[davinci]

Does anyone know what the wattage used by a basic tumbler is?

Here power is about 10 cents / KWH. I'm trying to add that in to my costs of reloading. Thanks!

[Highland Ranger]

Need to look at the UL tag on your motor for wattage understanding that the tag data may be maximum numbers.

If you have a HP number, 1 HP = 746 watts

As a guess I'd say you are looking at 1/8 horse motor = 93 watts

= about a penny an hour to run i.e. not a huge part of your cost is my guess.

[Jim Watson]

A friend had no problems with letting me cast bullets from his lead pot, but worried about the power consumption. I did the calculations and the next batch I cast, I handed him a quarter.

[davinci]

hmm... I don't have a UL tag on my Lyman. I know what you're talking about though...I think someone just pulled it off for whatever reason.

I think that it burns more than 93 watts. I'm thinking that the lights in my garage are 100 watt a piece.

[HuskerTanker]

UL tags are very conservative - I would be surprised if a device actually consumed the full nameplate rating. 60 to 80% is more likely.

If you really want to know, there's a doodad out there called a killawatt meter that plugs in inline with a device and measure the power. Don't get me started on true voltage, RMS voltage, etc...

The simplified equation for power is power (in watts) = voltage x amperage.

Your house will be 110 volts (at least the outlets that tumbler will plug into). A commercial building is probably 120 volts.

[Sistema1927]

This is a joke, right?

If you are really concerned, let me suggest that you let the kids roll a coffee can full of brass and media back and forth on the sidewalk. Tell them that it will result in ice cream, and they might just do this for hours before complaining.

[Walkalong]

The simplified equation for power is power (in watts) = voltage x amperage
Yep, and I am guessing the small tumblers pull maybe 2 or 3 amps, so around 240 to 360 Watts or near about.

I'll amp out my Lyman tonight and see. It's running right now. Oh my power bill. :D

[FieroCDSP]

Just don't leave it on for a week!!! Really, a few pennies a session. Computers suck up a lot more juice. 500 watt power supplies, figure they use about 420-460 of it at full tilt. That's nearly a kilowatt every two hours!! There's your bill right there. Turn off your comp when you run your tumbler and you'll save more cash.

[Mal H]

I have a Lyman "Turbo" vibratory cleaner. I just metered it and it draws 0.85 amps. YAMV

The actual wattage is going to be a little more than the I*V=W formula would yield since the motors used in most cleaners are not purely resistive, they have a reactance component as well. Anyway, calling it all resistive would yield: 0.85 X 120VAC (my house voltage) = 102 Watts. IOW, I can run my cleaner for 10 hours for about a dime.

If you could get the kids to roll the can around for a few hours, the cost of the ice cream would be higher than the current used to run the cleaner for the same time. ;) (And the cases wouldn't come out clean - guaranteed.)

[boobap]

If you are really concerned, let me suggest that you let the kids roll a coffee can full of brass and media back and forth on the sidewalk. Tell them that it will result in ice cream, and they might just do this for hours before complaining.

LMAO:D

[davinci]

I think the Killawatt meter is the best bet...as my tumbler produces a lot of heat.

Good point on the computer power supplies. Last I checked, it cost me 60 cents a load to dry my laundry, that's just electricity. It's a frigidaire dryer and they listed the kilawatt consumption per load on the energystar sticker. I use the clothesline about 90% of the time, it also kills germs that a dryer just can't...not too mention the lack of ironing. off topic, sorry.

I know that a tumbler isn't a huge draw, but I'm trying to get a spreadsheet together of my exact costs, this way I can post portions of it when someone starts up the next "will reloading save me money?" thread, besides... it's kind of a neat historical record that I may look at in 20 years and say "wow, lead was darned expensive back in 2007!" I'm even depreciating my 45acp brass 5% per reloading session because that's how many either get lost at the range or get destroyed.

If anyone has a Kill-a-Watt meter, could they drop it on their tumbler next time they use it and tell me what they come up with as far as consumption?

I know, I've got way too much time on my hands.

[Noxx]

The fact that there are so many electrically literate people on this forum gives me a warm fuzzy feeling. Just thought I'd let you know.

[Sharps Shooter]

Nevermind. I forgot what I was going to say.:confused:
But it IS kilowatts - not "killawatts.":D

[jeepmor]

Whatever the sticker states, it's about 1/3-1/5 that while actually operating. The sticker indicates the maximum current draw, which for electric motors is at startup. At startup, an electric motor instantaneously draws 3-5 times the current of steady state operation.

