excitement, I've kinda lost track myself. But, being this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya punk?"

[caz223]

If .44 mag and .357 mag were the answer to everything, we wouldn't have the .41 magnum (Or the 10mm.).
I shoot 210 grain bullets at 1300 fps in .41, not brutal at all, and they seem rather effective on deer, etc.
If you want to shoot lite, handload some 170 grain bullets at 1000 fps, you basically have a .40 short and wimpy.
Best of both worlds.
.41 seems to be easier to load for than .357 mag.
The first two loads I tried, I obtained excellent accuracy, and haven't tried any others.
If anybody has a good super accurate load for the .357, I am more than interested.
Till then, I am reduced to shooting 158 grain magtech through my .357s.
My best accuracy results in .357 are with magtech, which is much, much better than any of my reloads in that caliber.

[YodaVader]

"If anybody has a good super accurate load for the .357, I am more than interested.
Till then, I am reduced to shooting 158 grain magtech through my .357s.
My best accuracy results in .357 are with magtech, which is much, much better than any of my reloads in that caliber."

I always found the 357 easy to load for accuracy using reloads in my revolvers , single shot TC and even a Marlin lever action. The 686 wore a scope when I shot these benchrest 6 and 12 shot groups. The load data is on the targets. I would consider the 686 to shoot pretty well. The TC groups are smaller still.

[Gordon]

I have a new model Blackhawk in .44spl and same gun in .357. loaded with specials , 158grain round nose lead at 800, and 240 round nose lead at 775fps the .44 give 1.5 times the recoil sensation. Not much mind you, but that seems to be the disparity all the way up the spectrum.:)

[Porter Rockwell]

Save yer pennies and dollars twoblink! The larger problem is really deciding which S&W 44 Maggie to save up for??
Quest out the old Elmer Keith books or online articles as there's much history documented both defensive and hunting as well as long range plinking with all the barrel lengths.
The vintage Smiths have legendary fit and finish and are priced for the collector IMO, the newer Enhanced models (Dash -4 and above) are built with much harder steel alloys to hold up to full power loads W/O loosening up the works.
I'd suggest you test fire a few different barrel lengths and grip styes (if the grips don't fit YOUR hand properly, pain and bleeding can occur) to assure the 44 Magnum suits you?

[Dr.Rob]

Well where I live a .357 mag isn't legal for big game, where a .41 mag or a .44 mag is.

That was my excuse to get a 44.

[JohnKSa]

the .44 Magnum can do things that a .357 cannot do, like throw a 240 grain hard cast bullet at 1000fps+.
Corbon has a hunting load for the 44 that throws a 300 grainer at 1350fps.

[Majic]

What can a .44 do that a 357 won't?

The most obvious is chamber a .429 bullet. :neener:

[Frohickey]

With handgun velocities, you are not going to cause tissue damage using hydrostatic shock. With this in mind, its better to get more bullet diameter as that would cause more tissue damage as it crushes when you hit the target.

If you are only doing target shooting, having larger holes can increase your score if you are no where near the center of the scoring rings, since the larger hole will tend to cover more area, and likely hit the higher scoring ring.

But all of this is for naught if you are so recoil-shy that you can't properly control/maintain sight alignment/picture when you press the trigger. Hence, the advice to reload for light recoil loads for the 44Mag.

[Mike Irwin]

"With this in mind, its better to get more bullet diameter as that would cause more tissue damage as it crushes when you hit the target."

Then why are we so concerned with what the obviously wimpy .44 Mag. will do better?

Why aren't we asking, "What will the .577 Howdah do that the .44 Mag. won't do?"

Even the .577's a wussy cartridge compared to my newest pocket rocket, which chambers the same shells used by the French Mle. 1902 37mm Trench Howitzer...



:)

[twoblink]

Well..

I won't go huntin' with a handgun, as I believe that's what a rifle is for..

So plinking is probably all I'd do with handguns..

.44 ballistics doesn't sound all that great for humans; as far as homeD is concerned. And I don't think CCW is even a question here.. So..

