How many of you have pulled your CCW in self defense?


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brian0128
July 6, 2003, 08:34 PM
I'm just curious. I wouldn't think it would be that common to actually have to fire your weapon but I wonder how many people have actually cleared leather for your own saftey or someone elses and did you have to fire it. If you had to fire it, what was the outcome legally.

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ACP230
July 6, 2003, 09:26 PM
I haven't had to draw my gun yet. I live in a pretty calm area and make an effort to see what is happening before it happens to me.
In the last couple of years I came close with two dogs, but one was restrained by its owner and the other backed off on its own.

brownie0486
July 6, 2003, 09:52 PM
Carrying since "71".
Pulled twice out of uniform.
Once at 2-3am in Jamaca Plain [Boston ]on two who followed me into an alley. I was on the way back to the car and they picked me up and followed. They were silhouetted at the street from my position in the alley. When they got within range [ hand shake distance ], I popped up and stuck the barrel of the gun under ones chin, keeping him between myself and the other one. Had them get on the ground and walked away with the statement that if I saw them exit the alley before I had departed I'd finish what they started. They complied.

Once at a phone booth in Roxbury [Boston ]on Blue Hill Ave. in a snow storm white out. I'm in the booth calling the office at 5pm [ winter time and dark as hell out ]to speak with other investigators before they leave for the day about tomorrows assigments and work loads. The caddy is running at the curb. Man comes up with a knife to the door smiling. Another is getting into the caddy. I give my location over the phone and that I'll call back in 5 minutes. No call, get BPD to the area as they will be needed.

Yank the heat from under the jacket and show the knifer at the tel booth. He backs up allowing me to open the door. I look around, can't see a damned thing past 5 feet and step onto the curb. The guy getting into the caddy gets out and runs across the street with his friend who had the knife. I jump in the caddy and head to the next phone booth. Call to the office was in time, no BPD called.

Brownie

skippie
July 6, 2003, 11:47 PM
4 times while workin, none while not

P95Carry
July 6, 2003, 11:52 PM
Not ''pulled'' ....... but in a WalMart parkin lot last year .... quite late ... had three punks closing in and looking like they were after makin some trouble ... they were drunk or high on something......... headed right at me ....

I only pulled back my shirt enough to show P95 .... not threatening just ... well, ''exposure'' ... it had desired effect!:) .... sure wasn't ''brandishment'' ..... ;)

Zeke Menuar
July 7, 2003, 12:15 AM
Once in a bathroom at a state park. Hard to hold on to your winkie and draw at the same time but the perp got the message and got back into his stall. Made a hasty retreat

A couple months ago two teen thugs jumped me on my way home from the store. One pulled a knife, I pulled a Streamlight and a 45, I blinded him enough to get away and call the cops. The kid lives right around the corner from me. He is still in juvenile detention for the (lame) attack on me and some other charges. Believe it or not his father came over and apologized to me. Nice man. I hope his kid gets his act together. As a result of this kid getting busted, all the druggies, thugs and wannabes stay the hell away from me when I go to the store. And some of them seemed to have moved a couple of blocks down the street to do their business.
The cops were very respectful when they came over. No harrassment. Wanted to see my ID and CHL. Asked about my carry gun in an informational way, how's it shoot etc. One asked about my training background since I an a lowly civilian. Asked if I wanted to press charges(Hell Yes). The cops think he may get tried as an adult but that hasn't been determined yet. I just want the kid to give up mugging folks and get a real job. Send him to prison and most likely he learns to be a better criminal.

ZM

Weimadog
July 7, 2003, 12:19 AM
Not me of course, but a friend... In this story referred to as "Fr."

In a bad section of town, at night, trying to deliver a court summons to a drug dealer. Friend parks across the street from where the drug dealer supposedly lives. Fr. gets out of car, and some street level drug dealer on foot (not the defendant in the summons) mumbles something about what he is selling. Fr. ingnores him. Fr reaches door, and some lowlife shouts from a car "Hey, do you owe me money?". "No, I don't think so." Car leaves.