This is why manufacturers claim a 5hp electric motor driven device, when it actually runs on a 15amp circuit, which is about two horsepower. 745.7W is one horsepower, which is a 6.8 amp draw at 110V. 5hp would be 34 amps, and would not work on a 15 amp circuit for steady state operation. It's a sales gimmick that all the manufacturers use because very few people understand or know this point about electric motors. I learned it in college taking an electrical power systems course in engineering or I would not know myself honestly. Being the current spike is nearly instantaneous, the circuit breaker does not blow because average house breakers have delayed tripping to off. Pull that current for more than 2-3 seconds, your breaker or fuse will blow. Like when my contractor model table saw stalls because I push it too hard, the breaker blows.

Please use these numbers accordingly for your tumbler to bring the math to its scale, which is much smaller. Beyond the numbers, an ammeter will give you the real numbers for your calculations and is likely the only way to know exactly how much power you're consuming. Load will vary by device and use, but a tumbler is pretty much steady state and does not have much load compared to power tools like circular saws and what not that you can widely vary the load on it simply by the way you choose to operate it. Horse down on it, and it'll draw more, go easy, and it sips current instead.

As stated for the tumbler, it's peanuts, seriously.

[Mal H]

If anyone has a Kill-a-Watt meter, could they drop it on their tumbler next time they use it and tell me what they come up with as far as consumption?I thought I did that for you. It wasn't only for my curiosity.

[Highland Ranger]

So my guess of 100ish watts based on an 1/8 horse motor was close . . . .

(its that four year degree - paying dividends every day!)

[davinci]

Mal H: so, you are certain it's 100 watts?
If so, I'll just multiply it by 4 hours per 500 pistol cases. Since I've been known to shoot about 2000 .45acp in a weekend, that's about 16 hours of tumbler time, or 16 cents.

It just doesn't sound right is all. 16 cents is all it costs to run a tumbler for 16 hours?

[jr81452]

its right.

[jeepmor]

1/8hp = 93.2 watts

The motor will likely draw less than this unless at full load. Most motors are oversized a bit for longevity.

Conclusion - tumbling is a very cost efficient method of cleaning brass.

[Mal H]

It just doesn't sound right is all. 16 cents is all it costs to run a tumbler for 16 hours?Sounds about right to me. Why not err on the high side and say it costs 20 cents.

The motors in most vibratory tumblers are not wattage hogs. It would be about the same as running a small personal sized fan for the same amount of time. (Or about two record turntables, not including the amplifier, receiver, etc.)

Things in your house that take most of your wattage are those things that change the temperature of something (A/C, heaters, stoves, fridges, HW heater, etc.). Everything else is essentially a rounding error on your monthly bill (assuming you don't leave lights and the TV, etc. on all the time.)

A little electrical usage quiz: Which costs more in electricity, shaving with a razor blade or shaving with an electric razor?

[jeepmor]

A little electrical usage quiz: Which costs more in electricity, shaving with a razor blade or shaving with an electric razor?

Electric razor in my house, water is heated with gas. ;)

[HuskerTanker]

I'll bite Mal,

Assumptions;

Gas fired hot water heater
Two 40 watt bulbs in sink area where shaving
Rechargeable electric shaver consuming 25 watts
Charger for electric shaver is 50% efficient

5 minutes to shave with a blade, shaving cream, hot water
3 minutes to shave with the electric razor, no water or cream

0.0067 Kwh consumed by the light in 5 minutes. Disregard air conditioning costs to remove the heat of the lights - too small to mess with and it might be a cold winter day...
Gas fired water heater so no measurable electrical usage for the hot water

0.0013 kWh consumed by the electric razor, need 0.0026 kWh to recharge it

Electric razor is cheaper, margin is wider if you have an electric hot water heater.

Am I close, or do I have too much free time on my hands?

[FieroCDSP]

This post is officially sick. :D You people need jobs. Really, it's good to know that my practical knowledge, that puts me a ways above the commoner, is nothing compared to some of you folk. I am humbled...sorta.

[Mal H]

I know we're getting pretty far off topic here, but what the heck. We can stop any time, right?

Electric razor is cheaper, margin is wider if you have an electric hot water heater.True. I guess I should have said which uses more energy rather than electricity for you nit pickers out there. ;)

However, the study I was thinking about (yes, there actually was a study on the subject) included the energy costs of manufacture for the blades, handles, shaving cream, and of course the hot water required vs the manufacturing energy and home elec. consumption of the electric shaver. The elec. shaver won by a huge margin. IIRC, the energy required to manufacture the shaving cream was the largest amount expended (included some petroleum usage).

Ok, now back to your regularly scheduled reloading topic.

[brickeyee]

Most vibratory tumblers use shaded pole induction motors.
The same type as used in a typical clock, can opener, (or a million other very small loads) but just a little larger.
100 W is probably generous.

Watts = amps x volts only works for a purely resistive load (like a light bulb or toaster).
Motors are inductive loads and have a nasty thing called power factor.
Small shaded pole motors have a lousy power factor.