I was just wondering aside from knocking more steel down faster, what it can do..

Oh, but it _DOES_ have that Dirty Harry appeal.. I might get one based on the strength of that alone!

[Tamara]

I won't go huntin' with a handgun, as I believe that's what a rifle is for..

It's also what handguns are for. And bows. And boar spears. And...

So plinking is probably all I'd do with handguns..

That's mostly what I do with my .44 Mags.

.44 ballistics doesn't sound all that great for humans; as far as homeD is concerned. And I don't think CCW is even a question here.. So..

Which ".44 ballistics"? There are so many different loadings, ranging from 165gr to 300+gr that I'm pretty sure you can find one that should work for goblins. (Cor-Bon's 165gr/1300fps load doesn't sound too "overpowered"...) I CCW my 3" 629 loaded with 240gr JHPs on occasion; no one has adequately explained to me why a bigger, heavier, faster bullet, with more energy, is somehow going to be less effective for defense.

I was just wondering aside from knocking more steel down faster, what it can do..

There's a saying in the knife world: "A big knife can be pressed into service to do little knife jobs, but a little knife can't do big knife jobs." You can plink with an elephant rifle (albeit unpleasantly), but you can't take elephants with a .22lr. You need to figure out what the biggest job you expect it to do is, and buy to suit.

...or just abandon all this 'logistical' stuff and buy a gun just because you want it.

[BigG]

The 44 is definitely more accurate than the 357. 44s often will put all their bullets in a tiny group. Of course that is off the benchrest but the potential accuracy is greater in the larger caliber.

[Mike Irwin]

"The potential accuracy is greater in the larger caliber..."

Untrue.

"Potential" accuracy is a fine thing to discuss theoretically, but the only way "potential" accuracy can be measured is by actually firing the round, at which point its no longer potential. You simply can't look at a round, or its design specifications, and say "That's going to be one accurate round!"

Potential accuracy is nothing more than a chimera used to confuse issues and cloud discussions.

In the years I spent with American Rifleman magazine, the .357 Magnum revolvers were every bit as accurate as those .44s which we tested.

Using the theory that a larger round has greater potential accuracy, which somehow then translates over to practical accuracy, the .22 LR should be an inaccurate round. The MOST accurate firearm we ever tested was a Freedom Arms revolver in .22 LR, the second most accurate was a Freedom Arms in .357, and the third most accurate was a Freedom Arms .44. The group width that separated the three was less than 1/4 of an inch.

[braindead0]

For me though, a 45Colt would be better. It shares the same caliber bullets as my 45ACP

I guess that's true if you ingore the .002" difference...

[Ledbetter]

As Tamara said, buy it because you want it. The Dirty Harry factor is "just" for show and tell.

Plus, it's way louder and boomier. The recoil is, to put it mildly, exhilerating enough to be an e-ticket ride.

And, for me at least, there is no choice but a S&W Mountain Gun.

KABAAMMM.:what:

[keano44]

I've never compared my .357Magnum to my .44Magnum to justify having them. I just wanted each of them. (I also never made a spreadsheet before buying a gun.):D

[RandyB]

Actually I am looking to get a .45 colt/ .44 mag to go along with my .357. I think that the .44 is better for hunting than the .357. I think that the .44 is better in a carbine than the .357.

My question is after I get my .45/.44

Do I need a .480, .454, .500 ? Esp. if I get one of them in a carbine?:confused:

[Edward429451]

Weeelllll, lets just say that 357's are for the masses, and the 44's are for the mensa types!:D

OK, just kidding folks, but seriously, isn't comparing 357's and 44's kind of like comparing 223's and 308's?

Different niche's. Each is sorta specialized in its own way.

[Tamara]

If you don't have a savings spreadsheet, in which you contribute a small amount (or large amount) to the gun you want; what is going to happen is, you are going to go on a buying frinzy, and then you will owe on the credit card....