Fr is now on drug dealer defendant's porch, boxed in with only one way out. Fr's gun is holstered. Drug dealer on foot (from previous paragraph) now has a buddy with him, and they approach. Drug dealer says "That guy said you owe him money." along with an I-am-going -to-kick-your-adds facial expression and body language.

Fr. says "Do not approach me." Drug dealer and buddy come closer. "Do not approach me". Drug dealer and buddy come closer.
Certainly no help would come from the other drug dealer behind the front door. Fr. feels the situation getting worse and worse.
Yeah, there are a lot of drug dealers in this story.

Fr. takes out the Surefire light, and pistol, and aims both at the closest threat. They don't come any closer. With their night vision ruined, the two goblins walk to a well lit area.
No shots were fired.

Fr. will not again go into such an area alone.

Weimadog

Solinvictus70
July 7, 2003, 12:23 AM
Back in 1993, I was working in a particularly bad area of Birmingham. I worked 2nd shift, so I left the shop at 11:30 or later. One night, I was driving home on the highway and a kid in a carload started waving a pistol in my direction. I held the wheel,drew with my right hand, and sighted him. They sped away. Something similar happened two years later.

Zundfolge
July 7, 2003, 12:49 AM
Quite a while back on GlockTalk (in their off topic forum) I remember reading an account of a self defense shooting ... I beilieve the guy's name was RoadRep or something like that.

Go over there and do a search, its an interesting read.

Sharpie1
July 7, 2003, 12:54 AM
I was attacked once by a dog while I was walking from my garage to the back door of my house. It was shot four times with a Kel-Tec 32. I sustained injury. It died. I won.

My new policy is that upon seeing any dog on my property - it will be killed on the spot. No exceptions.

TD

Pilgrim
July 7, 2003, 01:07 AM
Many years ago in Pomona, CA, the wife and I were exhibiting at a four day dog show at the Los Angeles County fairgrounds. We ran out of supplies in the motorhome and went into Pomona to stock up on provisions.

Pomona is a town where the convenience stores, liquor stores, and even the supermarkets have armed security guards.

After stocking up on groceries, my wife and I returned to our car. Groceries and wife were loaded in car when I noticed a fellow appear out of nowhere and walk towards me with his right hand in his jeans pocket. Try walking with your hand stuffed in your jeans pocket. It is awkward and uncomfortable.

I asked him what he wanted. He kept walking towards me. I asked him again in a louder voice. He kept walking towards me. I pushed back my jacket to show my holstered Ruger Security Six and my reserve deputy sheriff badge clipped to my belt. PDRK reserve officers have to have a CCW permit when they carry off duty. I again asked what he wanted in a very loud voice. I had my hand on the Ruger's grips and the holster unsnapped.

The fellow saw the gun and stammered, "I need some change for the bus to Azusa."

I told him, "I don't have any. Walk away and don't take your hand out of your pocket."

He walked away as I commanded. When he was about 15 yards away he looked over his shoulder and shouted loud enough for everyone in the parking lot to hear, "F__king cop!" I expect he had some backup hiding behind the parked cars.

sm
July 7, 2003, 01:16 AM
Came home to find someone waiting on me, had broken in through a back window.

Hotel in Dallas I was conducting business with sales reps. I went to the restroom, overheard a rukus, and got the drop on the BG holding up the sales reps.

At one place I worked, one had to set alarm and exit through back door. I let the Boss out front to drive around and pick me up and as I exited, BG jumped from roof. Boss never saw him, happened quick. Boss then understood why I had bitched about the security set-up. Changed the next day.

Neighbor got drunk, beating his wife (again) pulled a shotgun on wife and kids. I was Cooking outside on grill when kids ran to my yard, He confronted me with shotgun...I had kids call 911 from my house. He came back out with shotgun on his wife...he came back into my yard , threats to me, and his wife...yardage kept varying because I kept moving.

In another life, security was a real concern for myself and those close to me. I prefer this low profile one now. My first "encounter was as a kid and the front door crashing in...parents went to get medicine for a sick kid, and I'm watching the sibs.

Just learned early to be aware, watch six, and first rule "have a gun".