The power rating from UL does NOT include the starting surge.
It does not last long enough to have any real effect on power even with a large motor since the power factor at that point is very low.

[redneck2]

It just doesn't sound right is all. 16 cents is all it costs to run a tumbler for 16 hours?
Think about it. Right now my air is running, maybe 6-8 lights, a TV, 2 refrigerators and a freezer, etc. It costs an average of maybe 30 cents an hour for everything.

Cracks me up when people whine and moan about electric bills, and all the money that the utility companies make.

Let's see....for maybe $8 a day I get lights, heat, water (from a well), power to my computer and all my equipment, refrigeration and freezer, air conditioning, clean clothes, etc.

[davinci]

redneck2: ok, that makes more sense when you break it into a daily amount for me. My electric bill is about $80 in the summertime, about $40 in the wintertime. I have gas furnace and water.

at $2.50 a day in the summertime, electricity is really cheap.

So, why don't we all have electric cars that we can just plug in at night? I drive 30 miles a day round trip to work, in my truck that's 2 gallons of gas at $3 a gallon, so $6! That's $6 for about 40 minutes, versus $2.50 for 24 hours worth of energy. Plugging in an electric car has gotta be cheaper.

[Sharps Shooter]

"Think about it. Right now my air is running, maybe 6-8 lights, a TV, 2 refrigerators and a freezer, etc. It costs an average of maybe 30 cents an hour for everything."

You forgot about your computer.:D

[Mal H]

Maybe he uses WebTV. ;)

[Highland Ranger]

Do the calc - lets say you have a 300hp truck.

300 X 746 = 233.8 kw X 10 cents/hr = $22.38/hour at full power.

My 300 hp truck at WOT goes about 110mph /15 mpg = call it 8 gallons x $2.5/gallon = $20/hour to run

But that's not whole story , when you brake in a gas powered car, the energy is all lost to heat. In an electric car I believe you scavenge back power by spinning the electric motors backwards to stop.

Plus no one runs WOT, there's probably battery heat losses, I'm sure there are other factors . . . . . . . wonder how it all would work out. . . . .

To keep it gun related, maybe we'll save some money and be able to buy more ammo!

[jeepmor]

I like the segway on this thread and how everyone is boasting their math skills. Especially how HuskerTanker went into the actual energy consumed for production of said razors. That totally eluded me, I was thinking about me using the razor. BTW, I have a skylight in that bathroom, but I did neglect to mention that I do turn on the lights while shaving. All the while, my tumbler is out there polishing brass and I can only hope my razor makes my face as smooth and clean for my woman.

I like the math and all, particularly the 300hp truck example, but in household power terms, you are pulling 2000 amps, with 110VAC, 1000 amps with 220VAC. Pacino Scarface voice on "Chu got some serious power there mang!"

But seriously, it appears that power consumption on the tumbler is probably the absolute cheapest part of the entire process. Except maybe for the Imperial Sizing Wax, by the time you figure that per round over the life of that little tin, you might just beat it by a healthy margin. I read a thread in here where an avid reloader claimed to have the same tin for nearly a decade. Now if we pay that much attention to detail in our reloading endeavours, don't let the wives know, because there is no arguing we don't have enough time for the honey-do list that way what so ever. ;)

[RustyFN]

So, why don't we all have electric cars that we can just plug in at night? I drive 30 miles a day round trip to work, in my truck that's 2 gallons of gas at $3 a gallon, so $6! That's $6 for about 40 minutes, versus $2.50 for 24 hours worth of energy. Plugging in an electric car has gotta be cheaper.
Because the govmint and all their buddies are in oil not electricity. They would stand to lose to much money.
Do the calc - lets say you have a 300hp truck.

300 X 746 = 233.8 kw X 10 cents/hr = $22.38/hour at full power.

My 300 hp truck at WOT goes about 110mph /15 mpg = call it 8 gallons x $2.5/gallon = $20/hour to run

But that's not whole story , when you brake in a gas powered car, the energy is all lost to heat. In an electric car I believe you scavenge back power by spinning the electric motors backwards to stop.

Plus no one runs WOT, there's probably battery heat losses, I'm sure there are other factors . . . . . . . wonder how it all would work out. . . . .

To keep it gun related, maybe we'll save some money and be able to buy more ammo!
No ofence meant but I got lost here. Wouldn't you be running off batteries, so you wouldn't be paying for electricity until you plugged in a small charger. I could see that if you were running off a giant extension cord.
Rusty

Edit: I used to watch a program on TV call Amp Heads. They drive electric cars and don't own any gas cars. They would build electric cars to race also. You would be amazed at some of the cars they would build.

[Mal H]

The original question has been answered, probably in more detail than he really wanted. ;)

Closed.