A writer once defined "provincialism" as "believing that the customs of one's tribe are the immutable laws of the universe." Some of us buy the guns we want and still use cash to do so. We're just more refined in our wants. ;)

Hunting? Isn't that what a 308 is for?? :D

...and a .44 Mag, and a .30-30, and a .45-70, and a .22-250, and a...

What are you hunting, and how do you wish to hunt it? :D

The ammo cost consideration means I'd have to handload..

Nonsense. :scrutiny:

Reasonably priced .44 Mag factory ammo is available in the MagTech, Winchester Whitebox, Remington UMC, Georgia Arms and other factory loadings. If you can afford to shoot .45 ACP, you can afford to shoot .44 Magnum.

Quit rationalizing: If you want a .44 Magnum, then buy one. If you don't, stop making up bogus 'logistical' reasons.

[Majic]

I guess that's true if you ingore the .002" difference...

Not all guns chambered in .45Colt requires .454" bullets. Alot of them do indeed use .452" bullets.

[SteelyDan]

The .44 mags aren't for everyone. If you're recoil sensitive, the .357 is probably a much better choice, plus it's a lot more versatile in the first place. But, there is still something special about the old .44...

In practical terms (or spreadsheet categories), I can only come up with three advantages for the .44. First, if you camp or fish in bear country, a .44 is much more comforting than a .357. Second, if you want to hunt, well, others have covered that. Third, after a bad day or week at work, when you just want to relieve some stress, the .44 is a great choice.

I'd suggest trying before buying. The kick really is manageable, but, again, it's not for everyone.

[Majic]

I just gotta ask.....how is the .357mag more versatile than the .44mag?

[SteelyDan]

Majic, if your question was directed at me, my point was that the .357 is probably the ultimate "if you could only have one" wheelgun. Shoots a huge range of bullets in .357, including top-rated M&S manstoppers, plus you've got the .38 option. And compared to a .44, it's lighter and easier to conceal. I'm not dissing the .44, I have two and love them.

[Glamdring]

Well the first handgun I purchased was a 357. In large part because of what all the Gun Rags said about the 357.

I still have that gun, a Ruger Security Six with 4" barrel.

But once I bought my first 44 mag, a 4" SW629, I basically stopped shooting the 357.

If you want defense ammo the 44 special loaded with 200 Gold Dot HP is just about perfect. It is factory loaded by Speer and Georgia arms. Gives you same ballistis as 45 acp with a HUGE hollowpoint. And the recoil is much less than any 357 MAG load IMO.

For hunting deer sized critters with 4" or 6" revolvers, 44 mag 240 grain hollowpoints will work much better than any 357 loads I know about.

Then you have the 300+ grain hardcast bullets for big big game.

IMO this is how 357 and 44 compare:

Self Defense 38+P/158LHP @ 800+ fps VS 44spec/200GDHP @ 800+ fps
Deer hunting 357/158 JHP/JSP @ 1200+ fps VS 44mag/240 JHP/JSP @ 1200+ fps
Bigger than Deer hunting 357/180 hardcast @ 1200 VS 44mag/300 hardcast @ 1200

***
Hi vel Defense 357/125 JHP @ 1450 VS 44mag(handload)/165 JHP @ 1450

[Mike Irwin]

You know, it's funny.

I LOVE the .357 Magnum -- I've got 5, and am looking for my 6th.

I LOVE the .41 Magnum. I've got a wonderful Model 58, and want to get a .57.

I LOVE the .44 Spl. I've got a Model 24-3 that is one of the sweetest guns I've ever handled. I want to get a Model 24 with a 4" tube in the near future.

The .44 Mag.?

For some reason I've just never been able to warm up to it, and I don't know why.

I'd much rather have a .45 Long Colt than a .44 Mag. I've repeatedly passed up good buys on .44 Mags.

[Legionnaire]

As Mike said, "it's funny." People's preferences, that is.

I like .357 and .44 (and should take possession of a .41 this coming week). I shoot the .44 far more than the .357, however. This fall, I plan to start reloading so I can shoot it even more, and play with different loads for different applications.