"One never knows the where or when of next encounter"- CRSam.

Devonai
July 7, 2003, 01:21 AM
Fall, 2002. While waiting for my next courier assignment on Washington Street in downtown Boston (Chinatown), a man approached my vehicle and demanded that I roll down the window.

Guy: Roll down the window.
Me: What for?
Guy: Just open your window.
Me: What do you want to talk about?
Guy: Open the :cuss: ing window, :cuss:
Me: I will not, what's your problem?

At that point this guy hauled back and hit my window as hard as he could (closed fist). I drew my Glock 17 from my shoulder holster and kept it hidden beneath my left arm.

Fortunately for both of us he decided not to hit my window again. If he'd broken it, I would have displayed my pistol in a defensive posture. Any further action on his part other than the use of a weapon would have resulted in me unlocking my door and hitting him with it as hard as I could. I have no idea if this was the best course of action, but I'm glad I didn't have to make that decision.

He walked away. After he'd walked far enough I exited my vehicle and filed a report with the State Police (the nearest LEOs).

To this day I have no idea what that guy's issue was.

Jeff OTMG
July 7, 2003, 03:12 AM
Three occurrances. One dead dog. Humans seem to know what a gun is and act accordingly. One guy followed me for blocks in New Orleans, didn't know if he wanted my wallet or a date, he left when confronted. 5 guys tried to abduct my girlfriend from a gas station phone booth. I was 35 feet behind them when she pointed me out. They saw me and left.

Zundfolge
July 7, 2003, 02:49 PM
Sounds like most of you guys have had "good" outcomes from pulling your CCW in self defense.

Sometimes it doesn't turn out "good" (I define "good" as nobody has to die and you don't go to jail).

Earlier I referenced a thread on GlockTalk about this and thought it would add a bit to this discussion so I went and dug it up.

http://glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=126319 (start reading at about the 6th or 7th post)

Not only did this guy have to draw in self defense but he had to kill ... its rather sobering and made me really sit down and think long and hard about the consequences of carrying for self defense.

While things eventualy worked out fine for him, its still a road I hope any of you or I never have to travel (although the unarmed alternative would have been much much worse)

El Tejon
July 7, 2003, 03:08 PM
Zun, Problem #2 is never fun even though scoffed at by GSCs.:(

Twice--dog, not dead like Jeff's, but hit by car and thus did not have to shoot [Hooray! Happened when I was a LEO--can you imagine the outrage over a LEO killing someone's doggie?]. First time was a kid with a baseball bat. These kids today! No bloodshed as well. Happy day!

Edward429451
July 7, 2003, 03:53 PM
3-1/2 times.

Dog attack, one in the grass turned him from attack.

Strongarm of me & wife by two men, backstepped and put my hand on it but didn't have to draw. They left.

Mixup with a tow truck driver. My crummy brother got stuck and called my wife to pull him out with our pickup, truck slid down ditch and locked up our pickup so a tow truck had to be called. He got him out and he left without paying the man and left my wife to deal with the towman. He wanted to seize our pickup but couldn't cause she had our kids with her. I called them later and offered to pay half to get them off our back. They said yes and I went down to pay and just as I pulled in the tow guys surrounded our truck and said they were going to seize it. One of em came up and jerked open my door and started to reach in to grab the keys, saw the CA Bulldog on dash with my hand getting ever closer, and backed off.

Once as a security guard to a guy I had to hit with a PR-24 who attacked me (drunk) when I told him to stop slapping his wife around in the bowling alley. Hit him three times with the PR, lots of blood, suddenly he went for his pocket real fast so I dropped the PR and drew the colt to low ready. He very slowly pulled out his car keys, cussing me all the while and got in his car.

Never shot anyone or anything, thank God.

OF
July 7, 2003, 05:08 PM
I would encourage everyone to read the posts by RoadRep in the link that Zunfoldge provided. An extremely thorough, detailed and open after-action report. A must read.

- Gabe

2nd Amendment
July 7, 2003, 05:40 PM
Couple times, neither very intense as these things go. Last was in '92 when I pulled up at my restaurant and saw the front door glass smashed. Glass was still falling. I went through that door and the inner was also smashed. Had an old Ruger 9mm at the ready as I checked the place, but I forgot something obvious, the cash register counter. As I came back out from the kitchen the kid, who had been hiding there, bolted for the back door and damn near took it off the hinges leaving(big steel fire door, I was impressed to say the least :D ). He had the big butcher knife from the kitchen and I restrained myself from giving chase. Cops picked him up an hour later, hiding under an old bus nearby. Idiot still had the knife. :rolleyes:

CWL
July 7, 2003, 05:54 PM
Once helped a teenager out of my backyard. He must have been lost since my G17 helped him find the way out.

Once left hostile area because my 9mm didn't match their artillery support.

Backed out of narrow alley in Phnom Penh because oncoming driver showed his CCW.

Meowhead
July 8, 2003, 12:37 PM
The first time happened on a deserted country road. Two friends in the car, all carrying. To make a long story short, a battered Ford truck sped past us, swung back onto the road and slammed on its brakes, blocking the way. The driver jumped out and charged our car, found himself staring into the muzzles of three guns, changed his mind, jumped back in his truck, drove off. While leaving he was waving his hand from the back window, making the universal gesture for gun - fist clenched, index finger extended, thumb cocked. Likely gesturing to the van which had pulled up behind us. Later that week he was caught, and we learned it was all standard operating procedure for some local guys that had decided to play highway robbery.

Second incident took place at two AM in Gary, IN. It was murder capital of the US at the time, and unpleasant neighborhood in general, so I made a habit of keeping a gun in the car.* Anyway, same situation; I was driving home from work when a car cut me off and screeched to a halt, blocking the road. He didn't do a very good job of it though; left enough room for me to swerve past and run, which I did. So in the end, this incident may not qualify for this thread - but I would like to point out that having my BHP in the passenger seat was very, very comforting at the moment.

*clear violation of company policy. The company shall remain unnamed, but people might recognize it from the fact that its employees are responsible for a popular euphemism for 'going nuts at work and shooting everyone in sight.' Faced with a rash of employees coming in and gunning their coworkers, the management decided to make guns forbidden in the workplace. Brilliant! Oh yeah, and the company might have something to do with mail.

tetchaje1
July 8, 2003, 12:59 PM
A lot of people don't talk about those things very openly on public forums. RoadRep's experience is a very eye-opening read, and I know of several other members who have only shared their experiences (like his, with shots fired and dead people) in confidence.

However, you will find a lot more people willing to talk about close calls, and guns pulled without shots fired. Here was a good thread over at SIGForum about the same thing.

http://sigforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=674608412&f=320601935&m=8556035&r=5176035#5176035

...and another where UXB and a few others actually related experiences like RoadRep's at GT.

http://sigforum.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=674608412&f=320601935&m=2256095302&r=5396095302#5396095302

spacemanspiff
July 8, 2003, 01:48 PM
i drew the weapon out the other day, had to clear my parents house as it was broken into on the 4th. came home that evening to a wide open door. told mom and the kids to stay outside. no one was in there, and nothing was missing, but the place was searched by someone, and a neighbor gave a description of a vehicle. we didnt call police since nothing was taken.
at least now mom is convinced that locking the deadbolts instead of just the doorknobs is a good thing. whoever it was that broke in used a card or something to open the door.

Zundfolge
July 8, 2003, 03:24 PM
spacemanspiff, keep in mind that house clearing is generaly considered a 2 man job ... most cops will tell you to NEVER clear a house by yourself.

Glad it went well though.

PeteyPete
July 8, 2003, 03:39 PM
http://glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=126319

Wow.....:eek:

spacemanspiff
July 8, 2003, 04:00 PM
i hadnt thought about that zund... in retrospect, i should have just grabbed the phone and called 911 and let police clear the house. theres very few places a person could hide in that house.

bowhnter
July 9, 2003, 07:51 PM
once, in a parking lot after work. I work as a bouncer at a popular club. We threw three guys out earlier in the night. They came back after hour to pay their respects. I suppose looking down a .45" hole will change your outlook in a hurry...

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