But you asked, what does the .44 do "better?" To that I say: (1) take medium and up sized game; and (2) roar! I have a Taurus M44 with a 4" ported barrel that is a hoot to shoot, especially outdoors around dusk. I'd never hunt with it. It's primarily a fun shooter, although I do carry it hiking sometimes.

I got into pistol shooting with semi-autos, then added revolvers. I still prefer the semi-autos for concealed carry, but I find the revolvers far more fun to shoot at the range, and thus far, the .44 is king!

[firestar]

If you don't handload, the .357 is a much better choice because .38spl ammo is probably the second cheapest centerfire ammo next to 9mm. It doesn't sound like you have any specific duties that you want either gun to preform so I assume that it will be just a fun/range gun. The .44mag has the fun factor nailed! It is way more fun to shoot .44mags than to shoot .357+Ps. Hot .357s sting and are unpleasant but hot .44s just have a bigger boom and more muzzle rise (actually it is more like entire gun and both arms rise than muzzel rise) but it doesn't sting like a hot .357.

If you get a .44mag, consider a SA revolver like the Ruger Blackhawk because it helps to roll the recoil in your hand. Also, not too many people shoot the .44mag in DA anyway.

[Edward429451]

I agree with firestar on the 44. When I break out the 320's and shoot it from the bench, it rings that steel bench like a gong when it goes off, turning many heads at the range.:D

Almost too much fun.:evil:

[yesterdaysyouth]

all this cost spreadsheet noise is taking all of the fun out of it....

either you have the cash in hand or you don't....

so

you either you buy the gun or save up the cash to buy the gun.... :D

has anyone here ever had to justify a firearm purchase???
chances are, if you have, then i bet it was to your wife.... :rolleyes::neener:

[Standing Wolf]

My carry gun is a .357 magnum. If I were sizeable enough to conceal it and/or could carry openly everywhere I go, I'd pack a .44 magnum. That said™, the .357 magnum is my favorite all around cartridge. I normally load it down to light .38 special levels for target shooting, but it can be hot-loaded just about as easily. Light .44 special loads in .44 magnum cases can still be a bit much for what's left of my wrist sometimes.

[444]

I think this is another one of these subjects where, if you have to justify it or come up with some reason for it, then you shouldn't buy it.
I love the .357 cartridge. I own over a dozen handguns in that chambering.
I also love the .44 Mag and have three of them. I shoot my .357s 100:1 over the .44s, but that doesn't mean I don't want the .44s. All three of my .44s are very acccurate. They are also a lot of fun to shoot and a great cartridge to handload. I can't give you any valid reason why I own either one of them other than the fact that I wanted them. And this is all the reason I need.

[schapman43]

The price of .44 Mag cartridges isnt bad at all. I pay $12.99 for 50 a bit less than I pay for .45 ACP.

[AV1611]

I'm a fan of the 45 Colt myself. I like the recoil of hot 45 Colt out of a Blackhawk much better than the recoil of hot 44 Mag out of a Smith 629. Also, if you're going to use it for hunting you're going to shoot the thing single action anyway. I find Peacemaker type grips much more comfortable and far better at taming heavy recoil than any double action hogleg.

AV1611 out...

[tex_n_cal]

I once stuck a can in the fork of a tree and shot at it with my .44, with full power loads. On the third shot half the tree fell down. Bet ya can't do that with a .357:evil:

[Frohickey]

I once stuck a can in the fork of a tree and shot at it with my .44, with full power loads. On the third shot half the tree fell down. Bet ya can't do that with a .357.

What kind of can was it? :D :p

[BigG]

Mike, when I said "potential" accuracy, I actually meant to say "inherent" accuracy. The 44 for some reason I'm not sure of is more inherently accurate than the 357 Maggie. Of course, it may be measurable only in fractions of an inch, but in target shooting and horseshoes, closer counts more. :D

For the same unfathomable reason, .308 Winchester is more inherently accurate than 30/06 Springfield, even though tons of development cash has been spent on both by Uncle Sugar.

[coldshot03/04]

Make a bigger hole?:neener: